Hinky gunshop practices


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Carbon_15
April 28, 2011, 07:22 AM
+UPDATE+

Apparently word travels fast on the internet. I got a very nice call from the big cheese this morning around 9am!!!
Mr. Sutton said word had gotten back to them about this thread. He apoligized, cut me a check for the difference, and is sending a token "opps" gift to say sorry. Very nice guy. I guess they have earned my business back. No need to let one salesperson ruin a long business relationship.

If you enjoyed reading about "Hinky gunshop practices" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
MachIVshooter
April 28, 2011, 07:26 AM
Hmmm.....I'd have gone home without it.

I had a gunshop do that to me once. It was a neat old revolver, I'd been in a few days earlier and looked at it. I thought on it and called them to see if it was still there. They said yes, and I said I'd be down later to grab it. Well, I knew what the price had been, and they tried to raise it $50. I told them they could sell it to me for the price it was 4 days earlier or they could keep it and lose my business forever. They lowered the price.

Had it been a current production gun, I'd have just said some choice words about them and their business practices and left, never to return. But when it's not a gun you can buy at the shop down the street, sometimes you have to be more forgiving.

I have not gone back there, though. They did lose my business over that.

fallout mike
April 28, 2011, 07:29 AM
I would have left it on principle alone.

GLOOB
April 28, 2011, 07:30 AM
Look at the bright side. Either it's worth it or it's not. If you were willing to pay 789 to have it now, then you still did the right thing. Enjoy! No use crying over spilt milk. If you refused on principle, you wouldn't have your Sig, now would you?

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 28, 2011, 07:31 AM
Seems to me, now that he has an interested buyer, he is suddenly trying to squeeze every nickel he can possibly get out of you. I believe, legally, he has to honor the advertized price. This also goes for items where new higher-priced stickers are placed over older lower-priced stickers. If you peel off the new higher sticker and see a lower price underneath, I was always of the opinion (what I have learned) is that they must honor the lower price.

The guy has to sell you that gun for $699, or risk being reported to the Better Business Bureau and losing a customer and all other customers that that customer knows. In other words, it is ultimately in his best interest to sell it at the first lower price.

So, he had it in stock, he most likely already has an invoice for the lower price. He sees that suddenly there is a price increase and to replace that gun, he would have to pay the higher price and sell the next gun at the appropriate higher price. Prices go up on items all the time, for the store owner to raise the price the exact day that he quoted you $699 is not being a good businessman. At that rate, this guy won't be in business long, which may be one of the reasons he has had to raise the price -- he is not making enough money.

So, his rationale is that he is working it like the gas stations. When the price of gas goes up, to replace the gas he now has in his tanks, he will have to pay the higher price, so he ends up raising the price for all the gas he currently has in inventory and has already been paid for. Funny how that works, let the price drop and they are not so quick to lower the price -- that is IF they lower the price at all!

M-Cameron
April 28, 2011, 07:32 AM
if i recall....thats illegal....you cant advertise for one price...and sell it for more at the counter...he even told you what the price was,so its not like he can claim he hadbt gotten to changing the tag....i sure hope the ATF doesntvget wind of his seedy practice.

kwelz
April 28, 2011, 07:34 AM
Never seen a gun in stock get a price increase when the dealers cost raises on new products. Ammo and other expendables sure. But never firearms and accessories. I guess they are trying to factor in replacement cost but I have never seen a gunshop do this. I would have left without the gun and never gone back.

fallout mike
April 28, 2011, 07:35 AM
Gloob, it doesn't matter what something is worth. It is never ok to get hustled.

ultradoc
April 28, 2011, 07:35 AM
I guess as long as you are happy that's what counts but ......

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 28, 2011, 07:37 AM
Gloob, it doesn't matter what something is worth. It is never ok to get hustled.
Exactly!

Davek1977
April 28, 2011, 07:38 AM
Theres no way I'd have paid it. An agreement is just that, and someone willingb to go back on their word so quickly "because thats just the way it is" isn't someone I'd want to do business with. A man is nothig more than his word is worth in my book, and lying to me or being dishonest or shady is certainly a way to guarantee me we won't be doing business. Lots of people sell guns. Buy from someone that will stand behind their word, not some vulture out there willing to take you for every penny this visit, not giving a damn if theres ever a second one.

As far as the ATF finding out....hmmm....THAT doesn't sit right with me either. Why is it as gun owners, some of us want to cuss the ATF at every turn, yet often threarten to "tell the ATF" every time a dealer handles something in a manner the customer doesn't like. If they truly the enemy many see them as, what kind of mindeset does it take to tattle to them? ust never quite made sense to me, but then again, many things fail to make sense to me

danprkr
April 28, 2011, 07:40 AM
FWIW - I'm in the let him eat the darn thing if he's going to pull that $&(! on you school of thought. There are lots of guns out there.

MachIVshooter
April 28, 2011, 07:40 AM
I believe, legally, he has to honor the advertized price. This also goes for items where new higher-priced stickers are placed over older lower-priced stickers. If you peel off the new higher sticker and see a lower price underneath, I was always of the opinion (what I have learned) is that they must honor the lower price.

No, they don't. And there's not much recourse, other than not buying. Contract=offer, acceptance/payment, receipt of goods/services. They'd be in violation of the law if they increased the price and wouldn't let him take his property without paying more after he'd already payed. In that case, they'd have to honor the original price or give him a full refund. But any business can offer any item for sale at any price they want, and change it whenver they feel like it as long as the item isn't already under contract.

However, it's pretty unethical to raise the price on an item due to an increase in the replacement cost. The next unit should be at the higher retail price, because it was bought at the higher wholesale price.

It'd be a little different if there was a printed ad that read Sig P220-$699 and had no expiration date. But just the sticker on the tag? Nothing you can do.

GLOOB
April 28, 2011, 07:41 AM
Gloob, it doesn't matter what something is worth. It is never ok to get hustled.
Then I guess you've never bought a car. :)
Yeah, OK. I know what you're saying. I'm just trying to help the OP get that bitter taste out of his mouth so he can enjoy his new toy! He obviously couldn't wait to take it home, and I guess it showed. :)

However, it's pretty unethical to raise the price on an item due to an increase in the replacement cost. The next unit should be at the higher retail price, because it was bought at the higher wholesale price.
So what happens if the replacement price goes down? The store will have a bunch of stock they can't sell at the original price, because other people are selling it cheaper.

Bubbles
April 28, 2011, 07:41 AM
i sure hope the ATF doesntvget wind of his seedy practice
ATF won't care. Advertising a product at one price and then charging a higher price is a violation of state laws, not federal, and not under ATF's jurisdiction.

Ever go to the grocery store, put an item advertised at one price in your cart, and then it rings up higher at the register? If you complain the store is supposed to let you buy the item at the lower price.

Personally I'd trash them to the point that it would cost them a lot more than the additional $42 they made off the sale.

Lex Luthier
April 28, 2011, 07:41 AM
Though I agree this joker at the store needs some attitude adjustment, I would have called when I was on the way to the store confirming the quoted price. If it was different, get the owner on the phone and explain. If the owner is jerk, remind him there are many other placed to buy what he sells.

You may have a few uncomfortable minutes of standing there while they eat crow and fill out the paperwork, but you will have made a point, gotten what they offered you, maybe they will learn a lesson. This also sets you up as a no BS kind of guy and possibly averts this situation in the future.

foghornl
April 28, 2011, 07:49 AM
Ask that character "Are you familiar with 'Bait-And-Switch', and just exactly how dim a view the Federal Trade Commission takes on such practices?"

Betcha he would have come back to the $699+tax real fast.

Of course, it is easy for us to sit back, have another sip of coffee and criticize how the deal went down....

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 28, 2011, 07:52 AM
I ordered a brand new pistol once. Money was tight, so I asked several times what the EXACT price will be. Well about a week went by and I had a call that the new pistol was now in the store, I could come and buy it.

I asked what the price is and the owner threw me a price that was nearly $50 more than his worker had quoted me! I went in and told him the price agreement we had when he placed the order. His response was "you can't trust *******, he only WORKS HERE."

I absolutely REFUSED to buy at the higher price than was quoted to me. My reasoning was, had I known it was going to be an additional $50 I may not have ordered the gun, or I may have shopped around.

In the end, the guy ate crow and gave me the price his worker quoted me. I don't want to play the part of "the jerk," however, right is right and the whole reason behind my originally getting a price quotation was so I could make an educated decision on whether to go with this gun or not!

Had he not come down on the price, he would have lost a LOT MORE than that over the following years in my business alone, not to mention other gun enthusiasts I bring into his store!

LemmyCaution
April 28, 2011, 08:18 AM
There's a local gun shop here that publishes the price of their stock on their website. It's a rural area, so if you're looking on line at their stock, chances are it's a bit if a drive to go make a purchase.

I find that every time I've gone there to buy a gun, the price on the tag is always 10% higher than the price listed on the website. I figure they're thinking 'this guy just committed to a 2 hour, 120 mile round trip. He doesn't want to go home empty handed,' and expect me to eat the 10%.

I generally pull out my phone, pull up their website, and ask if they want to honor their advertised price.

They must hate the advent of smart phones.

I'm still waiting for a good explanation for how this sort of craven exploitation of information asymmetry jives with the 'free, efficient market' blather people ramble on about.

trickyasafox
April 28, 2011, 08:28 AM
if you bought 25 guns their and they wouldn't cut you a deal and honor the posted price, then that would be the last thing I ever bought from that shop.

LemmyCaution
April 28, 2011, 08:47 AM
At this point, I generally purchase on the internet and transfer through a kitchen table FFL who lives in my town.

Aside from the pricing shenanigans, I've gotten tired of hearing 'I can $pecial order that for you.'

I'll order it myself, thanks.

Dejavu
April 28, 2011, 08:53 AM
If I remember my Business Law classes correctly, any advertising (print, TV ads, price tags ) is considered an "offer to do trade", no more. If a clerk mismarks an item, the store is not required to sell it at the mistaken price. It may do so, just to maintain good will, and I think this store should have because one angry customer, and all his many friends he will tell, isn't worth the extra $40 bucks. Any smart business should know that. And then make sure the price tag is corrected quickly.

A purchase constitutes a contract only after an agreement of price is made, money changes hands and a thing of value (ie the pistol) is exchanged.

What has been made illegal is bait and switch. I don't know all the nuances of that case law.

Take this for what it is worth, I am not a contract attorney, or any other type of atty for that matter, but that is what I remember.

Onmilo
April 28, 2011, 09:02 AM
You may have took the gun home and are happy to have it, but I am thinking down the road, that was the last visit you will ever make to that gun shop,,,

CajunBass
April 28, 2011, 09:05 AM
There is one way to find out what the real price is. All you have to do is say "I don't want it that bad. Bye." If they let you walk out the door, the real price was the one you left. If they say "Wait a minute" you'll know it was less.

The proper response to "The manager will tell you the same thing" is: "Ok. Go get him, and let him tell me."

(You can't make someone sell you something.)

1911Tuner
April 28, 2011, 09:06 AM
He'd have put it back in the display case and watched me walk out the door.

What he may not fully understand is that, when a customer looks at the price tag and says that he'll take it...and he proceeds to jack up the price beyond normal sales tax, he's in violation of a legally binding contract... and if you'd had two witnesses to the verbal agreement, you could have forced him to sell the gun at the advertised price. It would have required a lawyer, which may have made it not worth the trouble...but it can be done.

That works both ways, incidentally. Be careful of making an offer...even joking. If the other party says that he'll accept your offer, and he has witnesses...he can force you to buy it.

earplug
April 28, 2011, 09:31 AM
Inflation is making items cost more by the day/week. I believe we will see this type of price policy more often.
The replacement cost of items in stock increase faster then dealers can reprice them.
Buy it now, as the cost will go up as long as the dollar continues to fall in value.

candr44
April 28, 2011, 09:33 AM
If you refused on principle, you wouldn't have your Sig, now would you?

I know your reasons for saying this Bloog but if a gun shop owner said something like that I would tell him: yes I would have my Sig I just won't buy it here or anything else. Then I would ask him to recomend some place else where I could get a fair price.

Unethical stores like this don't deserve the slightest respect. Then they try to rationalize their bad behaviour with the same old saying: "You didn't get ripped off if you were willing to pay the price".

TNboy
April 28, 2011, 09:41 AM
It would be interesting to go back in a week and see what the tag on the gun says.

FROGO207
April 28, 2011, 09:47 AM
I would have walked also. If it was a used firearm and not available then I would have rethought it a little but sill most likely would have walked. Almost this same situation happened to me, wanted a used rifle and looked at it several times over a week long period. I called the next day to see if it was still there and found it was. Went there immediately and it had a $55 price increase on the tag from what it was the day before. I walked and bought it elsewhere that same day. Then went back to first store with the new rifle to find scope rings that I was sure that they did not have in stock.:cool: Said to them I was glad I looked around as I had found it for even less elsewhere.:D Also said that their offer to order the rings was not needed but thanks for looking as I probably could get a scope and rings for the same price as they could on line just as fast and walked out.
Next time in there a month or so later (I know:banghead:) I asked about a pistol on display and they immediately offered me a discount off the tagged price but I politely declined and stated that if they were that eager to sell it I probably could do better elsewhere anyway and immediately left there again. Haven't been back there since and it's been over 10 years.:D

oneounceload
April 28, 2011, 09:58 AM
In ANY store I have ever bought anything from - if the register price did not match the shelf price, the store ate the difference, as the posted price is the legal one.

You might have checked on-line prices to see where his price was in realtion to that before impulse buying

Averageman
April 28, 2011, 09:59 AM
Ten years ago I saw a Colt 1991 advertised $200 cheaper than anywhere else in my area, actually 200 dollars cheaper than anywhere I had seen on line even.
I saw the ad in the paper and then checked it again on line and left to be the first one in the door that morning. That was the first day of the advertised sale.
4 Clerks in the store, ad in my hand; I immeadiatly ask the first Clerk about the Colt. "No Sir, that was a misprint, the paper was wrong; but we sold out of them at that price yesterday."
Disappointed to say the least I shopped around a bit more, found some small parts and asked a second Clerk about the Colt as I was checking out. The second Clerk reaches under the counter and pulls out three Colt 1991's and opens each box for me. I found the one I wanted as the first Clerk came up to the counter and avoided all eye contact with me.
I haven't bought anything there since; but I wished I had bought all three at that time.
I don't like being lied to or giving my money to liars.
That was in Pflugerville Texas BTW,..

WhistlinDixie
April 28, 2011, 10:09 AM
Averageman: What the heck did that first clerk stand to gain by lying to you? Was he trying to buy the store out himself on minimum wage?

youngda9
April 28, 2011, 10:12 AM
Tell us the name of the gun store.

Send the gunstore an email with a link to this post showing them how much negative publicity they are getting due to their shady practices.

Hopefully that'll save the next guy from the same fate.

p.s. I would have told him where to go and then walked out the door for good.

(Oh, and a raise in price should coenside with the next set of firearms the gunshop sells...they already paid the lower rate for this firearm to sell...so any additional price increase is straight profit for them. The next set of guns that come in will cost more for the shop to stock, they should be the ones with the higher price.)

Just One Shot
April 28, 2011, 10:13 AM
Lodge a complaint with the BBB. If nothing else it will go into a file that other potential customers can see.

slowr1der
April 28, 2011, 10:36 AM
I'm going to be honest, 95% of the gunshops I've dealt had customer service like this along with usually being rude and having prices a lot higher than online or Walmart or similar. Everyone can say that online shops and Walmart are putting local stores out of business because of their prices. I don't feel this is entirely the reason, but instead it's because it seems like a large majority of the shops out there have horrible customer service and pull crap like this. That's what causes people to stop shopping there. Why should you pay a premium to be treated like this when you could just order it online usually for cheaper without the hassle?

Now I've dealt with a gunshop that was great, but I've literally dealt with 1 gun shop that's been great and I've been to dozens. Most of them have extremely high prices and rude customer service. They seem to be trying to capitalize on the "buy local" thing and be taking advantage of it.

I've since learned I'm going to go with the cheapest price which usually is Walmart or online. That one store I got treated great at, I'd pay a premium to buy from them, but they are the only store I feel worth a premium, and their prices usually aren't any higher anyway and usually cheaper. The downside is they are about an hour and a half from me in an area I hardly ever travel to.

CoRoMo
April 28, 2011, 10:45 AM
...I took the gun. the more I think about it, the madder it makes me.
I'm with ya. It sort of ticks me that you accepted that deal. That means this practice will only continue and other customers will have to deal with it.

45Fan
April 28, 2011, 11:00 AM
Something like this happened to me once. I had several other things I purchased at that time, and hadnt noticed the price being off by $50. The pistol was on sale, and it rang up at the regular price. I didnt catch this until I was home from the afternoon of shopping, and had sat down to go over the receipts. A quick phone call to the store and a chat with the store manager cleared it all up, and the next time I was that way, showed the receipt, and received a refund for the difference.
Have you tried to get in touch with the manager since you bought the gun? It may lead nowhere, but it could get your money back. Might just have been a less than honest employee trying to make himself look good at the cost of loosing a customer.

oneounceload
April 28, 2011, 11:14 AM
(Oh, and a raise in price should coenside with the next set of firearms the gunshop sells...they already paid the lower rate for this firearm to sell...so any additional price increase is straight profit for them. The next set of guns that come in will cost more for the shop to stock, they should be the ones with the higher price.)

That is incorrect, a store has to price the goods in relationship to the next price they will have to pay to replace them so it is NOT just pure profit to the store.

G27RR
April 28, 2011, 11:24 AM
Pflugerville Texas BTW,..
Red's? Just curious.

MICHAEL T
April 28, 2011, 11:34 AM
The door worked both ways I would have left . I almost never pay the price dealer has on pistol.l I always at least try to get him to eat taxes if nothing else . Be surprised how many will if you standing their cash in hand.

PapaG
April 28, 2011, 11:36 AM
Happens every day at the gas stations. Same old stuff in their storage tanks, price goes up because someone else raised theirs.

Crappy business practice.

Keb
April 28, 2011, 12:21 PM
You guys are missing the simple need for retailers to generate funds to replace inventory once a price increase is on the way. Yup, I "feel" bad if I don't skate thru at the lower price, but it is the seller's perogative to re-price. If they don't reprice they can miss the profit margin on a turnover. ( Profit = margin x turnover )

Sure, some times you make a deal when everyone involved know a big price change is in the works... like I just bought some junk silver halves at 11.50 each in mid-March because the seller didn't care. But I would not have had the right to prevent him from getting the bullion price that day.

So you are going to win some, and other times you wait too long. If you want to snarf off deals, use private want ads.

PS: US case law clearly allows retailers to correctly price items which were incorrectly priced in their ads

HGUNHNTR
April 28, 2011, 12:22 PM
The gun shop is not obligated to sell the gun for the advertised price, and you are not obligated to purchase it. It really isnt that big of a deal, price changes happen and sometimes it is to the consumers disadvantage. There is not a law that says a retailer must honor an advertised price.

medalguy
April 28, 2011, 12:24 PM
I understand your burning desire to own that gun, but no way I would have paid the higher price.

You might want to contact your local Consumer Fraud Division of the local DA's office. This is the kind of thing they can really get into. Might also want to talk to your local TV consumer reporter. Can't hurt even though it's (gasp) a GUN!! :eek:

youngda9
April 28, 2011, 12:51 PM
That is incorrect, a store has to price the goods in relationship to the next price they will have to pay to replace them so it is NOT just pure profit to the store.
Er, no. They bought the gun for X, they sell for X + Profit.

Next guy they buy for Y and sell for Y + profit.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 28, 2011, 01:08 PM
Agree with younda.

Suppose the market is such that everything is doubled a year from now. Does that give the gun shop owner (or any store owner as far as that goes) license to DOUBLE the price of the product PLUS any PROFIT??

I don't think so!:rolleyes:

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 28, 2011, 01:10 PM
I agree with youngda9.
Er, no. They bought the gun for X, they sell for X + Profit.
Next guy they buy for Y and sell for Y + profit.
Suppose the market is such that everything is doubled a year from now. Does that give the gun shop owner (or any store owner as far as that goes) license to DOUBLE the price of the product he is selling today, PLUS any PROFIT??

I don't think so!:rolleyes:

cyclopsshooter
April 28, 2011, 01:23 PM
That would never happen at my store- sometimes we mismark a tag but we let the customer win- happy customers is a good business practice-

makes me wonder whether the clerk was pocketing the difference- doesnt take much to void a sale and re-enter at the lower price and keep the difference.

id go back like someone else here said and take a look at the price of the new one in the case.

MtnSpur
April 28, 2011, 01:25 PM
I'm confused. The shop had the weapon in stock with a price tag attached. That + tax should have been the price out the door. It was their stock item not something they had to order for you at the new price, yes? Personally, I'd of taken my paperwork and told him politely "sir, that is not the price you quoted me " and walked out the door.

jmr40
April 28, 2011, 03:05 PM
I have mixed feelings on this one. Most gunshops only mark up new guns around 10% over their cost. People do make mistakes, typo's do occour and prices are sometimes misquoted. I've seen signs at the register in many stores lately that say something to the effect that "If there is a different price on your purchase than what is in the computer, the computer is right".

As a store owner I shouldn't have to sell an item at, or below cost because it was mislabeled. I might offer to sell it to you at the lower price, but am not required to do so. If a customer wanted push the issue, then I'd be happy to see him walk.

Olevern
April 28, 2011, 03:06 PM
Awhile back,I was out of state and visited a gun shop. Saw two pistols at decent prices that I decided I wanted, purchased them both and told the owner of the shop I would send a copy of ffl. I then asked owner how much to ship (yeah, I know, shoulda ask before I purchased and paid for the guns). He said $50.00 each. Told him that was out of line, he was firm (after all he already had my 900+ dollars in his cash register). Tried to recind the deal, he said, no returns on used firearms. Was forced to pay $100.00 for shipping. I am frequently in his town on business, never again walked in his shop, never will.

jmr40
April 28, 2011, 03:11 PM
Happens every day at the gas stations. Same old stuff in their storage tanks, price goes up because someone else raised theirs.

Gas stations don't work that way. The station does not buy the gas from the oil companies then turn around and sell it to you. The gas in the tanks belongs to the oil companies until you pump it into your car. The oil companies then pay the service station a set amount for each gallon they sell.

jmr40
April 28, 2011, 03:15 PM
Awhile back,I was out of state and visited a gun shop. Saw two pistols at decent prices that I decided I wanted, purchased them both and told the owner of the shop I would send a copy of ffl. I then asked owner how much to ship (yeah, I know, shoulda ask before I purchased and paid for the guns). He said $50.00 each. Told him that was out of line, he was firm (after all he already had my 900+ dollars in his cash register). Tried to recind the deal, he said, no returns on used firearms. Was forced to pay $100.00 for shipping. I am frequently in his town on business, never again walked in his shop, never will.

$50 to ship a handgun seems like a fair deal to me. UPS requires overnight shipping on all handguns and they would charge the gunshop $40-$50 per gun. He has his time and materials to pack and ship the guns. At $50 per gun he may not have broken even.

Olevern
April 28, 2011, 03:43 PM
He shipped both guns in one box. I assume he made a decent profit on the guns, I didn't try to negotiate the price, just paid his asking price. As for materials, how much does that cost? Time to pack, maybe five minutes, and UPS picks up at his store. It's not like I was asking him to ship firearms I didn't purchase from him. I still think $100.00 was excessive. It cost him a customer, me.

In another, unrelated, incident, I wanted to purchase a long arm out of state (not a contigious state) in a gun shop while on vacation in Tn. last year (a single shot 410), price $140.00, and the dealer insisted he needed $50.00 to ship it. Didn't buy it, won't go back there either.

Maybe I'm unreasonable, but it's my business (money) and I can take it anywhere I like.

Bubbles
April 28, 2011, 03:45 PM
$50 to ship a handgun seems like a fair deal to me. UPS requires overnight shipping on all handguns and they would charge the gunshop $40-$50 per gun.
FFL's can ship handguns USPS. A flat-rate priority box with insurance and signature/delivery confirmation for $20-25 depending on the insured value. It's a few bucks more if it goes to AK or HI.

azmjs
April 28, 2011, 04:05 PM
You shouldn't have bought it.

Sheepdog1968
April 28, 2011, 04:29 PM
I know some local shops who do raise prices like that (though they relabel and send out email warnings prices are going to go up soon) and others that only increase the prices on the new iventory of guns. The store could have probablly handeled it better. I'm sure you work hard for your money. Just shoot 150 less rounds in one month and you will be at break even or one night on the town. This kind of stuff used to bother me quite a bit more when I was in my 20's. Now it my 40's, I shrug it off.

Enjoy the Sig and shop elsewhere for a while if you can.

GLOOB
April 28, 2011, 05:32 PM
Er, no. They bought the gun for X, they sell for X + Profit.
Next guy they buy for Y and sell for Y + profit.
Suppose the market is such that everything is doubled a year from now. Does that give the gun shop owner (or any store owner as far as that goes) license to DOUBLE the price of the product he is selling today, PLUS any PROFIT??

I don't think so!

Yes, of course. Not only do they have the right, it is expected. If you bought an oz of gold in 1969, would you sell it for 150.00, today?

Look at the flip side. Consider what happens when the price goes down. Suppose you still have a case of SIG P250's, purchased when they first came out. Or Micro Eagles. The price on these guns went down a good bit since their introduction. You could try all you want to unload them at the original price, but good luck with that when everyone else is selling them for $200.00 less. As a seller, you'd take a loss on them. It works both ways.

youngda9
April 28, 2011, 06:11 PM
^^ "Rights" have nothing to do with this. It's about right vs. wrong.

TS got hosed. I understand it.

Germany
April 28, 2011, 06:59 PM
Honestly I when I find new gun store I play the "dumb" role to find out if I'm going to be offered a fair deal [for both parties]. I recently went to one to buy a tapco 20rnd sks mag and started asking basic prices on 91/30s , sks , ak's, basicly any milpsurp I can think of. When I'm told $250 for a common 91/30, I don't point out that its overpriced by a huge amount, but I also never buy anything from them ever again. No wonder big box stores and the internet are killing local shops, they clearly rip off their customers. I'm not saying all local shops do, but to give you a idea of how bad it is in my neck of the woods, $600-800 is common for a basic WASR.

Safetychain
April 28, 2011, 07:09 PM
There are a lot of posts about this type of bait and switch as being perfectly legal. In some states it isn't, but it is a state thing. In SC, if my old memory is too bad today, there are some laws against this sort of thing. It may be directed only at grocery, car or Wallymart, but I remember such laws being passed when Hugo roared through the state.

Galt
April 28, 2011, 08:45 PM
Gloob, glad you chimed in. Cost plus pricing is a loser's game. Prices should reflect value in the market, not what the store paid for its inventory.

Not saying the store was in the right, just saying that the argument that a shop ought to only price based on inventory cost or cost to replace is wrong. The shop ought to price at a level that reflects a reasonable expectation of moving the inventory for an acceptable return on investment or recovery of the investment.

M-Cameron
April 28, 2011, 08:49 PM
Yes, of course. Not only do they have the right, it is expected. If you bought an oz of gold in 1969, would you sell it for 150.00, today?

Look at the flip side. Consider what happens when the price goes down. Suppose you still have a case of SIG P250's, purchased when they first came out. Or Micro Eagles. The price on these guns went down a good bit since their introduction. You could try all you want to unload them at the original price, but good luck with that when everyone else is selling them for $200.00 less. As a seller, you'd take a loss on them. It works both ways.

yeah, i have no problem with them raising prices........

i have a problem with them raising the price after he agreed to buy it for another price.

Ironclad
April 28, 2011, 09:40 PM
For all of you folks who think its wrong to raise prices based on the current market -
I'd love to pay you that same $50 you spent on your surplus M1911a1 back in the day instead of the $1000+ they go for now. PM me if you want to sell me yours. Actually I'll pay you $55 dollars. (your original cost + 10% mark up) Any more and you are being unethical!

I do agree that its crappy to raise the price after a verbal contract though.

701
April 28, 2011, 10:41 PM
Lowcountry area?

HOOfan_1
April 28, 2011, 11:03 PM
I've seen signs at the register in many stores lately that say something to the effect that "If there is a different price on your purchase than what is in the computer, the computer is right".

Not at stores that want to survive....I worked retail management for 10 years. I wasn't the most customer friendly person either. I had all kinds of off the wall demands that I had no intention of meeting, except for the fact that my superiors often told me to go ahead and do it. Their reasoning was that the honest customers outnumbered the frauds and it wasn't worth it to have the frauds come in and make a scene.

However, I completely side with people when they see a price on the shelf, and it comes up higher in the computer. That is our fault...not theirs. We signed it wrong, or our employees were too lazy to go out and change the prices like they should have.

Sure, I've worked for stores that put up signs stating that the ad was incorrect. However, those signs are more for keeping everyone from coming up and complaining. They aren't for making sure we have no obligation to honor those prices. I have never worked for a store whose policy wasn't "if it is labeled for a lower price than the computer says, then we give the customer the lower price"

I'm not talking about missing "0's" here either. Obviously it is beyond customer service and more along the lines of insanity on both the part of the vendor and the customer to sell a $200 item for $2 just because part of a label got torn off. If we are talking about a $80 item, listed at $65 however, it is going out the door at $65 and I am immediately going back and changing the label.

MachIVshooter
April 29, 2011, 02:27 AM
That is incorrect, a store has to price the goods in relationship to the next price they will have to pay to replace them so it is NOT just pure profit to the store.

BS.

I buy items to stock in my shop. A month ago, I bought a bunch of Valvoline maxlife at $2.91/qt. This month, the price has gone up to $3.34/qt. I sell parts at my cost, and until I run out and have to resupply, my customers will continue to pay $2.91/qt.

In retail, the ethical approach is to only increase your retail price when you've had to buy the item at an increased wholesale price. You don't do it in anticipation.

If you bought an oz of gold in 1969, would you sell it for 150.00, today?

Whole different ball'o'wax there. You'd sell it for current market price, which is not set by individual wholesalers and retailers. And for the sake of argument, if the value of gold had gone down, you'd sell it at a loss or keep it. Gold and other similar investments are little more than low (no) risk stocks.

Also, a gun shop selling new guns with a fast turn around cannot be compared to the guy who bought a Colt Combat Commander for $200 in 1970 and sold it for fair market value today. Gun shops haven't had their money tied up in one piece of merchandise for 40 years, waiting on inflation.

Lex Luthier
April 29, 2011, 07:11 AM
It has been my experience as a contractor and a customer that the BBB is irrelevant. It is just another place for businesses to be afraid of and customers to wield some kind of childish control when they don't feel good about a transaction.

RimfireChris
April 29, 2011, 10:03 AM
Lex Luthier It has been my experience as a contractor and a customer that the BBB is irrelevant. It is just another place for businesses to be afraid of and customers to wield some kind of childish control when they don't feel good about a transaction.

So it's childish to feel hosed on a transaction?

gc70
April 29, 2011, 10:46 AM
I'm glad everything turned out well for the OP in the end; the store owner did the honorable thing to resolve the issue.

If I were the store owner, I would also hope to not have customers who would trash my reputation on the internet before giving me a chance to resolve a problem.

Averageman
April 29, 2011, 06:24 PM
Averageman: What the heck did that first clerk stand to gain by lying to you? Was he trying to buy the store out himself on minimum wage?
He didn't appear to be a minimum wage worker to me. He looked more like an off duty Cop to be accurate.

I was drinking my coffee and saw the flyer, it was either Saturday or Sunday and it was that days advertised special, first day of the Sale. I was pretty sure I was being BS'ed because I was essentially the first Customer that day.
What his motives were mean nothing to me.
The facts are
A) He either didn't care to look to see if he still had the pistol in stock.
or
B) Had them in stock and didn't want to sell them to me. Perhaps the clerk had promised them to other Customers.
The point is he lied.
The Second Clerk behind the counter immeadiatly pulled all three from one spot in the bottom of a large ornate wooden shelf behind a sliding door. That shelf sets underneath the wall long Rifle rack. (if you know the place, take a look)
It is a shame too, because I used to shoot on the indoor range they have;.. weekly for a while.
As far as making some sort of complaint, well essentially I have. I took my money elsewhere and forever. So the way I figure it thats their share of 15K + over the last ten years of firearms purchases they missed out on.
I really don't care who believes the truth, it is what it is.

Lex Luthier
April 29, 2011, 08:52 PM
No. Just saying that the BBB is irrelevant.

When two men enter a transaction, and they both leave happy, it was a good thing. If either does not, they learn how to transact differently. "Feeling" hosed is just another way of admitting to oneself that one should reevaluate how they do things.

RimfireChris
April 30, 2011, 01:24 PM
Fair enough, they've never been able to sort things out for me.

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