Would beautiful wood and metal have ever existed...?


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leadcounsel
May 6, 2011, 08:09 PM
If rugged firearm quality polymer and ceramic technology were invented hundreds of years ago, or even a century or so ago, would we have all of the wonder selection of metal and wood guns and stocks that we have today?

Imagine if the gun world just skipped all the wood and metal and went right to polymers... I bet some here would be upset...

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earlthegoat2
May 6, 2011, 08:16 PM
Hard to say really but I say.....Neh

Wood would be as natural a material for gunmaking as plastic since trees abound here. I mean, houses are made of wood so people would understand the strength and vast amount of uses wood has.

Plastic may have taken over if it was absolutely used for everything before anyone ever thought to use lumber.

Trees have always been here. Plastics technology has not.

Maybe if plastics came first there would be more trees around but maybe not because they would have been deforested in the name of petroleum for producing plastics.

Rembrandt
May 6, 2011, 08:17 PM
It would certainly have been more difficult to nail up "wanted posters" using a polymer gun as a hammer.....

content
May 6, 2011, 08:36 PM
Hello friends and neighbors // I love beautiful wood and would miss it.

My oldest plastic stocked firearm is from 1947 ,is still a looker:scrutiny: and uncracked. Probably due to its being a .22.
141813
Stevens 87T (T =Tenite an Eastman product from 1932) The rifle stock is probably Tenite II IIRC from 1938.

IIRC Tenite is a Cellulose Plastic so technically it might still be considered "wood".:evil:

GWARGHOUL
May 6, 2011, 10:04 PM
Stevens 87T (T =Tenite an Eastman product from 1932) The rifle stock is probably Tenite II IIRC from 1938.

IIRC Tenite is a Cellulose Plastic so technically it might still be considered "wood".

I recall them doing the same thing for Fender back in the early 90's I believe.. they made a "photoflame" strat, which was some kinda Eastman photograph of a real flamed maple top, glued onto the alder or poplar body like a veneer.

Same concept?

kozak6
May 6, 2011, 10:09 PM
Imagine if the gun world just skipped all the wood and metal and went right to polymers... I bet some here would be upset...

Why would that be? If it were polymer and ceramic from the beginning, that would be the status quo, no one would know what they were missing, and wood and steel would be viewed as curiously quaint and obsolete. There would be no reason to be upset about it. Are bronze handgonne enthusiasts upset about the widespread adaptation of ferrous alloys, cartridges, repeating mechanisms, and smokeless powders?

If polymer and ceramic were superior performance-wise and economically from the beginning, there wouldn't be much reason to build a gun out of wood and steel anymore. There would be a minimal selection of such firearms, likely limited to similarly obsolete designs. If wood and steel guns even still were in use, they would be relegated to a small minority of enthusiasts, perhaps like black powder is today.

Cob
May 6, 2011, 10:14 PM
That is an interesting question, I have to say, you should lay off the pain killers, or maybe the plastic fumes have been getting to you a bit...

heeler
May 6, 2011, 10:20 PM
None the less can you imagine how hideous an old American lever gun would be without nice Walnut wood??
Sorry, polymer has it's place but nothing for me at least gives an old Remington 700 or Winchester model 70 justice but nice grain Walnut.

Kendal Black
May 6, 2011, 10:43 PM
Humph. Progress takes three steps forward, two steps back.

Wood was an obvious gunstock material because, like, look around you, man. Notice anything strange? Like, trees are all around us, man... ;) Wood is light, slightly elastic and impact resistant, just the qualities now desired in synthetic stocks.

This is a case of art imitating nature. If we hadn't started out with wood stocks, we would not now be using synthetics that are 'like wood only better.'

One can imagine a rifle that is all stiff and solid steel, but with thick hard rubber butt pad, cheek piece, pistol grip and forearm--rubber where the meat to metal interface occurs. This would be different from what we are used to, but it would certainly work.

The rifle arose to prominence where people had walnut trees, and maple and birch, not rubber trees, else arms design (and much of history) would have been vastly different.

Owen Sparks
May 6, 2011, 10:44 PM
What if cotton fibers had never been woven into cloth and clothing was still made from "beautiful " animal hides?

Polymers don't rot, warp or crack like wood and make for better gun furniture. The objective of firearms is to put a hole in something that is out of arms reach, not to win a beauty contest. Form follows function. People used wood because at the time it was the best material avalable. The same way the horse and buggy was the best transportation avalable at one time. We have moved on, get over it.

Rembrandt
May 7, 2011, 07:14 AM
Cowboy's riding the range all day, many of those polymer guns would have started failing by now from lack of UV protection.....in search of a better product, wood and steel becomes the new material.

Jim Watson
May 7, 2011, 07:36 AM
As an engineer and science fiction reader, I still find it difficult to imagine a path of development that would bring out complex high energy products like strong plastics before something as simple as gunpowder.

And where are those firearm quality ceramics anyhow?

mrbro
May 7, 2011, 08:16 AM
Yes, but in far fewer numbers and at far greater cost.

45_auto
May 7, 2011, 08:57 AM
If rugged firearm quality polymer and ceramic technology were invented hundreds of years ago, or even a century or so ago, would we have all of the wonder selection of metal and wood guns and stocks that we have today?

Metal and wood are choices any materials engineer would consider when contemplating a new gun design. Even with all the "rugged firearm quality polymer and ceramic technology" we have today they are still much better solutions than polymer and ceramics in most cases.

Go to any big new gun dealer with hundreds of guns on display (Cabela's, etc) and count the number of polymer/ceramic guns. Then count the number of metal/wood guns .....

loadedround
May 7, 2011, 09:38 AM
I would have to say the Weatherby Mark V that I bought from the custom shop last year. Some of the best walnut and bluing that I have seen on a firearm.

jmr40
May 7, 2011, 11:34 AM
Wood and blue steel were used because it was the easiest materials to use and offered the best options for the technology available at the time. Not because they were beautiful. As long as wood and blue steel have been used, firearms owners have been looking for something better. It is only recently that some shooters are more interested in aesthetics than performance.

buck460XVR
May 7, 2011, 11:39 AM
If wood and metal guns had never existed, how could we miss them and why would some here be upset?:rolleyes:


Odds are because of the beauty of wood, someone, somewhere woulda put it on his polymer gun as grips or a stock, just for the beauty of it. Reason they still do it today, altho we have better and more efficient materials to do so.

xfyrfiter
May 7, 2011, 04:28 PM
The most beautiful rifle I have ever seen is the one that Larry Potterfield is cleaning in his commercial. That is the prettiest piece of tiger maple, and blue steel, just gorgeous,

45_auto
May 7, 2011, 08:32 PM
It is only recently that some shooters are more interested in aesthetics than performance.

You really think all that engraving, gold inletting, etc, on 400-500 year old black powder pistols was done to improve performance????

NMGonzo
May 7, 2011, 08:42 PM
...not to win a beauty contest.

http://www.firearmsengraving.com/Gallery/images/HnH500-C_tif.jpg

Owen Sparks
May 7, 2011, 10:08 PM
Wow beautiful, but does all that artistry make it shoot any better?

Sunray
May 8, 2011, 01:33 AM
Geezuz, NMGonzo. Do you really think a 3600 x 2857 pixel picture is necessary? This page will take a week to load for a dial up member.
"... would have ever existed..." Yep. Somebody would have thought about trying wood for stocks.

Jolly Rogers
May 8, 2011, 09:17 AM
Hate to break it to you guys but wood at the cellular level is a bunch of "plastic" straws stacked tightly together. Cellulose.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Cellulose
Joe

Owen
May 8, 2011, 09:23 AM
You wouldn't miss it, because you would have never seen it.

towboat_er
May 8, 2011, 09:46 AM
Wow beautiful, but does all that artistry make it shoot any better?

http://i900.photobucket.com/albums/ac210/thinspocentral11/before-and-after-diet.jpg

dirtyjim
May 8, 2011, 11:12 AM
if all you wanted was a generic rifle or pistol that looked like it was made from a cookie cutter it wouldn't make any difference as to what it was made from.
once you develop some taste and class you'll go back to metal and wood.

i'll also say there is not an off the shelf sporting rifle for under $3000 that does not need at least another $1500 in work to bring it up to what i consider usable

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