Ditching my p3at, should I get PF-9 or LC9?


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Nashvegas
May 9, 2011, 11:44 PM
I got a kel tec p3at as a pocket conceal gun to have when I'm at work, or in other situations when carrying a full size doesn't work. I have sufficiently broken the thing in, and it is terrible. It jams constantly, and I just don't enjoy shooting it. Anyway, I have decided that I cannot confidently carry this weapon.

I am considering either the kel tec PF-9, or the LC9 from ruger. I think the slightly larger size will fit my hand better, and I'm hoping they will be less prone to jam. Anybody have experience with these? I'm open to other suggestions as well. I just need something that I can put in a pocket holster in dress pants and it not be noticeable. I like the idea of a 9mm instead of a 380. Thoughts?

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leadcounsel
May 10, 2011, 02:29 AM
I had the same problems of relability. It's also very uncomfortable to shoot.

But...

Try two things. 1) Try brass ammo vs. steel ammo. Mine wouldn't feed steel but brass was okay. 2) Try returning it to KT. They have a good warranty. They replaced the handgun. Also know that Generation 1 was redesigned to Gen 2, which is supposed to be better.

eam3clm@att.net
May 10, 2011, 02:30 AM
I have the cousin of the pf-9 the p11 which is the double stack version. The trigger takes about a month to pull and doesnt feel good. I recently dry fired the lc9 and it was much better. I also have a p3at and I have not had any problems with it feeding. The only problem I ever had with it was it not firing wolf ammo. I carry golden sabers and they feed fine as well as winchester ball ammo.

TimeIsRunninOut
May 10, 2011, 03:26 AM
Check and compare the features and feel of both firearms. LC9 feels better but has a lot of safety extras. The PF9 feels marginally bigger that the P3AT, the trigger is the same as the P3AT. Again send it off to Kel Tec it will be worth your while.

mongo4567
May 10, 2011, 08:30 AM
The P3AT is very sensitive to grip, with its light weight and heavy recoil it can be made to jam very easily...especially with larger hands. One of my friends couldn't get two consecutive rounds through his till we worked on his grip. Have you had someone else that owns a P3AT fire it?

Small, light guns like this will never be fun to shoot. The PF9 is easier to hold onto, but it is still a small, light auto....and not really a pocket gun. I have a P3AT and a PF9, love them both...but they each fit a certain purpose. Have you thought of a j frame S&W?

snooperman
May 10, 2011, 09:55 AM
very good ammo . Also , the latest issue of Gun tests magazine gave a superior rating to the PF9 and a lower rating to the LC9.

G19G36
May 10, 2011, 10:15 AM
Check out the size and weight of Kahr's CM9 (or for more money, slightly better PM9). I just acquired a new CM9 and have been breaking it in. Planned for my summertime EDC.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v177/pvancelette/KahrCM9.jpg

kokapelli
May 10, 2011, 10:39 AM
+1 for the CM9

MachIVshooter
May 10, 2011, 12:37 PM
I have the cousin of the pf-9 the p11 which is the double stack version. The trigger takes about a month to pull and doesnt feel good

The P11 is a true DAO, while the PF9 uses the partially cocked hammer design of the P3AT. Trigger is much nicer on the PF.

To the OP:

The PF9 is a very slender and light weight pistol, but is quite a lot larger than a P3. Unless you wear very loose pants with huge pockets, it's not a pocket gun. The Rorbaugh is really the only 9mm that qualifies, and it's still too thick, IMO (.3" wider than a P3AT, and 6 ounces heavier). Even the Kahr PM9 (Heavier and wider than the PF, but a little shorter in both directions) is really too big for true pocket carry.

You really will have to switch to a mounted holster for the PF9/LC9/CM9/PM9 to be effectively concealed. I have a PF9 and use an Uncle Mikes and carry at 12 or 4 O'clock, depending on attire. It does become a pocket gun during winter with my Carhartt coat.

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/100_0566.jpg

Smaug
May 10, 2011, 12:42 PM
I have sufficiently broken the thing in, and it is terrible. It jams constantly, and I just don't enjoy shooting it. Anyway, I have decided that I cannot confidently carry this weapon.

With this experience, I'm not sure why you'd want another Kel-Tec.

The Ruger LC9 gets good reviews. Check out the youtube videos by hickok45. I'd get that one for sure.

kokapelli
May 10, 2011, 12:51 PM
With this experience, I'm not sure why you'd want another Kel-Tec.

The Ruger LC9 gets good reviews. Check out the youtube videos by hickok45. I'd get that one for sure.
You might want to check out this video on the LC9.

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/wheelguns/142996-buyer-beware-ruger-lcr.html

MachIVshooter
May 10, 2011, 01:49 PM
You might want to check out this video on the LC9.

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/wheelgu...ruger-lcr.html

That's an LCR.

Smaug
May 10, 2011, 01:54 PM
Unfortunate manufacturing defect of an early gun, which is not the same gun we're talking about here.

There seem to be a lot less issues like this with Rugers than with Kel-Tecs, hence Ruger's better reputation.

MachIVshooter
May 10, 2011, 01:59 PM
There seem to be a lot less issues like this with Rugers than with Kel-Tecs, hence Ruger's better reputation.

That's also not true, and KT's customer service is head and shoulders above Ruger's. Ruger doesn't even offer an express warranty, though they usually will fix problems. KT, on the other hand has a lifetime warranty, and though it is stated for defects, I've yet to hear of anyone who hasn't had thier KT repaired or replaced, no matter what happened and regardless if they were the original purchaser or not. KT has sent me free replacement parts, no questions asked, even when I told them I LOST (not broke) the part. They even ate the shipping.

451 Detonics
May 10, 2011, 03:34 PM
There seem to be a lot less issues like this with Rugers than with Kel-Tecs, hence Ruger's better reputation.

With Ruger's recalling every thing they have made of late I am not sure that statement holds water.

Both guns will likely do the same job with equal accuracy and reliability. The PF-9s I have handled including mine have better triggers but that is somewhat subjective from person to person. If paying more money for the larger gun with it's unneeded additional safeties makes you happy then buy the Ruger. For a gun that is just as reliable and less complicated, is smaller and costs less buy the PF-9.

Bonus...you can get a 22 conversion for the PF-9 which pays for itself quickly at the range!

Smaug
May 10, 2011, 03:55 PM
That's the same experience I've had with Ruger. Except that when I did something stupid once and damaged a gun, they did charge me for it. I wouldn't be surprised if they didn't charge me for a $0.05 part though.

I bet if we poll the forum on who makes better quality guns, the subjective majority would be "Ruger"

451 Detonics
May 10, 2011, 04:21 PM
Polling fanboys seldom creates realistic results, for that matter the majority of all polls are worthless. I would say the number of new guns sold tells the story much better.

PS...when returning a gun for repair work always ask for a call tag to save shipping on your end, most will send one if the the problem is warranty related.

rugerman
May 10, 2011, 09:24 PM
I've had 2 p3ats (still have one the other is on loan to my son who had his ppk stolen) I have never had a problem with either one after the initial break in period. When .380 ammo got hard to come by I got a pf9, it fits my hand better, has better sights and more power and it is my every day carry with the p3at being the deep concelment gun. The pf9 has been 100% from day one. A friend of mine wanted to shoot my p3at and he couldn't get it to shoot 2 in a row and I had no problems with it so I told him to quite limp wristing it and once he locked it down it ran fine for him too. Also if you are having problems with your ammo and you are using hp try fmj or a different shape of hp if that doesn't work polish the feed ramp and if that also fails send it home to keltec and let them get it going for you. best of luck

rbernie
May 10, 2011, 09:27 PM
I examined and held both pistols; the Ruger did not fit my hand nor grip as well as did the KelTec. I have two PF9s now, and both of them have seen a couple/three hundred rounds through them with nary an issue and surprisingly good accuracy.

Ala Dan
May 11, 2011, 08:02 PM
Also, keep Federal's Hydra-Shoks out of your KEL-TEC P3AT; as the bullet
makes the OAL too long, usually resulting in jamming of the weapon~! :eek: :uhoh:

M2 Carbine
May 12, 2011, 12:10 AM
Although I have 6 Kel Tec guns I haven't shot the PF-9.
I did however buy a Ruger LC9 in Feb. I quickly put over 1,200 rounds of mixed ammo through the pistol without one gun related malfunction.
It performed well from close up to 52 yards.

The LC9 is a good bit larger than the P3AT but can be pocket carried sometimes.

dsb1829
May 12, 2011, 03:33 PM
I went with the LC9 myself. While I do not care for the indicator or the mag lock the thumb safety I did want(mainly to eliminate the possibility of firing the gun while drawing it from pocket). I had been eyeing the kt for about 6mo when the lc9 was released. After handling both guns I formed the opinion that the ruger was made better in terms of fit/finish. I picked up my lc9 last week and promptly fed it ~100rd of 95,115, and 124g bullets in fmj and hp. I walked out of the range very impressed. I did not even have a single mechanical issue, it fed and fired everything. Accuracy was better than I thought, both me and the gun. Don't expect to drop 7rd into a quarter at 10yd, but if you do your part and stay focused it will keep it in 3-4in groups. Take that for what it's worth, usually with my full size guns I do 1.5-3in groups at 10yd.

The trigger takes some getting used to. It can be staged and is consistant though, so once I had a feel for it there was no issue.

Bottom line, I would recommend it to a friend.

GCBurner
May 12, 2011, 03:50 PM
I picked up a new, second generation P3AT last week, as a lighter weight alternative to my Walther PPK. I had two failures to feed in the first 25 rounds I shot, which were remanufactured reloads from Georgia Arms. I've since put two 50 round boxes of Remington FMJ through it with no functional problems whatsoever. I kind of like it, now, and it's considerably lighter to carry in a pocket holster in my front pants pocket than the PPK. I think it's accurate enough for defensive purposes at 7 to 10 yards, and after shooting a .357 magnum, the bark and kick don't really affect me much. It's going to be my new preferred baggy shorts and tee-shirt carry gun for here in Florida in the summertime.

pikid89
May 12, 2011, 09:19 PM
go with an LCP perhaps?

i had the hard chrome PF-9 that i loved...i bought it in the winter time and thus carried it cross draw in the inside pocket of my carhartt jacket pretty much every day, then non winter time in gainesville came around, and as all of you central floridians know...that equals holy crap hot and from my experience,
the pf9 is a belt gun that can be pressed into pocket carry, and if a gun has to be pressed into pocket carry, it wont be pocket carried for long, especially when all you can wear and not die of sweat is gym shorts and superlight golf shorts

so i sold it and got me a nice LCP and i havent looked back

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