Montana Gold Bullets


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steveumd
June 1, 2011, 06:54 PM
I have not used Montana Gold bullets in my loads as of yet.

Are these full metal jacket or plated bullets?

Please offer any insight, experience and rate of success loading Montana Gold would be very much appreciated.

Thanks in advance for any response.

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bds
June 1, 2011, 07:03 PM
Montana Gold FMJ/JHP bullets are brass jacketed (like Remington Golden Saber) and I consider them to be my "Gold Standard" in bulk commercial match grade jacketed bullets with very good finish and consistency in weight (variance usually within 1 gr bullet-to-bullet).

Happily been using them for the past 16 years and treat them just like my other copper jacketed bullets.

There are many regional and national level match shooters who use them.

RMRreloading (http://www.shop.rmrbullets.com/product.sc?productId=6)(longdayjake on THR) sells them cheaper than MG website with free shipping (If you want to try a smaller quantity, you can order down to 250 bullets).

mahansm
June 1, 2011, 07:04 PM
I just took delivery of 10K bullets a week or two ago. They are full metal jacket round nose. Hollow point and complete metal jacket configurations are also available.

I'm starting to load up about 1K or so 9mm and will follow up with 1K .40 S&W. A spot check of weight showed either 114.8 or 114.9 grains for several samples.

Excellent finish and uniformity. Well packed (in one large bag inside an inner box inside the USPS flat rate box. Good service, reasonable delivery time and excellent prices.

Highly recommended.

The only drawback I see is that you must order a case to get best price and a case ranges from 1700 to 4500 bullets (65 lbs). Minimum order quantity is 1000 bullets.

Steve Mahan (in sunny, hot Florida where hurricane season started today)

steveumd
June 1, 2011, 07:33 PM
I appreciate the feedback. I am going to absolutely give MG a try.

Anyone have accuracy MG loads in:

9mm

40 S&W

.45 ACP

357 SIG (yes, I load 357 sig)

38 SPL

357 Mag

swinokur
June 1, 2011, 08:12 PM
Buffalo Bore Ammo uses them in their 10mm stuff.

45ACPUSER
June 1, 2011, 09:15 PM
Thanks

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I appreciate the feedback. I am going to absolutely give MG a try.

Anyone have accuracy MG loads in:

9mm

40 S&W

.45 ACP

357 SIG (yes, I load 357 sig)

38 SPL

357 Mag



Obviously you have not learned how to reload, yet. You work up loads that are safe, reliable, and accurate in your guns. This means you have to do the leg work! No shortcuts period end of story! Next, off I doubt that you being in MA that you will find a vendor to ship componets to you direct in MA. You will probably need to have an FFL holder do your ordering.

steveumd
June 1, 2011, 10:06 PM
Must have taken you considerable time to get all of that commentary out. Good job! I hope that validates you.

Now, get the dictionary and read slowly on. I welcome all feedback and NEVER take a load in any context as safe. There are literally thousands of loads virtually available, claiming to be safe and accurate. None of which can or should be accepted as safe or accurate. Just a note, your intellectual prowess failed to quote SAAMI and I so would have looked forward to reading that in your reply as well.

I appreciate all who offered feedback, even yours, specifically sharing what they have had success with. I do not claim to be an expert by any stretch, and do admit to referencing anything I learn with current, published reloading data.

As far as Massachusetts is concerned, perhaps you should work for the Commonwealth, or maybe you already do. You do not have to publicize or remind the honest, patriotic folks who reside in our state that their Second Amendment rights are under constant attack. Remember Orwell? Your local library should have a large print copy with a glossary of all the big words. Thanks again for the feedback.

Minnesota Wild
June 1, 2011, 11:11 PM
As noted above by bds, MGs are jacketed bullets. I can't say precisely what the metal is, but as he noted they appear to be brass.

I use MG pretty much exclusively in my competition handguns, as do many others who shoot games. http://www.k8nd.com/documents/hl40sw.pdf has great data for 40, and the sight has data for a couple other calibers that I don't shoot. They are a bit more expensive than a couple other manufacturers of jacketed bullets (Zero, Precision Delta) but they are excellent bullets.

As I said above, they are oriented for competition. The FMJ bullet is not meant for expansion, it's meant to be a bit more accurate than the FP bullet and have an enclosed base. If you want to load self defense bullets and want expansion, these are probably not your best choice. If you want a reasonably priced jacketed bullet for competition or plinking, it is one of the best out there.

Also, sorry about the post above your last one. I like this forum because there tend to be less of the sanctimonious people who contribute little and just flame. There are some of those on here, though, and I'm sad that this guy is from the same state as me. I'd be shocked to see the new or experienced reloader that DOESN'T consider good recipies from others in their own guns to at least tinker with. If we didn't, we would all be sampling combinations of 20 different types of powder, 15 types of bullets, and 5 types of primers in varying weights to come up with a good load. I could provide you some loads in the calibers I shoot, but I think you'll get more info off the sight I posted.

1SOW
June 1, 2011, 11:39 PM
I agree with bds: The 124CMJ rn bullets are really high quality. Apparently there is a little zinc mixed in with the copper jacket that give it the 'gold' color and make it a skosh 'harder'. For 124 CMJrn, MG is my first choice.They shoot really well. The RMR site above only offers 115gr bullets. MG ships very fast and is good to do business with.

The 124JHPs also shoot (target) well but are conical in shape instead of having a traditional ogive. Some pistols (CZ/XD) with short headspace have to load these a little shorter than usual. My first choice is the Zero 125 gr JHP with a traditional ogive, but they are often 'sold out' and not reliably available. This too is a 'target'/competition bullet.

I shoot light loads with MG (124gr @ 1045-1055-ish), and have excellent results in my CZ 75B with Vihtavuori n320 at 1.1" oal over 3.9grs for the hollow points and 1.132" over 4.0 for the CMJs. In my gun, this is a light, clean-burning and accurate load.

HP-38/Win231 also runs well with these bullets, but burns very 'sooty' at my preferred speeds. At higher velocities, the HP-38/231 really is a good powder for these bullets.

EDIT to add, re other posts: MY PD experience-- I shot PD's 124FMJ bullets for some time with good results. An order arrived that had serious nose length and shape variations in the bullets. I measured 50 and sent the measurements to PD. They said 'oops', that must have accidentally come from our 'culls' and sent me 500 more. This free 500 bullets was just as bad as the previous 1K. I switched to MG, Zero and lately Berry's as my go-to bullets and haven't had any problems. The cost is just slightly higher, but the bullets have been completely reliable. YMMV

steveumd
June 1, 2011, 11:43 PM
Wild, thanks for the perspective as well as giving me pause to reflect and see that I was really no better than the poster you mention in my reply. It is what it is, a public board where all can exercise First Amendment rights that I also vow to protect. I would appreciate any loads you wish to share. I am willing to reply back with some I have had great success with as well. Thanks again.

frankge
June 1, 2011, 11:49 PM
just bought a case of 124's (3750), usually I get precision delta but they are out and I have given up on zero they never are in stock. At the case they are competative with PDs and I think they are slightly better quality although I shoot PDs mostly and NEVER have had a problem, maybe they are prettier. Is shoot USPSA and use these powders at minor PF - HP38, Unique, Titegroup, and Zip. Just ffing around becasue I like to but they all seem to shoot similar in my G34. Load them all 4.-4.5 with Unique at 5grains. If interested I can give you exact loadings.

bds
June 2, 2011, 12:45 AM
steveumd, people may hesitate to respond to an "Accurate Load" question as many may load what simply works for their pistol (feed/chamber/fire/extract/cycle the slide) using their favored powder(s) that loads broad range of calibers, not necessarily being the most accurate to reduce the number of powders on hand.

My motto is "Holes on target speak volumes" and do powder comparison range tests but find that most loads are more accurate than pistol/shooter :rolleyes::D My recent powder comparison test for Berry's 124 gr HBRN (http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?p=7266869#post7266869) revealed that Bullseye/Titegroup produced smaller shot groups (1.5" at 15 yards off hand) than my W231/HP-38 reference load (Winchester 115 gr FMJ with 4.8 gr W231/HP-38 at 1.135" OAL). Personally, I prefer heavier 124/125 gr bullet for 9mm as I do not need to push them as hard to reliably cycle the stiff recoil springs in my Glocks.

I am currently working on powder comparison tests for 40S&W and will post my results when I finalize them (There are a lot of bullet/powder/charge combinations! :eek:).

As to 45ACP, I shoot mostly lead and found W231/HP38/Bullseye produced the most accurate loads for me. I am also doing powder comparison tests for Berry's 185 gr HBRN that's got similar nose profile as 230 gr RN and will post my results when I finalize them.

------------------------------

Lyman #49 offers following "Potentially Most Accurate" loads:

9mm Luger:
115 JHP - Power Pistol 6.5 gr, 1212 fps, 1.090" OAL
125 JHP - AA#7 7.8 gr, 1119 fps, 1.075" OAL
147 TMJ (Speer) - N340 3.9 gr, 935 fps, 1.115" OAL

40S&W:
135 JHP - Bullseye 5.5 gr, 1070 fps, 1.085" OAL
150 JHP - W231 5.0 gr, 799 fps, 1.100" OAL
155 Silvertip - Power Pistol 7.8 gr, 1082 fps, 1.125" OAL
165 TMJ (Speer) - Power Pistol 7.0 gr, 953 fps, 1.120" OAL
175 Silvertip - WST 5.7 gr, 991 fps, 1.125" OAL
180 JHP - 800X 7.4 gr, 1013 fps, 1.115" OAL
190 JFP - N340 5.6 gr, 870 fps, 1.135" OAL

45 ACP / 45 Auto:
185 JSWC - Bullseye 5.6 gr, 975 fps, 1.135" OAL
185 JHP - HP-38 5.8 gr, 960 fps, 1.175" OAL
200 JHP - Bullseye 5.7 gr, 942 fps, 1.178" OAL
225 JHP - Unique 6.7 gr, 883 fps, 1.243" OAL
230 TMJ (Speer) - 700X 4.8 gr, 867 fps, 1.275" OAL

---------------------------------

Brian Enos forums are great source of match shooter's loads, but keep in mind that their loads are specific to meeting class power factors and/or working with barrel compensators, so they may not be the "most accurate" loads for particular bullet/powder combination.

Favorite powder/loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=58791&st=0&p=683317&hl=favorite&fromsearch=1&#entry683317

Here are some MG related threads you can browse:
9mm Minor PF loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=127803
9mm Titegroup loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=126956
9mm W231/HP-38 loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=113540
9mm 147 gr loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=126904

40S&W 180 gr loads (multiple links on post #3) - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=128734
40S&W minor loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=127585
40S&W 180 gr N320 loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=125831
More 40S&W 180 gr N320 loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=105852

45ACP loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=83171
45ACP 185 gr loads - http://www.brianenos.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=130034

I hope this helped. :D

atygrit
June 2, 2011, 01:03 AM
just bought a case of 124's (3750), usually I get precision delta but they are out and I have given up on zero they never are in stock. At the case they are competative with PDs and I think they are slightly better quality although I shoot PDs mostly and NEVER have had a problem, maybe they are prettier. Is shoot USPSA and use these powders at minor PF - HP38, Unique, Titegroup, and Zip. Just ffing around becasue I like to but they all seem to shoot similar in my G34. Load them all 4.-4.5 with Unique at 5grains. If interested I can give you exact loadings.
Can you elaborate on the on the price? When ever I compare PD to MG, I think the PD's are much cheaper. Maybe I'm looking at the wrong thing, but they just didn't compare when I checked prices.

45ACPUSER
June 3, 2011, 12:02 AM
Copy cat reloading is dangerous for many reasons let me count them for those that are just trolling for loads.

#1 No two guns are exactly a like.
#2 Someone's data could be in error in many forms

Faulty Recall of Load Data
Faulty Scale Allowing for Errant Readings
Could be "Slow" Lot of Powder
Could be shot in aftermarket barrel

#3 The EXACT gun is not used, but this is covered in point #1
#4 The EXACT same components are not used (but not as bad with handgun reloading)
#5 Skill set of the reloader with respect to duplicating COAL, crimp, and other parameters
#6 Testing of loads? is the copy cat reloader as skilled as the person who posted the data?

So many variables. Best to just work up your own loads using your components and testing your guns so that YOU concoct the best ammo you can.

I for fact shoot better then most people, so my loads for instance might not as accurate when shot by another shooter. Point is that unless the ammo is shot in a ransom rest with same gun there is no basis for even trying to duplicate the load. Apples to oranges......

Then again, there is not an experienced reloader that would be so lazy as to not put proper care into working up a load......But some lazy reloaders think they can skip being safe!

:D:D:D:D:D:D:D

bubbacrabb
June 3, 2011, 12:36 AM
Its not that hard to work it up. Just load up a magazine starting low, and ad
.2 increments. Thats how I do it. I found my glock 17 really liked the lower end using Unique. I found with 38 special using lead I needed to up it near the max for good results. Its just trial and error. I have considered ordering some 9mm projectiles from MG, but I ended up ordering 4k of them from Precision delta sense they were cheaper. I dont compete and they hit the steel or paper Im shooting at. Take care. Dont worry about people being rude. There just might not be anything else left to do in that part of the country.

buck460XVR
June 3, 2011, 09:19 AM
.

I for fact shoot better then most people


.............so says everybody on the internet.:rolleyes:

I shoot Montana Gold 200 gr JFP outta my 5'' Colt Government. They work well and their accuracy falls within the parameters of my shooting abilities. Good price on them too.

steveumd
June 3, 2011, 06:53 PM
When shooting and reloading folks get together at the range or club, talk tends to always move into conversations about the performance of a gun or the quality of a load, equipment, competition, hunting and so on. Unless I am mistaken, the forums on this site and those like it tend to have a lot of the same types of discussions. Of course there are those who always have a tape measure handy when comparing themselves to others, or pics on the ole cell phone when they claim to have more in thee X-ring than most. Hell, my dog thinks he's the best when he sniffs the yard too.

Without comparing notes, ie load data, Minnesota Wild said it best:we would all be sampling combinations of 20 different types of powder, 15 types of bullets, and 5 types of primers in varying weights to come up with a good load.

None of the quality posts to this thread have suggested or guided anyone to employ any loads or dangerous practices. Just the opposite. I guess to the majority of this site's membership and readers this point is what, OBVIOUS?

Thanks again to all who posted.

Steve Koski
June 3, 2011, 08:24 PM
Cool: A reloading thread about everything!

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