Kel-Tec Sub 2000 has problems


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Daedalus
January 18, 2004, 09:18 PM
A friend of mine has a new kel tec sub 2000 rifle. He bought some ammo today, we are checking it out before we hit the range tomorrow and there is a problem.

It is a 40 cal version, using Glock mags. Using the 10 round mag the rifle came with we attempted to feed a cartridge and it does not chamber properly.

http://www.gainesvillelan.com/images/keltec/stuck1.jpg

The ammo he is using is winchester white box with a flattened head which seems to be causing the problem. A traditional pointed bullet shape would probably feed fine but this ammo is not doing so.

Investigating the malfunction further we noted that the magazine does not seat completely inside the weapon.

http://www.gainesvillelan.com/images/keltec/magseat.jpg

However, if we put upward pressure on the magazine the firearm with feed properly every time.

http://www.gainesvillelan.com/images/keltec/magseatproper.jpg

Without this upward pressure the magazine appears to be .5mm to low in the weapon to feed this ammunition properly.

Does anyone know what the problem is? We are assuming there is an incorrect match between the mag catch and the notches in the mag. Is this a known issue with these rifles?

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Daedalus
January 18, 2004, 09:31 PM
Doing some more inspection I just noticed something else interesting. The feed ramp appears to be 1-2 degrees askew. I added red lines to assist in making this apparent

http://www.gainesvillelan.com/images/keltec/feedramp.jpg

I believe this in conjunction with the loose magazine fitting is causing the problem. My friend less than enthusiastic about returning his brand new rifle to kel-tec and paying 50$ more for this problem. Can the feed ramp be repaired with a dremel?

Pheonix
January 18, 2004, 09:35 PM
As I don not have a sub.....YET! I can tell you that I have red that several people have had to sand down the bottom of the pistol grip to get the mag to lock in properly.

Nightcrawler
January 18, 2004, 09:35 PM
I'd call Kel-Tec before doing any shade-tree gunsmithing. They have a very good warranty policy.

Daedalus
January 18, 2004, 09:38 PM
As I don not have a sub.....YET! I can tell you that I have red that several people have had to sand down the bottom of the pistol grip to get the mag to lock in properly.

Correct me if I am wrong, but the magazine is too loose. I have not yet found any sandpaper that will add material to a surface.

Pheonix
January 18, 2004, 10:58 PM
From what I have heard the problem was that the mags were not locking into place because they were not fully reaching the lock. So they were loose!

LeadPumper
January 19, 2004, 09:56 AM
I have had my problems with the Sub-2000. Mine is a S&W 9mm style that had an out-of-battery discharge.

After a few phone calls with Kel-Tec, I shipped it back to them and they rebuilt it.

It runs fine now, so don't underestimate the power of Customer Service.

They've done fine by me so far.

-LeadPumper

jYm
January 19, 2004, 07:27 PM
mine never had that problem...

i had a similar problem with a 30rd mag i got from a website recently, but if you hold the mag release button while you load it in it works fine....
mines in 9mm and i love it prolly bout 2000 rounds through it already and no malfunction...

also like it says in the manual to NOT use cheap sttel ammo or it will malfunction...

and also to not switch mag types with the rifle i.e. on the box it will say Glock or S&W 59 like mine..some people try to use Glock mags in the Kel-Tecs made for S&W mags or vice versa and cause problems....

Bobarino
January 19, 2004, 11:10 PM
mine does the same thing. 9mm glock mag version. i already sent it back to cure a bad mag catch, but it still malfunctions the same as yours. in mine, the round usually gets stuck vertically in the reciever, denting the side fo the cartridge. i'm not ready to give up on it yet. if a good thorough cleaning doesn't solve the problem, it'll have to go back for more work. they were very friendly responsive when i sent it back the first time. the only problems i've heard about with these guns have been with the Glock mag versions. perhaps i can talk them into to trading it for a Beretta mag version. mags for those are cheaper anyway.

Bobby

Bobarino
January 19, 2004, 11:23 PM
duplicate. deleted. sorry.

Bobarino
January 19, 2004, 11:42 PM
this is what mine usually does.....

Sven
January 20, 2004, 12:00 AM
When I called Kel-Tec recently, the customer service guy was really friendly and wanted to know what I thought of my product. I could tell they care - subtle but it matters.

Daedalus
January 20, 2004, 12:33 AM
We completely disassembled the rifle and gave all of the parts a good cleaning. This significantly reduced the problem and we were able to fire 100 rounds through it with only 2 occurances at the beginning, the problems seems to have worked itself out.

We got back early due to rain, so we decided to spruce up the rifle a little bit.
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=738838

Dionysusigma
January 20, 2004, 01:02 AM
Good heavens, sir!!!:eek:
Point that thing somewhere else!!!

:D

Nice paint job though...

<slight hijack> How much did y'all pay for yours? </hijack>

Sven
January 20, 2004, 01:08 AM
Daedalus:

That picture really has me worried. It violates one of the most basic firearms rules. I know you knew it was unloaded, but... jeeze, that's not too cool!

Daedalus
January 20, 2004, 01:20 AM
I did not even notice that until you mentioned it. He put the rifle down and told me to take a picture. I guess the fumes from all the clear coat must have gotten to us. Sorry. :o

desertsub2k
January 20, 2004, 04:59 PM
Hey, I'm the idiot in the picture with a death wish, sorry. I guess daedalus is right and all those paint fumes got to me.
dionysusigma--I got mine on gunbroker.com for 245.00 buyitnow.+20 shipping+25 for the ffl transfer. So all in all:290.00 in my hands NIB, which wasnt bad becaues the local gun shop wanted 299.99 plus tax, all i had to do was wait a week. Do you guys think i should paint the rest?

Bobarino
January 20, 2004, 07:28 PM
i paid $289+tax at a local gunshop. the salesman had jsut taken it out of the box and put it on display when i saw it and bought it. he said that happens everytime he opens one.

Bobby

Tropical Z
January 20, 2004, 08:15 PM
Im 99% sure the manual says to not use aluminum cased ammo or it will cause malfuctions.No access to my manual right now however.Dont remember warnings on steel cased ammo.
By the way,i love the paint job-give us some details on how you did it.

DrasticPlastic
August 5, 2006, 01:45 PM
Everyone is concerned for the guy in the nice picture but the first post say's they checked the rifle the day before they went to the range! I don't know about you folks but I don't chamber a round unless I am on the range.They do sell go/no-go gauges @ brownell's for this reason or you could have waited till the next day. It's better than patching your roof and/or expalaining yourself to the cops and looking really dumb. As for the mag catch issues My KTS2K is the 9mm B92 style and some mags (mostly the cheap ones you speak of) have the same problem. My Mec-Gar works the best. Also I would only fire steel case ammo in military weapons like a SKS M45 or YUGO M59/66 they are designed for that type of case, the extractor is stronger to accomadate the mat'l this is evident by the way a SKS spits spent cases as far as 25 feet ( no kidding I measured, and I think they could go further). Using steel case ammo would probably cause the extractor to fail after extended use.

dfaugh
August 6, 2006, 09:49 AM
Everyone is concerned for the guy in the nice picture but the first post say's they checked the rifle the day before they went to the range! I don't know about you folks but I don't chamber a round unless I am on the range.

And of course this would your first post, saying that a blatant violation of gun handling safety rules is OK?

Syndrome
August 6, 2006, 10:08 AM
That picture really has me worried. It violates one of the most basic firearms rules. I know you knew it was unloaded, but... jeeze, that's not too cool!

How do we know he is breaking a rule? The rule is "never point a firearm at anything you aren't willing to destroy" right? What if he is willing to destroy his liver? ;)

geekWithA.45
August 6, 2006, 12:20 PM
What if he is willing to destroy his liver?

There are more entertaining ways to destroy your liver.

Rule 6: Regarding the commemoration of violations of rule 2 with a photograph...

rangerruck
August 7, 2006, 04:22 AM
go to keltec site, and get the buttstock snap on, adds about an inch to lenght. Also order the front rail piece that attaches between the front handguards. Put on a scope ring, then in the scope ring add a small white light. Also go to home depot and get some of that foam tubing for ac pipes, and super glue some around that steel stock, your face will thank you for it. Waa laa! A tricked out keltec. I also added some wrap around velcro to the front, put in a laser pointer light , and velcroed on a little pressure pad switch to the laser. very likey!
But back to my origional thought. you may need to loosen or tighten the screws near and in the grip/magwell. I had some of these same probs using the beretta mags, until i LOOSENED my magwell screws. Problem solved.

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