I've never had a company refuse an owners manual


PDA






Nowhere Man
July 19, 2011, 10:23 AM
Until today. I called Taraus and asked for an owners manual for my Judge. I was told no and told to download it off their website.

I found this odd especially, living in a world of "CYA" a company would refuse to send an operating manual.:scrutiny:


Dave

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khegglie
July 19, 2011, 10:30 AM
if you can just down load the PDf and it will be right there for you to review

kingpin008
July 19, 2011, 10:40 AM
They didn't refuse you a manual. They pointed you towards their site, where you can download it. What's the point of sending you one if it's readily available elsewhere?

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 10:42 AM
In the year 2011, a manufacturer offering an electronic copy that's accessible instantly anywhere in the world 24/7/365 should be sufficiently checking the CYA box.

I don't think thats completely unreasonable that they don't want to deal with the effort involved to field those phone calls, take requests, keep printed copies in stock, mail them out, etc. Its a bigger expense than you think, and less accessible by the customer. Maybe I'm biased since I work in IT for a manufacturer (medical equipment).

ants
July 19, 2011, 10:45 AM
More frequently, companies are referring requests to PDF downloads so they can update quickly if they find errors in the manual.

In this day of CYA, that is even MORE important to them.

I think Taurus did the reasonable thing for you, Dave. If you want an original printed manual to complete a gun in its original box with documents, follow ebay and gunbroker and auction arms until one pops up.

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 10:46 AM
Another point I should add. Plenty of consumer products these days are shipped without printed materials at all. Many computers and other devices just come with a single CD containing all the PDFs, or even just include those PDFs on the device itself.

gym
July 19, 2011, 10:48 AM
This is true, several of the electronic/ kitchen devices I bought recentlly had no manual, you are expected to download it or read it on the computer

NavyLCDR
July 19, 2011, 11:15 AM
Oh come on.... good customer service would have been to at least print the dang manual from the PDF and mail it to him....

Personally, I've had very good luck with Taurus customer service, but I didn't need a manual.

forindooruseonly
July 19, 2011, 11:22 AM
Oh come on.... good customer service would have been to at least print the dang manual from the PDF and mail it to him....

This. Believe it or not, but there are people who don't own a computer or know anything about them, especially in the older age groups.

They should have sent him a copy.

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 11:25 AM
Oh come on.... good customer service would have been to at least print the dang manual from the PDF and mail it to him....

Eh, I disagree. I think clicking a link to read a PDF should be something well within the technical ability of someone who can participate in an online forum enough to complain about said PDF. I don't think its unreasonable expectation by the manufacturer.

kingpin008
July 19, 2011, 11:29 AM
Oh come on.... good customer service would have been to at least print the dang manual from the PDF and mail it to him....

They do it for him, he tells his friends about it, then they end up printing the dang manual for everyone who calls asking for one - thus negating ever having it available on the website.

I agree with Wh!plash - IMHO, if the customer can't be arsed to download their own manual, I feel sorry for that customer.

Mikee Loxxer
July 19, 2011, 11:30 AM
Companies are under a great deal of pressure to control costs, especially in this economy. The expense of printing out a manual and mailing it to you is not insignificant. The manufacturer I work for charges $50 per paper manual.

Justin
July 19, 2011, 11:34 AM
This. Believe it or not, but there are people who don't own a computer or know anything about them, especially in the older age groups.

They should have sent him a copy.

In the case of this thread, it's clearly evident that the OP owns a computer and has internet access.

Sorry, but this is the way of the future. Internet access either via landline or cell phone is nearly ubiquitous for everyone in this country, including even some of the most poor or rural. Furthermore, with the advent of laptops, smart phones, ereaders and digital pads it's much more convenient for both the business and the customer to simply download a PDF that you can read at your leisure or print if you wish to have a hard copy on hand.

What's the point of going to the trouble to have tens of thousands of extra manuals printed, and then mailing them out to people who ask for them, when you can have the entire manual, right now and ready to go in a format that can be distributed for practically nothing?

mgmorden
July 19, 2011, 11:38 AM
Companies are under a great deal of pressure to control costs, especially in this economy. The expense of printing out a manual and mailing it to you is not insignificant.

Indeed. In today's environment, sending out a paper manual everytime someone calls asking isn't a cheap proposition, particularly when a manual has been made available in a fashion that will not cost either party anything.

People love to come in and say things like "See! That's what buying a cheap gun gets you!", but realistically this is the type of things companies with low cost products do to keep their costs down. Some people prefer to reap the benefits (ie, cheaper prices) of buying from a company that DOES try to run efficiently and keep costs down.

Heck, why would I want a PRINTED manual anyways when I could have an instantly searchable and indexed PDF copy?

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 12:10 PM
Heck, why would I want a PRINTED manual anyways when I could have an instantly searchable and indexed PDF copy?

Agreed, I'll always take the electronic copy. Or better yet, a link to the original electronic copy. Because there is one other benefit to mention: revisioning.

If the manufacturer makes a change to the document, they need just change it in one place on their website. That's a huge advantage over having reprint their stock and ditch entire boxes of previously-printed manuals that are now out of date. How about all those boxes of product in the warehouse that were packed with the previous revision of the manual, not to mention all the unsold units in your distributors possession? Especially with a product like a firearm where improper use can cause bodily injury, I imagine it would be a big deal to be shipping units with incorrect info in the outdated printed materials.

NavyLCDR
July 19, 2011, 12:20 PM
I think the business needs to look beyond the immediate cost of an act of customer service and analyze the long term effects of their decisions.

What would have happened if the call went like this:

"I need a manual for my Taurus Judge"

"Sir, are you aware that the manual is available online at www.taurususa.com? We make it available that way so that you can have instant access to it and not have to wait for it to get to you in the mail. In order to save expenses we order only enough printed manuals to include in new guns we deliver to dealers; but if you have no way of downloading the manual, we can print the same file for you and send you a paper copy for the cost of processing and postage."

That answer is likely to satisfy the customer and they are more likely to purchase a product from that company again.

The answer of "we can't afford to help you" is likely to drive that customer to do business with other companies and take friends and family with them.

In today's economy, which costs a company more, mailing out a few documents that they print from a .pdf file, or losing customers and getting a bad word-of-mouth reputation?

Nushif
July 19, 2011, 12:37 PM
I am pretty sure the Taurus answer was not "we are too cheap to help you." That is us talking.
Their answer was probably something along the lines of "Oh, it is easily available! Just go to [the interwebs]"

I know we all hate Taurus, but they are a functional business, give them some credit. 8)

EAJ
July 19, 2011, 12:40 PM
I agree with NAVYLCDR’s business philosophy and would conduct business with his company if he had one. Customer service should always be a top priority. :)

Personally, I dislike working from an owner manual supplied by the manufacturer on a CD. It may be convenient and inexpensive for the manufacturer, but it’s not always convenient or accessible for the customer when you have the PC in one room and your product in another.

M-Cameron
July 19, 2011, 12:43 PM
i would actually be glad they pointed my to the PDF.......ide much rather have the manual now, than wait a week for it to arrive in the mail.

if i want a printed copy( which i do prefer)....simply print it out...


now if the gun was collectable....or somewhat valuable......then i could see calling the manufacturer to see if they had an original copy.

mgmorden
July 19, 2011, 01:13 PM
Customer service should always be a top priority.

Customer Service costs money though, which drives prices up. Everything a company does raises costs which in turn means we pay more. While I do want swift warranty work for things that are broken, I don't mind trading off the "customer is always right we'll send you whatever you want at no cost" bit if it means that I don't need to pay as much up front. Sure a lot of companies used to be like that, but realistically the vast majority of customers never, ever called the company for anything after the sale. Why should they subsidize the ones who demand "full service"?

It's not like you have no choices. There are companies out there that are still like that. If you want that level of service, do business with them. You can't really buy a budget-priced pistol though and expect premium price treatment.

CWL
July 19, 2011, 01:23 PM
If you guys ever run your own business, you'll understand why companies are turning to electronic data files only.

You may think it's easy, but it isn't easy to print, keep warehoused and then ship the dozens (or is it hundreds) of manuals they have to maintain for every firearm they ever manufactured. Don't forget that they have to do this in multiple languages, and they need to hire additional manpower in the shipping office just to maintain this.

Not only are these expenses passed-on to the gun buyer, but these are the kind of expenses that can sink a company.

Ole Coot
July 19, 2011, 01:31 PM
I'm of that "older generation" and even if a manual is available I still download the free pdf file and have them for all my firearms. It is no problem to burn all I need on a CD and store it in a gun safe. I don't know anyone that can't use a computer or knows someone that can print them a manual. I have downloaded manuals on firearms I was considering purchasing just to learn more about them. For what it's worth the first computer I worked on or used was 1964.

RyanAnchors
July 19, 2011, 01:42 PM
Personally I prefer the company puts the PDF online and I can print it out it I need it in person.

ants
July 19, 2011, 02:13 PM
Here's a good question:

Does a product manufacturer have an absolute responsibility to get you a manual?

EITHER:
The man bought a used gun, the seller didn't give him the manual.
What is the original manufacturer's responsibility?
To make up for the seller's failure?

-OR-

The man bought the gun new, and lost the manual.
What is the original manufacturer's responsibility?
To make up for the original buyers failure?



Does the manufacturer have added obligation because guns are dangerous?
So is a car.
So are power tools.
So are electric appliances.
And more than half the consumer products you own.



Manufacturers make manuals available so they can defend themselves when you do something stupid.

They distribute manuals only to protect themselves.
They can do that in print, or pdf, or CD, or any other medium. Their choice.

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 02:26 PM
That answer is likely to satisfy the customer and they are more likely to purchase a product from that company again.

That reasoning always sounds good, but again, it comes down to numbers. Real measurable business metrics, and calculating ROI.

What percentage of unit sales come from customers who:
1. Had that 'favorable' customer support experience in the past
2. Purchased this unit directly as a result of #1
3. Wouldn't have made this purchase had #1 not occurred

I'd say that number is pretty low. Or at least, low enough to justify not having an documentation team on staff to create, update, print, and stock your literature inventory, etc etc etc.

Moral of the story:
Unless you have a customer that just has a god-awful, nightmare of a customer support issue, most people aren't going to swear off a brand for something like that. Likewise, something as simple as this won't normally influence the purchase of something they wouldn't have needed/wanted/purchased otherwise (considering the item is in the hundreds of dollars). The majority of consumers make a purchase primarily because its a product they want.

Real life example. OP, are you saying you'll never purchase a Taurus ever again as a result of this issue? If they had printed a manual and mailed it to you, would it directly influence another firearm purchase that you wouldn't have made otherwise? There's your answer right there. I'm guessing if they come out with another product you like, you'll buy it, otherwise, you won't. And just think, you're one of the vocal minority of customers who will actually take the time to go to an online forum to post a complaint...

Double Naught Spy
July 19, 2011, 02:53 PM
Here's a good question:

Does a product manufacturer have an absolute responsibility to get you a manual?

No. They only have the responsibility to make them available and even then it isn't necessarily required by law.

They do not have to provide them for free with the cost of the product either.

Justin
July 19, 2011, 03:05 PM
Customer service should always be a top priority.

In what way is "Sir, thank you for contacting us regarding getting a replacement manual. If you like, you may have one instantly by going to http://www.taurususa.com/pdf/revolver-manual.pdf" not good customer service?

It seems that some of you are equating the costs of printing extra manuals, storing them, and then sending them out via snail mail with good customer service, when, in point of fact, the service that costs Taurus next to nothing is infinitely better because you get what you want nearly instantaneously, in a non-degradeable format that is also easily searched using keywords.

In what way is that inferior customer service?

As the comedian Louis C.K. put it "Everything's amazing, and nobody's happy."

Justin
July 19, 2011, 03:12 PM
You may think it's easy, but it isn't easy to print, keep warehoused and then ship the dozens (or is it hundreds) of manuals they have to maintain for every firearm they ever manufactured. Don't forget that they have to do this in multiple languages, and they need to hire additional manpower in the shipping office just to maintain this.


Having worked in the print industry, I know exactly what you're talking about. I've seen CONEX containers and rented storage units stuffed full of print products, moldering away on the off chance that a client needed more copies of the product.

More often than not those products would simply sit around until the latest edition would get printed, and the old ones would be tossed. So right there, you have the cost of storage (a monthly fee in the case of a rented storage unit, or lost real estate in the case of a CONEX container on site) plus the cost to print all of those items that had a slim-to-no chance of ever seeing the light of day.

Guess what? The cost of all of that had to get covered along the line somewhere, and I can guarantee that no viable company would pull that cost from their bottom line.

It may be convenient and inexpensive for the manufacturer, but it’s not always convenient or accessible for the customer when you have the PC in one room and your product in another.

There's a solution for that. (http://www.apple.com/ipad/) ;)

BBQLS1
July 19, 2011, 03:16 PM
They informed you of where it could easily be found. I really don't see the problem.

Roger Ronas
July 19, 2011, 03:22 PM
Within the last month I read on the net that 23% of USA can't afford or doesn't know how to operate a computer.
It would have been easy for Taurus to simply direct to pdf and also offered to send if customer desired. They could of offered to print out and send for minimal charge, then the customer could have chosen.
There are good points on both sides of this discussion. The unfortunate part is that the customer ended that communication feeling wronged and that's never good for the manufacture, do matter how minor of an incident.

Roger

Justin
July 19, 2011, 03:25 PM
They could of offered to print out and send for minimal charge, then the customer could have chosen.

I can't think of anything more unprofessional and cost-ineffective than mailing out a copy of something that came off of the secretary's printer.

Yech.

CapnMac
July 19, 2011, 03:28 PM
It is no problem to burn all I need on a CD and store it in a gun safe

This is slightly off-topic, but very germane and worth repeating.

Consumer-grade CD-R and DVD-R use a vegetable-based dye which is what is "burnt" on the disc.

Those dyes have a shelf life.
It's about 6 to 10 years before use.
But, it's only about 24 to 36 months after use before data degradation starts setting in.

You really need to check discs you are relying upon about every three years, to make sure the data is still good.

Which is also complicated, as Recordable disks of 5 and six years ago, those slower 4x, 6x, 8x discs, had more 'permanent' dyes on them. So, you could have very old discs which are good, and newer ones which are not.

I've been to this game a time or two, and it is not fun. OEM discs lost in fire, and then relying upon the in-house copies, to find those copies are not so good.

Double-check your data, mes amis.

mgmorden
July 19, 2011, 03:32 PM
Within the last month I read on the net that 23% of USA can't afford or doesn't know how to operate a computer.

I'd say that for "can't afford", that number is high, and I have little sympathy for "doesn't know how". LEARN. If they didn't know how to read they wouldn't send someone over to read it to them.

Besides, anyone who can't afford a computer a) likely has one available at the library, or b) probably doesn't have the disposable income to afford a gun either.

I can honestly say that despite being a VERY avid "gun nut" - I own over 3 dozen of them, target shoot weekly, reload etc - I'd give up every single gun I own LONG before I'd give up my computer. Modern life simply doesn't work too well without one. The issue with the electric users manuals reinforces that.

mgmorden
July 19, 2011, 03:35 PM
CapnMac: I still have discs I burnt in high school (12-13 years ago) that work fine. I pulled data off of some of them as little as 2 weeks ago. It really depends on the disc quality, but labs have done accelerated/simulated aging on some discs and found them still accessible after a simulated 100 years.

In any event, flash-based memory such as USB "thumb drives" is more prevalent than optical media now anyways, and I can guarantee you that a stored thumb drive - short of getting soaking wet or burned - will probably outlive most of us.

Justin
July 19, 2011, 03:43 PM
Double-check your data, mes amis.

It's also worth noting that there are other ways of storing data as well; thumb drives, portable hard drives, or even cloud-based services.

X-JaVeN-X
July 19, 2011, 03:49 PM
This is slightly off-topic, but very germane and worth repeating.

Consumer-grade CD-R and DVD-R use a vegetable-based dye which is what is "burnt" on the disc.

Those dyes have a shelf life.
It's about 6 to 10 years before use.
But, it's only about 24 to 36 months after use before data degradation starts setting in.

You really need to check discs you are relying upon about every three years, to make sure the data is still good.

Which is also complicated, as Recordable disks of 5 and six years ago, those slower 4x, 6x, 8x discs, had more 'permanent' dyes on them. So, you could have very old discs which are good, and newer ones which are not.

I've been to this game a time or two, and it is not fun. OEM discs lost in fire, and then relying upon the in-house copies, to find those copies are not so good.

Double-check your data, mes amis.
...so get a flash drive instead. I think I read awhile back that the shelf life of a flash drive is like 300,000 hours which is like 34 years. With thumb drives, the biggest cause of failure is using it over and over moreso than just letting it sit. As you read and write over the same areas of memory, the more it degrades, but if you are putting all your info on it and then storing it, it will last a LONG time.....even using it regularly it will last much longer than cd/dvd.

As for the OP's issue....meh...you obviously have a computer and internet connection, go download it and print it if you want a hard copy and move on with life. I'm definitely in the new school thinking of work smarter not harder. I don't think Taurus did anything wrong with pointing you in the direction they did. Now, if you were unable to download the copy for whatever reason (such as not having a computer or internet connection) then, my assumption is they would have found a way to get you a hard copy.

I worked in DSL technical support for far too long. Someone mentioned earlier that portraying the situation to the customer would likely have satisfied the customer and typically I would agree with you on that. Most customers if presented a logical option and explanation to solve their problem will do so and leave happy, but then you do have those that want it their way and only their way and want you pampering them to any end and any use of logic on them is wasted. These are the people that end up posting things like this on forums. It doesn't take much thought to see why in this day and age that Taurus responded the way they did. It makes sense for them and the customer.

Sav .250
July 19, 2011, 03:55 PM
"PDF"............ Sure is quick!

Strahley
July 19, 2011, 04:07 PM
I'd rather have access to an online copy, instead of a paper copy that I might lose, spill something on, rip, etc

Justin
July 19, 2011, 04:13 PM
"PDF"............ Sure is quick!

HA! :D

rodregier
July 19, 2011, 04:34 PM
Documentation delivered on soiled, dead trees is so...20th century :-)

wh!plash
July 19, 2011, 04:35 PM
Within the last month I read on the net that 23% of USA can't afford or doesn't know how to operate a computer.

What about public libraries, internet cafes, friends computers, internet-capable phones, govt subsidy programs...

Did you know there are well over 5 billion internet-capable devices in circulation? And forecast to be over 15 billion by 2015? That's more than two for every person on the planet.

If you have zero way to gain momentary access to an internet-capable device, you're simply not resourceful enough to be handling a firearm in the first place.

As for the "don't know how part", then learn. Or find someone to help, you know, at all those places I mentioned above. Taurus isn't asking you to write a PDF reader in assembly, just giving a PDF as a response to a voluntary request by someone who probably acquired the product second-hand.

So tired of this country having to dumb everything down for the lowest common denominator. Hey I know. Why doesn't Taurus just send a courier to hand-deliver the manual? Maybe he can bring along a pack of Charmin so he can wipe your *** for you while he's there...

geekWithA.45
July 19, 2011, 04:42 PM
In 1990, my professional C++ compiler cost about $300, came on roughly 25 3.5" disks, and also had no less than 10 printed manuals, each of which was a book in its own right. The box was about 3 feet long, and easily weighed about 20 lbs.

At that time, customer service call centers were considered a necessary cost of doing business, and so quality of documentation was considered a primary defense against incurring those costs.

That all changed over about 3 or 4 years. Compiler companies, out of necessity, started charging for their phone support. Overnight, what had once been a cost center became a profit center.

Immediately, the quality of the manuals began to plummet, until we were left with poorly written, barely comprehensible electronic documents shipped on CD.


Eventually, people started slamming them for it, and so the quality of the documents came up to within spitting distance of par.

And now, any manual for anything is available for anything on the 'Net.

All in all, not a bad trade.

firemanstrickland
July 19, 2011, 04:59 PM
There are reasons why company's like taurus keep there costs so low.......

X-JaVeN-X
July 19, 2011, 05:00 PM
What about public libraries, internet cafes, friends computers, internet-capable phones, govt subsidy programs...

Did you know there are well over 5 billion internet-capable devices in circulation? And forecast to be over 15 billion by 2015? That's more than two for every person on the planet.

If you have zero way to gain momentary access to an internet-capable device, you're simply not resourceful enough to be handling a firearm in the first place.

As for the "don't know how part", then learn. Or find someone to help, you know, at all those places I mentioned above. Taurus isn't asking you to write a PDF reader in assembly, just giving a PDF as a response to a voluntary request by someone who probably acquired the product second-hand.

So tired of this country having to dumb everything down for the lowest common denominator. Hey I know. Why doesn't Taurus just send a courier to hand-deliver the manual? Maybe he can bring along a pack of Charmin so he can wipe your *** for you while he's there...
agreed

I was raised to "if you're going to act like a baby, then I will treat you like a baby".

At some point, you need to grow up and start taking care of yourself...parents need to get back to some basics on raising their kids. My 4 year old son can fix and make his own lunch. He can microwave his own meals, make sandwiches, pour his own drink, etc. He has chores he does (which he earns money for as I believe that it's never too early to start teaching a good work ethic). He can also hit a 20 oz. soda bottle with his bb gun from about 10 yds away. My wife and I get weird looks all the time for some of our parenting choices, but when he we hear things like "he has such good manners" and "I've seen 8 year olds that can't make their own lunch" kind of comments we know and believe we are doing the right thing. Even things like toys that have age limits....really...we have to be told when our children can play with a certain toy? It's almost comical.

I realize this is going a bit off topic, but is just a pet peeve of mine. We need to get better at taking care of ourselves and stop depending on everyone and everything else to do it for us. I enjoy new technology and gadgets as much as anyone, but I also know that they aren't a replacement for self-reliance and I take comfort in the fact that if sh*t hit the fan tomorrow, my wife and I both know how to grow and hunt our own food and could provide shelter and other necessities for our family if needed.

LibShooter
July 19, 2011, 05:39 PM
Back in the day, everyone bought guns at local stores and paid 85 to 90 percent of MSRP. Margins allowed for overhead like pretty printed manuals and other such luxuries. Now everyone is chasing the absolutely lowest price, and websites make even a 2 dollar difference important to some shoppers.

I predict we'll see other things go the way of nicely bound manuals. Extra magazines are already gone for some guns. Look for nice cases or cardboard boxes to be replaced by disposable plastic packaging.

Remember when cars came with five real tires?

afponiky
July 19, 2011, 06:30 PM
Within the last month I read on the net that 23% of USA can't afford or doesn't know how to operate a computer.




Then they shouldn't own a gun in the first place!


This isn't even worth eating popcorn and watching this thread anymore..........

BBQLS1
July 19, 2011, 07:59 PM
Within the last month I read on the net that 23% of USA can't afford or doesn't know how to operate a computer.
It would have been easy for Taurus to simply direct to pdf and also offered to send if customer desired. They could of offered to print out and send for minimal charge, then the customer could have chosen.
There are good points on both sides of this discussion. The unfortunate part is that the customer ended that communication feeling wronged and that's never good for the manufacture, do matter how minor of an incident.

Roger

To me, it really just sounded like he just wanted to complain. There are some people you just aren't going to please. I'd imagine that it was offered as a much simpler and quicker solution to the OPs problem. If he had said, he didn't have access, I would think they would have obliged him.

Of course the CS rep might have said "You're such a loser, you don't have a computer. No way you should have a gun if you don't have a computer! Lulz, lulz, lulz. Hah, ha!!!!!"

Maybe I'm wrong..... I kind of doubt it though.....

Maybe the OP could clear the air.... Did they flat out refuse to send you a manual?

RyanAnchors
July 19, 2011, 09:13 PM
I have a 2GB flash drive that I paid $8 for. I can hold days worth of manuals on it.

Also, if someone can't afford a computer, how are they buying guns? lol (then again, I would sell my computer before I'd sell my last SD gun).

Additionally, the public library/local college almost always offers free internet access and often free or discounted printing :]

khegglie
July 19, 2011, 10:04 PM
no problem here that I can see; I got a used gun as a gift this month; went to the web site and downloaded the orig. manual and some other helpful goodies they had available.
info available... go get it

parsimonious_instead
July 20, 2011, 07:59 AM
I agree fully with the OP that it doesn't *feel* very polite, but it isn't unreasonable.
We're in the information age - anything that can be broken down into bits and bytes will be - it saves production cost and makes distribution both cheaper and near instantaneous.
In fact, I can see the "3d printing" revolution taken to its ultimate conclusion when instead of buying physical goods at a store or even online, we simply purchase the right to make a single unit on our home 3d mini-factories.

Nowhere Man
July 20, 2011, 08:29 AM
OP here.

I purchased the gun used and it didn't come with a manual. No big deal, I just like to have it with the guns I own so I can refer to it when I have the gun out if I want to. I don't see a reason to start the computer and find a manufacturers website to read a manual when every other time I've called a manufacturer they've sent me a manual. I guess I'm old fashioned that way. And, yes, I know I can print it but who does?

The guy who answered the phone at Taurus was polite. I was simply told "No. The pdf is available online. Is there anything else I can help you with?"

I didn't consider it rude. It just surprised me which lead me to my posting.


Dave

MMCSRET
July 20, 2011, 09:11 AM
I just save them to my desktop and print pertinent pages. I don't print the standard safety and disclaimers. Usually about 8 pages out of a 40 page booklet does everything I need to have hard copies of.

natman
July 20, 2011, 11:32 AM
It's the 21st century.

Cutting down trees and grinding them into pulp so you can ship printed paper around as a way of sharing information is going the way of film photography, fax machines and buggy whips. I realize can be a bit of a surprise when it actually happens, but that's the way things are going.

Red Cent
July 20, 2011, 11:58 AM
I don't know the question but I REALLY like his ads.

Smokey in PHX
July 20, 2011, 01:18 PM
Go to wwwstevespages.com and they have a manual on virtually every gun made. It's easy, fast, and free.

ObsidianOne
July 20, 2011, 02:45 PM
Inform them you lack an internet connection and have extremely bad safety habits, but extremely good lawyers.
I think they'll overnight one to you :3

saenzrich
July 20, 2011, 04:29 PM
^+1

I bought a used GP100 that didnt have a lock in the case (but did have the owners manual) told them my wife didnt feel safe w/o a lock and got one in the mail in two wks

Jeff H
July 20, 2011, 07:52 PM
This is 2011, there are plenty of places that don't have printed manuals anymore. Heck, my office and my wife's office are pretty paperless these days.

If you didn't know how to use a computer and they still refused to send you the manual, then there would be a real reason for this thread, but since this thread is on the internet and not a hand written letter to the editor, then you probably know how to use the computer.

It is just the way things are these days...I just read a newspaper article that Borders books is about to close 399 stores because they can't find a buyer and they are bankrupt. Actual printed items are more of a liability than an asset these days.

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