gun-cocking holsters


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il_10
July 30, 2011, 02:41 AM
I've heard of the makarov holsters that chamber a round when you draw a few times in conversation and saw one once on a t.v. show, but I've never actually seen one in person or for sale. I just stumbled across this site:

http://getrussiangear.com/index.php?main_page=index&cPath=11

and now I'm kind of curious. I always carry with a round chambered, and don't intend to change that, but I am interested if anyone's ever used something like this and would like to hear what your experiences were/are.

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ichiban
July 30, 2011, 08:42 AM
That might have some merit as a duty holster (provided the user trains a lot with it) but I don't think it would be very practical as a CCW holster. I'd be afraid of not getting it fully charged on the down stroke. Also, it looks kind of slow.

dovedescending
July 30, 2011, 08:54 AM
If I'm seeing this correctly, the trigger is exposed... not a liability I would want, even with an empty chamber.

Old Fuff
July 30, 2011, 11:41 AM
I have one that I got years ago that was made for a Colt Government Model. It worked as advertised, but the maker dropped it because of liability concerns if someone slipped and shot themselves in the leg - or whatever.

At one time some military service MP's would remove the wood plug in the standard USGI belt holster, and chamber a round by partially drawing the pistol, turning it to dig the rear sight into the leather, and then pushing down to cycle the slide backwards. The method worked for them, but never appealed to me.

If someone is really concerned about carrying a cocked & locked pistol, they can add a level of safety by using a thumb-break holster that places the strap over the back of the slide, but in front of the hammer.

SharpsDressedMan
July 30, 2011, 12:02 PM
A lot of GI's discovered that they could twist the 1911 sideways in the holster (after a partial draw), wedging the slide in the holster channel, and jam the gun down, chambering a round while the holster braced the slide. I've tried it, and it works. Not for everyone, especially if you have a collectible WWI or WWII leather flap holster, and don't want to tear up the interior.

SharpsDressedMan
July 30, 2011, 12:04 PM
^^^^This is what happens when you walk away from the computer for a few minutes and THEN finish your reply.:o

mgmorden
July 31, 2011, 10:12 AM
If I'm seeing this correctly, the trigger is exposed... not a liability I would want, even with an empty chamber.

They list a few variations - some have an exposed trigger and some don't. I definately would look into the covered trigger version if I were to look into one of these - I just don't feel safe with an exposed trigger.

That said, I don't feel any aversion towards carrying with one in the chamber anyways, so while a nifty idea, I just don't see the merit in spending this type of money on this feature.

Dnaltrop
July 31, 2011, 03:32 PM
Nifty! I thought the Russians had some sort of patent or there was a treaty blocking the import of these.

Also, aren't these sorts of holsters only good for a certain number of downward draws before they lose their ability to perform properly? Anyone with more experience please?

RX-178
July 31, 2011, 03:47 PM
There was never anything blocking the import of those, it's just that nobody thought they were practical enough to warrant spending money on bringing them to the USA until now.

I think they're kinda cool, and I might buy one just as a collectible, but on a practical level? Gun owners here don't have to keep the chamber empty, like lots of militaries around the world mandate as their official policy. So, can someone tell me the advantage of having a holster that automatically takes the safety off and chambers a round... as opposed to leaving the safety off and a round in the chamber, and drawing out of a normal holster?

The vast majority of unintended discharges are from negligence. With either option, once the handgun clears leather... or kydex, or whatever the hell these things are made of... once the gun is UNHOLSTERED, the gun is in the exact same condition. Safety off, chambered, and just one trigger pull away from firing. I really don't see the advantage, other than as a loophole to get around an enforced policy of carrying with the chamber empty.

FIVETWOSEVEN
July 31, 2011, 08:14 PM
If I'm seeing this correctly, the trigger is exposed... not a liability I would want, even with an empty chamber.

You're right, don't want to dry fire the gun because it could be bad for it.

mgmorden
July 31, 2011, 08:46 PM
You're right, don't want to dry fire the gun because it could be bad for it.

Nothing more dangerous than an unloaded gun. Walking around with an exposed trigger because you "know" the chamber is empty still doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

Twiki357
August 1, 2011, 03:30 AM
I seen to recall (Many years ago) that when the Los Angeles PD was switching to semi-autos, there was a molded holster with an open back and a hole in the bottom for the barrel to go through so that the gun, with an empty chamber, could be pushed down with the barrel going through the hole to push the slide back to chamber a round, then drawn. I don't think it ever became standard issue, or if so, it didn't last long.

BRE346
August 1, 2011, 08:30 PM
Sounds dangerous to me. I'm a believer in one in the chamber, cocked and locked.

Zundfolge
August 2, 2011, 01:31 PM
Seems like a hardware solution to a software problem.

Proper training of your armed personnel and you don't need such silliness (but this is what you get when procurement is done by untrained bureaucrats instead of the actual trained professionals using the equipment).

FIVETWOSEVEN
August 2, 2011, 01:40 PM
Nothing more dangerous than an unloaded gun. Walking around with an exposed trigger because you "know" the chamber is empty still doesn't seem like a good idea to me.

Its fairly easy to carry unchambered safety if you choose to, with no magazine in the gun, rack the slide a few times and both visually and physically check to verify the gun is empty. Close the slide and insert magazine. Your gun is now ready to be carried unchambered. It will not magically chamber itself and will stay unchambered till you rack a round in. Having an exposed trigger is the only way this holster can work, add a trigger guard and then it won't work. This holster worked fine for the Spetsnaz.

mgmorden
August 2, 2011, 03:49 PM
Having an exposed trigger is the only way this holster can work, add a trigger guard and then it won't work.

That's kinda directly contradicted by the fact that they show several models that do cover the trigger.

Their EFA-1 and EFA-2K models have it exposed. EFA-3, EFA-4, and EFA-G17 all cover it. Obviously, they've worked around that problem.

As to checking the gun, to me, from a safety (obviously not a physical) standpoint, verification of an unloaded status has an expiration time. If I check a gun and verify that it's empty, then that verification is good so long as I'm actively working with the gun (ie, cleaning, inspecting, doing dry fire practice, etc).

Any time I discontinue direct interaction and move on to other activities (which is the exact sort of thing a holster facilitates), then that gun is again to be treated as if loaded, and I'm not going to walk around with an exposed trigger on a loaded gun.

This is basically entirely what the first rule of gun safety is about. You don't walk around with a gun carried any less securely or safely "because it's unloaded".

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