Oakland Riots


January 27, 2003, 11:22 AM
After watching the Super Bowl last night the biggest news wasnt who won the Super Bowl, but the riots in Oakland. Over 300 officers were deployed as a precautionary response. More then once I saw individuals mobbing cars. At one point over 20 people surround a car trying to get through an intersection and began shaking this little car up and down.

My question: If I am my family and there was an infant in the vehicle I would not be a happy camper. At that point what would be the "rules of engagement" Say windows are up and doors are locked and your family is with you.

You are legally CCW. :)

Edit to add: What are legalities of pedal to the metal route. News Copters have the event being taped live with spots lights on Mobs.



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Gary H
January 27, 2003, 11:29 AM
You are legally CCW.

In and around Oakland.. You must be kidding.

January 27, 2003, 11:31 AM
I was watching the same thing and I was wondering how brave these lowlifes would be if there was a chance the occupants in the cars were armed.

Gun control in action. :fire:

January 27, 2003, 11:31 AM
In and around Oakland.. You must be kidding.

That was my first thought.

January 27, 2003, 11:34 AM
I would likely be scared spitless and I honestly don't know what I'd do, though reving it up and dumping the clutch comes to mind, as I'd really, really like not to be there. Though I have no idea of their motivations/intentions, it obvioulsy isn't friendly, I'm clearly out numbered, I am in fear for my life and that of my family. If I can't get away, I will defend me and mine. I don't think it's appropriate to brandish the weapon until the security of the vehicle was breached, at which point I'd shoot everything in sight and hope they scatter.

I honestly don't understand why these morons think that society should even slightly tolerate that kind of violent behavior just because of some stupid game, time to chlorinate the gene pool.

January 27, 2003, 11:34 AM
The driver of a car IS armed, with a far deadlier weapon than any handgun.

January 27, 2003, 11:40 AM
Reason #5486 I won't live in that socialist hell hole.

Only state in the country that can't even keep the lights on.

January 27, 2003, 11:47 AM
LOL...where's 10-ring? He must have went back up to Oakland to join the action.

You can take the Filipino out of Oakland, but you can't take the Oakland out of the Filipino! Go 10-ring, go!!! :D

Why don't we see this after IPSC matches? I thought WE were the violent ones??

January 27, 2003, 11:55 AM

Lessons from the '60s:

A problem is that the instigators shove mullets out in front to further incite the mob if one of the mullets gets hurt.

The instigators have zero concern for the rest of the rioters, and they WANT the situation to escalate.

Avoid the areas, and don't stop. Otherwise: :what:

January 27, 2003, 11:57 AM
I can't even imagine having to deal with something like that around where I live. THen again this is not the PRK. Close to it but not PRK yet. I would floor it and keep going. Then again I would never visit a hole like Oakland in the first place.

January 27, 2003, 12:04 PM
Just keep driving, if that means I bump some of these idiots with my car, too bad. A CCW wouldn't even come into play in a situation like this.

January 27, 2003, 12:12 PM
This type of behavior is all too common all over the country. It's the classic mob mentality. I know I would be plenty scared in anything smaller than a tank if a mob of liquored up ne'er-do-wells came my way. Definitely calls for some hasty E&E (escape and evade). As an aside, for grins my wife and I went to see the Gangs of New York yesterday. Now that was nasty mob to beat all nasty mobs.

January 27, 2003, 12:20 PM
I was once in a situation sort of like above-maybe not QUITE so hostile. Driving a school bus full of pep squad girls. Surrounded by a 'sea of humanity' who had lost a high school football game. Screaming and hollering, beating on the side of the bus, rocking it and throwing things.

Put 4-speed manual transmission in first gear and opened 'er WIDE OPEN. Moving very slowly but engine bellering like a bull-the 'sea of humanity' parted like it did when Moses parted the red sea!

NEVER did go back there (or similar places)! SCARED me bad!

January 27, 2003, 12:20 PM
"At that point what would be the "rules of engagement" Say windows are up and doors are locked and your family is with you."

You are in a vehicle. A mob is approaching. What do you do?

Don't bother with your CCW.

Get the vehicle moving and get out of there. Even if you have to push another vehicle out of the way of yours. Or run a red light.

January 27, 2003, 12:20 PM
It's gonna take an awful big bunch of rioters to turn over my Suburban. :D

Note to self: lock in hubs when entering city; red streets can get slick. ;)

January 27, 2003, 12:44 PM
A mob trying to stop my car with me and my family?

Shift down and put the pedal to the metal. ;)

George Hill
January 27, 2003, 12:45 PM
Pop The Clutch.

US ARMY DOCTRINE for response to an ambush... Assault Through The Ambush.
US ARMY DOCTRINE for response to a vehicle ambush... Drop the hammer... Drive out of the Kill Zone.

Both point to the same conclusion. Put the pedal to the metal and get out of the area.

January 27, 2003, 01:14 PM
You can take the Filipino out of Oakland, but you can't take the Oakland out of the Filipino! Go 10-ring, go!!!

Time to break out that fighting stick and balisong!


January 27, 2003, 02:30 PM
Cough Cough Cough Balisongs are not legal in PRK :)

It'd better be a Benchmade or Microtech :)

January 27, 2003, 02:54 PM
As a general rule, I live in the country and spit on the city. Forum rules prohibit my saying what I do in regard to Kommiefornia.

Suffice it to say that if 99% of Kommiefornians :cuss: off and died, it would suit me just fine.

January 27, 2003, 02:56 PM
Cough Cough Cough Balisongs are not legal in PRK

The one I got should be, its got a comb instead of a blade :D

January 27, 2003, 03:01 PM
Bali's are legal here, you just can't buy them, have them shipped, carry in public or in the passenger compartment of your car. If you get it from out of state and brought it home and left it there, it's fine.

We need a football team in Orange County, this place is getting kinda boring, the riots here are just fizzles :D

January 27, 2003, 03:06 PM
Problem is if you injure or kill ANY of them with your car, the BEST thing that's going to happen is that you'll end up in court as a defendant. Your "victims" won't be the despicable low lifes insitigating the riot. They'll be the kids of the rich Marin County blissninny liberals slumming for adventure in Oakland -- mere mullets shoved in front or under your car by the instigators.

I got caught in a riot in Okinawa in 1969. I wanted to see what was going on, but my Japanese friends forced me to stay inside out of sight while it roiled around the building we were in. The rioters were decidedly anti-American, and I sure couldn't pass for Japanese!

Take a look at the police riot gear and vehicles. If you don't have the same stuff AND equivalent trained personnel on your side, a riot can easily consume you like a box in a wild fire.

Riots generally only last a few minutes, so just stay away from them. Go someplace else. Don't stop and don't slow down. Go back the way you came.

January 27, 2003, 03:08 PM
What's a 'mullet', I thought country singers had those?

January 27, 2003, 03:16 PM
That's when you start throwing 40 ounce bottles of Mad Dog 20/20 out the window. When they go chasing them you drive off.

January 27, 2003, 03:41 PM
I can remember people talking about how violent European and Latin American soccer-fans are, especially the English "hooligans"...

January 27, 2003, 03:44 PM
Being originally from Oakland, I was able to call some friends this morning and find out what's up w/ the rioting. We were discussing how poorly the chief of police of Oakland handled things (I guess there'll always be Monday Morning QB-ing going on). Before the Super Bowl the Chief was asked if he was prepared & his reply was that everything possible had been done...they had even emptied the trash cans in the city :what: Potentially volatile situation and his response is trash pick up??

Unfortunately, I kinda knew the Raider fan would find an excuse to live up to their reputation if the Raiders had won or lost...:cuss:

January 27, 2003, 03:53 PM
Before the Super Bowl the Chief was asked if he was prepared & his reply was that everything possible had been done...they had even emptied the trash cans in the city Potentially volatile situation and his response is trash pick up?? Sounds like one good step to me. A full trash can in a riot is nothing but fuel and a container to use to start fires.

January 27, 2003, 03:59 PM
Not that I would be even thinking about it or care given that my life was in danger, but what are the legal implications of running over part of a mob in an effort to escape? Given that it's California, I can't help but wonder if I would be arrested for vehicular homicide because I ran over a few of these poor people who were, "only trying to express themselves.":rolleyes:

January 27, 2003, 04:07 PM
Run the creeps over. I think you would have good cause to do that too. Probably would get charged but at least 50/50 shot of getting off. Legitimate feer of your life. You could cite as refrence that poor trucker in the LA Riots. He stopped and look what happend to him.

January 27, 2003, 04:08 PM
First of all, I knew that "Raider Nation" was going to be just a little bit miffed!! ;)

Second, when the Diamondbacks got knocked off in last years playoffs, you didn't see us rioting in the streets!!

Those goofs in Oakland knew that probably they were safe to loot and burn, because nobody in safe, socialist Oakland was pack'in heat!!

It just goes to show that an armed society is a polite one!!! :D

January 27, 2003, 04:17 PM
What's a 'mullet', I thought country singers had those?It's an old slang term for a victim, bait, mark, sucker, patsy, etc., who's very expendible but a part of a cause that's quite prone to sacrifice him/her to further the cause.

Otherwise, it's a food fish.

I think the slang term came about from shark fishermen using mullet as shark bait.

January 27, 2003, 04:31 PM
Speaking of riots, isn't LA due for one? It's been 10 years since our last one.

January 27, 2003, 04:35 PM
Now 45R, I know the humanitarian in you was hoping for the 'right' answer. You should exit the vehicle and take the opportunity to show the upset individuals that you understand their frustration and truly empathise with their plight. Show them the gentle compassion they are reaching out for and that someone cares for them.

Aww heck, scratch that. Just spin donuts in the middle of the street till the tires melt off. They'll think you're crazy. Yeah, that's the ticket.

ps. Also, the assult truck come to mind.

January 27, 2003, 04:51 PM
Skunk- I've always been told balisongs were illegal to posse. End of story. Have any references.

Blackhawk: A good example of mullet is to look for a WWE wrestler that goes by the slogan "Latino Heat" :neener:

Shalako- I dont think that poor VW bug that was getting mobbed is capable of doing donuts :) I would have rolled down the window a tad and started pepperspraying everything in sight.

The country will never be a Raider Nation if these idiots are the fans that represent this football team. I dont understand the mentality of destroying the place you live just because your football team lost or won.:cuss: :fire:

On a better note I'll see you at the range tonight!


St. Gunner
January 27, 2003, 04:58 PM
What are legalities of pedal to the metal route.

Smash it through the floor, loot the mob with the front bumper and make a break for Texas, tell us you where moving here anyway and wanted to make sure the trash from Oakland didn't follow you, we'll keep you from getting extradited. :D

On a more serious note, cars are way more deadly than guns on a daily basis, use the most statistical stopper in a situation where your life is in danger. Who was the poor trucker got jerked out of his rig and beat with a brick in LA during the riots? Roger Denny or something wasn't it? Reverse may be your best option if the throng of trash is decending from the front.

Then you could back off 100yds and get a running start. "Bowling for rioters and looters on the next Jerry Springer..."

January 27, 2003, 05:00 PM
How about:
One shot stops: Minivans vs SUVs thread? :D

St. Gunner
January 27, 2003, 05:05 PM

Mini-vans are poor stoppers, I hit a whitetail deer that weighed about 125lbs with a ford aerostar, it killed him in the end, but not before he suffered for awhile as I looked for him in tall grass on the side of the road. $6,800 damage to the van, it had 800 miles on it.

Now my old Ford f250 1984 model 4x4, you could take out whole mobs and never scratch the paint. It had bumpers that looked liek the A-team had built em to ram tanks with.:D Poor ol truck, I only got 500,000 miles out of it. It claimed a couple deer when it was mine, never so much as busted a headlight. It claimed a Ford XTP once to, gal rear-ended me at 45mph as I sat at a stop light. It bent my drop hitch, it totalled her car.

For Urban assualt tactical planning budget in a large SUV, much better than the mini-van.


January 27, 2003, 08:12 PM
Anybody have a summation of the riots that have occurred in relation to wins/losses in championship games and how those riots may be cross-indexed to the predominant political party in charge of the riot scenes?

I know what my educated guess would be...and I'd bet that things haven't changed much in the last two or three decades.

January 27, 2003, 08:16 PM
I have a compact SUV. It's the SUV equivalent of a .380. Should I turbocharge it to get it to a +P+ rating?

It's been so quiet in socal. Ho, hum. We thought there may be riots last summer over the Inglewood/Morse dilleo...oh well.

Hey, riots aren't that bad. If it weren't for post-game riots, I may not have met the love of my life ;)

January 27, 2003, 08:37 PM
Roger Denny or something wasn't it?
Reginald Denny. I couldnt believe my eyes.:what: Poor guy.

10-ring stole my thunder. I knew that Oaktown was gonna riot, win or lose. I called it days prior. Losers.

A friend of mine was remodeling a house on "The Hilltop" in Tacoma years ago. The Hilltop is/was a very black neighborhood high in crime. Its better now due to drug houses getting seized,I'm told. Anyway, one night after work as he was starting to drive away, a gang of wayward youth walked out infront of him to slow him down to grab tools out of the back of his truck. He said he could see them real good as they :what: when the secondaries kicked in on that big 454! Needless to say, they got scarce quickly!:neener: :cuss: :evil:

January 27, 2003, 08:39 PM
Honda Civics= Frangible round
Ford Pinto = Incindary round
Mercedes Benz = JHP
Chevy = 230Gr ball. Like a rock


Those riots in Europe are pretty bad. I'd hate to be the guy on the bottom getting stomped on.

Sometimes I wish mommy would teach people "Its just a game!!!"

January 27, 2003, 08:41 PM
Sometimes I wish mommy would teach people "Its just a game!!!"

No kidding.

Some people. Just can't understand them.

January 27, 2003, 08:46 PM
We need to come up with a tactical lession plan that begins at pre-school and educate people that games are for fun, no bloodshed needs to be involved.


Uncle Ethan
January 27, 2003, 09:05 PM
Skunk- "The love of your life?" --tell us more? When did this happen??

Admiral Thrawn
January 27, 2003, 09:27 PM
Idiots... it *is* just a game.

If I was in my car on my own or with my family, and a mob came and tried to surround, damage and tip over our car, I would just drive straight through them without blinking an eye. There is no question; my priority would be to escape the danger area as fast as possible by the safest means possible.

January 27, 2003, 10:14 PM
Keep talking like that, and the gummint in the Land of Oz will be forced to ban cars.:uhoh: :what: :evil:

Neal Bloom
January 27, 2003, 10:23 PM
These people will use any reason to riot or make trouble. Its too bad they are using a game as the reason since this gives all Raider fans a black eye. Not all Raider fans are criminal.

Kahr carrier
January 27, 2003, 10:25 PM
Boy those OAKLAND residents are crazy, I drove thru Oakland last night 39th ave and it look like a war zone CHP ,Sherriffs,OPD and the fire dept were out in force. In all my years in the PRK have I have never seen a sight such as that except the LA riots. Those drunk clowns were going wild .LOL if you were in another part of Oakland and needed a cop .:banghead: :what:

Kahr carrier
January 27, 2003, 10:28 PM
Oakland-WELCOME TO THE JUNGLE>:neener:

January 28, 2003, 12:48 AM
Dudes, it's the Raider Nation. You pull out your pistol to defend yourself and they'll all pull out something that's bigger, better, illegal, and probably fully automatic. That being aside, a little recon work of where you wanna be when you know stuff like this is gonna go down is best, then you avoid it. If the Oaktown po-po are expecting trouble maybe you should watch where you're going and get ready to make U-turns to haul ***.

Oh yeah, it was all Barrett Robbins fault!!!

January 28, 2003, 12:51 AM
Who Barrett?? :D KABLAM!!!!!!!

January 28, 2003, 01:00 AM
The more posts I read re: Oakland, the more I'm getting home sick. :(
I really liked the Raiders pre-move to LA. They were my team growing up. Since then, they really adopted the thug life and have really lived up to that reputation. :cuss:

January 28, 2003, 01:47 AM
Yep, has nothing to do with football or winning/losing. It is an excuse for a group of people to riot en masse because they know that there is little or no chance of being held accountable.

Uncle Ethan
January 28, 2003, 11:35 AM
So it was the thug union that lobbied to ban the "streetsweeper" to increase their safety.

January 28, 2003, 03:32 PM
So it was the thug union that lobbied to ban the "streetsweeper" to increase their safety.

Yes, the thugs probably all voted for Perata! Is Oakland in or near Alameda?

January 28, 2003, 03:43 PM
Is Oakland in or near Alameda?

Yes...Well, city of Oakland is in Alameda County. Although there is the City of Alameda too.

January 28, 2003, 10:29 PM
THat explains it. Those are the people that voted for the Beretta totin' liberty rifle ban clown and made my life miserable :fire:

January 28, 2003, 10:44 PM
There's never anything to riot about in 2-14 Bengals country.

The fans are either dead drunk or fast asleep ten minutes into the first quarter.

Greg L
January 28, 2003, 10:51 PM
There's never anything to riot about in 2-14 Bengals country.

Well, not football related anyway. ;)


January 29, 2003, 09:26 AM
I use to live on Alameda. Went to Oakland twice and each time had a life threatening experience. That was many years ago.

I wouldn't go back, but if I did:

My Caddy has traction control, is built like a tank, and does a 12 second quarter mile. Good sound deadening too (Errr, sound proofing?) :D Wipers might not be up to the task, but hey, ya gotta do what ya gotta do.

Kahr carrier
January 29, 2003, 09:46 AM
Oakland Thug life is an under statement ,I work there and man you see the under-belly of life everyday. Last year they had over 100 murders and I am sure they will probably top that this year.:(

January 30, 2003, 06:29 AM
Skunk:Whats a mullet?

Here is a good example:


January 30, 2003, 08:28 AM
Eduardo Guerrero is... White?

I'll never see this as a legitimate method to balance racially lopsided crime stats. Why wont LEO call a spade a spade (for you PC (politically challenged) types that means "tell the truth and not cheat" and a spade is something you'd find in a deck of cards, card games have rules)?

Do hispanics actually approve of this :confused:

January 30, 2003, 11:53 AM
Last year they had over 100 murders and I am sure they will probably top that this year.

All this rivalry between northern and southern Cali. They just know we (Los Angeles) topped them for murders and they're trying to pass us by.

Uncle Ethan
January 30, 2003, 12:37 PM
Yeah, who says the younger generation doesn't believe in competition and core values.:rolleyes:

January 30, 2003, 01:30 PM
Ryder -
FWIW, "hispanic" isn't a race, it's and ethinic origin (i.e Spanish/mixed by way of the New World). Anthropologicllay, there are only three races: Caucasoid (white), Negroid (black), and Mongoloid (yellow), though there's eveything in between in the category of 'mixed race', though there are plenty of silly rules for labeling people 'more specifically'.

Likewise, you do not have a gender, you have a sex. Gender is a language construct that refers to the sex of the subject, i.e. male, female, or neuter (usually reserved for inanimate objects).

BTW, a 'spade is a spade' reference originally came from the olde English notion that a shovel is a shovel, you can't call a shovel a hoe - had nothing to do with cards . . . .

January 30, 2003, 05:02 PM
You couldn't get a CCW in Chokeland if Jerry "moonbean" Brown and Gray Davis were your best friends. You are driving a 2-3,000 pound rifle. Use it if in danger.

Mark D
January 30, 2003, 05:28 PM
Would I do what a bunch of perfumed courtroom law-jockeys deem to be "legal"??? Probably not. If my wife and child are in danger from a rioting mob, I will exit the scene as quickly as possible. If that means 4-lowing through the crowd, so be it.

I saw an interview with a retired SEAL once. The reporter asked him if he ever regretted killing, or ever wondered if he might have killed an innocent person by accident during his career. The SEAL just smiled and said something akin to, "If the people I killed were there to begin with, they were there by choice long after all of the "innocents" had left the area. That automatically removes any doubt about me killing someone that was innocent. No, I don't have any regrets."

If your participating in a riot and you get hurt or killed, it's your own dumb fault.

January 30, 2003, 09:24 PM
:) Thanks Mike, that makes sense.

For some reason I think adding the word "hoe" to the definition of spade is only going to cause even more of an uproar. :rolleyes:

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