Over 60 carry--How much handgun training


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27hand
August 7, 2011, 09:51 PM
OK, I'm over 60, actually closing in on 62 in a couple months.
I saw the thread about what yinz 60 plussers carry. Pretty wide variety with some nice carry guns as well as some that have some wear.

Pennsylvania does not require any kind of training to carry concealed and aside from Philly ( only first class sized city in Pa.), we don't need a License to Carry a Firearm ( LTCF is our version of a CCW or CCP) at all to openly carry.

I know some states require training to get a CCW although I'm sure it's basic at best.

My question.

How many over 60 people on this board have training specific to the use of a handgun for self defense?

I started to carry concealed about 12 years ago and since that time have attended a few 20+ hour basic tactical pistol classes, a few night/ low light classes, some tactics classes, a close quarters class and have done some simunitions training.

If you have the mindset that you don't think training is a big deal, chime in with your thoughts on why.

I know it may be difficult but I would also not like to see the thread degenerate into a training/ nontraining debate. Lets go KISS here with a few thoughts from each on the subject.

27hand

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blindhari
August 8, 2011, 02:41 AM
I have taken 3 courses in 8 yrs mostly for legal update. I am a point shooter, plain and simple. busting about 300 38 special a month to maintain familiarization(?)

blindhari

TexasBill
August 8, 2011, 03:08 AM
Went through police pistol training many years ago but I really learned gun handling through some great one-on-one training from friends who really knew their business.

Would like to get some refresher training, though. The range I frequent doesn't allow real defensive firearms practice and more training is better than less.

azyogi
August 8, 2011, 03:08 AM
I tried to take one, was more like a sales pitch for the latest greatest wunder pistol they had on sale that week.

bikerdoc
August 8, 2011, 08:54 AM
63 this month. CCw in three different states since the 60's.

Whole bunch of training over the years = military, leo, and private.

The private paid instruction on SD was the best.

Standing Wolf
August 8, 2011, 01:14 PM
I've both taken and taught classes. I've never cared for sitting in class rooms and listening to teachers, but must confess I've never taken a shooting-related class that wasn't worth the time and effort. Curiously, I've always done a good job of keeping classes lively for students.

SigP229R
August 8, 2011, 04:30 PM
Just turned 68 and, I took the class that was required in N.C. for CCP however all my safety and handleing is self learned and I try to visit the range as aften as I can. I carry a SigP229R in 40 S&W. and sometimes a Sig P6 in 9mm.

Odie Bar
August 8, 2011, 07:46 PM
79 years young in a couple of weeks. Learned gun handling and saftey on a ranch and in the military and years of experience will generally teach you something although certainly not everything. But have never attended a civilian sponsored class. For those with a little less experience and who want to learn safe habits that have taken a life time to aquire, I strongly recommend gun handling and saftey courses. Makes it safer for all those around you as well as yourself. I have seen some pretty scarey people in the way they handle guns. I carry a Ruger LCP with laser sight as backup to Pepper spray.

moxie
August 8, 2011, 09:06 PM
Not 100% sure what yinz means, but will go with y'all. The plural of y'all is all y'all, so what's the plural of yinz?

I'm in Texas, and the state requires an all day class to get a CHL. The class I took was excellent, and my range offers a variety of classes as followups depending on need/experience. I think a good basic training class is important from a safety and practicality point of view. I don't think we are born shooters any more than we are born NASCAR drivers. A bit of training makes good sense and I don't think anyone should feel their 2nd Amendment rights are being infringed by such requirements. (Yes, yes, I know that there is no right to drive in the Bill of Rights, so let's not go there.)

bergmen
August 8, 2011, 09:08 PM
61 here (62 in a couple of weeks). I've had my California CCW for about ten years. First course (a darned good one) was 16 hours (two 8 hour days on a weekend). Renewal classes are 4 hours on a Saturday once every two years.

In addition, our club has IDPA with a full Saturday shoot every month. Tremendous way to develop outstanding defensive gun handling skills as well as absolutely no-compromise safety skills and drills drummed into you.

I would highly recommend IDPA. Other possibilities would be more time consuming and spendy but Gunsite in Arizona has one week courses that are world class and extremely comprehensive. I'll take one of those someday.

Dan

jem375
August 8, 2011, 10:53 PM
Sorry, have been shooting and hunting since 1945 and personally don't think I need training at all, I think it is a waste of time unless you of course think you need the training. The training classes costs too much and by the time you take the ammo required, it is too expensive.

plateshooter
August 9, 2011, 05:00 AM
I am 63. I take at least one gun fighting class a year. Money and time well spent. Shooting with a gun and fighting with a gun are two different things as far as I am concerned. If I am going to carry a firearm, I am going to be the best I can be. Force on force is a real eye opener as to what you "think" will work opposed to what will work.

snooperman
August 9, 2011, 11:37 AM
in the U.S. Army as a tanker in the 4th armored div in Germany 1960-1963. I carried the U.S. 45 cal pistol as well as the M3 45 cal submachine gun. Also shot in competition with various clubs over the years. I have a CW permit for the past 25 years and shoot about 3 days a week now at my farm range as a semi-retired farmer.

bergmen
August 9, 2011, 12:27 PM
Sorry, have been shooting and hunting since 1945 and personally don't think I need training at all, I think it is a waste of time unless you of course think you need the training. The training classes costs too much and by the time you take the ammo required, it is too expensive.

Well, there are carry and defensive tactics that are much different than any other shooting or hunting activity.

Seeking cover, minimizing exposure, weapon presentation, strong hand/weak hand methods, when-how-whether to engage, etc., etc. Legal aspects to defensive use of force, the list goes on and on.

I was in the same position as you, shooting and hunting for 40+ years but exposure to the CCW realm completely revolutionized my knowledge base. As an example, the four colors of situational awareness is something I use 24/7.

Dan

mrt949
August 9, 2011, 04:17 PM
Will be 62 IN SEPTEMBER .I do a tactical match every couple of weeks.

jimniowa
August 9, 2011, 06:23 PM
I am 67 and have been carryng on and off for many years. Some time ago the state formalized the requirements for ccw and a coarse was required both lecture and practical experience. I found that it was worth the time and expense. Since then my wife attended the coarse as our daughter and son-in-law. We shoot regularly weather permiting and I reload. The interaction in the class is great and produces some safer people packing, many have upgraded there weapons to something they are comfortable with in using.
Jim

27hand
August 9, 2011, 09:20 PM
jem375, no need to be sorry. I asked for and appreciate your response. Most of my coworkers have the same mindset as you posted.

The cost of classes are going out of sight. In many instances, they are hovering at about $500 for a 2 to 3 day class with about $200 to $300 in ammo, a few hundred for missing at least a day of work unleess you get paid time off.

Meals and lodging if nothing is available in your area. All the incidentals, battery powered hearing protection ( this is pretty much a necessity for my over 60 butt), a spare gun (mechanical stuff breaks-- I've seen it on our range), flashlights for low light stuff, even gas to and from.

My friends can afford it but since they see nothing tangible in their hands ( new gun--buckets of ammo), they don't see the need.

I was going to post up a bunch of things covered in training classes but for now, I'd just like to see how you guys view the need and whether or not each one thinks it is necessary.

Thanks for the responses gentlemen.

Capt. Ct.
August 10, 2011, 03:10 AM
Well I turned 60 four months ago. My father and older brother taught me gun safety and handling. I took police science in college and part of that was a six month firearms course. Point shooting, right and left hand, and so on.
Went in the Air Force and had more training with a S&W .38 special and M-16. I became capt. of the base pistol team.
Later I went into the Army and qualified as a small arms expert. I also qualified with German small arms.

JohnBT
August 10, 2011, 09:10 PM
"training specific to the use of a handgun for self defense?"

My father was a farm boy, WWII vet and VA State Trooper. Does that kind of training count? His first cousin was the county sheriff for 27 years.

They didn't charge or sell hats though.

John

gvf
August 11, 2011, 04:49 PM
OK, I'm over 60, actually closing in on 62 in a couple months.
I saw the thread about what yinz 60 plussers carry. Pretty wide variety with some nice carry guns as well as some that have some wear.

Pennsylvania does not require any kind of training to carry concealed and aside from Philly ( only first class sized city in Pa.), we don't need a License to Carry a Firearm ( LTCF is our version of a CCW or CCP) at all to openly carry.

I know some states require training to get a CCW although I'm sure it's basic at best.

My question.

How many over 60 people on this board have training specific to the use of a handgun for self defense?

I started to carry concealed about 12 years ago and since that time have attended a few 20+ hour basic tactical pistol classes, a few night/ low light classes, some tactics classes, a close quarters class and have done some simunitions training.

If you have the mindset that you don't think training is a big deal, chime in with your thoughts on why.

I know it may be difficult but I would also not like to see the thread degenerate into a training/ nontraining debate. Lets go KISS here with a few thoughts from each on the subject.

27hand
I started carrying at 59 and now am 63. I shot a handgun twice in my life and a rifle once when I got my permit. I trained myself with help of off-duty police at my range and other shooters and range officer. Also, Homeland Security leases space there and a range and does training. Helpful too.

We have computerized targets and draw and fire live if we are trusted (I am) and run target in like a BG running at you and draw, fire etc. I'm a good shooter now, and go to the range at least once a week and feel competent carrying a weapon. What would happen IF? I don't know, that's up the moment and fate - and those weeks and weeks of practice. Like everyone else, you do what you can and hope for the best - IF.

hardluk1
August 12, 2011, 11:50 AM
I have carried for 26 years and hunted with hundguns on and off for 42. I am 55 years old now. I did take a ccw class in florida when I started and one in NC when we moved here. I shot with seveal leos that I road motorcyles with back in florida and just felt both then and now that most of what these defence training class's deal with people that carry wearing coats vest and much more normal holster in side or out side the belt. All not what i do. So I just rely on many years of hunting and carry'n. So much is about being comforable with your handgun and haveing good muscle memery. I also tend to shoot close up with just a point and shot style not aimed fire. Save the controled fire for more than 12 to 15 yards. My knees have been junk for some time so know running around, no kneeling to fire quickly. If i get down ,I am there for a moment. I also pocket carry mainly or appendex carry IWB and that seems to no be what most defence/tactical class's want there.

Hangingrock
August 13, 2011, 09:36 AM
It seems that shooting schools/instruction/methodology/courses are in abundance. I question the quality in relationship to the quantity of instruction. Some instructor’s seem to value their signature of procedures as opposed multiple problem solving concepts. It’s almost like the right way, the wrong way, and their way.

I’ve had instruction. Some of it was shooting up bang - bang with a staggering round count while others were more class room. There is a balance point.

My observation is that there are those that attend course of instruction with one type of pistol as an example yet CCW with another type.

AZ_Rebel
August 13, 2011, 01:06 PM
I've carried a gun since 1958 and thought I was a pretty good pistol shot.

In 1979 I took my first trip to Gunsite and Jeff Cooper showed me what I did NOT know!

Went back for many more courses in Pistol, Rifle and Shotgun. These were some of the most informative and entertaining weeks of my life. Some of my instructors were Clint Smith, Robbie Barrkman, Louis Awerbuck and the Stock Brothers.

I learned much from Col. Cooper, the Gunsite Staff and the many, varied students I had the pleasure to shoot with.

RedAlert
August 13, 2011, 06:03 PM
I'm two months shy of 64.
In the Navy, I had several training courses on the 1911. Total of about 80 hours of range time. As a civilian, I've only attended one SD course and that was a couple of years ago at Front Sight where I took the basic Pistol SD course. Since then I've done a fair amount of "DRY FIRE" as promoted by Front Sight.
Range time when I can afford it.

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