30 carbine pistols....


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chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 12:20 PM
Who makes/made them and who has one. Pics please....

Bill.

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Sam1911
August 10, 2011, 12:24 PM
Revolvers? The only one I know of is Ruger who makes a version of the Blackhawk in .30 Carbine.

I have one. I don't have a picture of it, but here's a link to an article with a photo: http://www.lasc.us/fryxellvarmintrevolver.htm

rcmodel
August 10, 2011, 12:26 PM
Ruger Blackhawk is still being made.

http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkBlued/models.html

They are terribly loud, and the muzzle blast & ear splitting crack is far worse then a .44 Magnum.

Taurus also lists one but I have never seen one, and wouldn't buy one if I did.
http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=186&category=Revolver

rc

arcticap
August 10, 2011, 12:31 PM
The Taurus Raging Thirty has been out of production for years but looking at the used prices that they command shows that they're much sought after.

AMT made the Automag lll in .30 Carbine.

Photo links:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:MY_AUTOMAG_III.JPG

There was also the Enforcer made by Universal:

Photo link:

http://picturearchive.auctionarms.com/296820/7341876/f70296421a71aea5c44710c7bceadbc3.jpg

http://www.m1carbinesinc.com/UniversalEnforcer2.jpg

SDC
August 10, 2011, 12:44 PM
At one time, a company called Kimball also made a 30 Carbine pistol, but they gained areputation as being unsafe to fire after a couple of them came apart; they were essentially blowbacks, and the slides came off.

chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 12:52 PM
Sam1911...

Thanks, do you enjoy shooting it? How is the recoil on it? Is the recoil comparably to say a 44 mag or 357 mag?

Bill.

chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 12:55 PM
Ruger Blackhawk is still being made.

http://www.ruger.com/products/newModelBlackhawkBlued/models.html

They are terribly loud, and the muzzle blast & ear splitting crack is far worse then a .44 Magnum.

Taurus also lists one but I have never seen one, and wouldn't buy one if I did.
http://www.taurususa.com/product-details.cfm?id=186&category=Revolver

rc
Thanks for the reply RC...

What do you think makes them so loud compared to a 44 mag? In your opinion, couldn't we reload the large muzzle blast and crack out of it using a powder more suitable for short barrels?

Bill.

Sam1911
August 10, 2011, 12:58 PM
Oh, I can't say that I shoot it very often. It sure fits a weird niche. But it is a lot of fun when I do.

It does have a little "blast" to it. Nothing to make you run home and cry, but it will probably be more noticeable than other handguns.

Handgun recoil is so subjective that I don't know what to tell you there. "Minimal" would be my assessment, but I tend to think of recoil in terms of "Magnum" (300 gr. at 1200 fps or more), "Not Magnum" (pretty much everything else), and ".22"

So it's a "not-magnum" level of recoil. I guess it would be a little like a hot 9mm or a .357.

Sam1911
August 10, 2011, 01:00 PM
couldn't we reload the large muzzle blast and crack out of it using a powder more suitable for short barrels?
Sure. It's a revolver. You can make up just about any load you might want for it.

My Speer No.11 manual has a page of .30 Carb revolver loads -- not just the H110 or 2400 loads you usually use in the carbine.

Trailboss and a lead .308 bullet would make a fun pinking load.

Kendal Black
August 10, 2011, 01:06 PM
Iver Johnson, as well as Universal, made pistols on their own renditions of M1 carbine actions, & also generally called "Enforcer" pistols. http://www.google.com/webhp?hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1C1CHNV_enUS400US400&q=m1+carbine+enforcer+pistol&gs_sm=e&gs_upl=10401l11725l0l12502l9l7l0l0l0l2l388l1004l2-1.2l3l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&biw=1024&bih=653&ie=UTF-8&sa=N&tab=iw#sclient=psy&hl=en&safe=off&rlz=1C1CHNV_enUS400US400&site=webhp&source=hp&q=m1+carbine+enforcer+pistol&pbx=1&oq=m1+carbine+enforcer+pistol&aq=f&aqi=&aql=&gs_sm=s&gs_upl=0l0l0l32355l0l0l0l0l0l0l0l0ll0l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.&fp=81eba942b626e508&biw=1024&bih=653 They were not highly popular: On the bulky side and very loud.

content
August 10, 2011, 01:32 PM
Hello friends and neighbors // The main thing I notice is more consistant groupings past 25yards, not recoil.

Just got one in 2009, great to carry when walking the woods with the M1 Carbine.

7 1/2 inch and as accurate as you'd expect a Blackhawk to be.
Compared to shooting .357mag ,recoil is close to my 6" S&W 586, , as far as barrel tilt, but a Blackhawk rolls so felt recoil is much less with the .30 carbine cal.

They are loud with a bit of flame.
Just adds to the fun.
147115

chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 01:46 PM
Thanks all. I'm not scared of the recoil, just curious. I like the flashy/noisy. As sam1911 said, it a niche.....kind of unique. I'm curious like a monkey with it right now.

Anyone have a clue at what this round will do to forcing cone, flame erosion?

Please keep pic's coming if you have them. You all are great.

Bill.

keyboard commando
August 10, 2011, 01:48 PM
Don't forget AMTs' stainless semi auto.

SaxonPig
August 10, 2011, 02:55 PM
I had a Ruger and clocked 110 grain military ball ammo from the 7.5" barrel and found it went 1400 FPS. I have loaded 110s in the 38 Special to that velocity. I was unimpressed and sold it. The 30C in a handgun can't get off its knees in terms of power. All it makes is a boat load of muzzle blast and noise.

chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 03:52 PM
Don't forget AMTs' stainless semi auto.
Thanks, I'm mainly looking for revolvers right now.

Bill.

sgtdevildog
August 10, 2011, 03:57 PM
US Firearms I think still makes a .30 carbine revolver SAA - expensive but seem to be quality.

chevy_dmax
August 10, 2011, 04:03 PM
I had a Ruger and clocked 110 grain military ball ammo from the 7.5" barrel and found it went 1400 FPS. I have loaded 110s in the 38 Special to that velocity. I was unimpressed and sold it. The 30C in a handgun can't get off its knees in terms of power. All it makes is a boat load of muzzle blast and noise.
That sounds disappointing...

Bill.

waidmann
August 10, 2011, 10:16 PM
Armi Jaeger made a SAA clone in .30 Carbine.

arcticap
August 11, 2011, 04:35 AM
Here's a previous post about my experience with the Blackhawk .30 Carbine:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=3824000&postcount=22

chevy_dmax
August 11, 2011, 08:54 AM
Here's a previous post about my experience with the Blackhawk .30 Carbine:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showpost.php?p=3824000&postcount=22
Thanks for sharing. This is why I read so much here. The information is invaluable. I think from what I have gathered here and other sources, that now I am thinking 30 carbine is a no go. Maybe .357 or .44 mag.

Bill.

Sam1911
August 11, 2011, 09:33 AM
Interesting experience. I'm not sure what to take away from the decision to abandon the concept without actually finding out if Ruger COULD fix that problem or not -- and it certainly isn't one I've heard of in these revolvers before. It also seems like a problem that could happen with any revolver in any caliber. Certainly not .30 Carb. specific.

Regarding the extraction question raised: The idea that the Taurus version uses moon clips to eliminate hard extraction seems to miss the point. The Taurus is a DA revolver with a swing-out cylinder. It doesn't have an ejection rod like an SA revolver, so it HAS to use moon clips to remove rimless cases. Similarly, moon clips would be a complexly impossible solution to a SA revolver's problems as the cylinder is locked into the frame and the cartridges or cases have to come out via the loading port -- one at a time. Ejection via push-rod is far more positive than any of the methods used by swing-out cylinder revolvers anyway.

zxcvbob
August 11, 2011, 09:46 AM
I've clocked 110 grain reloads (or maybe they were 100's, I don't remember) at 1700 fps from mine. And it's scary-accurate. The only problem with it is hard extractions because the tapered cases bounce off the back of the frame and wedge back in the chamber. Having to pound the empties out -- and not just with handloads but most brands of commercial ammo too -- takes a lot of the joy out of it.

arcticap
August 11, 2011, 01:59 PM
I'm probably the only person to ever report having a problem with their Blackhawk .30 carbine. I have another Blackhawk convertible in .357/9mm that I love a lot. And I'm a fan of Ruger guns overall.
I felt that the problem was more than just the brand of ammo. So I took my loss so that someone else could send it in to Ruger to have it fixed for free.
I also have an AMT Automag lll .30 carbine semi-auto that I bought new. While I have hardly fired it, it functioned flawlessly and without much recoil at all.
Owning the AMT was another reason why I felt that the Ruger was expendable.
At the time that I wrote about the Blackhawk problem, I felt that the Raging Thirty's moon clips would have helped to prevent the cartridges from backing out as the cylinder turns. While the Raging Thirty is more difficult to load with its 8 shot moon clip, I still feel more confident about the Taurus design and I would buy one. It also has a solid factory scope mount and comes with longer barrels.
I didn't have the benefit of all of the good reports when I decided to sell my Blackhawk.
However all of those good reports about the Blackhawk .30 carbine should more than make up for my one bad one. :)

awgrizzly
August 11, 2011, 08:40 PM
Here's my .30 M1 BlackHawk

http://i101.photobucket.com/albums/m44/Grizzlyguy/Blackhawkrt.jpg

chevy_dmax
August 13, 2011, 12:51 PM
Thanks for posting the pic awgrizzly.

Bill.

GRIZ22
August 13, 2011, 01:49 PM
FWIW I recall seeing a prototype of a 30 carbine S&W revolver made during WWII at S&W maybe 15 years ago. Muzzle blast issues killed the idea.

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