Looking for a 8 shot 45 acp pistol...any suggestions?


December 27, 2002, 12:53 AM
I've kinda narrowed my choices to the 1911 (how could I look at 45 acps & not at least consider another 1911?), a USPc 45 (already have 4 diff't USPs, this would round things out a bit), and the SIG P220ST.
Current front runners are the USPc 45 & the SIG 220ST.
USPc 45 would go well with the others I have. Plus, I've very familiar with the manual of arms so there'd be no learning curve (at least in theory).
The SIG 220st does have a few things going for it. First, being an all steel 45, I'd bet it's a dream to shoot. Secondly, since there is no mag compatibility in the USPs, buying mags for this gun (either USPc 45 or SIG) is truly unavoidalble. Lastly, I think I'm ready to give SIGs another chance.
So, OUTSIDE OF BUYING BOTH! What are the pros & cons of both & why should I buy one over the other?

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December 27, 2002, 01:49 AM
I'd buy a 1911. It's a different platform & will add some variety to your collection.

Besides, no .45 battery should be denied a nice 1911! :)

December 27, 2002, 01:55 AM
Go for the 220ST.... It's a great pistol, and probably my most favorite .45acp right now. It's extra heft does indeed reduce flip compared to a standard 220 with aluminum frame.

The HK USP45 is also a great pistol. However some folks have a difficult time with the size and blockiness of the grip. This is offset by the 10 round standard mags available. One plus is the variation of safety options.

December 27, 2002, 02:08 AM
I was shopping for a new .45 last month and looked at everything you mentioned.

The CZ-97B really felt good. The Witness (CZ clone) felt even better because it's grip is more narrow. Best feeling .45 I could find (10 rounds, too). 700 rounds with no problems.

Try one out before you decide.

December 27, 2002, 04:24 AM
Out of what you mention I'd go with a 1911.

Other good options:
Taurus PT945 (alloy frame)
Ruger P90 (quite accurate and inexpensive)
CZ 97 (actually 10 round mags, but you can find something to do with the extra 2)

December 27, 2002, 07:17 AM
Ditto on the 1911 with a Wilson 8rd. mag.

December 27, 2002, 10:00 AM
Of the three choices originally mentioned, it's kind of hard to go wrong, I think. Never had the HK, but I'd probably judge it a keeper, based on other peoples comments who own them. Having some (:D ) experience with the other two, I'd take either.

Which one do you like the most? (This is the only real criteria you have to satisfy to be happy with a gun purchase, after all). Buy it.

December 27, 2002, 10:35 AM
I've got a project Colt '91a1 that I'm having more fun customizing than shooting. Also have a SA Mil Spec that I've been enjoying completely stock. So, in my mind, the 1911 niche has been filled (at least temporarily).
As for which I would prefer most right now...honestly, it's a toss up between the 2. I'd like the USPc 45 because it would be a nice addition to my existing USP collection. The SIG would be nice simply because I don't own one right now. But I've had 'issues' w/ SIGs in the past and am a little leary about investing $1000 into another one.
My son says we need a custom 10/22 in the mix, but what does he know? :rolleyes:

December 27, 2002, 10:58 AM
Definitely a 1911. Preferably a Springfield Loaded Stainless or Kimber Classic Stainless.

December 27, 2002, 11:02 AM
Neither are bad pistols, although I'm more fond of the 220 than the H&K. OK, I'm a lot more fond of the 220...and you should be able to find a LE-turn-in for a lot less than a grand.

That would let you turn the rest of that thousand around to a plain 10/22, and a bull barrel, and a nifty stock, and let you learn how to fix a 10/22 trigger and bolt hold-open...


December 27, 2002, 11:03 AM
Don't have one, but I've been turned off USPs because of the idea (picked up on TFL) that they use cast (MIM) parts in a few places. Maybe I'm confusing the brand with another, but cast parts knock a gun off my acquisition list.

One that is still on it is a Taurus PT-145. Last price I heard was $365 NIB at a gun show.

December 27, 2002, 11:10 AM
Originally posted by Blackhawk
Don't have one, but I've been turned off USPs because of the idea (picked up on TFL) that they use cast (MIM) parts in a few places. Maybe I'm confusing the brand with another, but cast parts knock a gun off my acquisition list.

MIM parts work fine if done right. That said, I dislike USP 45s because I had one and the welds gave on both magazines.

December 27, 2002, 11:18 AM
If I wanted to nitpick, I could say similar things about a standard P220 I once owned. But really, anything man made will have some imperfections now and then, but when companies build reputation & loyal fans for building quality, I would be willing to bet that the glitches are atypical. I have had nothing but great luck w/ all of my HK's and I think I'm ready to give SIG another try.

Almost wanna get the SIG just to prove that the 220 I had really was a lemon & not typical.

Decisions decisions decisions

Still Learning
December 27, 2002, 11:23 AM
I've had zero trouble with either of my Kimbers and Wilson 8 rounders. Any of the firearms mentioned in above posts should also work


You're just going to have to buy them all!

December 27, 2002, 11:45 AM
Ditto on the 1911 with the Wilson 8 rounders.

Second would be the Sig 220

December 27, 2002, 12:05 PM
You're just going to have to buy them all

Still Learning, that's exactly what I'm afraid of! :p

December 27, 2002, 04:57 PM
Give a 1911 platform a try. I am falling in love with my Kimber compact and with a Wilson 47D or Shooting star Magazine it holds 8 + 1, I'll grant you you have a little magazine stickoutus. With a flush mag, It will hold 7+1. I'm always for the plus 1 carrying condition 1. Happy New Year from a new refugee from shooters

December 28, 2002, 02:24 AM
You need one of these:


Ala Dan
December 28, 2002, 05:48 AM
Well, I haven't seen the need to acquire a SIG P220ST;
cuz my standard ole' P220 is perking along just fine!
To paraphrase my old friend Mike Irwin, It's MY first choice, MY last choice, and MY only choice!

Best Wishes,
Ala Dan, N.R.A. Life Member

December 28, 2002, 08:05 AM
Pendragon, great photo! How'd you get that quality? Oh, yeah... and what gun IS that?

Mikey D...

December 28, 2002, 09:00 AM
The photo is of a Jardine Valtro. This is a semi-custom pistol that sells for about $1200.00, roughly double the price of a USP. By all accounts they are excellent.

Blackhawk said:
but cast parts knock a gun off my acquisition list.

Then I imagine a Caspian custom 1911 would be off your list along with a number of other very fine products such as the Wilson CQB. Caspian frames and extractors are cast. They are also regarded as among the best you can possibly buy.

Honestly, as an engineer, I just don't understand the production method phobia some people have. May be an example of not liking something you don't understand ?

December 28, 2002, 10:38 AM
Ala Dan - why no need for the 220st? Is it just simply your aluminum 220 hasn't given you reason to look elsewhere, or is there something about the steel frame you don't care for?
How old & how many rounds have you put through your 220?

December 28, 2002, 11:44 AM
Get the 1911 boss; then you will see what all the fuss is about
Colt, Kimber, or Springfield get a full size and some Wilson 47d mags find one with a sweet trigger (not hard) and be prepared to catch the bug. If you have 4 Hks you will get a Dozen 1911s:D

December 28, 2002, 01:05 PM
Take a look at the Kimber Ultra Ten II. Thats the one Im gonna acquire after I get back to the States. Its a sweet ride.http://www.kimberamerica.com/_images/2501_Ultra_Ten2_L.jpg

December 28, 2002, 01:16 PM
I have a SIG Sauer P220 and a Kimber Custom II, so I recommend either of them. They both cost less than the HK USP does and magazines for the P220 and 1911 cost about half that of USP magazines.

December 28, 2002, 01:30 PM
I couldn't imagine not owning a 1911. That would be my first pick if I did not own one. However the Sig 220 is a fine weapon too. Can't go wrong with either of those.

December 28, 2002, 04:46 PM
Really depends on what you are going to use the gun for. You could dump both your current 1911's and pick up that Valtro in the picture and be very happy. If you are set on a USP vs. 220st, they are very different pistols. If the weight of the 220 and the 8 round mag limit are not a hinderance they I say go for it. I have a standard 220, but I also have a P220 Sport that is a dream to shoot and very accurate. I think $1000 is a bit steep though. A buddy of mine in Indianapolis just bought one for $595 and when they first came out at the Texas gun shows they were only $695.

December 28, 2002, 06:31 PM

December 28, 2002, 06:57 PM
Sig 220 in two tone!

December 28, 2002, 07:01 PM

There's always a joker in the group! :neener:

December 28, 2002, 07:04 PM
He can use the Glock for a target for the Kimber;)

January 2, 2003, 12:18 AM
How about I take your Expert 45 and I give you my USP45C + cash? :D

January 2, 2003, 12:34 AM
I would buy a Kimber or better yet, the Para Ordnance, companion which has a different action == smooth firing mode with the hammer down, or one of the spiffy 1911s like Wilson, STI, etc; however, I prefer dbl action, single action; and I really like the simplicity of being able to field strip a semi auto in seconds; SO I happen to like Sig Sauers -- I have the P220ST, and I am considering buying the alloy Taurus 945 -- except I just noticed they are not on the CA approved list.

meine zwei pfenning

January 2, 2003, 12:41 AM
How about I take your Expert 45 and I give you my USP45C + cash?

:neener: :what:

January 2, 2003, 02:17 AM
I had the same dilema about the .45ACP a month ago. I was a 1911 or a Sig 220. Both have excellent triggers and ergonomics. The bottom line is what you want the gun for.
Target I chose the Kimber Target II 1911.
For Carry or SD the Sig 220. The Sig is one of the best .45s out of the box.

I went with the 1911 because I have plenty of combat style guns and wanted a Target Pistol.

The Choice of a 1911 was the right one for me. Shoot them both and see which one your the most accurate with. Sounds like you already have you mind made up on the HKs :)

January 2, 2003, 03:33 AM
You could get an STI Eagle and download it.

January 2, 2003, 02:04 PM
If I read this right, you already have at least one 1911?how could I look at 45 acps & not at least consider another 1911?

If you have HKs but no SIGs, I'd go with the SIG.

January 2, 2003, 09:11 PM
Kimber Custom Classic in SS
Wilson Combat 8 round mag.

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