Stupid duty belt question...


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.45Guy
August 24, 2011, 08:24 PM
I found this old Vic De Mayo duty belt the other day, and the purpose of the four brass d rings have me baffled. The only thing I can think of is perhaps the old Keystone Kops cross body suspender... Can someone enlighten me?

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c1ogden
August 24, 2011, 09:28 PM
The rings are for attaching the shoulder strap. When I started, some 30 years ago, a few of the older guys still had belts like this. i don't think they've been made with built in rings like this since the 60s. I understand the rings were put on both sides of the belt so that it could be worn righty or lefty. I've never seen the lower rings used for anything except as keyring hangers.

.45Guy
August 24, 2011, 09:31 PM
Thank you!

Lawdawg45
August 24, 2011, 10:55 PM
Remember Warren's rig on the Andy Griffith show;)

LD45

GCBurner
August 25, 2011, 12:13 AM
It's part of a "Sam Browne" belt rig. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sam_Browne_belt

The lower D-rings are for snapping in your sabre hanger. :)

pendennis
August 25, 2011, 01:01 AM
GCBurner wrote:

The lower D-rings are for snapping in your sabre hanger.

Disagree.

The sword was hooked to the Sam Browne belt using a separate hanger, or "frog". The frog consisted of a loop going around the belt, and it had a flat link chain to hook to the lower ring on the scabbard. The upper ring on the scabbard was dropped onto a hook which was integral to the frog. Notice that the lower D rings match the location of the uppers. This was for running the shoulder strap over either shoulder. The belt could be reversed easily.

The "over the right shoulder" carry was to support the sword or a left-handed holster, and the "over the left shoulder" supported a right hand holster. A lot of police officers dropped the shoulder strap, since it was something else to get in the way, and a perp could easily grab it in case things got rough.

GCBurner
August 25, 2011, 01:24 AM
Here's a picture of a sabre frog that clipped to the D-rings on the belt. This one is, I believe, WWI vintage. By this time, wearing a sword was not a part of everyday uniform except in formal dress occasions, and being able to put it on and remove it with snap links was very convenient.
http://www.warrelics.eu/forum/military_photos/polish-armed-forces-second-republic-si-y-zbrojne-ii-rzeczypospolitej-polskiej-1918-1939/213274d1308424497t-100-original-polish-wz-21-sabre-frog-hanger-frnt.jpg

The only way I see to use the lower rings to fasten the shoulder strap over the left shoulder would be to flip the belt over and buckle it backwards, or left handed.

Here's a current production British belt showing the sword frog in use: http://www.militaryheritage.com/images/sambrownebelt.jpg

pendennis
August 25, 2011, 05:49 PM
The Sam Browne belt was used from 1927-1940, and was dropped as a part of the uniform then. Thereafter, officers wore a plainer leather belt (or wool) with the dress blouse, and dress swords were mounted to the belt with a flat chain and frog assembly.

I am only familiar with the US Model of 1902 sword. The only method to attach this sword to the U.S. Sam Browne belt, is the method I described.

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