Where to buy .308 AP Ammo


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USA123
September 11, 2011, 08:03 PM
First is it federally legal? And where can you buy it? and for about how much? Should i re-post this under the legal section?

So anyone know where i can buy some from? 7.62x51 , i have a DSA FAL.

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OhioChief
September 11, 2011, 08:05 PM
I don't believe you can. Because .308 is or at some point was a hand gun cal. it's illegal to have .308 AP rounds. At least that what I read a few years ago, and I've never seen them. I've purchase them in .223 without any issue, but never .308.

longdayjake
September 11, 2011, 08:25 PM
It is not illegal to own them. Well, unless your city, state, or county forbid it.

daorhgih
September 11, 2011, 08:30 PM
"Now in .380, that is a problem."

Z-Michigan
September 11, 2011, 08:32 PM
I've purchase them in .223 without any issue, but never .308.

You own M995 with the tungsten bullets? Because that's the only AP ammo I've heard of in .223 (really 5.56 NATO).

Common M855 is NOT armor piercing, either legally or in fact, and is not viewed as AP ammo by either the military or the BATFE. M855 does not meet the definition of "armor piercing handgun ammunition" under federal law, because that definition is based on construction and materials and M855 isn't made the way that is deemed "armor piercing."

7.62x39mm has been expressly classified as a handgun caliber for purposes of prohibiting AP and steel cored ammo in that caliber.

To the OP: nearly all true AP ammo is deemed handgun ammo (even if a rifle cartridge) and therefore illegal for civilians under federal law. Certain types are expressly excluded, namely the .30-06 AP that was made and surplused in huge quantities and can still be found at gunshows, and .50 BMG AP which is quite obviously not a handgun caliber. There may also be calibers which have no classification as a handgun caliber for purposes of the law against AP ammo nor any express exemption, and are therefore legal to own AP ammo in until the BATFE decides otherwise.

TexasRifleman
September 11, 2011, 08:33 PM
Borrowed from the old Bardwell site, but the info is still correct (Federal):

If you are NOT a (FFL) licensee under the Gun Control Act (an individual):
It is:

ok to OWN AP ammo
ok to SELL AP ammo
ok to BUY AP ammo
ok to SHOOT AP ammo
NOT ok to MAKE AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))
NOT ok to IMPORT AP ammo (18 USC sec. 922(a)(7))

USA123
September 11, 2011, 08:41 PM
Anyone know where to buy some AP/Steel Core ammo?

OhioChief
September 11, 2011, 09:11 PM
I was wrong about the handgun cal. It's a confusing law. I just reread it, and it's still hard to understand. Anyway, maybe if you contact these guys they can help you:
http://www.garysguns.com/exotic.htm

OhioChief
September 11, 2011, 09:19 PM
Z-M, I guess I was referring to Penetrator Ammo. must not be classifies as AP.

Boanerges57
September 11, 2011, 09:26 PM
why do you need ap?

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&cd=6&ved=0CEUQFjAF&url=http%3A%2F%2Fnucnews.net%2F2000%2Fdu%2F98du%2F981204du.laws.htm&rct=j&q=5.56%20ammo%20ap&ei=hVBtTvSZAeni0QGlwoH7BA&usg=AFQjCNFP6cx7Wd4SC73e_wbBq_J3ch_y7w&cad=rja

rifle ammo is fine. m995 has a tungsten penetrator, not core. m885 has a steel penetrator

USA123
September 11, 2011, 09:47 PM
so anyone know a reputable site to buy 7.62x51 AP ammo

madcratebuilder
September 12, 2011, 07:51 AM
Gunbroker.com

ball3006
September 12, 2011, 08:45 AM
I see AP bullets at the gun shows around here all the time. The CMP sold a bunch of AP 3006 last year. You can pull the bullets and reload them in 308 if needed. Why do you think it is illegal? chris3

henschman
September 12, 2011, 10:45 AM
For 7.62x51 AP, you would have to find some that was put on the market prior to the Reagan ban in '86. It commands pretty high prices due to the fact that none has been put on the market since '86. Or you could do like was previously suggested and get some M2 AP .30-06, pull the bullets, and hand-load them into .308. Doing that, you could increase the velocity a little over the military issue stuff and get even better penetration out of them if you want. Sometimes you can find pulled M2 AP bullets being sold by themselves.

I've given some thought to pulling some of these and loading them for .300 Win Mag to get some serious penetration!

Anyway good luck finding what you are looking for. I would say search gunbroker, armslist, and local gun shows.

Fullboar1
September 12, 2011, 11:04 AM
Wouldn't pulling 30-06 bullets then using them to make 308 AP ammo be classed as making AP ammo (illegal)
(refer TexasRifleman post number 6)

longdayjake
September 12, 2011, 12:21 PM
No, it is not illegal to make your own AP ammo. What is illegal is for you to manufacture AP projectiles.

henschman
September 12, 2011, 05:07 PM
It would be illegal to swage your own bullet with a core that is made entirely of steel, tungsten, brass, bronze, beryllium copper, or depleted uranium (I guess nondepleted uranium is OK ;) ), if it could be loaded into a cartridge that any pistol has ever been made for; i.e. pretty much any diameter projectile in existence; or to swage a bullet the weight of which is 1/4 or more in the jacket, if it is intended for use in a handgun.

But if you swage a bullet with a core that is 90% steel and with the back 10% made out of lead, it would be completely legal.

rondog
September 12, 2011, 07:08 PM
Not illegal, but not common either. Usually in high demand and sells quick, it's lots of fun on steel targets.

SCPigpen
September 12, 2011, 08:09 PM
I think the easiest was is to use the 30-06 AP prjectile pulled and used in .308.

stchman
September 12, 2011, 08:23 PM
I have lots of steel core old milsurp 7.62x54R for my old Mosins. It blows the cleanest holes through 1/2" steel plates like they were not even there.

From what I understand the difference between steel core and AP ammo is the steel is hardened steel.

USA123
September 12, 2011, 08:51 PM
I checked GunBroker and i didn't find any .308 AP ammo, i saw bullets, but i currently do not reload so this did not help much. Any other suggestions?

henschman
September 13, 2011, 10:26 AM
Get a .50 BMG

longdayjake
September 13, 2011, 10:59 AM
Nobody will sell you any .308 ap ammo. You will have to buy the bullets and make your own.

henschman
September 13, 2011, 11:47 AM
I found a rare ammo site that sells the SLAP saboted armor piercing tracers for $50 per round:

http://www.ammo-one.com/762SlapTracerWWC.html

ball3006
September 13, 2011, 01:21 PM
Just what do you want the AP ammo for anyway? I bought my 3006 AP ammo from the CMP because it was cheap. I still have not shot any of it yet......chris3

SN13
September 13, 2011, 02:10 PM
For Penetrating Armor, DUH!

He doesn't need to have a reason other than he wants it.

henschman
September 13, 2011, 02:37 PM
You don't necessarily have to go through the full hand-loading process to load M2 AP ball into .308... all you have to get is a bullet puller and a crimp die. You can pull the bullets from the .30-06, pull the bullets from standard .308 ammo, seat the .30-06 bullets in the loaded .308 brass, and crimp them in. You will have to seat the M2 round pretty deep in the case to fit it in a magazine if you're using a semi auto rifle. No its not the most cost-effective way of doing it since you are buying 2 full rounds of ammo for each AP round you create; and you wouldn't be able to test different loads other than just slapping the .30-06 round on different types of .308 ammo; but if you don't want to go through the full hand-loading process it is about the only way, short of paying collector-grade prices for surplus black tip 7.62x51. You will also want to consult a hand-loading guide for whether it is a safe combination.

USA123
September 14, 2011, 05:51 PM
also, i wanted it because, my friend has a ****ty old car that no one wants to buy, so were draining the fluids out, then cleaning it out, then bringing it to his range for fun. Thought it would be fun to go at it with a .308AP.

henschman
September 16, 2011, 04:33 PM
Try some regular FMJ 7.62x51 on it. You will probably be surprised at how well it does.

USA123
September 16, 2011, 05:42 PM
You think it will go through both sides?

jnoble87
September 16, 2011, 09:22 PM
Standard .308 ammo travels on average at 2700 feet per second, and carries with it over 2,000 ft lbs of energy...Yeah, I'd say it'll go through both sides of your car..And carry on through whatever is behind with no issues either....Save the expense of AP ammo for the time when SHTF and you need to punch holes in engine blocks at 500 meters with no issues. It'll do it...Don't ask me how I know, but a little birdy told me that AP will cut through bridge steel pretty darned well

Zerodefect
September 16, 2011, 10:48 PM
You think it will go through both sides?

You minus well be shooting a cheese wheel. The only thing that'll stop the .308 is the block. It'll go clear through the rest of the car very easy.

Car wheels and rotors may offer a little cover. But not much.

Hummer70
September 16, 2011, 11:11 PM
There were only two lots run of 7.62 NATO during the Nam years. Most if it was shot up in testing. Testing of steel plate in the 80s was accomplished by pulling 30.06 AP down and reloading the bullets in 7.62 as they are the same projectile on the drawings. The reason I know this is I pulled the bullets at Picatinny Arsenal.

Owen Sparks
September 16, 2011, 11:20 PM
I have a handfull of .30-06 AP bullets and they are really too long to load in a .308 and still expect normal velocities. They would take up too much space in the case. Steel is lighter than lead and these things are about as long as standard 200 grain lead core hunting bullets yet only weigh 150 grains.

Boanerges57
September 17, 2011, 01:05 AM
I would bet on regular 308 fmj going right through the car, unless it is so old that it is from when cars were actually tough.
Other than that good luck finding what you are after.
Ive got a bunch of stand alone level 4 plate that ive been considering shooting up for quite some time now. It is supposed to stand up fairly well to 308 m2 AP.
Some friends and I were wondering how much .500 s&w it could handle.

jnoble87
September 17, 2011, 04:01 AM
IF it will stand up to a rifle round, it'll handle any pistol based round you throw at it.

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