CZ 75 RAMI: .40 S&W vs 9mm for CCW


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beatledog7
September 21, 2011, 08:04 AM
I'm considering whether to supplement my carry gun options with a subcompact semi-auto. I did a search on the site, and there's plenty of discussion on these calibers for CCW and on the RAMI generally, but I didn't find much on the specific issue of the RAMI in .40 vs the RAMI in 9mm for CCW.

I shoot both calibers, .40 mostly for HD, 9mm for plinking and (someday) competition. I reload .40 but am not currently set up to load 9mm.

Anyone have experience with RAMI in both calibers? Anyone carry a RAMI who would care to comment on your experience CCWing it in either caliber?

Specifically, does the relative (for a subcompact) heft of the RAMI facilitate target reacquisition in spite of the significant kick and muzzle flip of the .40 round?

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Dr_2_B
September 21, 2011, 10:38 AM
I have the RAMI in 40. It is pretty wide & doesn't carry as easily as some of my others. For that reason I haven't carried it or shot it in a while. I want to say I had at least some issue with the pistol cycling effectively on one or more occasions at the range. Unfortunately I don't recall the specifics.

I recall reading at some point that there was an issue with the 40 caliber RAMIs whereas the problem did not appear in the 9mm. But you'll have to check me... I don't know the veracity of that.

The Lone Haranguer
September 21, 2011, 07:36 PM
I prefer 9mm in any compact or subcompact size gun, myself. I had a somewhat similarly sized, if not shaped, Glock 27 and found it unpleasant to shoot.

chris in va
September 21, 2011, 09:24 PM
I think you can do better than the RAMI for CC work. It's pretty darn wide.

If you like all steel, take a look at the Kahr K9.

Dean1818
September 21, 2011, 09:29 PM
I have shot many medium to small 40s

The worst feeling one was the Rami

There are better choices

If you want to stay CZ, they have great 40 in the CZ75 P06

Awesome gun (A bit fat)

dcarch
September 22, 2011, 12:11 AM
From my personal experience, the .40 would kick much harder. I would probably take the 9mm (with the manual safety option, of course).

Triggernosis
September 22, 2011, 12:52 PM
Every .40 I've ever shot has been rather "rowdy" compared to 9mm. There's not enough statistical difference in stopping power between the two to worry about. Me, I'd rather shoot what's cheaper and more user-friendly. That'd be the 9mm.

scythefwd
September 22, 2011, 12:56 PM
i didnt think it was too bad. its wide....but conceals pretty well. wouldnt want to shoot it without the mag extension. Ive got the rami p in .40

rori
September 22, 2011, 03:01 PM
I can't understand why anyone would want a 9mil. Especially when he has so many other good calibers to choose from. The 9 is a weak low powered toy that I sure as hell wouldn't bet my life on and thats exactly what your doing with conceled carry. Get a big boy gun like a 45 or the 40 or at least a 38 super. Big guns make big holes and big holes equal more blood loss and more internal damage!!!! Don't even think about recoil as you wont even know it happened when the s00t hits the fan. how do I know this, quite a bit of experience. Frank

harmon rabb
September 22, 2011, 03:04 PM
I can't understand why anyone would want a 9mil. Especially when he has so many other good calibers to choose from. The 9 is a weak low powered toy that I sure as hell wouldn't bet my life on and thats exactly what your doing with conceled carry. Get a big boy gun like a 45 or the 40 or at least a 38 super. Big guns make big holes and big holes equal more blood loss and more internal damage!!!! Don't even think about recoil as you wont even know it happened when the s00t hits the fan. how do I know this, quite a bit of experience. Frank
interedasting

scythefwd
September 22, 2011, 04:16 PM
The 9 is a weak low powered toy that I sure as hell wouldn't bet my life on and thats exactly what your doing with conceled carry

Interesting... that's why the military went with it right? Or a very large number of police departments? Or maybe you can ask all of the people that have been killed with it... there's probably a few 100,000 or so. If your shot placement is good, a 22lr will be fine. 2 in the heart, one between the eyes... don't matter what caliber you are shooting... BG is dead.

CZF
September 22, 2011, 06:44 PM
If you can find a RAMI .40 that works fine, then you will have a great gun.

I wish I could say that all CZs run 100% but that's not the track record for the .40s.

The 9mms are a different story for the most.

That said.

Those that have working RAMIs in 40 truly love them.

One cpould only hope that CZUB offers the RAMI in .357 SIG.

They have played around with the 357 for a few years now.


Good luck with your eventual RAMI purchase.

KEV
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/RAMI%202/RAM1.jpg

scythefwd
September 22, 2011, 09:33 PM
czf - there was an issue for the first few years, but I hear the later years of production have been good. I did do a chamber polish, a ramp polish, and ran a polishing stone over both rails and the whole length of the slide to remove any burrs there might have been. Other than 2 limp wrist failures, been perfectly reliable. One was from some remington umc 165gr, the other was from some golden sabre 180 gr.

danez71
September 22, 2011, 10:07 PM
If you can find a RAMI .40 that works fine, then you will have a great gun.

I wish I could say that all CZs run 100% but that's not the track record for the .40s.

The 9mms are a different story for the most.

That said.

Those that have working RAMIs in 40 truly love them.


I was interested in the 9mm a couple yrs ago. I 'read' a lot and the above statements is what I found regarding the .40.

Again... I 'read' it.... and it was a couple yrs ago.

CZF certainly knows CZs better than most.

CZF is a CZ fanboy (I say that with affection). I always take notice of when fanboys say something less than good.

scythefwd
September 22, 2011, 10:18 PM
I trust him on cz's as well... but the comment about .40 rami's contradicts most everything I have read elsewhere about later production cz's (including on czforum). I'm not seeing a cutoff date for when they became trustworthy.

beatledog7
September 23, 2011, 10:04 AM
Thanks for the responses. I'm currently leaning toward just sticking with .38SPL for daily CCW.

All I requested was some experience or opinions on recoil and controllability of .40 vs 9mm in what is otherwise the same platform. I didn't mean to stir the "what's the best caliber for xx?" fire.

The 9 is a weak low powered toy that I sure as hell wouldn't bet my life on and thats exactly what your doing with conceled carry.

In contrast, we all know that an assailant hit in the pinky by a .45 ACP magic death ray round will immediately stop, drop, and either disintegrate or burst into flames.

But let's be serious. All handgun calibers have their fans and their detractors. All can kill, and all have killed. It's also true, for all handgun calibers, that determined assailants have taken several rounds and kept on coming.

When it comes to betting my life, I rely primarily on awareness of my surroundings and on my ability to avoid dangerous situations. I carry a firearm as a last resort line of defense; I will take every other possible course of action before going for my gun.

Should the day ever come, my judgment and my aim will make a lot more difference than my gun's caliber.

Batty67
December 19, 2011, 08:32 AM
Necro thread arise!

Just wanted to chime in that my CCW is a CZ RAMI (decocker/BD) in 9mm. I carry the extended magazine, (14+1), but have had two 10-rd mags fitted with modified Pierce XD extensions. Ergonomically, the handgun is wonderful, just sits in my hand and points better than any other pistol I've shot. It IS a touch on the wide side due to the doublestack magazine, but OTOH, with 14+1 I don't feel the need to carry and extra magazine. Very accurate and my FBI buddy and I put 300-400 rounds of 6-7 types of ammunition, including +P+ and zero issues. He stated "as far as I am concerned, this is a reliable handgun for concealed carry." Works for me.

I like shooting 9mm.

Ghost Tracker
December 19, 2011, 09:00 AM
I've owned/shot both 9mm & .40 S&W in compact autoloaders (but never in a RAMI). I'll have to vote for the 9mm. I don't consider myself recoil sensitive, but hot .40s get a little rowdy as the gun gets smaller. It's one thing to have the time to concentrate, at the range, in the daylight, to get the perfect, firm, two-handed grip. A hurried, surprised, in the dark, one-handed grip is MUCH more a personal defense reality. And...only HITS count.

gsreimers
December 19, 2011, 10:09 PM
I carry a rami in 40 S%W everyday as my carry gun. I had some issues with failure to feed when new and sent it in to CZ. They polished the feedramp, changed the spring and replaced the magazines. It has performed flawlessly since.

It shoots well and is accurate. However, small frame and 40 caliber, it is a handfull to hang on to.

CZguy
December 20, 2011, 12:55 AM
I've carried a RAMI in 9mm for several years now. It is a chunky little gun, but not hard to conceal. The main reason for carrying it is because I can shoot it almost as well as a full size pistol. And it has never failed to fire. In short I have confidence in it.

But this is a very personal choice of what works best for you. Heck, some people carry a Glock. :p

You have to spend enough time and effort to figure out what works best for you.

CZF
December 20, 2011, 06:28 PM
I'll admit that according to various forum posters...the new RAMIs in 40 are working better than in years before, but they are not up to RAMI 9mm standards quite yet.
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/vacation/RAMIs/ramik.jpg
I'm among the first ones to fly the CZ banner proudly, but not so much of a fan boy that I won't keep from pointing out bad points along the way.

No gun or tool is perfect, but most all CZs have worked out for me over the last 25 years or so.

It's nice that people can read on forums about guns before purchasing,
and both CZ-USA affiliated forums are growing steadily each day.


I don't want to scare anyone away from buying a 40 RAMI, just let them know that the guns can be more temperamental than other CZs.

The same could be said about the CZ40P and some other models as well.


In service To The CZ Community!

KEV
http://i204.photobucket.com/albums/bb26/czrami/vacation/RAMIs/cztude.jpg

CTGunner
December 20, 2011, 09:01 PM
My .40 Rami wouldn't run. Constant feeding problems. I also didn't care for the saftey.

scythefwd
December 21, 2011, 12:01 AM
CT... what type of ammo were you feeding it and what were the feeding issues? I know that sounds weird, but were they getting stuck on the ramp, hitting the bottom of the ramp and not leaving the mag, not chambering (mouth of hollowpoint getting caught on something in the chamber opening)?

I ask because of the two failures I've had in my .40. One, the hollow point caught on the bottom of the ramp and stuck there. Polished the ramp and haven't had one yet. The other, was the round got stuck in the chamber mouth... polished that out and no further problems. I've only used PMC and golden sabres in it. One error with each. Both errors were withing the first 20 rounds. Bout 100 rounds of each.

Just wondering... if I can find an ammo known to cause problems, I'll buy some and try it out.

BamAlmighty
December 21, 2011, 12:19 AM
Been there, done that.

Eventually retired it for a XDSC .40, which has now been replaced with a Kahr CM9.

I got lucky with my .40 Rami (2004 production), it fed most FMJ and JHP just fine. I really liked having an external hammer and being able to deock. Can't say I was a huge fan on how it shot, the XDSC felt slightly better.

If you haven't shot other sub compact forties I wouldn't settle on the Rami until you have.

http://www.bigempty.comule.com/imgs/IMG_0301.JPG

Shoot66
December 25, 2011, 06:56 AM
I carried a (Czech made) RAMI P in 9x19 for almost 18 months daily. It was accurate and worked without hickups. Then I swichted to a full size and let her go to a friend.

CTGunner
December 25, 2011, 07:57 AM
CT... what type of ammo were you feeding it and what were the feeding issues? I know that sounds weird, but were they getting stuck on the ramp, hitting the bottom of the ramp and not leaving the mag, not chambering (mouth of hollowpoint getting caught on something in the chamber opening)?

I ask because of the two failures I've had in my .40. One, the hollow point caught on the bottom of the ramp and stuck there. Polished the ramp and haven't had one yet. The other, was the round got stuck in the chamber mouth... polished that out and no further problems. I've only used PMC and golden sabres in it. One error with each. Both errors were withing the first 20 rounds. Bout 100 rounds of each.

Just wondering... if I can find an ammo known to cause problems, I'll buy some and try it out.

Sorry for the slow response, I missed this question. Rounds (FMJ) would hang up on the feed ramp and not just for me, for others also. I could have tried various things to fix it but I decided to cut my losses.

The thing I liked most about the gun was the feel of it in my hands. Here it is...

I switched to a Glock 26 and haven't looked back, but that's just what worked for ME.

https://lh6.googleusercontent.com/-7cQDzlwLPxs/TvZtjsed8HI/AAAAAAAACas/FquisS7XPWY/s800/Rami%252520P%25252040.JPG

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