9mm Load Help


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ImjinScout
October 2, 2011, 05:06 PM
Hi All,

Need a little help with some 9mm and load data, I have been loading .40S&W for awhile and this is my first attempt at 9mm.

The question I have is I will be loading Rainer's 115gr RN, with HS-6 powder, Hodgon's site list 6.4gr to 6.9gr for LRN with a min COL of 1.100, and 6.7 to 7.0 for Spr. GDHP with a COL of 1.125.

What I am not sure on is, I would like to load these longer say from 1.35 to 1.50 as the same as the factory COL that I shoot and works well in my 9mm's. Should I still stay at the suggested starting load of 6.4gr and work up from there? The last thing I want is to load to light with a longer COL and end up with a squib load. I realize that the longer COL will reduce pressure and velocity, but I'm not sure how much. Thanks in advance for any help

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J_McLeod
October 2, 2011, 05:13 PM
I highly doubt you'll get a squib load with just going out a bit on the COL. Hodgdon's data has always been good when I've used it, and the starting loads cycled my 9mm even when I went out on the COL like you describe.

john16443
October 2, 2011, 05:24 PM
Hi All,

Need a little help with some 9mm and load data, I have been loading .40S&W for awhile and this is my first attempt at 9mm.

The question I have is I will be loading Rainer's 115gr RN, with HS-6 powder, Hodgon's site list 6.4gr to 6.9gr for LRN with a min COL of 1.100, and 6.7 to 7.0 for Spr. GDHP with a COL of 1.125.

What I am not sure on is, I would like to load these longer say from 1.35 to 1.50 as the same as the factory COL that I shoot and works well in my 9mm's. Should I still stay at the suggested starting load of 6.4gr and work up from there? The last thing I want is to load to light with a longer COL and end up with a squib load. I realize that the longer COL will reduce pressure and velocity, but I'm not sure how much. Thanks in advance for any help
Imjinscout - I sure you just dropped a number in your indicated COL as there is no way a 9mm round that is 1.35 to 1.50 will chamber or fit in your mag. I'm sure you meant 1.135 to 1.15".

Both of these dimensions will be fine, and I'd also advise you to use the Hodgdon data for the LRN for your Rainiers.

zxcvbob
October 2, 2011, 05:31 PM
I haven't used HS-6 yet, but I've read about it. You might want to use magnum primers, or small rifle primers if you have those already. (SPM primers are hotter than SR primers. Both of course are hotter than SP's)

ImjinScout
October 2, 2011, 07:03 PM
Ya good catch on the COL, I did drop a number, 1.135 to 1.150 is what I want to load, thanks for the info, I will stay with the LRN data that Hodgon provided. Planned on starting at 6.4gr and working up from there, thanks again.

Is there any info out there that shows the pressure increase or decrease depending on COL?

Walkalong
October 2, 2011, 07:30 PM
Yes, OAL affects pressures, but not so much that a minor change will cause a squib or a kaboom assuming a reasonable OAL and a charge less than max.

1.100 is pretty short for the Ranier 9MM 115 Gr RN. I load that bullet at 1.130 to 1.135. (Expect some variance in OAL)

Changing your OAL to 1.130 or even 1.150 will not cause a squib even at the starting load with HS6. It may burn a little dirty, but it will fire fine.

I have never used anything but standard small pistol primers with HS6, and they have worked fine.

popper
October 2, 2011, 08:09 PM
Bell a dummy case, dump in barrel to make sure it goes into full battery. Mike the mouth. That is max taper crimp dimension. Slit another case lengthwise, inset a bullet, push into chamber to seat bullet at the lands. This is max col. Drop a few thousandths from these numbers and write it down. 9mm is a tapered case, the chamber may or may not be tapered. Load below max col or whatever works for the mag. Load midrange, shoot, smile or adjust powder.

ImjinScout
October 3, 2011, 12:41 AM
Well, I loaded up some of the 9mm tonight and hope to get to the range tomorrow and try them out, this is what I loaded for my first test.

10 rounds 6.4grs @1.125 COL, and 10 more @1.135
10 rounds 6.7grs @1,125 COL, and 10 more @1.135

Thanks for the help guys, will post back on how they shoot,

ArchAngelCD
October 3, 2011, 01:58 AM
Did you use a Magnum primer like suggested above? If not I highly suggest you do so. You will get much better ammo when using HS-6 with a magnum primer.

Walkalong
October 3, 2011, 08:43 AM
Since ArchAngelCD has shot a lot more HS6 than I have, I would listen to him.

MtnCreek
October 3, 2011, 09:18 AM
Using Mag primers w/ HS6 cut my SD's in half. The only problem w/ SPM primers is they are often not available at my local shop (like never unless I ordered them). For me, it seems HS6 likes to be loaded pretty hot.

I've never used Rainer bullets, so I have no idea what they are. The 2 loads you referenced are very different, although the charge spreads are similar. Often, data for lead and radical HP designs like the GD and XTP willl have odd COAL and charge weights. When possible, I try to find data using bullets close to the design/profile as the ones I'll be using.

ImjinScout
October 4, 2011, 12:17 AM
Well I had a chance to go to the range tonight and test out the rounds that I loaded.

All the loads fired fine, were accurate and cycled the action in the wife's M&P 9mm with out any problem's, however the loads for 1.135 COL, and the one load @6.4grs at 1.125 COL did not lock the slide back on the last round in the mag. I need to load up some more and do a little more testing. The loads at 1.135 and 6.7 grs seemed to be the best as for accuracy. I may need to up the load a little if I want to load at the longer COL. Guess I will have to go back to the range in a couple of days, :)

ArchAngel what is the reason that you suggest mag primers? The primers that I have on hand our Federal Match SPP,

Also, MtnCreek sorry for my ignorance but what are SD's, thanks guys for your help

Walkalong
October 4, 2011, 08:41 AM
SD = Standard Deviation. (Consistency)

Bump the charge up .1 or .2 Grs, as data allows, on the ones that did not cycle the gun solidly.

ArchAngelCD
October 5, 2011, 04:02 AM
ArchAngel what is the reason that you suggest mag primers? The primers that I have on hand our Federal Match SPP,
There are a few Ball powders which are hard to ignite. The most common are HS-6, HS-7 and W296/H110. When lit with a magnum primer you get better powder ignition, a more complete powder burn and better SD numbers. Accuracy seems to be better with magnum primers too. I know there are reloaders who will tell you they use nothing but standard primers with HS-6 and they are just fine. I have a feeling they haven't done side-by-side tests with standard and magnum primers like I have so while their ammo is probably fine like they say it could be better.

I hope that explains it somewhat.

MtnCreek
October 5, 2011, 10:09 AM
After reading and posting in this thread I went back and looked through my 9mm load book and found 25 shot group of 124 gr GDís, 6.8gr HS6, standard Win SP primer gave SD = 21. Same load using Mag Win SP primers gave SD = 12. Average velocity was a little higher with Mag primers, but well within the ES of the standard primer loads. I did not lean the pistol back between shots so these SD would be consistent with normal range shooting.

Iíve noticed the same reduction in SDís with other powders. One that comes to mind is IMR 4756 in .45acp with 230gr FMJ. Loaded with CCI 300 LP primers SDís were >10; loaded with Win LP primers, SDís were 8. FYI: 4756 in .45 produces a very smooth, accurate load. Itís a good powder that very few people use anymore (IME, it burns cleaner than it looks like it would).

Walkalong
October 6, 2011, 04:51 PM
I did not lean the pistol back between shots so these SD would be consistent with normal range shooting. That load should fill the case enough that position would be irrelevant. IIRC, and I believe I do. :)

MtnCreek
October 6, 2011, 05:10 PM
That load should fill the case enough that position would be irrelevant. IIRC, and I believe I do.

Youíre probably right, but I do know there is enough room left for 0.4 gr of additional HS6.:D

Walkalong
October 6, 2011, 06:43 PM
I loaded some 124 Gr Golden Sabers with 6.8 Grs HS-6 and put them back for a rainy day. It filled the case so well I did not bother to log the approximate % that it filled the case, minus the bullet seating depth. I get around 1000 FPS from a 3" barrel, around 1175 from a 5" barrel and a bit over 1300 from a 16" barrel. Plenty good enough.

gamestalker
October 7, 2011, 12:08 AM
As long as you are at, or above published SAAMI OAL for a particular bullet, the rest is about finding the OAL that fits your magazine, and feeds well through your firearm. It's when you start seating deeper than than the published data that pressures begin to rise. And with AL cartridges pressures can rise quite quickly and unpredictably high.

ImjinScout
October 7, 2011, 01:22 AM
Thanks for all the info guys, loaded up some more to take to the range and test out, on the rounds that I had no slide lock bumped up the charge .2 grs as was suggested, well see how these work. Also loaded some with a little shorter COL to test.

Thanks for the explanation about the mag primers, will have to try some when I get ready to buy some more. But as you said I have nothing to compare them with. Have not had any issues so far with all of my .40S&W loads and they are a lot more accurate than I am :uhoh:, the wife and I do not do any competition shooting just for target shooting at the range, thanks again

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