Question re Bushmaster AR15 A2


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The Sensei
January 28, 2004, 01:13 PM
I have a good friend who has offered to sell me his AR15 which is a Bushmaster xm15-e2s, .223 cal., 16" barrel w/flash supressor in approximately 95% condition. Probably has only a few hundred rounds through it.

My friend had bartered for it a couple years back...since he did not pay cash for it, he is not sure what the value of the gun is.

Can anyone tell me what a fair price would be for the gun? He is local so would be a FTF sale (ie no shipping costs or FFL fees).

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Kaylee
January 28, 2004, 01:28 PM
with flash suppressor?
That's important. Make sure it was manufactured before the ban of september of '94, if the suppressor is real (and not a faux FS or a "muzzle brake"

If it's a pre-ban gun, the price is (for at least the next few months) significantly higher than a new in box model... in the 1200 range around Idaho, significantly higher in other spots.

If it's a post-ban rifle, and has a real flash suppressor on it, it's worth quite a few years at least in the Federal pokey. :)



-K

rock jock
January 28, 2004, 01:44 PM
A true used post-ban would go for about $600-650 depending on condition. Check the FS to make sure you are not getting an illegal weapon. Barring that, I would offer $550.

Redlg155
January 28, 2004, 01:44 PM
Depends on how good of a freind he is and whether or not you mind paying a bit more for the sake of "freindship".

Online guns sales average around $750-$800 for that model. Figure in $50 for dealer transfer fee and shipping. Subtract $100 for it being used. A fair price would be around $650-$700. Try a quick check over at Gunbroker.com or Gunsamerica.com for a price.

You mentioned Flash Supressor. I suspect you mean a muzzle brake. Now if it is actually a flash supressor abd it also has a bayonnet lug, then it may be a pre ban (post 94 rifle). If it is a verifiable factory built pre ban then your value goes from $650-$700 to $1600-$1700.

If he's a good freind and needs the money I'd get the average price for one at the local gunshops and split the difference it would cost you to order one online.

Otherwise start at $550 and start haggling! :D

Good SHooting
Red

ARperson
January 28, 2004, 08:09 PM
Assuming that it's a post-ban and that it's a brake not a flash suppressor, anything over $600 is probably too much in my opinion.

It's used, has gone through at least 2 owners, one of which you know nothing about, and you're inheriting any and all potential problems (not that there are necessarily going to be problems, but if there are, you'll get them).

If those assumptions are not correct, then it's a different story. It's either a true (legal) pre-ban and therefore worth a good deal more. Or, as Kaylee said, worth nothing more than some supervised years in the big house.

The Sensei
January 28, 2004, 11:25 PM
My mistake...you are right. It is a muzzle break. Someday I will learn the difference. The gun is "post ban"

Actually, could someone enlighten me re the difference between a muzzle break and a flash suppressor? And why is one banned and the other not?

Sensei

capt_happypants
January 28, 2004, 11:39 PM
A muzzle brake redirects gas to the rear and sides in order to reduce recoil and muzzle rise. A flash suppressor is a bit of a misnomer - it's really a flash diffuser. Most suppressors work by allowing the burning gases to mix with the air and spread the flash over a much larger area. In a combat situation, a muzzle flash can be used to pinpoint your position, which means Very Bad Things(tm). I'm not aware of any flash suppressor that truly eliminated muzzle flash.

You can blame the politicians who said that it's okay to build an AR-15 with a pistol grip and a detachable magazine, but the second a flash suppressor gets screwed onto the barrel, it becomes an Evil Baby Killing Death Machine. Other things that are verboten are collapsible/telescoping stocks, bayonet lugs, and threaded barrels.

They didn't mention muzzle brakes in the legislation, so that's perfectly legal.

So, you end up with a situation where the AK-74 muzzle brake (which also acts as a flash suppressor) is legal to install on a post-ban rifle, but there's hell to be paid if an A2 "birdcage" flash suppressor/muzzle brake is used.

Any Bushmaster with a serial number of L062xxx or higher, or BFIxxxxxxx is a post-ban. Serial numbers of L051xxx and below are pre-bans. Be careful with serial numbers in the L052xxx-L061xxx range - some are pre, others are post.

The Sensei
January 29, 2004, 12:01 AM
Thanks for the insight. Not sure it makes a whole lot of sense...ie the flash suppressor being illegal but at least I understand the difference......and it further confirms my belief...politicians are either idiots, liars or lying idiots.

By the way...Happypants? Interesting handle. Was wondering how you came up with that one but figure I probably better not go there!!
:D

Have a good one,
Sensei

capt_happypants
January 30, 2004, 12:16 AM
diannef@senate.gov was taken, so I went with my current nickname.

artherd
January 30, 2004, 01:31 AM
Flash suppressor/hiders are NOT supposed to make the flash less obersavable from the enemey's perspective. (infact, many actually increase it, expecially at night.)


The only goal is to re-direct the muzzle gas away from the SHOOTER's eyes, so he can see the bullet impact the target, and better avoid night-blindness.

That's it.

And yes, the government wants you blind.

geekWithA.45
January 30, 2004, 09:48 AM
And yes, the government wants you blind.

And Deaf, too!

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