Strange cases.


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Jurist
October 18, 2011, 07:49 PM
Just noticed this strange marking on some of my 9mm cases.Does it look familiar to any reloaders ?.

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Timmypage16
October 18, 2011, 08:12 PM
It looks like the cases are belted

Woody3
October 18, 2011, 08:34 PM
Plus 1 on looking like they were belted. Hmmm?


Keep your head low and your powder dry.

GP100man
October 18, 2011, 08:53 PM
Looks as if the sizer is stoppin short of the case head, maybe adjust ment is needed or a thinner/different shell holder????

DaveInFloweryBranchGA
October 18, 2011, 08:54 PM
Looks like your dies aren't set right or there is something wrong with your dies. Do you have a second 9MM set to compare your dies to?

rcmodel
October 18, 2011, 09:04 PM
Looks like an old set of carbide dies.
They used to have only a narrow ring of carbide to size the case.

Works fine on straight cases.

But the 9mm is a tapered case.

Can't have it both ways when the mouth is .011" bigger around then the base.

rc

ReloaderFred
October 18, 2011, 09:43 PM
It's simply where the sizing die stopped sizing. There is so much variation in different 9x19 cases from around the world, or even from the same country, there is no wonder that this sometimes happens.

If your sizing die isn't just kissing the top of the shell holder, then you're not sizing enough of the case. There is also the possibility of your sizing die having a sharp edge at the mouth of the die, though that normally causes shaving of the brass. I had one die that did that.

Another area to look at is where the rounds were fired in the past, and what the load was. If it was hot, or the brass has been reloaded numerous times, then there may be some expansion at the web that the sizing die can't reach.

The bottom line is they probably shoot just fine, but with the plethora of 9x19 brass, I'd toss those in the scrap bucket and forget them.

Hope this helps.

Fred

Krogen
October 19, 2011, 04:54 AM
Looks like you ran them into a 38 Special / 357 Magnum die and squeezed out the taper in the 9mm cases.

res45
October 19, 2011, 08:08 AM
Over on the Glock Forum about a year ago a similar issue came up and it was determined that undersized Dillon 9mm sizing dies were causing this issue and basically gave the appearance of a belted 9mm case.

Walkalong
October 19, 2011, 08:37 AM
There is also the possibility of your sizing die having a sharp edge at the mouth of the die, though that normally causes shaving of the brass. I had one die that did thatSo have I. Two. Lee replaced theirs, and the replacement was fine. Redding said not to screw it down as far, but it did not help. I will never buy another Redding carbide sizer. I have had three that had the carbide ring turn loose, and this replacement with the sharp edge which they gave me BS about. :)

jgiehl
October 19, 2011, 09:04 AM
The extractor groove kind of looks like it's from a .40 S&W to me.
Could just be seeing things.

sugarmaker
October 19, 2011, 09:13 AM
I'd be careful shooting those too many times, that kind of stress right at the head / body junction is going to seperate case heads fairly soon.

Seedtick
October 19, 2011, 03:22 PM
What is the diameter of the brass on each side of the line and also the diameter right on the line?

Is it a ridge? Step? Optical illusion?

Just wondering if it just looks worse than it actually is.

Seedtick

:)

Hogpauls
October 25, 2011, 12:23 PM
What kind of gun were they shot out of previously? I get the same thing happen from my .40 brass that is three times fired out of a gen 2 Glock 23. I am using carbide dies and those rings are more pronounced where the case head gets the least support. I usually get maybe 6 out of 100 that do that, I just throw those away given the history of .40 kbs.

bigedp51
October 25, 2011, 05:17 PM
rcmodel hit the nail on the head, the cases were squeezed down by a carbide sizing die and they left the ring at the base. Also if you look closely you can see the cases have unequal crimps at the mouth of the cases so case length might be a problem also.

I have one question, does this ring go completely around the case or is it just on one side, if it is only on one side you have case bulge from the case being unsupported at the loading ramp.

Deavis
October 25, 2011, 05:37 PM
They used to have only a narrow ring of carbide to size the case

Exactly/ You have to size the neck enough for proper tension and make sure the body is also sized properly. However, in a tapered case the diameter of the carbide ring has to size the neck and that makes it smaller than necessary for the body/base unless the ring itself tapers, i.e. 9mm mouth diameter is .380" and near the base it is .391".

Which explains why Redding came out with these:

http://www.redding-reloading.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=124:dual-ring-carbide-dies

You could also grind a tapered carbide ring, which I believe is the reason their 9mm carbide die is so expensive. That defect you see is really obvious with EGW dies and certain brands of brass like PMC, AMERC, and foreign military brass. They are ugly but they will shoot.

bigedp51
October 25, 2011, 06:32 PM
Deavis

Which explains why Redding came out with these:

http://www.redding-reloading.com/ind...g-carbide-dies

Actually they invented the full length resizing die and case lube first. :eek:

You coulds say "speed" damaged the cases above...........

Kernel
October 25, 2011, 07:28 PM
Is this what a 9mm case would look like if you tried sizing it with a .380 die?

bds
October 26, 2011, 12:46 AM
If the sizing mark is only on one side of the case, it may be from sharp mouth of resizing die scraping the side of the case from die not aligned with the case/shell holder/plate.

In the past 16 years of reloading semi-auto pistol cases, I have never ran into this problem, even resizing Glocked cases. For me, the benefits of using Lee carbide dies with rounded mouths with looser #19 shell holder/plate that works for both 9mm and 40S&W cases are that case base moves around to center itself in the die and the radiused mouth of resizing die won't cause scraping of the case wall.

Geckgo
October 28, 2011, 11:15 PM
what brand is the brass?? My resiser is doing this to the little 92 triangle stamped brass (Delta?) but doesn't do it to other brands. I'm glad this thread is recent, I was just searching for this type of thing.

beatledog7
October 28, 2011, 11:34 PM
I had two .40 S&W cases come out exactly like that last night. The sizing die was an RCBS carbide. I can only assume that cases had a severe Glock bulge. It was just two once fired Winchester brass out of maybe 500 mostly Winchester and Federal.

Paul24
October 30, 2011, 10:54 PM
Jurist, Are you using a Lee "Factory Crimp Die"?

gamestalker
October 30, 2011, 11:05 PM
That is a 9mm case that has been sized on a .357 die. After looking at it I thought of what might cause that effect, and guess what, it came out looking exactly the same. I do have to admit, that was pretty slick!

918v
October 31, 2011, 12:12 AM
When my Hornady titanium nitride .357 Mag die gave up its ghost, it was doing the same thing to my 357 cases. I don't know what it was, but I suspected the nitride coating failed. I tossed the die. Last year my Redding titanium carbide die started doing the same thing to my 9mm brass. I determined the sizer ring got fouled with brass and started to gall the cases. I was cleaning my brass ultrasonically and they were ending up too clean (bare brass acid cleaned in vinegar). I cleaned the sizer ring with Sweets, lubed it, and the problem went away. Maybe the OP should do the same.

beatledog7
October 31, 2011, 12:34 AM
I cleaned all my dies after I got a .40 case like the OP.

gamestalker
October 31, 2011, 01:20 AM
918V, I know what your saying there. I watch my dies closely for fouling or any build up occuring. My first experience with that was back in the early or mid 1980's, or when ever it was that carbide's came out on the market. Prior to that it was a given to have to clean your old steel die's, galling from copper fouling, not to mention lube build up being a constant issue that kept us busy watching how we stored them and cleaned them.

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