October 22, 2011, 04:16 AM
Hey, I want to start handloading for my pistol and rifles and was wondering what books would you suggest i get and are there any good starter sets outs there. I own a 9x19mm pistol, a .308 win, .223 rem, and a .243 win rifles. Any help and advice would be much appreciated
October 22, 2011, 04:44 AM
I'd get "The ABC's of Reloading" (http://www.amazon.com/ABCs-Reloading-Definitive-Novice-Expert/dp/1440213968/ref=sr_1_1?s=books&ie=UTF8&qid=1319269248&sr=1-1) and a couple of good reloading manuals (like Speer and Hornaday) and read them. As for starter sets I'll let others answer as I just bought everything from Dillon in '02 and have been very happy with all of it.
October 22, 2011, 06:48 AM
I don't like the starter sets myself. I would suggest starting with rifle because you will see more money saved per hour spent & the same setup will work for all your rifles. A SS press will load 9mm also but you should really go to progressive if your going to shoot much. I you burn a lot of .223 it may be the same as the 9mm.
I have Lee & RCBS tools myself. RCBS is a great company with great tools & custumer service that is second to no one. I prefer the Lee tools tho. I still have mostly RCBS because that is what I started with.
You just need to read all you can & use others if you can. Make the best guess you can then make changes later.
October 22, 2011, 10:51 AM
+1 for the ABC's of reloading, great book and it gives insight on LEE's tools, which is an economical way to get into the hobby. The simplest press would be a Lee hand press but I would recommend the Lee classic turret. It can be used as a single stage or progressive
October 22, 2011, 02:08 PM
Just my opinion but the Lyman manual is hard to beat and Speer also has a good manual. I would get one of them and read it cover to cover.
October 22, 2011, 02:23 PM
Kingmt, whenever I see "SS" I think first of stainless steel. Obviously what you mean is "Single Stage". The OP is new to reloading, but not firearms. "SS" might be confusing.
Dnmccoy, while the Lee turrets CAN load with equal facility in both continuous mode (the progressive press' preferred mode) and batch mode (the single stage press' preferred mode), you will get purists all over you that the feature that defines a progressive press is that multiple operations happen simultaneously (and most all of them produce a finished cartridge with each cycling of the operating lever). So, they say, no turret press can be used as a progressive.
Please forgive me for acting as the "language police". I really do not get incensed over such things, but just want to clear confusion and prevent off-thread tangents.
My next post will be more useful as soon as I gather it together.
October 22, 2011, 02:40 PM
Here are 10 advices I composed for the new reloader. My perspective is that of a handgun reloader, but I tried to make it as universal as my experience allows.
The same time I bought my first handgun, I also bought a reloading setup (no kit, just the parts I felt I needed). The guy who sold me my gear gave me 6 (unassembled) cartridges. He loaded 3 and narrated while I watched and I loaded 3 while he watched and critiqued. That was the extent of my training, plus a Lyman's manual and "The ABC's of Reloading". This was in 1975.
When I first started (with a single stage press) I could produce about 50 per hour. I recommend doing things one process at a time. Multiple operations at a time are too complex for me to keep track of. My due care kept me moving slowly. I used progressives for a while, but but finally have settle on a Lee Classic Turret as my preferred machine. Others may choose differently, but this one suits my style and temperament.
I have thought of a few things I think are useful for handloaders to know or to consider which seem to be almost universal. So much is a matter of personal taste and circumstance, though. So, all advice carries this caveat, "your mileage may vary".
Bonus advice: Advice zero, if you will, "Why load?"
At the same time as I bought my first gun (.357 Magnum Dan Wesson revolver), I bought a reloading setup because I knew I could not afford to shoot if I did not reload my own ammo. It cost me about 1/4 of factory ammo per round and paid for itself pretty quickly. However, most shooters will not realize any savings at all. Instead of shooting for 1/4 the ammo cost, you will shoot four times as much for the same cost. However, handloading can be more than a means to an end (money savings or increased accuracy), it can be a satisfying pastime in itself.
Now, here are my Ten Advices.
Advice #1 Use Reliable Reference Sources Wisely - Books, Videos, Web Sites, etc.
Study up in loading manuals until you understand the process well, before spending a lot of money on equipment.
I found "The ABC's of Reloading" to be a very good reference. Short on loading data but full of knowledge and understanding of the process. Check out offerings in your local library. Dated, perhaps but the basics are pretty unchanging.
Read as many manuals as you can, for the discussion of the how-to steps. What one manual covers thinly, another will cover well. As far as load data in older manuals, the powder manufacturers and bullet manufacturers may have better information and their web sites are probably more up to date. But pay attention to what the ammunition was test-fired from. (regular firearm vs a sealed-breech pressure test barrel, for example)
The reason you want more than one or two manuals is that you want to read differing authors/editors writing styles and find ones that "speak" to you. You also get better coverage of the subject; one author or editor may cover parts of the subject more thoroughly than the others.
The public library should have manuals you can read, then decide which ones you want to buy.
There are instructional videos now that did not exist in the '70s when I started.
Richard Lee's book "Modern Reloading" has a lot of food for thought, and does discuss the reasoning behind his opinions (unlike many manuals, and postings). Whether right or wrong, the issues merit thought, which that book initiates. It is not a simple book, though and you will find it provocative reading for many years.
Only after you know the steps can you look at the contents of of a dealer's shelves, a mail-order catalog or a reloading kit and know what equipment you want to buy. If you are considering a loading kit, you will be in a better position to know what parts you don't need and what parts the kits lack.
Advice #2 All equipment is good. But is it good FOR YOU?
Almost every manufacturer of loading equipment makes good stuff; if they didn't, they would lose reputation fast and disappear from the marketplace. Better equipment costs more generally. Cast aluminum is lighter and less expensive but not so abrasion resistant as cast iron. Cast iron lasts practically forever. Lee makes good equipment, but is generally considered the "economy" equipment maker, though some of their stuff is considered preferable to more expensive makes. Just think about what you buy. Ask around. Testimonials are nice. But if you thing Ford/Chevrolet owners have brand loyalty, you have not met handloaders. Testimonials with reasoning behind them are better.
Be aware that many handloaders don't use brand names, preferring the manufacturer's chosen color, instead. RCBS equipment is almost all green; Dillon, blue; Lee, red. Almost no manufacturers cross color line, so many handloaders simply identify themselves as "Blue" or whatever. But this is not 100%. I have a Lee Powder Scale that is green.
On Kits: Almost every manufacturer (and retailer) makes a kit that contains everything you need to do reloading (except dies and the consumables). A kit is decent way to get started (with less puzzling over unknowable questions). Eventually most people wind up replacing most of the components of the kit as their personal taste develops, but you will have gotten started, at least.
Advice #3 While Learning, don't get fancy. Progressive or Single Stage? Experimental loads?
While you are learning, load mid-range at first so overpressures are not concerns. Just concentrate on getting the loading steps right and being VERY VERY consistent (charge weight, crimp strength, seating depth, primer seating force, all that). Use a "fluffy" powder that is, one that will overflow your cartridge case if you mistakenly put two powder charges in it, and is easy to verify that you have not missed charging a case with powder.
Learn on a single stage press or a turret press. Do not learn on a progressive press. Too many things happen at the same time, thus are hard to keep track of. Mistakes DO happen and you want to watch for them ONE AT A TIME until handloading becomes second nature to you. You can learn on a progressive, but it is easier to make mistakes during the learning process.
Note: A turret press is essentially a single stage press with a moveable head which can mount several dies at the same time. What makes it like a single stage rather than a progressive is that you are still using only one die at a time, not three or four dies simultaneously at each stroke.
Also, a good, strong, single stage press is in the stable of every reloader I know, no matter how many progressives they have. They always keep at least one single-stage.
Advice #4 Find a mentor.
There is no substitute for someone watching you load a few cartridges and critiquing your technique BEFORE you develop bad habits or make a dangerous mistake. (A mistake that might not have consequences right away, but maybe only after you have escaped trouble a hundred times until one day you get bit, for instance having case lube on your fingers when you handle primers 99 times, no problem because primers are coated with a sealant, but the hundredth primer may not be perfectly sealed and now winds up "dead")
I started loading with the guy who sold me my press watching over my shoulder as I loaded my first 6 rounds to make sure I did not blow myself up, load a powderless cartridge or set off a primer in the press. I could have learned more, faster with a longer mentoring period, but I learned a lot in those first 6 rounds, as he explained each step. I educated myself after that. But now, on the internet, I have learned a WHOLE LOT MORE. But in-person is still the best.
After you have been mentored, mentor someone else. Not necessarily in loading or the shooting sports, but in SOMETHING in which you are enthusiastic and qualified. Just give back to the community.
Advice #5 Design your loading space for safety, efficiency, cleanliness
When I started reloading, I did not use a loading bench at all. I just mounted the press on a 2" x 6" plank long enough to wedge into the drawer of an end table My loading gear all fit in a footlocker and spread out on a coffeetable, end table and/or the lid of the footlocker. Good leverage meant the table did not lift or rock. I still use the same plank, but now it is mounted in a Black & Decker folding workbench. A loading bench "bolted to the center of the earth" (as some describe their setups) would be more stable, but I do not feel deprived without it.
You will probably spill powder or drop a primer eventually, so consider what you have for a floor covering when you pick your reloading room/workspace. I would not try to vacuum up spilt gunpowder unless using a Rainbow vacuum which uses water as the filter medium.
Advice #6 Keep Current on loading technology
Always use a CURRENT loading manual. Powder chemistry has changed over the years. They make some powders differently than they used to and even some powder names may have changed. However, if you are using 10 year old powder, you may want to check a 10 year old manual for the recipe. Then double check with a modern manual and then triple check with the powder maker.
Read previous threads on reloading, here are a couple I read.
TheFiringLine.com, "Handloading, Reloading, and Bullet Casting"
THE ACCURATE RELOADING.COM FORUMS - Powered by Social Strata
RugerForum.com :: View topic - Interested in reloading
RugerForum.com :: View Forum - Factory Ammunition and Reloading
The second one is a thread started by a new recruit to reloading which the moderators thought highly enough of to make it "sticky" so it stays on the top of the list of threads.
Advice #7 You never regret buying the best (but once)
When you buy the very best, it hurts only once, in the wallet. When you buy too cheaply it hurts every time you use the gear. The trick is to buy good enough (on the scale between high quality and low price) to keep you happy without overpaying.
Advice #8 Tungsten Carbide dies (or Titanium Nitride)
T-C dies instead of regular tool steel (which require lubrication for sizing your brass) for your straight-walled cartridge cases. T-C dies do not require lubrication, which will save you time. Carbide expander button for your bottlenecked cases. Keeps lube out of the inside of the cases.
Advice #9 Safety Always Safety All Ways.
Wear eye protection, especially when seating primers. Gloves are good, too, especially if using the Lee "Hammer" Tools. Children (unless they are good helpers, not just playing around) are at risk and are a risk. Pets, too unless they have been vetted (no, not that kind of vetting). Any distractions that might induce you to forget charging a case (no charge or a double charge, equally disturbing). Imagine everything that CAN go wrong. Then imagine everything that you CAN'T imagine. I could go on, but it's your eyes, your fingers, your house, your children. Enough said?
Advice #10 Remember, verify for yourself everything you learn from casual sources. Believe only half of what you see and one quarter of what you hear. That goes double for everything you find on the internet (with the possible exception of the actual web sites of the bullet and powder manufacturers). This advice applies to my message as much as anything else and especially to personal load recipes. Hare-brained reloaders might have dangerous habits and even an honest typographical error could be deadly. I heard about a powder manufacturer's web site that dropped a decimal point once. It was fixed REAL FAST, but mistakes happen. I work in accounting and frequently hit "7" instead of "4" because they are next to each other on the keypad.
Thanks for asking our advice. Good luck. Always wear eye protection, especially when working with primers and don't pinch your fingers in your press. Be safe. Always. All ways.
October 22, 2011, 02:45 PM
My first advice: Read "The ABC's of Reloading", an excellent tome on the general processes of reloading.
Let me share with you some posts and threads I think you will enjoy. So get a large mug of coffee, tea, hot chocolate, whatever you keep on hand when you read and think. Then read through these. Don't read just my posts. These threads in their entirety will be useful to you.
Like manuals, which have many different authors and different writing styles and emphasis different aspects of loading, the different authors of the posts in these threads will give a wide variety of viewpoints with different styles. Some writers may "speak" to you better than others.
The "sticky" thread at the top of TheFiringLine's reloading forum is good, entitled, "For the New Reloader: Equipment Basics -- READ THIS FIRST "
The "sticky" thread at the top of TheHighRoad.com's reloading forum is good, entitled, "For the New Reloader: Thinking about Reloading; Equipment Basics -- READ THIS FIRST"
The first draft of my "10 Advices..." is on page 2 of this thread, about halfway down.
"Budget Beginning bench you will never outgrow for the novice handloader" was informed by my recent (July 2010) repopulation of my loading bench. It is what I would have done 35 years ago if I had known then what I know now.
I have a thread "To Kit or Not to Kit?" that describes different philosophies of buying or assembling a kit one piece at a time.
Minimalist minimal (the seventh post down)
Thread entitled "Newby needs help."
My post 11 is entitled "Here's my reloading setup, which I think you might want to model" November 21, 2010)
My post 13 is "10 Advices for the novice handloader" November 21, 2010)
October 22, 2011, 04:25 PM
Although I usually support the suggestion for starting out with a single stage press, especially loading for rifle cartridges, but if you plan on loading multiple calibers, consider this.
With single stage press, you will be changing out dies with each operation. Multiply that with 4 calibers you are initially starting out, that's a lot of die change outs.
I have both single stage and Lee Classic Turret presses for loading rifle cartridges and the LCT will allow you to set up all of your dies in one turret that you can change out for each caliber - meaning you don't have to mess with your die adjustments. I deactivate the auto indexing on the LCT and use the press as a single stage press.
Instead of screwing die out/in, I simply rotate the turret to go to the next die operation. When I am done with a caliber, I swap out the turret and I am ready for the next caliber without having to screw in/out any dies. Makes life A LOT easier/faster. :D
If you look (classified, gun shows, etc.), you'll eventually come across good used single stage press in good shape for cheap (around $20-$40). Any "O" ring type single stage will do.
Main thing is having more fun than work reloading. :)
October 22, 2011, 09:56 PM
Welcome aboard !
I fully support the suggestion for ABC's of Reloading, but you'll only need it for a short time. So check your local library first. They may have it for free.
If you want to buy a manual, then get the Lyman #49.
October 22, 2011, 10:05 PM
Yup, get the Lyman #49 manual, I'd also suggest the Lee Turrent, altho I use 2 single stages side by side simply because it the way I like to do it. If you end up with a single stage use true locking rings on your dies then there is no set up each time as with the Lee "O" ring design. One of the few things I dislike about Lee.
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