What would you think???


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ShortFatHokie
November 6, 2011, 08:01 PM
Was shopping locally for some H4350 the other day. Went in one shop where they had a boatload of IMR4350 on the shelf, but I didn't see any H4350 though they did have a good supply of Hodgdon powders.

The owner asked if I needed help with anything. I told him I was looking for H4350 and asked if he had any in the back. He walked over to the display, looked, and said two things that puzzled and worried me...

"Don't think I've ever heard of H4350. Just use IMR4350, its the same powder."

What would you have though if a shop owner selling reloading supplies told you this?

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FROGO207
November 6, 2011, 08:11 PM
Well the owner seems to not be a reloader for one thing. Also the H4350 and IMR4350 are CLOSE on the burning rate chart but are not exactly the same. IIRC I recently heard that H4350 was going to be discontinued in the near future. I may be wrong but this is what sticks with me. So you may have a tough time getting any more. I am sure if I am wrong someone will set me on the correct path.:scrutiny:

flashhole
November 6, 2011, 08:13 PM
Two things

1) He does not know what he is talking about and clearly not a hand loader.

2) As a shop owner he has IMR powder in stock and will try and sell you what he has on hand regardless of the safety issues that he knows nothing about.

I would have explained the powders are not interchangable even though they have the same numerical designation.

rcmodel
November 6, 2011, 08:17 PM
Discontinued might be too strong a word.

Hodgdon has modernized H4350 by shortening the grains for improved metering and making it insensitive to hot/cold temperatures in the last few years.

It is now one of the powders in the "Extreme" powder line.
I don't see them discontinuing it any time soon after doing all the expensive development work just a few years ago.

As for the OP's gun store dealer?
You can't fix stupid!

rc

ShortFatHokie
November 6, 2011, 08:41 PM
flashhole...that's exactly what I did and told him thanks but I'd have to continue my search for H4350 somewhere else, which is exactly what I did.

Went to another shop Saturday, they had some H4350 behind the counter. Asked the employee behind the counter for a jug of it and he comments that its a great powder for 165 grain bullet in 30-06, which is the exact reason I was buying it.

I guess I know where I'll be buying my reloading supplies from now on...

kingmt
November 6, 2011, 08:57 PM
I could really care less if the retailer knows anything about the item I'm buying. I'm acually impressed if they know how to count back change if they make a mistake. A good salesman knows enough about his product to make you believe it is what you need but you really need to know what your going after before you go.

Now the manufacture is a different story & a dealer should also be very knowlage able.

ShortFatHokie
November 6, 2011, 09:10 PM
Personally, I like it when an owner/retailer/salesman has some knowledge of the products he's selling. Otherwise, I'd just shop at Walmart.

ROCKFISH
November 6, 2011, 09:19 PM
Had a similar situation, when I was looking for H4895, one dealer tried to sell me IMR4895 and said it was same powder from diferent brand. No thank you.

Deavis
November 7, 2011, 12:04 AM
If only you had asked for 231 and he tried to give you HP38 :)

I like it when an owner/retailer/salesman has some knowledge of the products he's selling

I agree but it is hard to know everything about every item carried in a store, even for the owner. It would be better to not give advice when he doesn't know, but that doesn't always stop people.

ShortFatHokie
November 7, 2011, 10:32 AM
LOL@Deavis...231=HP38...he did have plenty of each in stock though.

And, I agree, if he didn't know there was a difference between the two, he shouldn't have said they were the "same thing". I would have been happy if all he had said was "we're out of H4350" instead of offering misinformed advice.

BinRat
November 7, 2011, 12:32 PM
"Don't think I've ever heard of H4350. Just use IMR4350, its the same powder."

That's the comment that jumped out at me. If he's hasn't heard of H4350, how that heck can he say it and IMR4350 are the same powder.

ShortFatHokie
November 7, 2011, 04:00 PM
BinRat...hadn't thought about that but you're right, if he hasn't heard of H4350 how does he know its the same as IMR4350...you make an excellent point. Beginning to think Mr. Shop Owner is full of...it...

kingmt
November 7, 2011, 07:18 PM
Pondering on this I bet Mr. Hodgdon would like to have a talk with Mr. Store owner. I have talked to them a few times & they are very stright forward, proud of there company, & care about there custumers. I bet they would like to talk to him.

ridgerunner1965
November 7, 2011, 09:15 PM
either one will work in the same cartridges, with proper adjustment of course.i really dont expect the help to know as much as i do.ive done this all my life. i dont think they have.i use imr and hogdens powder all the time. if yu use the data provided, ive had them shoot the same in the same rifle.both will always overfill the cartridge if yur messin up.

jcwit
November 7, 2011, 11:10 PM
Per their Data web site IMR 4350 loads lighter than H4350 so it would have worked OK even at IMR 4350's max load you wouldn't be at max, in fact approx 2 1/2 grains under.

But I do understand wanting the powder you asked for.

steve4102
November 8, 2011, 07:49 AM
"Don't think I've ever heard of H4350. Just use IMR4350, its the same powder."

That's the comment that jumped out at me. If he's hasn't heard of H4350, how that heck can he say it and IMR4350 are the same powder.

^^^^ This!

Searcher4851
November 8, 2011, 12:03 PM
I think I wouldn't ask him for reloading advice. Come to think of it, I wouldn't rely on any shopkeeper or clerk for reloading advice unless I knew him personally, and had complete confidence in him and his safety practices. I don't think this guy would make that short list. But his ignorance or mistake in this instance wouldn't preclude me from buying what I wanted, as long as he had it and the price was reasonable.

DANNY-L
November 8, 2011, 05:59 PM
I think I would have just laughed and said I think you need to do your homework.

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