New .32 auto cartridge?


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Pigoutultra
November 17, 2011, 09:24 PM
Does anyone else on this forum also think that it's a real shame that there aren't any .32 caliber cartridges for auto pistols that can take heavy bullets?
The .327 magnum can use bullets of weights up to and perhaps beyond 115 grains but the heaviest bullets that can be accepted by the autos in that caliber is in the 70 grain range.
Since the main flaw most people site with the auto cartridges in this caliber is penetration, I think that it could be solved if there were heavier bullets for autos in that caliber.

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rcmodel
November 17, 2011, 09:32 PM
In order to use a heavier bullet, it would take a longer case & more pressure, and a bigger gun with a locked breach to hold the pressure, with a bigger magazine to hold the longer cartridges.

Pretty soon, before you know it, you are in 9mm & .40 S&W gun size & weight territory.

The .30/.32 cal probably reached it's zenuth with the 7.6225mm Tokarev round of Russian & Chinse WWII fame.

It proved to be a much better sub-machinegun round then a pistol round, due to it's length requiring a big gun to hold it in the grip, and lack of stopping power due to the small caliber hole it made.

A heavy bullet .32 ACP would be no different.

rc

gripper
November 17, 2011, 10:16 PM
.32NAA??...RIA has a 9mm necked down to .22(not a .32,I know),so.I wonder how a 9mm or .40 /10mm necked down to 7.62 would fare.....would make for a .30 Luger renaissance, or some interesting multi barrel kits....

Snowdog
November 18, 2011, 03:26 AM
The problem concerning penetration is only an issue when using JHPs that actually expand. When using FMJ as many do with pistols chambered in .32acp, this cartridge is a deep-digging horror.

Though I'm all for additional options, I've chosen 73gr ball for my P32 and unless something truly exceptional comes about, that's the way it's going to stay.

The Lone Haranguer
November 18, 2011, 05:12 AM
If you want to actually shoot such loads in a little one-finger-gripped gun, be my guest. :p

harmon rabb
November 18, 2011, 08:39 AM
In order to use a heavier bullet, it would take a longer case & more pressure, and a bigger gun with a locked breach to hold the pressure, with a bigger magazine to hold the longer cartridges.

Pretty soon, before you know it, you are in 9mm & .40 S&W gun size & weight territory.

The .30/.32 cal probably reached it's zenuth with the 7.6225mm Tokarev round of Russian & Chinse WWII fame.

It proved to be a much better sub-machinegun round then a pistol round, due to it's length requiring a big gun to hold it in the grip, and lack of stopping power due to the small caliber hole it made.

A heavy bullet .32 ACP would be no different.

rc
small hole = lack of stopping power? would you like to volunteer to be shot with a puny .308? ;)

saltydog452
November 18, 2011, 11:27 AM
Buffalo Bore .32 ACP + P claims to be a 75 grain Hardcast F.N. (1150 fps/M.E. 220 FT. Lbs). That information is from Buffalo Bore, not me. I don't know.

I do know that it plays nice in my NAA .32 Guardian.

salty

Jim Watson
November 18, 2011, 11:36 AM
There are two late 20th, early 21st century European developers of super duper 7.65/.32/8mm pistol cartridges that I know of. Rounds are hot enough to call for locked breech actions and long enough to require service pistol action lengths. One was in cahoots with STI, the other showed conversions of Glocks. You can get a lot of .32s in a magazine meant for 20 .38 Supers or 17 9mms; but they are not meant for light blowback pocket pistols.

Unfortunately for the OP, they emphasize light, fast, hard, bullets for a lot of penetration with low recoil. The European approach does not consider expansion nearly as much as the US system. Many places don't allow expanding pistol bullets even for cops, anyhow.

rcmodel
November 18, 2011, 11:54 AM
small hole = lack of stopping power? would you like to volunteer to be shot with a puny .308?No thanks, I've already been shot with a .22 long rifle and once was enough.

But seriously, are you trying to twist my words by comparing a hopped up .32 pistol bullet to a .308 rifle??

rc

Onward Allusion
November 18, 2011, 12:07 PM
I've said this before. We need a totally rimless .32 ACP cartridge so that mouse pistols can have 15 to 20 round mags.

Marlin 45 carbine
November 18, 2011, 12:16 PM
a .32 pistol started WW1 and ended WW2 in Europe.
I keep a .32acp Beretta on my person 24/7 around my place - on the edge of town about 150 yds off the pavement. cops are minutes away when seconds count.

Pyro
November 18, 2011, 02:36 PM
I wouldn't want a heavy .32 auto cartridge.
It's like if someone designed a heavy .25 auto cartridge, the handgun would have to be bulked up to take the higher pressures which isn't attractive to me. I like having a slim, small gun to carry.

x2 on the rimless .32 auto cartridge.
A p32 with a 12 round magazine that fits in your pocket sounds nice.

Pigoutultra
November 18, 2011, 04:51 PM
Oh, silly me, I completely forgot about the 7.92x24 VBR cartridge. This is basically what i'm talking about. A pistol cartridge in .32 that can accept heavier bullets. Though, it is far from catching on and may very well disappear.

gripper
November 18, 2011, 05:03 PM
Is that 7.92x24 or 7.62x24mm?

The Lone Haranguer
November 18, 2011, 08:18 PM
Oh, silly me, I completely forgot about the 7.92x24 VBR cartridge. This is basically what i'm talking about. A pistol cartridge in .32 that can accept heavier bullets.
But this would require a larger gun. Twenty-four or 25 millimeters is nearly an inch, not including the bullet. (By way of comparison, the 9mm Luger's case is 19mm, or about 3/4 inch, in length.) It isn't going to fit into, say, a Seecamp or Kel-Tec. In fact, it would require a .45 Auto-sized gun, and if you're going to make it that big, you might as well go with a .45. Little guns like this are the raison d'etre of the .32 ACP cartridge, IMO.

Jim Watson
November 18, 2011, 09:34 PM
7.92
I gather they use the American system of listing by bullet instead of bore diameter. Still a 7.65/.32 in the usual nomenclature but they didn't want to confuse it with a common .32 ACP/7.65 Browning.

But this would require a larger gun.

That's what I SAID, the VBR is largely based on rebarrelling a Glock.
There was another brand with the same idea talking to STI about a really big gun holding a whole lot of little rounds, but less funky than the Five seveN.

Pigoutultra
November 18, 2011, 10:22 PM
I feel that it is necessary to clarify that the title doesn't mean a new .32 ACP cartridge, but means a new .32 caliber auto pistol cartridge.

The Lone Haranguer
November 19, 2011, 08:48 AM
I did misunderstand. :o

OK, a high-velocity .30- or .32 caliber makes some sense, but only with JHP bullets. FMJ, outside of a few wildly improbable scenarios (BG wearing body armor or extremely heavy clothing, or if you can get multiple BGs to stand one behind the other :p), is going to be overpenetrative. The biggest hurdle for such a cartridge is going to be getting people to buy it. The vast majority of folks are (like me) likely to think, "Hmm, in a gun that size I might as well get a 9mm, .40 or .45."

gripper
November 19, 2011, 09:41 AM
I LIKE the 7.62x25,both in FmJ and JHP trim......I CC my M57 regularly.I for one would LOVE a modern,hi-capacity offering from Glock,CZ,HK,FNH,S&W,Springfield......the idea of a service sized,18-21 round pistol has merit to me,at least.....the same applies to "modern .30-.32calibers.....think "rimless .327 "-maybe a bottleneck conversion from 9x23 or 10 mm,or the like.

Pigoutultra
November 19, 2011, 02:12 PM
I'm not sure if I'm correct in assuming this, but aren't bottlenecked handgun cartridges more finicky with heavy bullets?

gripper
November 19, 2011, 03:05 PM
.357 Sig?9x25 Filling?.400 CorBon??They do fine with medium/heavy bullets....and there have been both sanity/5.56 and .30 carbine bullets uses in Tokarev vases with good results.

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