Got a tough one yestrerday....


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41 Mag
November 21, 2011, 08:40 AM
This one soaked up two 85gr bonded core .243's through the shoulders from less than 65 yards and after two hours, still required a finishing shot from my 454 to put him down for keeps.

My friend and I were both astonished with damage done from the two bullets and the fact the deer was still functioning. Sometimes their tenacity is truly amazing.

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f285/41nag/Hunting%202011/th_PB200277.jpg (http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f285/41nag/Hunting%202011/?action=view&current=PB200277.jpg)

http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f285/41nag/Hunting%202011/th_PB200276.jpg (http://s49.photobucket.com/albums/f285/41nag/Hunting%202011/?action=view&current=PB200276.jpg)

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ultradoc
November 21, 2011, 08:41 AM
Awsome! Congrats on the hunt

heeler
November 21, 2011, 09:58 AM
Congrats on recovering the buck.

What kind of internal damage did the buck have??
As a betting man it would have me to think these bonded bullets did not expand and zipped right on through.

627PCFan
November 21, 2011, 10:16 AM
Great deer but a 454 to finish him? :D

Cocked & Locked
November 21, 2011, 10:28 AM
I wonder if a heavier bullet would have helped put it down quicker...probably not, only the deers knows.

I looked for several deer after shooting Hornady Interlock 165 grain bullets in .300 Win Mag. I finally discovered they were leaving a for caliber size exit hole and not expanding. I switched to light 150 grain Interlocks and the deer started dropping.

Sometimes I think deer don't know they are supposed to be dead. :scrutiny:

I've got a Browning BLR .243. I could never load any thing accurate for it so bought a box of Federal 100 grain Power Shok...Federal's cheapest ammo. It groups very well for me and drops deer quickly.

H&Hhunter
November 21, 2011, 11:15 AM
This one soaked up two 85gr bonded core .243's through the shoulders from less than 65 yards and after two hours, still required a finishing shot from my 454 to put him down for keeps.

Did the .243 bullets not penetrate into the chest cavity?

MCgunner
November 21, 2011, 11:36 AM
Nice buck. You were shooting a varmint bullet. I'd go to 100 grains for deer in .243, myself. JMHO

MCgunner
November 21, 2011, 11:40 AM
I looked for several deer after shooting Hornady Interlock 165 grain bullets in .300 Win Mag. I finally discovered they were leaving a for caliber size exit hole and not expanding. I switched to light 150 grain Interlocks and the deer started dropping.

I had the same experience with 117 grain Interlocks in .257" from my Roberts at 3050 fps. I switched to a 100 grain Game King which is also a 1/2 MOA load at 3150 fps and have NOT had a problem on Texas deer with it. It penetrates well enough and expands well.

I think that 117 Interlock must have been designed for guys hunting elk with the .257 Weatherby magnum or something. It's just too tough a bullet on Texas whitetail at the velocities I push it from my Roberts.

double bogey
November 21, 2011, 12:33 PM
I think if you hit a deer in the shoulder and it is not right there you missed the bones. Easy to miss vitals in the shoulder area. I feel a hit on the point of the shoulder is an exellent shot. Every deer I have put a bullet into shoulder bones was laying right close even if it wasn't dead. Glad you recovered him. I also like 95-100 bullets also for .243
Like Cocked and Locked was saying, I have had a few deer run of after being well hit with a .300 win mag.

303tom
November 21, 2011, 12:40 PM
Here is the one my little brother got yesterday afternoon, one 150gr. PSP .270 put him in the dirt.

303tom
November 21, 2011, 12:49 PM
Here is another one.

CMC
November 21, 2011, 01:26 PM
My Grandson hunts with the .243 winchester supreme 95 gr ammo and both the deer he shot drop right there on the spot.
I had one experience with core lock and it did not expand and i had to track the deer.

Geno
November 21, 2011, 01:40 PM
In .243 Win and 6mm Rem, I like the 95 grain Nosler Partition. You get great expansion, and unbelievable penetration. As has been said, I think sometimes they don't know they're dead...or they could be zombie-deer. :o

Geno

sixgunner455
November 21, 2011, 01:55 PM
That's a nice deer! Congrats.

85gr bonded bullet isn't really a varmint bullet, is it, McG? I was under the impression that bonded bullets were for deep penetration on big game, not rapid disruption in varmints.

sKunkT
November 21, 2011, 02:35 PM
congrats on the buck- some of them just won't give up!

MCgunner
November 21, 2011, 05:22 PM
85gr bonded bullet isn't really a varmint bullet, is it, McG? I was under the impression that bonded bullets were for deep penetration on big game, not rapid disruption in varmints.


Mmm, well, bonded sounds like it should penetrate, hmmm. Just that I usually think of the 85 grainers and lighter as for vermin and that was my first knee jerk thought, probably didn't penetrate to vitals. When in doubt, partition or Barnes, I say. :D .243 is a very popular caliber for deer down here, though so is .22-250, but even on our little deer, you gotta choose the right bullet on the smaller calibers.

KodiakBeer
November 21, 2011, 05:54 PM
Unless you're shooting at a downward angle or shooting very low into the shoulder, there's a lot of area where a bullet doesn't do much damage.

http://www.deerhunting.ws/drawart.jpg

sixgunner455
November 21, 2011, 06:13 PM
Well, I've got my .243 zeroed for 100gr Interlock boat tails over 35.5gr of IMR4895, getting sub 1" groups at 100 yards. Little Coues bucks run around 100lbs for a big one, so I'm thinking that should be plenty of bullet for them. :D Season starts this Friday. I'm basically no good at work right now. :D

retrieverman
November 21, 2011, 10:33 PM
Maybe I missed it, but did the 85 gr bonded bullets pass through?

sKunkT
November 22, 2011, 12:57 AM
Thank you for sharing pictures of a great buck. I'm sure every hunter here has had one go a little further than expected, even with a great shot. If not, they are either 'super hunters', liars, or haven't been hunting very long.

MachIVshooter
November 22, 2011, 02:46 AM
I had the same experience with 117 grain Interlocks in .257" from my Roberts at 3050 fps. I switched to a 100 grain Game King which is also a 1/2 MOA load at 3150 fps and have NOT had a problem on Texas deer with it. It penetrates well enough and expands well.

3,050 with 117's from a Bob is gettin it; Is it improved?

Every CO mulie I've taken has been with a 117 gr. Gameking starting at 3,200 FPS from my .25-06, and none has ever required a second shot. Gamekings are pretty destructive.

We'll find out how .323" 180 gr. Ballistic Tips at 3,300 do if I get both deer and elk tags next year.

41 Mag
November 22, 2011, 07:00 AM
Thanks folks, he was a hoss of a deer for the area I was hunting, fully mature 4.5 - 5.5yrs old. I hunt with a great close friend on his properties from time to time, and we normally don't see to many decent bucks on this particular place. Not that they aren't there, but it is simply so thick and overgrown, they usually don't even have to get up to eat, simply roll over and grab another mouth full. As such the better deer usually stick to stuff rabbits shudder to go through. This one just happened to have other things on his mind when he ventured out into the open. Since we haven't shot many deer off this place over the past few years we are starting to see some of these big straight six points show up and he decided to start culling them out as we can. It is all low fenced free range, so you can only do what you can do, but with 500 acres, and weeding out the ones we can we can still make a difference.


I'll try to get to everyones questions but might miss getting them in order.

The loads are running around 2750fps from the little Ruger 16.5" barrel. The first shot was around 65yds max, the second no more than 30. Both hit within an inch of one another but from two different angles, and both exited. Granted the exits weren't huge gaping holes, but the internal damage was more like one would see from a much heavier bullet. The shoulder blades were both penetrated in two areas, but not totally wasted, but the ribs under both sides were simply a 3+ inch wide path of destruction which I could easily shove my hand into from either side. Like I said, I and my bud were at a loss at why he was still hanging in there. The shots were both a bit higher than I had wanted, but they still both went right through the rear of both lungs. If looking at the diagram posted, more or less center straight up from the heart where the blue artery comes off, and about where the big red branch comes straight through the middle.

The brush he headed up and into was thick, and no way to manage even the shorter rifle. I had the 454 along for hogs and am easily good out to 100yds so figured that with the previous 243 experience it wasn't a bad choice. The finishing shot with it was high shoulder, breaking up all CNS neck and spine, with a 300gr RFN pushing 1450fps.

MC, in most cases I would agree that a bullet in that weight is a bit light. In some cases even for this caliber. I used the old 85gr Solid Base for years with no issues, but once I had issues, I switched. It wasn't because of the lack or penetration, or a loss of deer, but simply the areas I hunted changed and I was shooting further and they drifted in the wind a bit more than the heavier 100's did.

I figured I would give these a try since they were bonded, and also for the fact they were originally going to be used up close on hogs, just the ol buck came by first. I am still going to put them to use on a few hogs. My friend had been telling me since bow season opened to shoot one of the older big six's they had been seeing, if I saw one. Well I saw one that morning that didn't give me an opportunity and then this one on the evening hunt. The original use for these is for my middle grandson, but the ranges are going to be 50yds or less. He has a few years to go before I turn him loose on a deer.

I think if you hit a deer in the shoulder and it is not right there you missed the bones. Easy to miss vitals in the shoulder area. I feel a hit on the point of the shoulder is an exellent shot. Every deer I have put a bullet into shoulder bones was laying right close even if it wasn't dead. Glad you recovered him. I also like 95-100 bullets also for .243

I agree with hitting the major shoulder bone point on, but was a bit hesitant with these bullets as this was the first time I had used them. I figured that they would easily destroy the lungs if slipped in just, well where I put them. I do also feel that had the shot been simple an inch or two lower it would have been a done deal with only one. I accept the blame on the shot placement, and am not saying the bullets failed in any way as they did a hell of a lot of damage. Just every once in a while you find one that has a will to go on and this one had it for sure. I have hit them with bigger calibers and done way more damage and still had them try to leave the county, and also had WAY less damage than what I saw here, and had them pile up on the spot.

retrieverman, yes they both exited. If you look close at the picture you can see the exit holes. They are both together on the shoulder and only look like a little bloody spot. The lump in the hair just above and on the top edge of the shoulder, is the exit from the 454.

Like I said they didn't blow any wide gaping holes going or leaving the hide, but just under it was a total mess. Had it not been close to or right at 80 degrees, and us being in a hurry to get it dressed out and in the cooler, I would have taken plenty of pics. I usually like to do a very in depth necropsy to see just what all went down when using a new load or bullet. I simply didn't have the luxury of time to mess around.

Caddisflied
November 22, 2011, 07:52 AM
Nice 6-pointer there 41 Mag!
Congrats.

heeler
November 22, 2011, 08:50 AM
It is strange how these things go down.
And if you hunt long enough something like this will probably happen to you.
I once shot the heart right out of a buck that ran a fairly considerable distance before running out of gas and dropping dead.
It happens.

41 Mag
November 22, 2011, 08:58 AM
Very interesting development. The sweetie was slicing up some backstrap, and came across one of the bullets. Not sure now what the deal is, but figure it had to be the second shot, as it was more angled than the first. Still in all, I did have two holes exiting the offside shoulder but one could have been from a piece of bone at the initial shot.

I have cleaned the recovered one up, and will try and get some pics up soon.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
November 22, 2011, 06:23 PM
41, Nice deer buddy!! I too have seen some amazing resilience from many deer in my days. The toughest one that comes to mind was a little 120 pound doe. 8mm Mauser with some 150gr Interlocks loaded up in her. Little over 50 yards first shot, dead broadside, let it loose, she barely jumped, ran CLOSER to me (right at 25 yards) and stood behind a big oak. Stood there for a couple of minutes and didn't even get the shakes! I was thinking in my head "No damn way I missed her" Well, she stepped out quartering away a bit, let another 150gr fly. She took off like she was struck by lightning. 150 yards later I found her. First shot had transected the top of the heart and exited just in front of the off shoulder. Second shot took out the rest of the heart and blew it clean out of her chest! I swear she didn't even act hit from the first shot! Funny thing about this is, same rifle, same loads, 120 yards, 230 pound Buck, same exact shot presentation as the first shot on the doe, same damage (transected the upper part of the heart), Buck dropped in it's tracks! Go figure!

waffentomas
November 22, 2011, 07:24 PM
Some just don't want to die.

I killed a big mule deer last year, 5x5, nice thick beams. Shot him in both lungs, and he fell over. Then, he gets up and starts walking again right at me! I probably should have just let him go down on his own, but wasn't sure, given the range, that I'd made a killing shot. So, as he's walking towards me I shot him in the neck to end it.

First time I've ever seen game get up after I blew up both lungs. I hope he has offspring...

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