mosin nagant for big game


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jae011
December 25, 2011, 07:29 PM
I am relocating to north dakota. They say we will get plenty of hunting and fishing opportunities once we get up up there. I have never had the chance to hunt big game before and i just received a mosin nagant for christmas. I was thinking of using it for big game once we are there. Im from texas so big game is new to me. What are your thoughts on using this rifle for larger game?

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MCgunner
December 25, 2011, 07:35 PM
You're from Texas so big game is new? How big is big. We've got lots of hogs around if nothing else bigger.

I expect Caribou will post, after all, it's a Mosin thread. LOL Do a search. He kills stuff like grizzly with his. Me, I'd want my scoped M7 in .308, but that's mostly because of my 60 year old eyes that never were that good in the first place.

jae011
December 25, 2011, 07:47 PM
big game as in in moose and elk

MCgunner
December 25, 2011, 07:50 PM
It will kill moose and elk, but it's light for that in the same way that the .30-06 is light for that. But, to the limit of your iron sights and with the right load (could be a problem since there's not a lot of load variety) it'd do the job no doubt about it. Elk and ESPECIALLY moose are huge animals. I'd not really hesitate on elk, but I'd think about moose a bit. They CAN be agressive and they take some killin'. Again, it will do the job if you do your part and use a good load. I don't even know if any premium bullets are available in the caliber, let alone in factory ammo. Someone with more knowledge will advise, I'm sure. You may not by law be able to use FMJ in that state and I wouldn't, anyway. Me, if I were forced to use it on moose, would handload something in a controlled expansion bullet.

caribou
December 25, 2011, 08:33 PM
Your Mosin , indeed, will do you fine :D

7.62X56R is in the .308W .30-06 class of bullet flingers.


It will do fine for Moose as well, though your gonna wanna heed MC gunners advice, for sure, and get some quality ammo.

Its out there, and a lotta commercial loads are hitting the market, but a handload with good,legal, bullets and some practise with them before hand ,incase they impact high/low so you can adjust.

Still, no matter the animal, proper placement is everything, and a 7,62X54R will dig its hole plenty deep. accurate ammo in an accurate rifle like a Mosin is good start, ........................now where would you find Moose in N.Dakota??? :D

Todd1700
December 25, 2011, 10:10 PM
It will kill moose and elk, but it's light for that in the same way that the .30-06 is light for that.

Dang I took a nap today and when I woke up the 30-06 and 7.62x54r had become "light" for moose and elk. LOL! Guess I slept through the meeting. Lord help us if a 180 grain bullet launched at 2700 fps has become light weight for elk and moose.

Todd1700
December 26, 2011, 12:46 AM
Oh, and there are indeed factory hunting bullets being produced for the 7.62x54.

For deer sized animals Prvi Partizan and Wolf Gold makes a 150 and 180 grain SP. Sellier & Bellot and Winchester makes a 180 grain SP. Barnaul makes a 203 gr SP. I have killed deer and hogs with the Wolf Gold and the Barnaul. They worked fine for animals that size.

For elk or moose Norma makes a 180 grain soft point that has a MV of about 2400 fps. It's a better bullet and should hold together better on larger animals like elk or moose. They aren't cheap but if I were hunting elk or moose I wouldn't cheap out on the bullets.

Good luck and good hunting.

Screamin'Eagle
December 26, 2011, 02:05 AM
now where would you find Moose in N.Dakota???

I know there are some in MN, but getting the chance to hunt them is next to impossible. In MN we have a lifetime lottery, in the sense that if you do get picked, that is your one and only chance, no matter if you bag one or not.

After looking at the ND Game and Fish website, it looks like ND is the same way-one lifetime chance. Only residents can hunt Moose in ND.

T.R.
December 26, 2011, 10:58 AM
http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c146/rushmoreman/mosincarbine.jpg

I rec'd this photo from a friend in Nebraska but I've never met this happy hunter.

TR

MCgunner
December 26, 2011, 11:21 PM
now where would you find Moose in N.Dakota???

I's thinkn' that, myself.

For deer sized animals Prvi Partizan and Wolf Gold makes a 150 and 180 grain SP. Sellier & Bellot and Winchester makes a 180 grain SP. Barnaul makes a 203 gr SP. I have killed deer and hogs with the Wolf Gold and the Barnaul. They worked fine for animals that size.

For elk or moose Norma makes a 180 grain soft point that has a MV of about 2400 fps. It's a better bullet and should hold together better on larger animals like elk or moose. They aren't cheap but if I were hunting elk or moose I wouldn't cheap out on the bullets.

Is there a PREMIUM bullet load for 7.62x54R? See, something like a Nosler Partition or Barnes or one of the bonded bullets? Even a Hornady Interlock would be preferable to WOLF on moose. :rolleyes: As you say, probably fine on whitetail given the overkill of the caliber in the first place and deer's thin skinned nature. I guess on BIG game, I'd go with the Norma out of these choices. ME, I'd get a set of dies, but I think the OP isn't a handloader.

And, ya know, if I were going after moose or elk, I wouldn't get cheap on a RIFLE, either, but that's just me, I guess. I have a cheap Savage 110 in 7 mag I'd take, so cheap can work, I suppose. :D Mosins do have a rather good rep for accuracy. If that's what ya got, it'll work.

Clipper
December 27, 2011, 01:07 AM
The Norma 180 grain load is super high quality stuff, but pricey. I have some of the old PSPBTs from the '80s, and it shoots 1.5 MOA with my old eyes and a set of peep sights. When I had a M-N sporter years ago, the Norma would group .75" with Williams guide sights and much younger eyes...

Todd1700
December 27, 2011, 03:21 AM
Is there a PREMIUM bullet load for 7.62x54R?

Did you read my second paragraph? Yes, and it's made by Norma. Pricey but it's top quality stuff.

As for the quality of the gun, a Russian Mosin Nagant wouldn't be my first choice for extreme long range shooting or a benchrest competition but every one I have handled or owned that didn't have a sewer pipe for a bore would easily shoot well enough to kill deer out to 300 yards. A few that I scoped would shoot 1.5 inch groups at 100 yards consistently. That's hell and gone good enough for hunting. Some of the Finnish Mosins I own shoot very well by "any" modern rifle standard you care to grade them on.

And a 180 grain bullet through the vitals at about 2400 fps has no fluctuation in it's lethality whether it came out of the barrel of a 100 dollar Mosin or a 4000 dollar Weatherby Mark V.

MCgunner
December 27, 2011, 11:07 PM
By Premium, I meant controlled expansion. I suppose a 180 would have plenty of penetration, especially on elk, if it's a well constructed bullet. I'd look for the Norma stuff. Norma makes some good ammo, been around for a long time. I remember my Uncle had this Sauer drilling he'd picked up in the war. Uh, that'd be WW2. The rifle barrel was chambered for 8x57JR. Now, THAT is an oddball, .318" round nosed bullet (intended for the old 88 Commission rifles) loaded into a RIMMED 8x57 case. He had a box of Norma ammo for it. They make EVERYTHING in old European stuff, sporting or military, and with hunting bullets. Yeah, I know they're good stuff. My uncle died in 1970 and Norma is still around making stuff you can't find anywhere else. :D

nathan
December 28, 2011, 11:24 AM
They should be fine, a many SIberian hunter(s) use the Mosn to hunt polar bears and tigers in Kamchatka and the frozen far east. 180 gr out of that barrel is a lot of punch at reasonable distances.

spclpatrolgroup
December 28, 2011, 01:20 PM
Where in ND are you moving to? West and East are very differnt. I live in eastern ND. Yes there are Moose, in NE ND, however getting a once in a lifetime tag is easier said than done. We have Elk out in the park, Mulies out west, as well as antelope when they decide to reopen the season. Also there are coyotes everywhere, and an open season on moutian lion. If you like goose hunting ND is a great place. For upland there are partridge and pheasant out west, grouse in the east. If you want to connect with ND ourdoorsmen I would highly recomend http://www.nodakoutdoors.com/forums/

jae011
January 6, 2012, 06:17 PM
i will be going to minot ND.thanks for the link

4895
January 6, 2012, 07:34 PM
Big animals up there. I would use any centerfire rifle round with 'magnum' in the name.

gfanikf
January 18, 2012, 02:30 PM
Can a Nagant be an acceptable choice for deer hunting?

caribou
January 19, 2012, 04:05 AM
Ya, Mosin might be Overkill on many Deer, but its better to have too much power than not ennough.

Any 150 + grain .30 cal bullet moving at 2,550Fps will kill a deer, Elk, Muskox, Moose, Caribou, Beluga, walrus, Brown, Polar abd Black Bear quite Dead.

brnmuenchow
January 19, 2012, 09:29 AM
It will do just fine, better if it was scoped IMO... my eye's are not what they used to be but I can hit a target with deadly accuracy between 100-180yd's with the simple iron sights. (The only thing I would be worried about would be a 1,000+ lb. pissed off Kodiak Bear on the charge, for that a bazooka would be nice!):D

Zombiphobia
January 19, 2012, 12:47 PM
oowee, I'd like to hunt a Kodiak. Is it legal?

nathan
January 19, 2012, 01:36 PM
54 R can also take a bear if need be. Just make sure they are within 150 yds.

HarcyPervin
January 19, 2012, 01:39 PM
4895 Big animals up there. I would use any centerfire rifle round with 'magnum' in the name.

Not really necessary, its not the Land of the Lost...they're still not bullet-proof.

Cosmoline
January 19, 2012, 01:42 PM
Is there a PREMIUM bullet load for 7.62x54R?

Norma, Lapua, S&B, all make quality SP's for hunting. Handloading is also an option. Try the Woodleigh 215 grainers if you want maximum take-down power for the 54R.

I'd like to hunt a Kodiak. Is it legal?

If you follow Alaska's F&G laws. There are other brown bears in other GMU's with far more relaxed regs, but for a non-resident brown bear means guided.

Smokey in PHX
January 19, 2012, 02:52 PM
You have a rifle known to be accurate. As stated there are many types of ammo available for it. You will be fine for any game in that state. Remember it is not how hard you hit an animal but where you hit it.

Joshua M. Smith
January 19, 2012, 03:26 PM
Hello,

A 150 grain bullet moving at 2500fps is not fast for a Mosin-Nagant.

If you handload, you can move 180 grain bullets over 2700fps safely. These are strong actions and Hodgdon publishes data for this load.

You'll want to slug your bore to be sure but you'll likely have something in the area of 0.310 to 0.312" groove diameter. While 0.308" bullets will work just fine, you can get a bit more precision from 0.311" to 0.312" bullets and handloads.

I've never hunted anything like moose with this. I don't live in that area. However, I consider it heavy for deer unless I download the round. It turns a coyote inside out. Was pelt hunting and had a nasty shock there!

Any one of the 0.303"/7.7mm bullets listed at Midway will likely do fine as long as it's a soft or hollowpoint. I do not know much about bonded stuff; whitetail generally don't care if it flies apart around their heart area.

The rifling was originally designed to stabilize long, 212 grain bullets. I've had no problems at all with bullets from 150 grain to 200 grain. The 180 grain seems to shoot best.

I think I might try, after getting input from these folks, a Barnes Copper monolithic 150 grain bullet. Looks to be longer as I'd imagine it would be, but lighter due to the all-copper construction. I would figure it would hold together best and really deliver a punch to the vitals.

I plan on pig hunting with mine when they get here. The bayonet would be affixed; maybe get another M44 for brush. I'm looking at casting for that. I want a blunt nose hard cast bullet to get through all that gristle.

I'm left handed and, after polishing the bolt's contact points to mirror finishes, the Mosin bolt is one of the fastest I can work. I reach over, snag it with my thumb and operate it.

Bolt actions are never going to be as fast as other types, requiring four distinct movements (open, extract, load, close) while others require, at most, two (lever action). However, they make that up in precision and power.

Precision in a Mosin? Yup. After using cork stock to bed mine, it can shoot sub-MOA with loads it likes, but I am only capable of about 2.5MOA at 100 yards prone and front rest due to 20/40 vision.

If I were shooting corrected, I could see a 200 yard shot over open sights being about right for something like a deer-sized critter or larger. Just take it to the range first and confirm your rear sight settings. Shouldn't drop all that much but you want to know where it shoots out to 500 yards or so.

The thinner the front sight, the more precision you can get. Stock front sights measure about 0.080" wide; the ones I make are 0.060" wide as this is the thinnest most folks can see, but I've had requests for thinner, in the range of 0.030" to 0.040" from those eagle-eyed experts -- and the targets they send me show they make good use of that width. 10 in the 10 ring at 200 yards, people! I was impressed.

Regards,

Josh Smith
Smith-Sights.com

caribou
January 19, 2012, 07:25 PM
Precion with a Mosin...Thats why I use one.

Ask Simo Hayha, the worlds top scoreing sniper, how much he liked his Mosin.

Or ask my wife, this bear is twice her 5'1", but she had the Mosin...:D 2 shots and 75 yards of blleding out later, he was done.
http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g71/edwardhailstone/kiwalik65.jpg

Out of the last 17 BrownBears Ive caught, at least a dozen were with My Sako M-39 Mosin Nagnat, never had one not die very quickly.

ScrapMetalSlug
January 19, 2012, 07:34 PM
Wolf Gold 180grn. soft points work pretty good on white tail. I use one of the mojo peep sights. There isn't much that is bigger than whitetail to hunt around here.

Zombiphobia
January 19, 2012, 08:23 PM
Caribou, that is an awesome picture, what bullets did you use for that bear?

Also, that thing is HUGE, makes our FL black bears look like cubs even full grown.

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