Downside of reloading to light?


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lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 11:09 AM
I have a DE .50ae. I love it. Love shooting it. I learned to reload with this gun also. At first i was always loading them very hot. Right at the max. 34 grains. 34.5 is max. I have no learned that isnt necessary.

Well, i have a wife and a kid who both want to shoot the gun. Right now, with the 34 grain rounds im not about to let them look at it. I dont find it funny when some dude hands his wife the cannon and hits herself in the face with it..

So, what i did was i loaded up 4 cartridges. 300 grain bullet, and 29 grains of h110 powder. Thats a full 3 grains lower then what the lowest number is in the book.

I figured worst case scenario is the gun doesnt cycle or feed. I took them out and shot them. They cycled fine and the gun felt like shooting a small .45 acp. IT FELT GREAT!!!. I would like to continue to run this load because its going to save me money on powder in the long run and now i know my kid and wife will have zero issues firing it.

Besides the non feeding issue, is there any other issues with running light like that??

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Striker Fired
December 27, 2011, 11:19 AM
H110 is one of those powders that is usually a no-no to reduce the charge on.I don't know at what point it becomes dangerous,I believe it has to do with the actual pressure, below a certain pressure it becomes more "explosive"(for lack of a better term right now).I'm not all that familiar with the powder, but someone that is will chime in a clear this up. I think you are ok with that particular caliber and charge.

1911Tuner
December 27, 2011, 11:26 AM
What he said. If you'll look a little closer, you'll probably notice that warning about reducing Olin 296 and H-110 below starting levels. There are doubtless some very good reasons for that. If you want to use reduced loads with slow ball powder, I'd suggest 2400. It's a lot more tolerant than the other two.

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 11:53 AM
Well, crap. So LOWERING the level could actually be worse. Damn.

I was figuring the lower the level, it would just not function. Oh well. Glad i asked. I have only made 4 cartridges so luckily i dont have to pull anything.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 11:54 AM
Not what ether of them said. They have no idea what they are talking. This is how internet disinformation gets started & runs wild. The warning states not drop below min listing. It is because it needs the pressure to burn(opposite of spike) & you could stick a bullet.

Use a faster powder.

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 11:55 AM
Thanks kingmt.

Would i know if a bullet stuck???

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 12:01 PM
Well, little research for myself. Well, so much for that. Seemed like it would be fun to shoot now for everyone. Guess not.

"Reduce H110 and Winchester 296 loads 3% and work up from there. H110 and Winchester 296 if reduced too much will cause inconsistent ignition. In some cases it will lodge a bullet in the barrel, causing a hazardous situation (Barrel Obstruction). This may cause severe personal injury or death to users or bystanders. DO NOT REDUCE H110 LOADS BY MORE THAN 3%.

"""

Kevin Rohrer
December 27, 2011, 12:14 PM
Go w/ 2400 for reduced loads. You could also use something like Unique.

And lighter bullets would also reduce recoil.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 12:15 PM
You should know. If the bullet stuck it would make a wired sound & the slide would not function. Somehow people still manage to chamber another & blow up there gun. I believe it is the TRS(Tap Rack Squeeze) teaching.

Like I said go to a faster powder & you will have less recoil.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 12:17 PM
Lighter bullets usually increase recoil because you need more powder to increase the pressure to burn right & function the slide.

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 12:21 PM
King,

I was thinking of just doing a set of 50 of these. I have NO problem loading one bullet at a time. Its rare my wife and kid come out to shoot. But when they do, it would be nice to have something for them.

say i did 1 round at a time, checked the bore everytime. Think there would be an issue??

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 12:33 PM
No. Not if your sure headed. I stick bullets all the time just to see where that point is. If I want a load that just barley cycles the action I will go way below it to make sure it is nowhere near sticking a bullet.

You will get much better results from a faster powder tho. Is there a reason you don't want to try another powder?

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 12:36 PM
Not really any main reason for sticking with this powder. Just what im used to using. I have another powder i use for my other pistol rounds.

It will take me a week or two to get to the store to get another powder. Thats why i kinda wanted to run with what i have.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 12:42 PM
What other powder do you have on hand?

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 12:47 PM
Tite group.

Used that for my .40

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 01:16 PM
I don't know anything about your gun but H110 is slower then I run in my rifle & Titegroup is very fast. It would get the bullet out but 2 problems to look for is it would be function your slide & way blow out your case if you get it to function. Not knowing the gun I would probably try Universal or the fastest powder you have data for.

Sorry I can't be more help.

beatledog7
December 27, 2011, 01:20 PM
I don't mean to rock the boat, but if you want to share our sport with shooters who prefer powder puff rounds, why are you looking to do that with the .50ae? Can your family enjoy shooting only if they "shoot the cannon"? Is shooting intentionally softened loads from the cannon really "shooting the cannon"?

For the price of a couple hundred of those rounds, you could buy a nice used .38spl or 9mmx18 that everyone can shoot comfortably and cheaply.

And you'd solve your additional powder issue. Assuming you would reload this hypothetical .38 or 9mm, Titegroup can do that.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 01:34 PM
I just assumed it was because it was because it was his gun & he could. Part of it being the novelty of it. I catch all kinds of flack around here because of sharing what I know or why I load a certain way. Thing is at the end of it all I prefer the truth & reward of enjoyment of it so it really doesn't matter what someone I don't even know complains about.

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 01:43 PM
No rocking the boat. Legit question. yes, the family loves shooting. i just bought my kid his first 22 this christmas. And yes, shooting softer loads is soft for me, but still a pretty decent bang for them. Its likened to shooting a very light .45. They want to shoot it, but i wont allow it with the standard loads.

I have a .40 they shoot. Plus we get free rentals at the range so they shoot everything. EXCEPT the .50. ahaha.

I just love the gun and would like them to shoot it. Thats all.

ArtP
December 27, 2011, 01:45 PM
Lighter bullets usually increase recoil because you need more powder to increase the pressure to burn right & function the slide.

That's simply false. The exact opposite is true. Recoil is not exempt from physical law.

If it were my family, I'd buy some lighter for caliber bullets and run them at moderate levels with a different powder.

If you can't find any load data, I'll post some for you when I get home, where my load books are.

MtnCreek
December 27, 2011, 02:07 PM
Iíve read here about loading lower recoil loads to meet a power factor. Since then Iíve tried some of the suggestions and have realized a 9mm 115gr minor is pretty snappy compared to a 147gr at the same power factor. While not the same thing, it seems like you could look at slide operation as the required power factor. Makes sense to me that the lighter bullet with just enough power to operate the slide would be snappier than the heavier bullet with just enough power to operate the slide. Is there something wrong with my thinking on this?

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 02:08 PM
ArtP
You simply don't know what your talking about.

It isn't exempt you just don't understand the physics.

gamestalker
December 27, 2011, 02:15 PM
I load 99% exclusively with H110/296 for it's magnum applications and have for many years. And the reason I do is because it is a full house magnum powder, and only a full house powder and not intended for anything less than that. Unlike 2400 and other simular powder's, it doesn't function predictably when reduced, with the exception being, you can count on it doing anything but performing predictably when reduced.

One other tid bit I would like to mention. If the published data indicates the use of a magnum powder for H110/296 don't try substituting the application. I did once when magnum primer's were hard to locate, and the results were anything but predictable. Other's will probably jump on me for that statement, but it didn't work well for me.

Pick a different powder to play around with, and positively don't reduce it!

ArtP
December 27, 2011, 02:25 PM
All that is needed is to look at some recoil tables to understand the heavier the projectile the more recoil is generated.

Example:

.350 Rem. Mag. (200 at 2700) 8.5 22.3 13.0
.350 Rem. Mag. (225 at 2550) 8.5 24.2 13.5
.350 Rem. Mag. (250 at 2500) 8.5 29.0 14.8

(projectile weight at velocity) rifle weight / recoil energy / recoil velocity

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 02:36 PM
That has nothing to do with what I said. We are not talking about bullets moveing at the same speed. If you move to a faster powder the bullet will be slower. If you try to push a heavier bullet to the same speed then you need more powder. Like I said you don't understand.

Heavier bullet needs less powder to burn correctly. It won't move as fast.

3006mv
December 27, 2011, 02:36 PM
it is better to check for something else too, b/c your slide MAY still work. When testing loads check for bullet impact downrange. Load single. Check for bore obstruction visually or run a rod down there. I stuck a bullet in a 1911 before; it ejected the case and wanted to feed another round. I didn't notice if my target had another hole in it, luckily the next round didn't fully chamber so therefore could not fire. Now I know to at least check to make sure the bullet exited at all.

AA1680 is another good powder for 50AE; I use it for heavy bullets in subsonic 300 Whisper and save the H110/W296/LilGun for lighter transonic (supersonic) loads.

Also if possible get a .44 mag or .357 bbl and load for those

cougar1717
December 27, 2011, 02:37 PM
To get back to the OP's question - check out this reloading data: http://data.hodgdon.com/cartridge_load.asp
It shows a 325gr bullet with a starting load of 29gr H110. Granted, you probably want to double check and get data for the 300gr bullets that you're using, but the 50AE "light loads" are very close to starting loads. If they fire and cycle a DE without squibs, then happy shooting.

ArtP
December 27, 2011, 02:38 PM
If you compare ballistics at book maximum, meaning lower velocity for heavier bullets, the heavier bullets generate more recoil.

In the example I listed above, you can clearly see the heavier bullets are launched at lower velocity.

Remington makes a managed recoil line of ammo. In every instance (caliber) they use light for caliber bullet launched at a little less than max velocity for a 50% reduction in recoil.

This is part of the OP's question. For reduced recoil you should use light for caliber bullets.

Constrictor
December 27, 2011, 02:46 PM
Lighter bullets usually increase recoil because you need more powder to increase the pressure to burn right & function the slide.
This is 100% incorrect.
you will get a huge bang and muzzle flash with lots of powder and smaller, faster bullet but the biggest recoils is felt by the heaviest bullet. This was evident yesterday while we were shooting my 44 mag with 180g bullets, then we shot some 300g bullets, after 6 rounds of the 300's i already had a trigger guard blister.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 02:51 PM
ArtP

I'm sorry your haveing a hard time reading. We are talking about loading down.

I never looked at your chart tho because I prefer real life. I don't care what someone says something is should do I care about what it really does. I don't load by charts & graphs. I usually don't use manuals. With the exception I do however use burn rate charts.

ArtP
December 27, 2011, 02:55 PM
ArtP

I'm sorry your haveing a hard time reading. We are talking about loading down.

I never looked at your chart tho because I prefer real life. I don't care what someone says something is should do I care about what it really does. I don't load by charts & graphs. I usually don't use manuals. With the exception I do however use burn rate charts.

You don't use load manuals but you do use burn rate charts which are vague at best?

Using your proven scientific methods, while dealing with controlled explosions, I'll be certain to check with you first, next time I want to develop a load.

BeerSleeper
December 27, 2011, 03:02 PM
Lighter bullets will have less recoil than heavier ones at the same velocity.

Recoil is a function of momentum (mass x velocity).

"Felt recoil" is an entirely subjective concept subject to anything and everything that affects the shooters perception of the round. A lighter bullet may produce less total recoil, and yet that recoil feels more "snappy" than a heavier bullet. Many will interpret that snappier felt recoil as meaning more actual recoil, but in many cases it is not.

Try it both way, and load the round that feels better to you. How it feels is the more important parameter than whether the recoil is actually more or less.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 03:02 PM
OK.

Strykervet
December 27, 2011, 03:22 PM
Whatever. You don't understand math and physics either until you can explain it to your grandmother. Einstein said that, and I figured it out myself trying to explain it to my wife. Complex ideas in nature usually have simple and elegant answers once you understand completely. Which is good, because most forums aren't conducive to displaying the mathematical formulas necessary to model these systems.

Look, when you decrease some powders, the powder burns and builds pressure at different rates compared to others. They are all different and all experience this to some degree, but it is most apparent in slow powders when used in firearms. So if you have, say a slow burning powder, and you reduce it, it will burn and expand and build pressure until it begins to push the bullet, which only requires so much pressure to get moving.

If you have the case full of a powder like H110 it will burn, expand, reach the appropriate pressure, then push the bullet.

If you have a case half full of H110 (for instance) it will burn, expand, but instead of reaching the appropriate pressure to push the bullet in a nice predicatable fashion, you get a pressure spike. It expands to fill the space, but too fast. This creates the pressure and thus the problem. It'll push the bullet, but not before the pressure jumps to a very high level that can exceed the ability of the chamber to hold.

But all isn't lost. If you "work up" your loads, you can "work down" too, but you'll need a chrono to do it best. You can't really "feel" it, although some will feel snappier than others. When you get into an unsafe area, you may not know it, but with the chrono, you'll start seeing the numbers get erratic. This is indicative of pressure spikes when using reduced loads. If you have 50fps difference, I don't see that as a problem indicator personally, but a 200fps spread is. Scale back up until you get a predicatable spread. Note that temperature will affect these numbers too, hotter gives higher pressure and cooler lower --whereas it may not be important otherwise, when dealing with max and min loads it is. Always.

This issue of pressure spikes seems to pop up most often when using low explosives in a sealed container. If the charge fills up the case, you have less problems. Half full cases of low explosives are, in fact, necessary for high power explosions in absence of high explosives. Keep this in mind, it is a rule of thumb. Because low explosives aren't very brisant, a pressure spike is desired when using it in demolition --but avoided when handloading. Remember, handloading and demolition are two different things, but some handloaders seem to confuse the two, thus KB's, which can come equally from low and high charges.

Also note that when loading subsonic ammo, you get the same problem. If you load a rifle cartridge with enough rifle powder to get subsonic velocities, you get erratic velocities and sometimes KB's too. So subsonic load data is usually scarce, and they are usually loaded using pistol powders --because they will fill the case more.

An option is to use a filler, but I haven't messed with it. A filler will prevent the pressure spike by reducing the case volume, theoretically you can use this with any load. But in practice, settling occurs, and the whole thing is dynamically modeled, so at some point you will reach a point where there is too much filler to give reliable ignition or sufficient pressure.

Another low pressure event is caused when the charge is too low, the bullet gets stuck, and then the pistol blows up. But step back and you will notice that the same thing is happening --the bullet goes so far, plugs up, but in the process creates a larger combustion chamber allowing the gas to expand and a pressure spike to occur. In this case, the pressure spike occurs before the slide reciprocates and you get the KB that way.

Bottom line: you can do it safely, but understand what you are doing. Best advice is to go with a minimum charge load using a powder that fills the case as much as possible, ie, a high volume powder.

Hope this helps, answers questions, and dispells myths.

Strykervet
December 27, 2011, 03:28 PM
Yep.

Say you have two rounds, a 200gr. bullet and a 135gr. bullet. Both are loaded such that the recoil spring is compressed to identical rates. To me, the 135 feels snappier. They have the same recoil, numerically, but it is delivered at different rates.

Impulse is the measure of force over time, it doesn't get mentioned often enough. While the forces are equal, the time in which the spring is compressed isn't, and so it feels different. Because the lighter bullet is accelerating at a faster rate than the heavier bullet, the equal and opposite reaction is that the recoil is delivered proportionately --you get the same recoil, but you get it "all at once" as it were.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 03:57 PM
I'm not even trying this from my phone & probably won't have time when I get to a PC. I guess grandmaw will have to just wonder.

fpgt72
December 27, 2011, 04:01 PM
I don't know much about reloading I have only been doing it for a few months....but the guy that got me started said don't ever do something that is not in the book. If you want to try lighter loads use the min that is in the book, if that is not light enough for you try a different powder that is listed in the chart. Powder is not that expensive...he always told me if I come across a powder I don't like I can always give it to him :)

All that said I do load just about everything at the min loading, I am a small guy with some health problems and just can't cake the recoil that well. I have only come across one "formula" if you will that did not work and left a bullet in my barrel.

kingmt
December 27, 2011, 04:39 PM
How many times did you try this formula? Did you fallow it exactly? Did you pull down your other rounds to check your work? How far into the barrel did it go?

I have a hard time excepting a published load stuck a bullet.

lyrikz
December 27, 2011, 05:06 PM
Art, i do run the 300 grain. I havent ran the 325's yet.

Strykervet, good info man. THanks. I picked 29 grains because that was the lowest number on the 325 grains.

I think im just going to finish making these 50 cartridges that i have in the 29 grains and just test it out. One at a time. I have loaded 32 grains before and i couldnt tell the difference between those and the 34 grain loads.

dickttx
December 28, 2011, 10:58 AM
The OP said he loaded 29gn of H110, the minimum load recommended in the tables.
IIRC the warning is to not go more that 3% BELOW THE MINIMUM LOAD. He is not.

35 Whelen
December 28, 2011, 11:53 AM
Like others have said, you need to go to a faster powder. Here's a link to a post with some lightER loads for the 50 AE:

Reloading the 50 Action Express
(http://www.castboolits.gunloads.com/showthread.php?t=117958&highlight=Action+Express)

35W

lyrikz
December 28, 2011, 12:25 PM
"300 grain Hornady XTP
Powder H110
Start - 29.7 grains 1284fps
Max - 33.0 grains 1398fps
"

Thats me right there. Im 29 though. not 29.7.

Im running the bullets. Im just going to do it one at a time. AND, being these bullets are for family members or friends who want to shoot it but start off light. I doubt i will be using them much.. They are just going to be labelled light. PUll it out when needed.

kingmt
December 28, 2011, 01:44 PM
I hate to give much advice since I don't know the powder just the stories & you know how stories go. I don't use magnum primers but this might be a good application for them & pay close attention on really cold days.

It sounds like everything is fine with your load but I don't know enough to say so.

ArtP
December 28, 2011, 02:13 PM
I use 110/296 in a 44 mag load. The recipe calls for a max of 25 grains. I started this load at 22.5, which is below the 3% variance we're supposed to stick to with that powder (with a magnum primer).

I didn't have any problems with it, going below the variance mentioned, and would shoot that load again today if I had a reason to. But I would be awful careful to watch for the symptom of a stuck bullet, exactly as you're doing.

Blue68f100
December 28, 2011, 04:02 PM
I've been around long enough to see what kind of destruction this powder can do if not done right.

You have to use Mag Primers with the WW296/110 to get a complete burn. This powder is slow burning and is hard to light off, using std primers do not cut it. Std primers will not give you a complete burn with this powder. If you have a crony you can see the instability.

If your below min with std primers I WOULD NOT SHOOT THEM. Pull them down and do it right for safety reasons. Your more likely to get a KBoom vs stuck bullet.

ArtP
December 28, 2011, 05:55 PM
I'm aware the manufacture advises to stay within 3% of max. However my Hornady 7th manual lists starting at 20.7 with a max of 24.8 of 110/296. That recipe also uses a WLP primer.

I'm not advocating doing so, but I am using it as a reference for why I chose to start at 22.5 with a magnum primer.

My Lyman manual starts at 4% below max and obviously is more inline with the manufacturer.

Perhaps the strangest information is right from Hodgdon where they clearly warn the reloader to start at 3% below max charge (as opposed to 10% on other products). But their own starting load is 4.1% below max.

35 Whelen
December 28, 2011, 09:32 PM
Lyman's 49th Edition for the 50 AE list 21.7 grs. of AL2400 with a 300 gr. Hormady for a velocity of 1094 fps. Relatively light, but personally think it'd be a little much for a child to shoot.

35W

Bovice
December 28, 2011, 09:56 PM
The desert eagle is not meant for small people. You should only be "downloading" your ammo to the low end of the charge range. Getting a bullet stuck in the barrel is a very scary thing. It's a quick way to turn your handgun into a hand grenade.

Lost Sheep
December 28, 2011, 10:48 PM
Kingmnt,

I believe you may be giving some potentially dangerous misinformation yourself in your posts #5 and #9. Please pardon my bluntness.

I believe the OP's gun is a gas operated action. If a bullet stuck in the barrel past the gas port, the action would, indeed cycle (and probably more vigorously than normal) and a new round would chamber with potentially disastrous results if/when that round is fired. Very likely, the report would be muffled, as you said, but this is often not noticed by the shooter and the following round produces catastrophe

If the bullet stuck before it reached the port, you are indeed correct. The action very likely would not even start to cycle.

The downloading of H110 is advised against by the manufacturer. They emphasis VERY strongly against reducing loads more than 3%.

I admit the existence of the so-called "detonation" or pressure spikes (by small charges of slow-burning powders in large cases) is controversial. There are those who believe it does not exist, and, indeed, the phenomenon has been impossible to reproduce reliably in ballistics laboratories. Its unreliability notwithstanding, I have read credible first-hand accounts of blowing up guns with small charges in large cases.

As I said, some people do not believe it happens. I do. I also believe that to dismiss the possibility in the absence of proof carries some risk.

If I misunderstood your posts, please forgive me and correct me.

To the O.P. (original poster): Thanks for asking our advice.

Every gunpowder has a pressure range (or performance envelope) within which its burn rate is predictable and stable. The recipes you find in load manuals are presumed to be operating within that performance envelope. Some handloaders (I am excluding professional ballisticians in my opinion) go outside the loading manuals. The good ones do this carefully, as I am sure Kingmtn does, observing signs of overpressure, velocity changes, etc and using good safety precautions.

Most handloaders do not push the envelopes. Instead, they decide on a velocity or power level they want and select a powder that the load manuals suggest will deliver that performance, usually in the mid-range between the maximum and minimum loads. Then they go and buy that powder and load up a few rounds below what they expect will deliver their desired performance and work up the where they want. A chronograph helps, but I loaded for years without one.

Since yours is a gas-operated action, you will want a clean-burning powder as well so it will be easier to clean the operating piston and the gas port doesn't get clogged with soot. Powders operating at the higher end of their pressure range tend to burn cleaner than at the lower end of their pressure range. This is just a general trend, though, not a hard and fast rule.

Good luck,

Lost Sheep

p.s. I missed Strykervet's post #34 before I composed mine. It is one of the best explanations of the various ways to blow up a gun I have ever read. Thanks Strykervet.

kingmt
December 29, 2011, 07:45 AM
Lost sheep

Thanks for being blunt. It makes everything so much easier.

I agree I'm ignorant of this gun & powder so if it is gas operated instead of blow back then I can't say it wouldn't load the next round. I know enough to know how they work but don't use them & not very informed about them.

Please never fell wrong to correct me where I'm wrong. This is one of the reasons I keep pointing out I don't know the gun or the powder.

I didn't even have load data for this cartridge. I said I don't use manuals but I do have 1 & data I use to reference cartridges I don't know or get dimensions. My powders have no reliable data.

lyrikz
December 29, 2011, 11:35 AM
Thanks everybody for all the good information. The lowest 110 rating i found for my 300 grain bullet is 29.7. I loaded mine at 29. That is almost EXACTLY 3% lower. They say dont go below 3%. Like i mentioned, i ran a few rounds through and it was fine. BUT, now knowing what i know, when i do run this ammo, which i will. I am going to only do it 1 at a time. 1 shot, check barrel, and reload. Its ammo that will be marked and rarely used. I have no desire to shoot it.

As for kids not being able to shoot the gun i agree. My 13 year old has been shooting since he was 4. Obviously with me holding the guns for him. He wants to shoot it. This is the only way to make that happen unless i wait a few years for him to get a bit stronger and hands a bit bigger. I will video tape it and let you guys know how it goes.

langenc
December 29, 2011, 12:28 PM
Check w/ powder maker or couple of reloading manuals-no free lancing!!!!

lyrikz
January 9, 2012, 11:16 AM
Just to check in. I took the rounds to the range. Gun was perfect. You couldnt really tell that it was a lighter load. The 29 grains shot perfect. The 34 grains are just down right violent.

4895
January 10, 2012, 02:01 AM
I have never loaded for a .50ae. That being said, I would stick with H110 powder for that round. Now that you know 29.0 grains is (ok) functional, I would go up and get closer to the actual starting load listed. If they can't handle the recoil with a standard starting load, then they shouldn't shoot the firearm. They are in more danger shooting an improper hand load than being uncomfortable with heavy recoil. You think that DE kicks, I just loaded up some .44 mag for a friends friend.
He called me up to say, "My friend is a single mother, not much $$ and needs some .44 mag to practice with her personal defense handgun. She has a bucket of brass here and says the gun has a big flash and lots of noise. Can you load up something special for her to practice with?"
I said, "Sure, I can come up with something."
Then I go to get the brass from him. She is there and so is her 'personal defense' handgun of choice. It's a Taurus Ultra-light 3" barrel .44 magnum. I said, "Honey, that's a big hole and a short barrel. It's gonna kick like a donkey and be loud as hell."
She said she loves shooting it. Shoots full house magnum in it all the time. She can't afford it at $35 a box. So I asked a few questions and got some answers. Now she has some lower powered .44 mag rounds. Point is, she likes the recoil, snap, etc. She can handle it. I think we, as big, tough, macho men, believe most women are frail little creatures that can't handle the big boom of a "man's gun". Truth is, they can handle more than you think.

kingmt
January 10, 2012, 09:13 AM
If it was me I'd find out where a bullet does stick on a cold morning with the ammo in the car over night & stay above that load.

lyrikz
January 10, 2012, 10:51 AM
4895, this is my only batch im going to make. It is less of a boom, but not enough. So my thoughts were yours, if they cant shoot it like that, then they just wont shoot it. Not the end of the world. As for the kick from a 44 mag and my de. There isnt really a comparison. My buddy has a 44 and with his mag loads its big, but not DE big. Just this weekend there was a guy next to me with a 44. It was loud. But when i let off, everyone stopped. ahaha. Including that guy. Out of respect for everyone in there, i normally warn the guys to my left and right before i fire, and normally no more then 2 or 3 rounds at a time.

Kingmt,
You say that because everything cold will be at its smallest so there would be no way that at room temperature i would have an issue?

kingmt
January 10, 2012, 12:43 PM
Your thinking. Why leave anything to chance.

greyling22
January 10, 2012, 12:57 PM
I've runs several thousand rounds of 30 carbine on a reduced h110 load without issue. Not saying it's for everybody and every application, or even a great load, but it never blew up, was accurate, and cycled the gun fine.

blarby
January 10, 2012, 04:58 PM
Its fairly bright.

You see all kinds of crap you can overlook in semi-darkness.

Its more expensive.

AC/DC sounds less awesome in a well-lit room.

As a result, my ammo runts generally prefer dim, it causes them less headaches.

lyrikz
January 10, 2012, 05:02 PM
Darby, i think you are losing it man. lol

blarby
January 10, 2012, 05:11 PM
Darby, i think you are losing it man. lol

Lost most of it a long time ago.

The rest of it I lost last January.


Livin stress free and happy has its upsides though....you get to clown on forums throughout the day. Sometimes you even learn :cool: stuff- and meet :cool:er folks.

1911Tuner
January 10, 2012, 05:56 PM
Not what ether of them said. They have no idea what they are talking.

Wow. Reloading since the 60s, and all of a sudden, I'm a dummy.
Until I stopped using it 10-12 years ago, I probably burned up more 296 than you've seen. I used to buy it by the keg when I had the metallic silhouette bug.

Not as much H110, but still quite a bit.

Check my post again. It cautions about loading below starting (minimum) listed data.

And, yep...I've seen it go sideways more than once when that advice is ignored. Both Olin 296 and Hodgdon's H-110 seem to be at their best at 98-100% loading density...bullet base touching the powder...or very lightly compressed. Air space gives erratic pressures and velocities.

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