Can You Believe This Drek?


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Loyalist Dave
December 28, 2011, 08:42 AM
The NY Times published this hunting account. :cuss:

Hunting Deer With My Flintlock by Seamus McGraw (http://www.nytimes.com/2011/12/26/opinion/hunting-deer-with-my-flintlock.html)

It is amazingly inaccurate, to the point that it smacks of a fraudulent account. I doubt the author has taken deer with a flintlock, let alone did it in the manner he describes. :banghead:
I have taken nearly a dozen deer with my flintlock..., his story does not ring true.

LD

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Cocked & Locked
December 28, 2011, 09:40 AM
L-D...I agree with you 100%. Wonder who that guy thinks he's kidding. My favorite BS line was this one below...yeah, right. :scrutiny:

"The sun was sinking behind the ridge. I didnít have the time or the tools with me to fix the gun ó I had carelessly left them behind ó and so I laid my rifle down on the ground, pulled my knife from its sheath, wrapped my arms around the wounded and frightened doe, and ...

I hate to kill."

Rail Driver
December 28, 2011, 10:23 AM
On the one hand, it's a nice story. There are a couple small continuity problems (probably stemming from the fact that it's either fictional, or partially fictional, or else the editors of the NYT decided to edit the story before publication). On the other hand, I don't see what gives you the idea that the story is BS, aside from a couple small inaccuracies in the information given.

Cocked & Locked
December 28, 2011, 10:42 AM
I don't see what gives you the idea that the story is BS

This gives me a strong hint that the story is embellished with BS..."wrapped my arms around the wounded and frightened doe"

woodsrunner38
December 28, 2011, 10:50 AM
In my opinion:

What we see here is an arthur writing for publication in the same style, so to speak, as maybe Zane Gray, Alan Eckert and other outdoor writers who write for entertainment. It is aparent to me, as it would be to anyone who is experienced with flintlocks and the woods, that this man has experience in neither. Was this published to be a true account? If it was, then it borders on stupidity.

Rail Driver
December 28, 2011, 10:59 AM
Not having any real experience with flintlocks, I can't pick out any real problems... Someone care to enlighten me a little?

SleazyRider
December 28, 2011, 10:59 AM
'Tis a brave man who would wrap his hands around a wounded deer and (presumably) slit its throat. Not me. I'd think about taking my knife and fashioning a spear, perhaps, to dispatch the animal if I absolutely positively could not get my flinter running again. I guess that makes me a chicken.

This makes a good case for carrying a sidearm when hunting with a flintlock, but that is prohibited in my state. (Shhh ... I know of some folks who do it anyway.) At the very least, why not amend the rules to permit carrying a muzzleloading revolver as a sidearm during muzzleloading season?

somoss
December 28, 2011, 11:59 AM
i use flintlockts, not sure what he said is 100% inaccurate. maybe he has made some exaggerations for the sake of the art.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2011, 12:34 PM
Only thing I saw was the "wrapped my arms around the wounded doe" but then again, how wounded was it? We do not know. I have spine shot a few deer that I have had to finish with a knife to the throat during ML season in PA. Sorry Loyalist_Dave but I do not see anything in the story to upset anyone. He seems to portray an account nicely and with some taste.

d2wing
December 28, 2011, 12:44 PM
Besides the wraping arms around the doe, the part about she stomped her foot and he still had time to take a knee and refresh his pan charge then shoot seems a little odd. but not impossible. Seems plausable enough.

Loyalist Dave
December 28, 2011, 03:00 PM
Perhaps I can enlighten a bit...,

First, he claims the doe was looking right at him, actually challenging him, then...,

He drops to one knee, he "fumbles in his pocket", he opens his pan [he doesn't say this but he would have to], he added prime to his frizzen , then he shuts his pan [again he had to do this; doesn't mention it], and then takes aim..., that's a lot of movement for a deer that is alerted to danger to put up with, and him still be able to have a shot...,

[I]The impact of the bullet had knocked her to the ground, and as the rest of the herd high-tailed it over the ridge, she struggled to stand, staggered a few yards and then collapsed again. OK so he hasn't hit the spine, nor the head, nor the legs, for he doesn't mention anything other than staggering..., why again did the deer fall down? The only time I have had them fall when using my flintlock was when I hit them in the spine..., I other hunters knock them down from a shoulder, hip, or leg hit..., doesn't mention this.

Instead of hitting her in the heart or lungs, which would have killed her instantly, WHAT? I have killed no less than ten deer with lung hits from my flintlock, through and through, and NONE have been killed instantly. I have hit two in the spine, and that dropped them instantly.

And because these ancient guns are notoriously balky and inaccurate, there is a very good chance that you’ll miss your target altogether or, worse, that you’ll simply wound the creature and in so doing, inflict greater suffering than is necessary. This is a total myth.

I loaded my gun, charged the frizzen, and pulled the trigger. There was a flash in the pan — that is where the expression comes from — and then nothing. I tried again. Still nothing. Again he misuses "frizzen" then correctly uses "pan".

I didn’t have the time or the tools with me to fix the gun — I had carelessly left them behind — and so I laid my rifle down on the ground, pulled my knife from its sheath, wrapped my arms around the wounded and frightened doe, and ... BS, you have a knife, are in the woods, it takes mere seconds to make a prick and open a touch hole..., plus the crap about his dispatching the animal that he wounded.

I submit...,
He has a book that came out last summer..., it's mentioned at the bottom of his piece; I submit he got some cash (perhaps) from the NY Times, AND he got free advertising of his book.

Follow
The
Money


LD

marksman13
December 29, 2011, 03:40 PM
I've grabbed wounded deer before and slit their throats. I didn't take the time to read the article, but that line in and of itself does not make me doubt the story.

Notice I said I have slit the throat of wounded deer before. It's not something I make a habit of doing. I was young and stupid. Never got hurt, but had a close call or two. That's the way I was taught by a cousin of mine to finish off a wounded deer. It wasn't until later in life that I realized he told me to do it as a form of amuzement for himself.

It's not something I would intentionally set out to do now, but made complete sense back then.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 29, 2011, 08:05 PM
Besides the wraping arms around the doe, the part about she stomped her foot and he still had time to take a knee and refresh his pan charge then shoot seems a little odd. but not impossible. Seems plausable enough.

d2wing, I stepped out to the field, looked to my right, there was a doe up the hill about 25 yards, I eased down to my knee, took careful aim (I thought) let it loose, and missed! Deer ran about 60 yards out and stopped, turned around and looked at me while I reloaded, put a cap on, took aim, put one right through her chest! Deer can do some really retarded things to be so smart huh!

Dave, It was a nicely written story that may or may not have been 100% accurate as far as some terminology but really, so what? Different deer do different things and react different ways to all sorts of stimuli. Some, actually most, choose to flee, while others actually will stand and challenge or just look from what THEY perceive as a safe distance.

To say that this story rings completely untrue to you just because YOU have yet to experience something of this nature with a Flintlock after JUST "nearly a dozen" is way out of line. Personally I have had deer drop dead in their tracks from lung shots delivered with a ML and I have had them run for hundreds of yards with identical equipment and identical shot locations. Not even a full dozen deer is not a reliable base to be able to form a truly educated opinion on. At least not one to completely discount the story.

infmp32
December 29, 2011, 11:40 PM
It seems a far fetched story, and the inaccuracies and inconsistency in naming parts of the rifle are a big red flag. The kind of mistakes that writers make in fictional books, tv shows and movies. I would imagine an experienced flintlock hunter would know the difference between his pan and frizzen. And if he were a real traditionalist he'd refer to them as the pan, hammer and cock. Unless he were Dutch. ;)

Frogomatik
December 30, 2011, 10:51 AM
and you know there's only two things we don't put up with here. Racial intolerance...and the Dutch...lol

More seriously, the bit about going to one knee and prepping a round while the deer is looking right at him sounds like some baloney to me(in my experience when a deer sees you move, they are gone in a flash). The bit about a heart/lung shot being an insta-gib is patently untrue. And wrapping your arms around even a "mortally wounded" deer is just plain foolish.

Oh, and that stupid phrase about "moral ambiguity" then later contradicting that very phrase by saying it's our responsibility to hunt (which I agree with) If you have a responsibility to do so, then there is no moral ambiguity. Also the bit about "hate to kill" What? I've never known a hunter that ever expressed anything of the sort. In fact it's kind of the opposite. The hunters I know hate to NOT kill, I know I do. It's only happened once, but it still bothers me that I wounded an animal, didn't kill it, and then was unable to track it down and finish it. I don't lose sleep over it, but that incident it present in my mind every time I hunt and has affected my decision making...for the better.

Cocked & Locked
December 30, 2011, 01:14 PM
Just appearing in the New York Times says it well for me. :scrutiny:

CoRoMo
December 30, 2011, 01:20 PM
Okay, now I know what 'drek' means. :o

buck460XVR
December 30, 2011, 03:31 PM
First, he claims the doe was looking right at him, actually challenging him, then...,

He drops to one knee, he "fumbles in his pocket", he opens his pan [he doesn't say this but he would have to], he added prime to his frizzen [it's a pan not a frizzen], then he shuts his pan [again he had to do this; doesn't mention it], and then takes aim..., that's a lot of movement for a deer that is alerted to danger to put up with, and him still be able to have a shot...,


After hunting deer with gun and bow for almost 50 years, I can say I've seen deer do stranger things before they died. I've seen many a hunter doing stranger things also before they killed a deer. Thus I doubt the statement "It is amazingly inaccurate, to the point that it smacks of a fraudulent account". Did the author maybe enhance his story in order to make it more interesting and to make himself look like more of a hunter? Show me one hunter or fisherman that has never done this themselves.:scrutiny:

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