Buy American or foreign?


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Mitchell Gard
January 2, 2012, 11:49 PM
Earlier today on another thread the topic of buying American made products came up. Now I'm not one to sacrifice quality for origin and unfortunately some countries bring more to the table on some firearms and other misc. products than America does. I Do my best to buy American as much as possible but when push comes to shove I'm goingto look at quality and price(to a certain extent) over origin. How do y'all feel about buying or not buying American made weapons?

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Hossfly68
January 2, 2012, 11:56 PM
My first pistol was made in Italy, sold for half of anything I could find American made and has never had so much as a burp. If it works for you, it works for you and the heck with what anybody thinks about it. It's not that I'm not patriotic, but that I believe form (and price) follows function.

Of course, you can look at it another way. You're gonna buy it in America, right? Then an American somewhere is making a profit off of selling it.

Skribs
January 2, 2012, 11:58 PM
That depends on how far into it you want to go. My Springfield Armory, USA handgun was "Made in Croatia". Do you want all of the parts to be made in America, or just have the gun assembled here? Is it considered buying American if the company is in America but the plant is in China or South America?

Personally, I buy products from quality manufacturers, no matter where they are from. This is what capitalism is all about. I think people who say you should only buy "Made in America" have their heart in the right place, but are setting a dangerous example to the rest of the world to only buy from their home country.

beeenbag
January 3, 2012, 12:09 AM
I started out not buying based on origin, but have found my self weeding out the imports and replacing with domestic made firearms.

I know some foreign made guns are great products (Glock was the one that I didn't like getting rid of) but there was just something about looking at the foreign ones, then at the "Made in the U.S.A". I am almost completely Red, White, and Blue!!

R.W.Dale
January 3, 2012, 12:12 AM
Where's everyone's computer they're using to post here made?

posted via tapatalk using android.

1894
January 3, 2012, 12:14 AM
I buy quality. I buy it here.

What Hossfly said.

hso
January 3, 2012, 12:15 AM
You'll find a few folks that only buy American, some that prefer to buy American, but will buy quality if if comes from a foreign manufacturer, and most that don't care.

Would You pass up a CZ 75 or a Sako rifle or a Benelli shotgun just because they weren't made in America? Of course not.

splithoof
January 3, 2012, 12:19 AM
No Jap guns?....The Winchester lever-action copies I have seen & used that are built in Japan rival, if not exceed the stuff built by the original company. I have copies of both new and old, and while the nostalgia of the old ones with worn finish, saddle dings, and stories of hunts from long ago make for fine conversation pieces, the newer Japan models have much more precise tolerances with finishes just as good.

Buck Kramer
January 3, 2012, 12:26 AM
I have a 3 AK's I built on American receivers, where do they fit? Otherwise I have a BG 380 (America) and a XD 9mm (Cromerica?)

Mitchell Gard
January 3, 2012, 12:27 AM
I agree hso, I definitely fall into the prefer but won't turn down quality. Especially a SAKO. I do know that it seems like for every imported fine rifle there of course is an absurdly expensive custom made in America rifle that could compete with quality. Seems you usually get what you pay for on the firearms market

Robert
January 3, 2012, 12:28 AM
I will buy what best fits my needs/ wants and budget. If it is American made than that is a bonus.

Mitchell Gard
January 3, 2012, 12:34 AM
Absolutely Gus, and that's actually the situation I'm in now with looking for a new rifle.

MachIVshooter
January 3, 2012, 12:37 AM
I always buy American made if its available, even at a much higher price. That said, where guns are concerned, there are many with no domestically produced option.

I will not own China made weapons, though. No exceptions.

Robert
January 3, 2012, 12:39 AM
I'm in now with looking for a new rifle.
What are you looking for and what is your budget?

Mitchell Gard
January 3, 2012, 12:43 AM
Unless it was a gift I would never own a chinese made weapon either.

bushmaster1313
January 3, 2012, 01:11 AM
All of my guns, except for maybe part of my SIG 226, are:

http://i700.photobucket.com/albums/ww6/bushmaster1313/CIMG0292.jpg

Tim the student
January 3, 2012, 03:04 AM
Generally speaking, I want quality first. I prefer that quality be American, but that doesn't mean I'll buy a gun made elsewhere if it is what I want.

I try to avoid buying Chinese, but it is unavoidable for some products that I want.

Davek1977
January 3, 2012, 04:50 AM
I buy by what suits me, not country of manufacture. I've owned quality weapons from the US, Spain, Romania, China, etc...I don't let blind loyalties guide my purchasing decisions

TexasBill
January 3, 2012, 05:29 AM
I am wearing a shirt that was made in Bangladesh; jeans made in Nicaragua, shorts made in Costa Rica and shoes and belt made in China. Don't know where my socks are from but it's a good bet it's not here. At the moment, a German pistol in an Israeli holster is on my hip. The pistol is loaded with American-made ammunition.

Incidentally, with the exception of the Walther pistol and Fobus holster, everything I am wearing has an American brand name. These were all companies that used to employ Americans to make their products.

I am writing on a computer made in China while sitting in a chair made in Canada. I drive a car that was built in Germany (my previous two "American" vehicles were assembled in Mexico).

Looking through the guns I have bought in recent years, I find three American rifles, one Italian carbine, two American revolvers, a pistol manufactured in the U.S. by a Belgian company, an American-branded pistol made in Italy, two Italian pistols and four German pistols.

I would love to buy more American products. But that means somebody needs to make more products I want to buy in America.

Sav .250
January 3, 2012, 07:56 AM
I try to get the best buy for my money, no matter where it`s made.
I do draw the line on ......made in China though.

BeerSleeper
January 3, 2012, 08:08 AM
Where's everyone's computer they're using to post here made?
Mine was made right here in my basement, but sadly, home built computers is rapidly becoming a lost art.

As for guns, 75% of mine are made in USA, but that is a matter of coincidence. I make no effort to buy "domestic" over all else. I prefer to buy US made products, but I am not willing to settle for inferior product quality, or exorbitant pricing. I think guns are the last product area remaining where I am usually able to buy American, and not have to sacrifice quality or value to do so.

Pilot
January 3, 2012, 08:28 AM
I have many American made guns, I have many foreign made guns. I like to support American companies, that employ American workers, but as others have said, that isn't always possible. I buy guns that suit my needs, and don't restrict myself as to country of origin.

I think the foreign products have forced U.S. gunmakers to step it up in quality and new offerings to compete in the market.

cowpoke
January 3, 2012, 08:32 AM
ALL my guns & leather are made in U.S.A

catnphx
January 3, 2012, 08:57 AM
I currently only buy American guns. If my collection ever gets so big that I need to go foreign then that's a good problem to have. I just feel more comfortable in the quality and service of an American firm ... that's me though. There would be a few foreign guns I wouldn't mine having but I'm satisfied (at the moment) with USA.

ultradoc
January 3, 2012, 09:01 AM
When it come to guns it doesn't really matter to me. Now vehicles are another subject.

Zoogster
January 3, 2012, 09:13 AM
There is many fine foreign products.
I myself have not had the fortitude to ignore them out of a sense of moral obligation, but I can certainly appreciate people that do and will not belittle them.



Most of us are raised to be selfish today. To hold value and a good deal above all else. We can invent plenty of excuses to justify it:
If a domestic manufacturer wanted our business they could produce just as good or better of a product and sell it for less or at the same price as products made in a nation with workers operating under poor conditions and who barely make enough to eat.
Yeah!
We can support barbaric treatment of those people, even to save just a small percent, while at the same time demanding better salaries and conditions here.
We are a nation of selfish hypocrites. Where the most successful business models are those that import the lowest priced products from nations with the least compassion for their workers, in the highest numbers.

Part of the problem of course is those that support freedom have been taught by party lines and big business that freedom involves free-trade.
Republicans backed by big business teach it.
Democrats support it, Clinton signed NAFTA.
'Free-trade' is complete crap, and the founders knew it.
Tariffs and duties were charged for many imports during their time. The purpose of which is to push the price of foreign goods up, insuring people don't buy foreign to save a few pennies, and only when the foreign product is actually good enough to pay more money for.
No I don't support actually banning or restricting those foreign products from being imported either, which is also done in some cases today. That is not freedom either.


Gun manufacturing is one of the few industries protected by legislation that gives domestic manufacturers some advantage over foreign products.
Just look at the points system for import of revolvers and pistols, making it impossible to import many of the most popular designs, and insuring American companies don't even have to compete with foreign production.
Or 922r type legislation with long guns, sporting configuration requirements, etc that give domestic manufacturers an advantage over foreign.
However contrary to what I posted above I do not support that hypocrisy, it is not a flat tariff, a tariff on par with what is imposed on all other imported products (of which there is none on many things today.) No they are blanket bans on importation of certain firearms or configurations entirely.
It would also be hypocritical to support even tariffs for firearms when it is not done for most other industries, and only for firearms.
That is wrong as well.

Tariffs should be imposed across the board on most imported products, not huge ones, but enough to cause people to pick American over Chinese when the difference is a couple percent price difference.
They should be designed to encourage domestic production and local business.
Not benefit multinational corporations who are selfish and teach that free trade and the free market equal freedom because it is more profitable to have factories in China, their headquarters on an island with lower taxes, and no loyalty to any nation, morals, or ideals.
But it would have to equally apply to most industries, not a couple.
While domestic taxes should be lower.
There is very clear ways to have a booming economy, but we would rather be selfish.


But then again the selfish situation does make nations less patriotic, and ties economies of nations with opposing ideals together instead of letting them be independent. That probably reduces the occurrence of large scale industrial wars. After all China and the US would probably be doing a lot more military posturing and similar to the times of the Cold War if our economies were not intertwined and mutually dependent on the other.
Millions of people are not sent off to die every couple decades as the early 20th century showed was going to be the norm with an industrialized world.

So you know what, I don't have the answer after all. Selfish multinational big business with no loyalty to any ideals or any nation, and who would abandon the US if profit dictated, may be benefiting us after all.
Now to go price some foreign imports.

JohnBT
January 3, 2012, 09:45 AM
The last gun I bought was a recent import. It was made for the Swiss Army 40 years ago and cost me $2500. Am I going to hell?

:banghead:


"We are a nation of selfish hypocrites."

You might be, I'm not, so speak for yourself. Neither am I stupid.

John

303tom
January 3, 2012, 10:14 AM
Buy American & America Works !

RedLyons
January 3, 2012, 11:14 AM
It's about the parable of the broken window for me. The more I spend on something means that I have less to spend on something else. It doesn't matter what I'm buying, if I can get an equivalent product for a lesser price, it benefits everyone that I still have the extra cash to spend on something else.

I don't think I have the opportunity to buy products from countries that I really have issues with, as I get older I despise greedy unions more than child labor. Unions protect their members rights to not have to work. Children working in sweatshops is often their best opportunity to improve their lives, and it's better than starving. I think we have done our youth a disservice by disallowing them from working until they are older. We have come a long way from children in coal mines, and I think kids could benefit from some honest labor.

I buy my foreign made products from Americans, so they benefit from my purchase, and I benefit from being able to keep more of my cash. I don't see what is more American than that.

Rail Driver
January 3, 2012, 11:16 AM
I try to buy American, but every time I do, I end up with a gun from brazil, so I said forget it and started buying russian... At least those are Really made in Russia. I was shocked and appalled when I turned over my springfield and saw an Imbel Brazil mark on the bottom.

Quiet
January 3, 2012, 11:22 AM
I was shocked and appalled when I turned over my springfield and saw an Imbel Brazil mark on the bottom.
Except for a few of the 1911s made by their Custom Shop, all handguns sold by Springfield Armory are made in another country (Brazil or Croatia). It's been that way for decades.

Neo-Luddite
January 3, 2012, 11:31 AM
My 'budget' Romanian WASR-10 is now at 3000+ rounds, six years, never cleaned and hasn't even hinted at malfunctioning---should I trade up?

Point being, apart from my 'no commie' rule I'm flexible if the quality proposition is good for the money (and yes, *I know* I have let it go that AK's are Soviet bloc weapons in design).

jad0110
January 3, 2012, 11:51 AM
It's basically a tie breaker for me. A product has to first meet my needs (quality, form, funciton, price, etc). So it's a tie breaker for me in a way. If 2+ products meet my needs and one is American, I'll pick the American product every time, of course. I think most of us would.

Now, if no American made product fits my need, or does not fit it as well I'm simply not going to buy it. When my wife and I were shopping for a mid to full size car, the only one that fit into our budget AND worked for our height differences (she's 5', I'm 6'7") was the Toyota Avalon. Of course, like firearms, I buy used, so American vs foreign does not matter as much.

And the car example is particularly muddy. What is more American, the Ford that is assembled in Mexico ... or the Toyota that is made in Kentucky? The GM that is made in Canada, or the Hyundai that is made in Alabama?

youngda9
January 3, 2012, 12:01 PM
"Buy American & America Works ! "

That about sums it up.

MedWheeler
January 3, 2012, 12:05 PM
I buy what I want. To me, that's part of "freedom". I have made no effort (regarding firearms) to "regulate" from where each comes. Looking at them now, there are two from Brazil, one from Argentina, one from Canada, and the other eleven hail from here. There are two more which I no longer own; one was from here and the other was from Germany.
If I never bought anything made in China, I'd go broke. Just the truth, no emotion behind it.

WinThePennant
January 3, 2012, 12:31 PM
You lose absolutely NOTHING in buying American.

Ruger and S&W make very fine rifles and handguns. I'd put Ruger and S&W right up there with Glock or Sig.

I'll probably own a Glock 19 sometime in the near future. But, a Ruger SR9c is a must have in my book.

56hawk
January 3, 2012, 12:41 PM
Gun buying is the one place where I support diversity and multiculturalism. I have guns made in:

Austria
Belgium
Brazil
Canada
China
Czechoslovakia
England
Egypt
Finland
France
Germany
India
Italy
Japan
Korea
Russia
Spain
Sweden
Switzerland
Turkey
United States

Most of these guns are military collectibles. In term of non military guns though I buy strictly on quality. Most times guns made in the USA are better. However with semi auto pistols there aren't any US designs I like, and prefer pistols made in Germany or Italy.

khegglie
January 3, 2012, 02:06 PM
^^^^^^^, YUP.

JohnBT
January 3, 2012, 02:15 PM
Do any of the buy-American folks own any foreign stocks or bonds?
How about South African Krugerrands?
Scotch or imported beer?
Drywall from China. :cuss:

John

amd6547
January 3, 2012, 03:41 PM
The made in USA 1911 I had came with plenty of MIM parts and a cast slide and frame.
I was glad to find a made in China 1911 with solid forged steel everything.
...and, when I can find a made in USA Swiss K31 chambered for 308, I will buy it...especially if it is around the $150 I paid for my Swiss version.

jojo200517
January 3, 2012, 04:16 PM
I buy whatever I want from whoever is selling it at the best price. My mossberg Maverick 88 shotguns are assembled in Texas with some parts from mexico. Both of my AK-47's are romanian but they have US made trigger groups. No clue where the bullpup stock kit on that one came from but the other one has an Israeli made Mako Group stock. So does my Saiga .308 but it was made in russia. The metal mags I bought for it from csspecs are american made tho and I was willing to pay the hefty price tag for the good metal mags not just because they were american made and gave me the compliance parts but because they were what I wanted and well made.

So the question I have is where are my weapons from if they have parts from all over?

This laptop I am on says it was assembled in china, I just popped the optical drive out of there tho and it says it is a product of Malaysia.

What if I were to buy a weapon that was made and assembled here in America of all American made parts but the metal ore was mined in China, Russia, or India. Then would it really be an American made gun?

If anyone has any of these weapons from other countries that they no longer wish to have PM me your address and I'll send you a postage paid UPS or FedEx label so you can ship it to my local FFL.

I think TexasBill summed it up pretty well
I would love to buy more American products. But that means somebody needs to make more products I want to buy in America.

dirtyjim
January 3, 2012, 08:18 PM
Buy American & America Works !
actually its a handful of americans and a ton of legal and illegal immigrants work.

i rarely buy new rifles and there are not any american made rifles i would buy but there are several german, british, austrian, french & czech rifles i would buy over any american rifle thats currently in production.
now with full blown customs bolt rifles the worlds best builders are currently americans

EddieNFL
January 3, 2012, 08:42 PM
...some that prefer to buy American, but will buy quality if if comes from a foreign manufacturer...

Yep. Unfortunately, that knocks many American made products out of the running.

Omaha-BeenGlockin
January 3, 2012, 08:56 PM
Mostly American guns--save for Glocks and an Italian shotgun-------vehicle is still foreign.

rellascout
January 3, 2012, 08:59 PM
I buy the best product I can for the intend use regardless of where it was made. This applies to guns, cars, TV, computers etc... We live in a global economy and that it not going to change anytime soon.

rduchateau2954
January 3, 2012, 09:05 PM
When I bought my benelli and later my tikka, I hated the fact that they were not made in the USA. But at the end of the day I bought what I wanted and don't regret it.

The Lone Haranguer
January 3, 2012, 09:07 PM
If it is US-made, all the better, but I look at quality, performance and suitability for my needs first.

Tiberius67
January 3, 2012, 09:17 PM
Except for a few of the 1911s made by their Custom Shop, all handguns sold by Springfield Armory are made in another country (Brazil or Croatia). It's been that way for decades.

The XDs are Croatian designed and produced...'Springfield Armory' is just the US distributor. The first time the Croatians tried to market the pistol, then called the HS2000, it flopped.

OTOH....most Glocks sold in the US are made in the US, in a factory in GA, I believe.

Mitchell Gard
January 3, 2012, 09:24 PM
Yea its in Smyrna ga near where I lived. I think they're just distributed from there though

firesky101
January 3, 2012, 11:56 PM
Just did a quick count 57% american. Never really thought about it. I would have guessed soviet arms would have taken the cake. I guess my tastes are getting more expensive. ...sigh...

Ben86
January 4, 2012, 01:21 AM
I Do my best to buy American as much as possible but when push comes to shove I'm goingto look at quality and price(to a certain extent) over origin.

And that doesn't make you less of a patriot. Don't buy a crappier deal or something that you don't want just because it is American. Don't miss out on something just because it is foreign (although most companies have factories that employ many people here).

That said I prefer to buy American as long as they have what I am after. S&W, Kahr, Ruger and Remington have me covered for the most part.

arcticap
January 4, 2012, 03:02 AM
I buy what I like and sometimes its American made and sometimes it isn't.
I look it at this way.
I drive an older American car and pay a lot for repairs to keep it on the road. So if I can get a good deal on an imported gun or ammo that I like then I'm going to buy it to help me offset my car repairs.
It's just like buying gasoline. You buy it where it you buy it and when you need it at the price that you're willing to pay for the brand that's being offered.
Which is just like most goods on the marketplace being sold, if everyone only bought "American gasoline" then there wouldn't be enough of it to go around.

DNS
January 4, 2012, 04:00 AM
Yep, American.

Just bought my first AR, an Smith and Wesson Sport. Qaulity all the way.
Beats the snot out of any russkie or chicom stuff.

TennJed
January 4, 2012, 04:34 AM
I currently only buy American guns. If my collection ever gets so big that I need to go foreign then that's a good problem to have. I just feel more comfortable in the quality and service of an American firm ... that's me though. There would be a few foreign guns I wouldn't mine having but I'm satisfied (at the moment) with USA.
I really don't consider it too much. The main reason is I can't keep up with who is American now and who is not.

I assume you own a Kahr based on your tag line. Kahr is an American company owned by a South Korean company Tongil. While it is great that Kahr employs American workers, I assume a lot of the bottom line profit makes its way back to South Korea.

I buy what suits my needs. If I save $100 buying a gun from another country, I can then spend that $100 taking my family out to eat and help an American waiter or cook earn a living.

Or maybe take them to a professional sports game and help an American athlete earn a million $ :)

justice06rr
January 4, 2012, 06:37 AM
I'm all for buying American and helping our domestic economy. Why not?

Many companies like Smith&Wesson, Ruger, Spikes Tactical, even Keltec make great firearms so if I can patronize American-made and assembled products I will do so. Not to say I won't buy foreign, as I have in the past with Springfield armory, or Taurus.

It just makes one feel good and proud to support your own country's products

guyfromohio
January 4, 2012, 06:41 AM
Hi-point is American. I'll keep my Sigs.

Mp7
January 4, 2012, 07:45 AM
Capitalism is about moving goods around the planet.

Prosperity would be about staying so good that people from other countries buy your countries products. A nationalistic consumer approach is narrow minded imho.

Wanderling
January 4, 2012, 08:58 AM
A quality product, regardless of whether it's a firearm or a kitchen table, takes skill and time to make, and costs accordingly.

I do not think that competition based on quality of workmanship and design hurts America or anyone for that matter; just the opposite. If the Italians or Germans or whomever can build a better pistol, by all means buy it and force our own manufacturers to improve their standards.

It's the poverty-based price-over-quality competition that hurts everyone.

jblackfish
January 4, 2012, 09:16 AM
So many US companies have foreign "assembly" plants and, unless you do a study it's often difficult to tell who's behind a label whether it's guns, clothes, cars, or any other products. I'm reminded of the fact that many foreign cars are "built" (assembled) right here in the USA - the states bid heavily to land a foreign car assembly plant on their soil.

I guess we need to continue to pursue quality and let the companies work it out - I know most individuals don't have anything other than the dollars they spend to "control" how companies are run and we're not organized enough to make an impact. Many of us are too busy trying to stay afloat.

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