1895 conversion to 450 Alaskan?


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klover
January 31, 2012, 08:21 AM
Years ago a friend was making these, but never had a chance to build one for me.
I was trying to remember exactly what was required to do such a conversion.

I do know it is an obsolete round and requires expensive die sets to make ammo. Ammo for such a rifle is hard to find, but a few companies still make it.

If someone knows lever smiths who do know, could you please post such a reply?

The idea is for more than a 45/70 in a lever gun. These approach .458 Winchester Magnum in power.

Thanks.

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lowerunit411
January 31, 2012, 08:44 AM
try these guys.......http://wildwestguns.com

natman
January 31, 2012, 10:47 AM
The 450 Alaskan is built from the 348 Winchester necked up. The 348 is a rimmed round with a very large base and rim. The 1895 is designed to feed rimless and much smaller rimmed rounds, such as the 30/40 Krag. I'm not saying it's impossible to convert one to 450 Alaskan, but getting one to feed would be interesting.

It's more common to convert a Model 71 Winchester since they were designed from the ground up to feed 348 Win, or since the originals have become collector's items, one of the newer 71 copies from Miroku (sold as Browning or Winchester).

Or you could just get a 450 Marlin from Browning or Marlin.

lowerunit411
January 31, 2012, 10:50 AM
what about this?:http://www.realguns.com/archives/184.htm

natman
January 31, 2012, 10:53 AM
The 450 Alaskan is built from the 348 Winchester necked up. The 348 is a rimmed round with a very large base and rim. The 1895 is designed to feed rimless and much smaller rimmed rounds, such as the 30/40 Krag. I'm not saying it's impossible to convert one to 450 Alaskan, but getting one to feed would be interesting.

When I wrote this I was thinking of a Winchester Model 1895. I see now that the OP was talking about a Marlin 1895.

Never mind. :o

If you're going to start with a Marlin, I don't know if I'd convert to 450 Alaskan, given that you can shoot 45-70 warm handloads, buy one in 450 Marlin or have it converted to 457 Mag by Wild West. If you're going to do all the work to get a 348 case to feed, go all the way to 50 Alaskan.

huntershooter
January 31, 2012, 12:44 PM
Try Ben Forkin, White Sulpher Spgs. Montana.
He did a mod. '71 to .450 Alaskan for me. I know he's done the conversion on Marlins as well.

NCsmitty
January 31, 2012, 12:45 PM
With both the 45-70 and the 450 Marlin capable of shooting a 400gr bullet at 2000 FPS and capable of taking any game in North America, it's hard to believe that 450 Alaskan would give you much advantage when you have to deal with firearm conversion and case fabrication. Would a 200 fps advantage make a difference on the game? Not in my book.


NCsmitty

VancMike
January 31, 2012, 03:27 PM
I agree with NC.....spend the time building thumper 45-70 loads....

klover
January 31, 2012, 10:52 PM
I always suspected my friend was a little off for building these.
I know where there is a good used Marlin 45/70 for a very fair price.

Clipper
January 31, 2012, 11:49 PM
One builds a .450 Alaskan to have a .450 Alaskan. I'm reboring and chambering a Mosin-Nagant sporter to .348 rimless not because I have to have a .348 M-N, but because I want a .348 M-N...

Owen Sparks
February 1, 2012, 12:38 AM
I have worked up .45/70 loads to get an honest 2000 fps with a 400 grain bullet. Recoil was brutal.

Pete D.
February 1, 2012, 09:54 AM
With both the 45-70 and the 450 Marlin capable of shooting a 400gr bullet at 2000 FPS and capable of taking any game in North America, it's hard to believe that 450 Alaskan would give you much advantage....
About the 400 gr. bullet at 2000 fps from a 45-70.......I can't say that you are wrong but I wonder about the source of the data. I have just been looking through my manuals and can find none that spec a 400 grain bullet at 2000 fps for use in the 1895 Marlin. (Hornady, Lyman, Sierra, Nosler, Speer, Lee).
As to advantages....+1 about the idea that one does a conversion like this one because one wants a 450 AK.
Forget velocity differences, the 450 Alaskan delivers muzzle energies in the range of 4300 to 4400 ft.lbs, about 15 to 20% more than either the 450 Marlin or hot (and safe) 45-70 loads. At least, this is what published data tells me.
I do see that Grizzly offers a +P load for the Marlin that specs a 405 at 2050 (3778 ft.lbs)
The point, though, about whether the extra is necessary or not is worth consideration.
Pete

NCsmitty
February 1, 2012, 11:11 AM
I can't say that you are wrong but I wonder about the source of the data.

www.hodgdon.com, under "lever actions".

Believe me, I understand about having whatever caliber that I want, because I build my own Mauser based rifles, but also common sense can dictate choices too.
As Owen Sparks so eloquently stated, a 45-70 with a 400gr @ 2000FPS load, Recoil was brutal.
To each their own.


NCsmitty

CraigC
February 1, 2012, 12:41 PM
The .450AK is not obsolete, it is a wildcat. Big difference. It can be used in the Marlin action but it is not long enough to allow the .450 to stretch its legs. It's really better suited for the Winchester/Browning 1886/71 platform it was designed for. In those guns, which are significantly stronger anyway (Marlin owners don't like hearing that but it's true), think 500gr at 2000fps. A Marlin .45-70 can't touch that.

jeepnik
February 2, 2012, 10:32 PM
More than the 45-70 in a levergun? You do know that folks have killed elephants, hippos, rhinos, lions and tigers and bears, OH MY!, with the ancient 45-70. The secret is, wait for it, wait, "modern ammunition". Look at the specs on some of the Buffalo Bore and Garrett offerings.

If you need more energy on target than what's currently available "off the shelf", then you must be worried about a Jurassic Park scenario. In which case, it's time for air or artillery support. Or if you are on an island, naval gunfire will more than suffice.

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