Sig Sauer 1911 Opinion


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el Godfather
February 4, 2012, 02:38 PM
Dear THR

I would like to ask for your opinion on Sig 1911 pistols. I have recently picked up two of then. One C3 and the other is Nitro rail carry.

I want to know how far has Sig come in producing a quality 1911 pistols when compared to some high end brands like Wilson, Ed Brown, Nighthawk, etc? Off course not, to forget the time tested Colts.

Thank you,

:)

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plateshooter
February 4, 2012, 02:44 PM
I have a Sig C3 and l like it a lot. Compared to the other 1911s that I have owned, it is far above in quality and accuracy. Hope you are enjoying yours.

JTQ
February 4, 2012, 02:50 PM
I don't think Sig is in the same league as Baer, Brown, NighHawk, or Wilson, but they are probably in the same class as Colt's.

They had some problems early in their production, but from my reading lately, they are producing a good pistol. They do have a Colt style Series 80 firing pin safety and an external extractor that bugs the traditionalist, though.

flatlander937
February 4, 2012, 07:07 PM
I came -very- close to buying a Sig 1911 as my first pistol, but ultimately ended up with a Colt... I just like it better, and it's the only company that's been doing it for 100 years. I can always buy a Sig at a later time(and I very well just might).

FWIW the Sig XO that I rented at the local range ran perfectly, and was very accurate. I liked it a lot. One reason I didn't choose one was because of the unusual slide geometry... from what I read online(dangerous, I know) it doesn't fit as well into holsters as other 1911s. Also I do not care for the slide serrations... the Colt 1991 had everything I knew I wanted.


I voted for the very good option... it's not going to be like a Baer or Ed Brown... neither is a stock Colt though, and that's fine with me.



If you like them, and don't regret buying them, then it sounds like you landed a good deal:cool:

9mmepiphany
February 4, 2012, 07:34 PM
After addressing the initial function problems, I think the SIG 1911s are able to stand with other mid-priced 1911s. The greatest selling point is their different slide profile (for folks who want a different look) and it is also their greatest failing (for folks who don't want to get different holsters just for their SIGs).

The SIGs aren't in the same workmanship class as the high end production 1911s you have named, but I would put them somewhere above a Kimber and below a S&W E-series or entry level Dan Wesson

el Godfather
February 5, 2012, 05:55 AM
Thank you.
I also did notice immediately after purchasing Sig that it didnt fit at all in the previous 1911 holsters I had. I think thicker profile with rail is especially a problem.

I admit I am one of those who are partial to the Sig profile in terms of looks.

Big Nugget
February 5, 2012, 12:01 PM
I've never been lucky enough to handle a hig end 1911 so I didn't vote as I have no reference, but I'm leaning towards your top two. In my opinion, I prefer my Sig more than any SA, Kimber or Colt that I've shot. Not that I would turn my nose up at any of them! :)

The holster problem is the only thing that I can grumble about, but thats it. There are a number of Holster makers that can make one, in various price ranges and materials, if you feel the need to have one. If thats a deal breaker for some people Sig does offer their Traditional line of 1911s which has the normal slide profile. Though they still use an external extractor, which still leaves something for people to bitch about...:rolleyes:

My needs are basic. Does it feel good in hand, functions properly and can I be as accurate as I can be with it consistently. For me, my Sig excels my expectations.

bds
February 5, 2012, 04:20 PM
After failing to buy a Dan Wesson PM7 (1 of like 100/200 made for California each year), I range tested various 1911s and settled on Sig 1911 Nitron railed TacPac (http://www.sigsauer.com/CatalogProductDetails/1911-tacpac.aspx) that comes with laser/holster.

I have a friend who has several Kimbers and the Sig TacPac will shoot comparable to his more accurate Kimbers. Keep in mind that regardless of the finish (black Nitron or stainless), all 5" models are built from stainless frames/slides. Compact models have aluminum frames.

I use the Sig TacPac primarily as a load development/accuracy testing platform as it has tight match barrel/bushing and chamber with very quick start of rifling (almost no leade) that's worked well for lead SWC loads. After 5000+ factory jacketed and plated/lead reloads, it is shooting very accurate and silky smooth. I consider sub $800 5" Sig 1911s undervalued and compare readily to $1200+ range 1911 models.

GT27
February 5, 2012, 04:33 PM
Colt is the Holy Grail in the 1911 platform,everything else is just a copy!

Olympus
February 5, 2012, 08:37 PM
After addressing the issues with the early GSR models, Sig has really turned up the heat on their quality, features, and variety of their lineup. I consider the new Sig 1911s as the best bang for your buck right now. They are easily the most underrated 1911 on the market. The slide profile was enough to cause Sig to acknowledge the value of the traditional design, so Sig now offers both slide designs. My FIL has a Nitron Carry and I've spend a lot of time with it. Very high quality gun with very few MIM parts. I plan on adding one to my collection in the future.

Inebriated
February 5, 2012, 09:26 PM
Colt is the Holy Grail in the 1911 platform,everything else is just a copy!

Way to inspire competition and innovation!

Olympus
February 6, 2012, 12:08 AM
Way to inspire competition and innovation!

It's best not to feed the trolls. Just ignore them and they go away.

el Godfather
February 6, 2012, 03:05 PM
Colt no doubt makes great 1911s, but to dismiss the rest as simply a copy would be unfair to lots of work and effort that goes in to some those custom handguns. I for sure like, but I also believe that Colt just isn't enough to satisfy its civilian customer base anymore.

boricua9mm
February 6, 2012, 04:04 PM
From the perspective of individual parts quality, build quality and features, I find the SIGs to be the best 1911 type pistols for under $1,000. They are much better than the completely MIM-filled pistols from other big name manufacturers in the same price range.

Now, someone will soon come along to tell us that an external extractor and a different slide profile means it "ain't a 1911."

9mmepiphany
February 6, 2012, 05:14 PM
I find the SIGs to be the best 1911 type pistols for under $1,000. They are much better than the completely MIM-filled pistols from other big name manufacturers in the same price range.
Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but it sure sounds like you're trying to imply that the SIG 1911s aren't using MIM parts.

While that was true when they first introduced the GSR (the ones with the function problems), it hasn't been true in a long time...certainly not since they've become more reliable. Also there are no 1911s under $1k, I'd even venture to raise that figure to $3k, that don't use cast parts...but if that use doesn't affect function, it really shouldn't be an issue

boricua9mm
February 6, 2012, 05:26 PM
Maybe I'm reading this wrong, but it sure sounds like you're trying to imply that the SIG 1911s aren't using MIM parts.

While that was true when they first introduced the GSR (the ones with the function problems), it hasn't been true in a long time...certainly not since they've become more reliable. Also there are no 1911s under $1k, I'd even venture to raise that figure to $3k, that don't use cast parts...but if that use doesn't affect function, it really shouldn't be an issue

Wrong read confirmed. According to a 1911forum Moderator who works at SIG assembling the 1911s, SIG is currently using 5 MIM parts; slide stop, thumb safety, grip safety, disconnector and firing pin stop. For production level guns around the $1k mark, only Colt can boast having less MIM with only 3 parts. On that note, the 2010 model SIG I received only had two!

I'm always amazed that people are willing to spend over $1k on MIM-filled offerings from S&W, Kimber and Springfield at a time when SIG is finally on top of their 1911 game with more hand-fitting, features and higher quality parts. Paying more for a pistol that uses manufacturing processes designed to save money never made much sense to me, but that might be straying off the topic farm a good bit.

Olympus
February 7, 2012, 11:36 AM
Is Colt still using plastic MSHs?

Storm
February 7, 2012, 12:09 PM
I had an early GSR, one from after the initial problems were ironed out. It was a good 1911 but I realized that I only had it only because it was a SIG. I put it up against a SW1911 that I acquired at the same time and it wasn't quite the equal of the Smith. A nice gun to be sure, but not as refined in some respects.

That said, if I saw another GSR at a very good price I might be tempted.

Olympus
February 7, 2012, 03:14 PM
I had an early GSR, one from after the initial problems were ironed out. It was a good 1911 but I realized that I only had it only because it was a SIG. I put it up against a SW1911 that I acquired at the same time and it wasn't quite the equal of the Smith. A nice gun to be sure, but not as refined in some respects.

That said, if I saw another GSR at a very good price I might be tempted.

I guess I noticed the opposite. My FIL also aquired a S&W 1911 target (the one that looks like the new Ruger, stainless with black small parts). I thought the Nitron Carry has closer tolerances and a better fit and finish the S&W did. I preferred the adjustable rear sight on the S&W, but other than that, it didnt impress me. I thought the Sig was made a little better.

Then he got a new E-Series and it blew both of them away!

gpjoe
February 7, 2012, 09:06 PM
I've got a 5" reverse two-tone, with the traditional slide and it compares favorably to my Colts and Kimber. My opinion is that it is nicer, at least in fit, than the S&W E-Series gun. I compared the two and the Smith had a sloppy thumb safety, kind of mushy with no audible or tactile "click". I'm a S&W fan and really wanted to like the E-Series, but was disappointed - at least with the sample I handled.

I chose the Sig and couldn't be happier. Nice looker too - naked stainless frame with a black nitron stainless slide.

Olympus
February 8, 2012, 12:10 AM
I've got a 5" reverse two-tone, with the traditional slide and it compares favorably to my Colts and Kimber. My opinion is that it is nicer, at least in fit, than the S&W E-Series gun. I compared the two and the Smith had a sloppy thumb safety, kind of mushy with no audible or tactile "click". I'm a S&W fan and really wanted to like the E-Series, but was disappointed - at least with the sample I handled.

I chose the Sig and couldn't be happier. Nice looker too - naked stainless frame with a black nitron stainless slide.

See, I always considered that variation the regular two-tone. Black on top of silver. I have always called the silver on top of black the "reverse two-tone". I guess I've been getting it backwards all this time.

9mmepiphany
February 8, 2012, 03:27 AM
See, I always considered that variation the regular two-tone. Black on top of silver. I have always called the silver on top of black the "reverse two-tone". I guess I've been getting it backwards all this time.
That was the original two-tone...black slide above a alloy frame that had been stripped.

USPSA shooters started going with the white slide over a black steel frame for quicker site pickup.

When hard anodized alloy and polymer frame became more common, the white over dark became the "standard" two-tone

thefamcnaj
February 8, 2012, 03:59 AM
The c3 is a great gun. I have one and its ran flawless. It's also a very accurate gun. How ever at its price point I think it should have come with night sights.
I would put it above kimber and s&w 1911's, but below baer, Wilson, nighthawk, and high end SA's. I think the sigs stack up nicely against the Colts.

gpjoe
February 8, 2012, 08:57 AM
See, I always considered that variation the regular two-tone. Black on top of silver. I have always called the silver on top of black the "reverse two-tone". I guess I've been getting it backwards all this time.

I call it a reverse two-tone because that's the decription that Sig uses for the configuration (black slide - white metal frame). I'm not sure of any "history" regarding this color combo. It does make a nice looking pistol, though, IMO.

Dr_B
February 9, 2012, 08:01 PM
The c3 is a great gun. I have one and its ran flawless. It's also a very accurate gun. How ever at its price point I think it should have come with night sights.

Yes, the C3 sold in 2011 for almost the price of a new P226 with night sights. Now Sig has increased all their prices by about $100. The MSRP for the Sig C3 is now about $1000.

9mmepiphany
February 9, 2012, 09:03 PM
One thing I've never understood about the GSR-patterned slide is why they chose to dress the top profile parallel to the frame rails rather than the more common angle of the bore...when the barrel is in battery.

Granted it does make it look more SIG, but they are giving up holster fit, sight regulation (not too bad with fixed sights, but unsightly with an adjustable rear) and adding excess mass (in the context of target transitions) without much gain

heidad01
February 10, 2012, 01:35 AM
I am sending back a new Sig XO 1911 BNIB (purchased from a gun shop in CA)for the second time. I have owned it for more than a month and Have not shot it yet. It'll be a few weeks before I get it back and I'll let you know. It had the absolutely worst finish I have seen on any new gun out of the box, and I have been buying guns for the last 30 years.
On the first call the Sig's attitude was "that is tough luck" if we say it is good it is and you have to take it. :uhoh:
I went to 3 different gun shops and looked at 10's of 1911 and none had a finish as bad!! On the last trip back, my 1911 was given to a drunk teenager (my guess from the workmanship i received back) to scrub it into shape. Well it came back with just as bad of a finish with peening marks and a rough scotch brite polish on the barrel. They also did me a favor and scraped the heck out of the front of the guide rod and muzzle while taking it apart. Also, as an added bonus, was a gritty and loose triger which it did not have before going to Sig Sauer for a new gun repair. :cool:
So like I said, I'll let you know how it comes back. I was at a sporting store today and checked a few other 1911's, Sigs had the worst finish on the barrel. That is just my experience and I am sure there are alot of folks who love Sigs though it makes me wonder why?

bds
February 10, 2012, 02:01 AM
heidad01, sorry to hear about your Sig XO 1911. I would press Sig Sauer to have your finish fixed or have your pistol replaced.

I have a railed Sig 1911 Nitron (BTW, 5" Sig 1911s are all stainless steel frame/slide with different color finish depending on the model) and quite impressed with the finish that's been durable over 5000+ rounds. Despite the intentional rough handling in the range bag, the finish is not showing any scratches or discoloration.

As to the barrel finish, here are some pictures:

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=150161&stc=1&d=1317583364

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=150162&stc=1&d=1317583364

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=150163&stc=1&d=1317583427

bds
February 10, 2012, 02:23 AM
Just took a picture of my Sig 1911R TacPac. I shot several hundred rounds of lead SWC reloads last weekend and have not cleaned the pistol. I wiped down the exterior with a paper towel for the picture.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=158734&stc=1&d=1328855006

boricua9mm
February 10, 2012, 09:25 AM
Granted it does make it look more SIG, but they are giving up holster fit, sight regulation (not too bad with fixed sights, but unsightly with an adjustable rear) and adding excess mass (in the context of target transitions) without much gain

In my own experience, the slide profile isn't such a big problem when it comes to holsters. It's the combination of slide profile and railed dustcover that causes the most grief.

For example, my SIG Carry has the SIG style slide but no rail on the dustcover. That pistol is a snug fit in a leather IWB holster made for a normal 1911, but all it really needs is a little stretching to accommodate the pistol and allow for an easy draw while still offering good retention. I've taken the advice of a holster maker and used a piece of folded Saran wrap to cover the pistol, then inserting it into the holster for a day or two (some folks use a plastic shopping bag). For SIGs without the dust cover rail, this method seems to work just fine for traditional full-size and Commander leather holsters. Add in an insistence on Kydex, and that's another issue altogether. FWIW I've heard of some folks using a hair dryer to heat up the Kydex to accommodate the SIG profile, but I don't do Kydex so I can't say for sure how effective this would be.

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