Scope choice for AR...


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marksman13
February 7, 2012, 12:24 AM
I've got a 300 BLK complete rifle and a 458 SOCOM upper on order. I'm thinking I've got a few weeks before they arrive, so I'm taking my time in selecting a scope for the 458 SOCOM.

I'm pretty sure my 300 BLK will wear a Nikon 3x9x40 BDC. I've already got a spare one laying around and I like how much scope I get for my money.

I really want something more compact for the 458. I'm looking really hard at a Nikon 1-4x20 with German 4 Reticle and a similar Leupold scope with standard duplex reticle. Are there any advantages or disadvantages to either of these scopes? Any body had a negative experience with either? How well will these scopes perform in low light?

I can get a really good price on either and the price would be similar. Let's say the Leupold would be thirty dollars more. I believe the quality of glass is similar. I would say Leupold is probably the tougher of the two. What say ye?

Primary use of the 458 will be hunting deer and hogs. Thanks in advance.

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Robert
February 7, 2012, 12:29 AM
I run a Nikon M223 1-4x on my AR and like it. But Leupold makes quality scopes as well. Between those two I'd say 6 one way half a dozon the other. I'd go down to the LGS and see if they had both in stock and see which one has the better glass and let that be my factor since they are near enough to the same.

marksman13
February 7, 2012, 12:45 AM
How do you like that 3 MOA dot in the center of that reticle? That we the only reason I stopped looking at that scope. I'm not big on dots in my cross hairs.

Chances of getting to look through either scope are pretty slim.

henschman
February 7, 2012, 06:37 AM
.458 SOCOM is such a close quarters oriented round... I wouldn't think of putting anything other than a red dot on it, like an Aimpoint. If compact is what you want, any Aimpoint is a lot more compact than any of those scopes.

Hunterdad
February 7, 2012, 07:12 AM
Burris Tac30 would fit the role nicely.

madcratebuilder
February 7, 2012, 08:38 AM
How do you like that 3 MOA dot in the center of that reticle? That we the only reason I stopped looking at that scope. I'm not big on dots in my cross hairs.

Chances of getting to look through either scope are pretty slim.
When I installed my M2231-4 I thought I had made a mistake in choosing this scope. After a few range trips and using the scope for it's designed purpose I have become to really like it. Great for engaging steels at assorted ranges out to 200yds.

It may not be the best scope for shooting bug hole groups but that's not it mission.

It's bright, optics are good for the money and the zero set turrets are nice. It's more of a 3 gun scope than a precision scope.

marksman13
February 7, 2012, 09:14 AM
I saw the Burris Tac30 last night also. It's not a bad looking piece of glass, but the last Burris I owned didn't gather light as well as the Nikons I own.

I'm not a fan of red dots at all. I have tried to like them, but I can't.

gotigers
February 7, 2012, 09:37 AM
I have a Weaver Classic V 1-3x on my 3 gun AR. It is a little weak for over 300 yards, but it will be fine for the 458. It has a classic thin crosshair reticle and is very light. It is the lightest of the 1-3 or 1-4 class scopes i could find. It with the Burris PEPR mount was less than $250. I agree with henschman, it needs a good red dot.

Isn't the 300blk a rather short ranged cartridge compared to most AR rounds? Wasn't it made for silencers? For the 300blk i would go with a 1-4 like the tac30 or similar. I think there is a 1-6x. I can't remember who makes it.

marksman13
February 7, 2012, 10:36 AM
I used an Aim-Point Comp M3 in Iraq and hated it. I've tried other red dot and holographic optics and hated them as well. They aren't very precise and when the day fades to dusk, no matter how low the brightness setting of the reticle they wash out targets for me.

If I was willing to spend the money I might mount an ACOG with the chevron, but I'm not going to drop that kind of coin.

gotigers, the 300 BLK was designed with suppressor use in mind, but in a 16" barrel with super sonic ammo, it is ballistically similar to a 30-30 with Leverevolution ammo. That's why it is getting a BDC scope. I figure it will be just fine on deer out to 300 yards and would like to be able to take full advantage of that range.

gotigers
February 7, 2012, 02:52 PM
That makes sense. I like my 30-30 for a deer gun. I guess, I could see the 300blk being used with that scope.

The 300blk also puts you in major/heavy metal in 3 gun matches. Just a thought. :)

henschman
February 7, 2012, 03:30 PM
If you don't like red dots, then I would go with a 1-4x of some sort. I have the Leatherwood CMR and don't particularly recommend it. I love the ranging/BDC reticle but don't like the unforgiving eye box and eye relief or the exposed, non-lockable target turrets, and it certainly isn't the brightest glass around. I wouldn't necessarily assume the Nikon is brighter than the Burris though; I have heard the Burris 1-4x is actually pretty bright and works well at dusk. Probably the best and brightest 1-4x would be a Trijicon TR-24 Accupoint. That or a Vortex Viper or Razor.

cougar1717
February 7, 2012, 04:04 PM
This is a serious suggestion - since the 458 socom is approximately 300gr bullet at 1900fps (which is approximately equivalent to the old 45-70 trapdoor rifle data and is on par with today's muzzleloaders), how about using one of those muzzleloader scopes?

repmurcs
February 7, 2012, 04:47 PM
My 458 has been on order now for 4-weeks (killin' me), I've also done some research into what optic to use. I personally like (here comes the laughter) Mueller Quick-Shot 1 x 33, I've contacted their tech support and here's what they said (looking for email to copy and paste)

"Hi repmurcs,
We actually sell more of these scopes to the Turkey hunters than anyone else and many of them use 12ga shotguns with heavy magnum loads, including myself and they have been holding up excellent!!"

Robert
February 7, 2012, 05:06 PM
How do you like that 3 MOA dot in the center of that reticle? That we the only reason I stopped looking at that scope. I'm not big on dots in my cross hairs.
At first I was the same way. Honestly I do not notice now. I use it to make regular shots out to 425y with no problems.

ns66
February 7, 2012, 05:12 PM
i read nikon m-223 is calibrated for 3240fps, and most rifle/ammo combo can't reach that speed so they shoot low, is that a problem for m-223 owners?

jsimmons
February 8, 2012, 04:56 PM
i read nikon m-223 is calibrated for 3240fps, and most rifle/ammo combo can't reach that speed so they shoot low, is that a problem for m-223 owners?

I have a M-223 3-12x42SF with BDC reticle. It doesn't shoot low. I shoot M855 and M193 with mine.

If someone zeros their scope, and it starts shooting low, either their rings/mount is loose, or the scope is defective. If the scope is defective, they should send it back to Nikon for repair. I've never heard of a M-223 needing to be repaired.

ns66
February 9, 2012, 12:04 PM
I have a M-223 3-12x42SF with BDC reticle. It doesn't shoot low. I shoot M855 and M193 with mine.

If someone zeros their scope, and it starts shooting low, either their rings/mount is loose, or the scope is defective. If the scope is defective, they should send it back to Nikon for repair. I've never heard of a M-223 needing to be repaired.
so you use nikon spot on to input your round data (there's no m193 or m855 data in the database, at least i couldn't find them in the pull down choices), like your muzzle velocity, weight, BC, then print out BDC chart? what kind of values did you use for your rounds?

jsimmons
February 9, 2012, 06:31 PM
M855 is 5.56, 62-grain
M193 is .223, 55 grain (this is the round the scope is calibrated for. Since I shoot no more than 100 yards, and I have old eyes, I zero for 100 yards using 193 and go with it.

snakeman
February 9, 2012, 06:37 PM
you could look into a hi-lux cmr

nyc71
June 10, 2012, 06:42 PM
Here's a .485 SOCOM in stock, it's where I got mine from:
http://www.pkfirearms.com/Rock_River_Arms_Barreled_Uppers/57/c

The 17th upper down.

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