Chances of renewal


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N3rday
February 9, 2004, 11:22 PM
Ok realistically, what are the chances of the ban actually getting renewed? See, My 18th birthday is the 3rd of december, just 3-4 months after the sunset. What if it gets renewed? No Cx4 Storm, no AK derivative, no Olympic Arms AR?

And my parents don't let me write my senators or congressmen because they think the FBI will profile me and contact my school...not much I can do.

So, whats the status? Does it look like no renewal or what?

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El Tejon
February 9, 2004, 11:36 PM
If we do nothing, 100%.

Great Vishnu!!! How many threads are there going to be on this? Mother of Buddha, everytime I flip back! It's getting bearesque.

Go write your letters! And do so tomorrow as well.

N3rday
February 9, 2004, 11:40 PM
Did you read the above? Can't write letters! Wanted to, printed the list of names and addresses, but CAN'T SEND THEM!
I'm still a minor by law, so I don't have a choice!

Andrew Rothman
February 10, 2004, 12:03 AM
Are you kept tied up in the basement? Do you think you could make a break for it and buy some $.37 stamps?

You are not a child. In a very short time you'll be a legal adult.

Here is a chance to start acting like one.

Write the letters. Emphasize that you WILL be of age and WILL vote in the 2005 and subsequent elections.

N3rday
February 10, 2004, 12:13 AM
Ok here's the whole story-

So, I'm writing to Bush, the first on the list, and I have an envelope and stamp ready when my parents find out. They give a huge rant about how the FBI profiles for people like this and that since I am a minor they would be held accountable. I argued that that was untrue and highly unconstitutional, but they persisted.

I can't drive yet, have a month left on my permit, and as much as I reminded them that they are lucky to have a son who actually writes to his government, they refused to let me send any letter with that particular topic. My parents always tell me to get out of the house but won't take me shooting or rock climbing. Then they give me the 'develop some interests' rant and I tell them that I already have, but I can't pursue them.

They are but typical sheeple.

they seriously believe the FBI would contact my school. Can anyone disprove that theory? Doesn't sound kosher to me...

Anyway I will be up the creek without a paddle if I send said letters. HELP! Give me a counter-argument that I havent tried!

p.s. I can't vote in 2005...:(
won't be old enough...

Andrew Rothman
February 10, 2004, 12:22 AM
p.s. I can't vote in 2005...
won't be old enough...

My 18th birthday is the 3rd of december, just 3-4 months after the sunset.

So you'll turn 18 in December 2004. You'll still be 18 in November 2005, and 18 is the voting age. What am I missing?

Highland Ranger
February 10, 2004, 12:23 AM
Not what you want to hear but, you should respect your parents wishes while you live under their roof. Do it if only out of respect for the fact that you'll be them, sooner than you think.

In this particular case, I don't think their fears are well-founded especially if the letter is a polite statement of your viewpoint.

But while they pay the way . . .

Andrew Rothman
February 10, 2004, 12:30 AM
For counter-arguments, I can't do better than this: Why should you be treated like a suckling child on December 2 and like a man on December 3?

Or will they continue to treat you like a child after you are old enough to both vote and die for your country?

Good parents allow their kids to gradually transition into adulthood. That means, from age 10 to 18, gradually assuming more responsibility for your own life.

You're 17. Do you have a part-time job? Do you choose your own clothing? Dress yourself?

Are you acting like you should be trusted? Staying out of trouble? Getting decent grades? Otherwise acting responsibly?

I'm not ripping on you (yet! :)), but I am trying to see whether they are truly as unreasonable as you are making them out to be.

And are there buses in your town?

My parents always tell me to get out of the house but won't take me shooting or rock climbing. Then they give me the 'develop some interests' rant and I tell them that I already have, but I can't pursue them.Frankly, this sounds like whining. Do you need them with you to rock climb? Can you join a club? Take a class? Or are they refusing to sign a permission slip?

What is the whole story?

N3rday
February 10, 2004, 08:44 AM
Again, no transportation...I doubt my parents would let me take a bus either...

I go to a blue ribbon school, get good grades, haven't ever done drugs or gotten in to any real trouble. I don't see what they think the problem is. Does anyone here really think the FBI is going to profile me? I think they are a bit paranoid on this subject.

Anyway, I can't drive by myself yet (arg) and their schedules are so busy that I'm pretty much stuck at home playing video games and talking to you folks. My only mode of transportation (my bike) had its seat chewed off by my friggin dog...but they wouldn't let me ride a bike more than 2 miles from my house anyway. I live near busy streets, they claim. I gotta give my mom some slack, she IS a doctor.

I have sent various emails to politicians, but they don't really pay e-mail much mind compared to snail mail. Has anyone here ever been 'profiled' because they sent such a letter? I would seriously doubt it.

In response to Mpayne, no I could not join a club or take a class, how would I get there? I WILL be able to March 7th, when my permit is up. At which time I will also mail said letters...

cracked butt
February 10, 2004, 08:51 AM
If you are a regular poster on a board about gun politics, the FBI and/or the batf have profiled you already.:uhoh:

Zach S
February 10, 2004, 08:59 AM
All I have to say is this: Based on what I've read, if I had parents like yours, I would have pulled my hair out long before I turned 18. I've got a lot of hair too...

Cool Hand Luke 22:36
February 10, 2004, 11:23 AM
So, I'm writing to Bush, the first on the list, and I have an envelope and stamp ready when my parents find out. They give a huge rant about how the FBI profiles for people like this and that since I am a minor they would be held accountable. I argued that that was untrue and highly unconstitutional, but they persisted.

I don't think that you're going to wind up with an FBI or Secret Service file on you unless you include something in your letter that constitutes a threat of some kind.

Of course you might want to avoid phrases like: "Our holy Jihad will continue" "The infidels will be expunged" "The flaming death-sword of Allah's revenge" and "Until the Zionists are driven to the sea" :D

tommytrauma
February 10, 2004, 01:10 PM
You're 17 years old and your parents won't let you take a bus? No, they're not "typical sheeple", it's gone far beyond that point.

So, if you turn 18 this year, how will you be too young to vote in '05?

tiberius
February 10, 2004, 01:38 PM
Is this a joke? Are you just pulling our collective legs?

If not, then I say the following:

Your parents have no right to tell you what letters you can and cannot write. This has nothing to do with “their house, their rules”. It is a simple political expression and does not affect them in ANY way as long as you pay for the stamps with your own funds. If they really think that the FBI tracks everyone who writes non-threatening letters to their political representatives, they need a serious reality check……or at least need to readjust their tin foil.

Two more words: Grow up!

What if it gets renewed? No Cx4 Storm, no AK derivative, no Olympic Arms AR? These are legal now so a renewal would have no affect on that. There are those who would like to ban them though, so we do need to keep our collective political pressure up.

Bruce H
February 10, 2004, 02:34 PM
I have a bigger question. What are the parents into that they are afraid of FBI profiling and them being looked at?

Mizzoutiger
February 10, 2004, 03:55 PM
Your parents need to get a clue and take off the tin foil hats.

If the FBI even gave two craps about gun enthusiasts, they still have much bigger fish to fry.

Henry Bowman
February 10, 2004, 03:57 PM
When deciding whether to follow you parents' wishes or to ignore them -- remember that you will probably get a reply (form letter) to whatever return address you list on your letter.

N3rday
February 10, 2004, 05:57 PM
If you are a regular poster on a board about gun politics, the FBI and/or the batf have profiled you already.

oops. Too late now...

Of course you might want to avoid phrases like: "Our holy Jihad will continue" "The infidels will be expunged" "The flaming death-sword of Allah's revenge" and "Until the Zionists are driven to the sea"

:D
That brightened my day. Aww, no expunging of the infidels?:rolleyes:

Anyway, I am worried about them letting me keep guns in the house (under lock and key of course). I wouldn't want to jeopardize that...but yeah, heck with them, I'll send the letters.

See, Tiberius, thats exactly what i told them, although I didn't mention any tin foil:D
Also, AKs aren't legal to sell unless they are pre-ban or take neutered mags, right? Just wondering...

In response to bruce: My dad is employed by the state (CPS), my Mom is a doctor. They mentioned something about it affecting their jobs or something along those lines. They really are reasonable except when it comes to guns...
I also pointed out that my dad himself owns 2 guns, and my mom has a colleague that is into shooting.

tiberius
February 10, 2004, 06:03 PM
Also, AKs aren't legal to sell unless they are pre-ban or take neutered mags, right? Just wondering...

Real AKs are select fire and therefore subject to a $200 tax per NFA. Also there are executive/administrative orders that prevent importation of many weapons. However, when you wrote "no AK derivative" you included the many SA only AK variants that still are produced and sold legally today. They do not have bayonet lugs and flash supressors, but the are AK variants and accept AK mags.

Thumper
February 10, 2004, 06:10 PM
AKs aren't legal to sell unless they are pre-ban or take neutered mags, right?

No. AK clones are fine with full cap mags here.

No4Mk1*
February 10, 2004, 09:08 PM
Something tells me that if you are not trusted far on the bicycle you will not be allowed to have an Ak-47.

N3rday
February 10, 2004, 10:51 PM
No, its not that they don't trust me, its that they are horribly distrustful of others... like, say, everyone that drives a car:rolleyes:
My mom works in the PICU, so whenever someone gets mauled by a dog or has major head trauma, she ends up with them. She had a particularly bad dog mauling today in her unit. I didn't hear much, but apparently the intestines weren't where they should have been :(

Besides, they respect (kinda) that I WILL be old enough to own one, but probably not an AK. I will get a 10/22 and a revolver-caliber lever action, and hopefully move forward from there.

Hopefully...

Highland Ranger
February 10, 2004, 11:09 PM
Couple of things, being a man has nothing to do with turning 18 or any other age. You can be 50 and still be a child. I know many adults who are children.

Being a man does have to do with pulling your own weight and taking responsibility for your actions.

Doesn't sound like you're quite there yet but I think you will make it. You sound like you'll make a good man.

As far as your parents go, they sound like they are concerned people. Maybe a bit overprotective, but I bet they're good people and good parents.

You don't say where you live, but as someone who grew up in NYC I can tell you that it wouldn't be unusual for parents to be concerned about a bus ride through some neighborhoods. Rational and even prudent.

I also suggest you consider the ages of some of these posters when you evaluate how much good information you are getting . . . . many sound like they aren't old enough to vote yet.

That in itself doesn't discount them but if it's a teenager gripe session, well, kids have complained about their parents since the beginning of time. I did it. My kids do. Yours will. It is the way of things.

I maintain, their house, respect their wishes. Get a job, pull your own weight and do as you please.

N3rday
February 10, 2004, 11:27 PM
ahh, theres some wisdom!

Yeah, actually I am going to get a job this summer, to pay for the 10/22, the lever action, the Mosin Nagant, etc.
Oh yeah, and car insurance too:D

Yes, my parents (ok, mostly my mom) are naturally overprotective...but thats not all that bad. At least they distrust other people and not me, and I'm on my way to getting my mom into guns. She always has these little scares where she'll hear about a criminal on the news or see helicopters flying and say 'Ya know, that made me think about getting a gun'.

Well, I hope to convince her to get her CCW license soon...that will be the first step...

By the way, I live on the north side, no danger up here. I don't know if its the fear of mass transit or...well, most doctors have some irrational fears that you just kinda have to put up with. Its almost part of the job. She is a good mother though, just has the usual fear of guns that comes with being a doctor.

Werewolf
February 11, 2004, 05:24 PM
N3rDay claims:

Yes, my parents (ok, mostly my mom) are naturally overprotective...but thats not all that bad. At least they distrust other people and not me

I'm sure your parent's intentions are good. Unfortunately you're the one that must suffer for those good intentions.

However, as much as I hate to rain on your parade and burst your bubble it is you they don't trust - they're just saying they don't trust others to either spare your feelings or are blind to their lack of trust in you themselves.

What they mean is that you aren't responsible enough to interact in a world with people they don't know. That you aren't smart enough to decide when to cross the street or what neighborhoods to travel into. They are saying that you don't have the sense to choose the movies you go to or the people you consider friends - THEY WON'T EVEN LET YOU RIDE A BUS FOR PITY'S SAKE!

Sorry but their saying it's others they don't trust is little more than blowing warm air up your skirt. They're the ones that are afraid for you and they define that fear as a lack of trust in others. Parents should be protective but not to the point that their children are never allowed to experience real life. Your parents just won't cut the cord (my wife and I battled over this concerning our 3 daughters until they all got old enough to leave home).

I'm sure your parent's intentions are good.Unfortunately you're the one that must suffer for those good intentions.

TarpleyG
February 12, 2004, 09:48 AM
They give a huge rant about how the FBI profiles for people like this and that since I am a minor they would be held accountable
If that were the case I'd be under Levenworth about now along with the rest of the more active members here. I usually just get a canned letter back.

Your Dad is with CPS??? That's his problem right there. Conservative people aren't allowed to work for CPS.

E-mail the letters to me. I'll go and mail them for you.

GT

Politically Incorrect
February 13, 2004, 07:52 AM
They're the ones that are afraid for you and they define that fear as a lack of trust in others. Parents should be protective but not to the point that their children are never allowed to experience real life.

I'm sure your parent's intentions are good.Unfortunately you're the one that must suffer for those good intentions.

Good observation Werewolf.

This reminds me of our legislature trying to protect us from ourselves. :rolleyes:

Kharn
February 13, 2004, 11:22 AM
"Borrow" an entire book of stamps you need from your parents' stash (a missing book will look like they just lost it vs taking stamps individually), then drop the letters off at your school's office in the 'Outgoing Mail' box.

Or, got any like-minded friends? Pay'em $1 for every two letters they stamp and mail for you (so they make ~25% profit).

Kharn

Trebor
February 14, 2004, 01:06 AM
You have bigger problems than not being able to mail a letter about the AW ban. My advice? Get a part time job after school, start saving your cash and, as soon as you can, buy a car and move out. Of course, if you are planning on going to college on your parent's dime, that may change your plans. Take it for what it's worth.

Highland Ranger
February 14, 2004, 11:12 AM
Gee, parents concerned about a 17 year old . . . . .what a CRIME!

:banghead:

If we had more parents like yours, we wouldn't have all the social problems we have today.

But you're getting some real good advice here: drop out of school (part time job won't be enough $$), get a job, don't go to college and move out.

Even better, why work, you have access to guns, just go rob banks!

That's a good idea!

NOT.

Some people have real issues with their parents and need to seek help and rightly so if they weren't lucky enough to be born into a family like you have been.

My advice is, when listening to advice, consider how being born into less fortunate circumstances would color the advice someone might give to a 17 year old.

And the rest of us will have to forgive them for being IRRESPONSIBLE.

Werewolf
February 14, 2004, 05:19 PM
Highland Ranger says:
Gee, parents concerned about a 17 year old . . . . .what a CRIME!

The issue is not that N3rDay's parents are concerned but that they are so concerned that they have essentially caged him up - at least that's the impression I get from his description of the situation.

It is true that boundaries must be set and if the teenage years of my own 3 grown daughters (and my own teenage years) are any indication any boundaries are too constricting if you ask a teenager.

I'm of the opinion that N3's parents go a little overboard on the restrictions. In my 52 years I've watched repeatedly overprotected kids go into the world and all that accomplishes is that once the kid gets out on their own they have no experience setting their own boundaries and tend to go wild. Not a good thing. My wife was way over protective and I leaned to the opposite extreme. Compromise pretty much gave just about the right amount of freedom for our daughters - many of their friends weren't so lucky.

If N3 is comfortable with the boundaries as established then fine if not he needs to talk about them with his parents. If the parents won't loosen up - and it doesn't sound like they will - then N3's just gonna have to grin and bear it or haul ??? when he get's out of school. I hope he's wise enough not to go wild when he does finally get his freedom.

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