45 ACP Berry's 200 gr hp


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dragon68
February 9, 2012, 03:57 PM
I do not know what if anything i am doing wrong. I know 45 does not need much if any crimp but these plated bullets from berry's slide in the case (from 1.155 to 1.060 OAL ) with 2 cycles of the slide (i put it in the magazine and close the slide to look for good feeding). When i put enough crimp to hold the bullet in place (about 1/8 turn more than above crimp) it holds but when i pull the bullet to check it for damage it has a ring around it but is not pulling apart.

This is before and after.. I might just be over cautious but i don't want to damage anything ..Thanks for any help !!!!!

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guzzi
February 9, 2012, 04:18 PM
What you have there is what I see with 9's and 40's and 45's. This seems to have little or no effect on accuracy with the pistols my wife and I use in IDPA or just regular target shooting. About the longest distance we practice at is 50 yards. This may be an issue at 200 yards.

rcmodel
February 9, 2012, 04:26 PM
Way too much crimp on the second photo!!!

Case neck tension is what holds bullets in place, not excessive taper crimp.

Either your expander plug is too big and over-expanding the sized brass?

Or you are loading Remington cases, which are often too thin to size down enough.

Measure your expander and see if it is .449" to .450" dia.
If it is bigger then that, it is too big for .452" bullets.

If that is the case, chuck it in a drill, spin it up, and wear it down with a strip of 240 - 320 grit emery cloth.

It needs to be .002" to .003" smaller then bullet dia for proper case neck tension.

If it's Remington cases?
You need a different brand cases.

rc

Walkalong
February 9, 2012, 05:15 PM
Agree with rcmodel.

I have three .45 ACP sizers. One is seriously tight, but gives excellent neck tension, and a pronounced "coke bottle" effect. One is too big to use with Remington brass, and sometimes other brands, and one is just about right.

Actually I have another one as well, but it damages the brass, and the maker says it's my fault. :rolleyes:

I load that bullet at 1.200. Great bullet.

PapaG
February 9, 2012, 05:34 PM
Too much taper crimp will "swage" the bullet down and you will lose neck tension. I believe that the proper amount of taper crimp is to have the outside neck diameter wind up at .472". I use a slightly turned down neck expander to get good tension and then taper crimp to that diameter. I test by pushing loaded rounds against a bathroom scale. If I can push down and read 30 or so pounds without the bullet moving, I have a good load. Have never blown a case, a gun, or had one telescope into the case. Before I started the above process I used to really screw down that taper die. I ruined a box of pricey jacketed bullets one time when I tapered too much and the bullets almost fell back out of the cases.
I use that same expander ball on 45 Colt cases also. The case neck expander is used only to get a slight flare so the bullet base will go in the case without shaving lead or crumpling the case. The part turned (ground) down is the part just below the flaring taper on the expander ball.

XxBulletBendeRXx
February 10, 2012, 05:34 PM
Too much taper crimp will "swage" the bullet down and you will lose neck tension. I believe that the proper amount of taper crimp is to have the outside neck diameter wind up at .472". I use a slightly turned down neck expander to get good tension and then taper crimp to that diameter. I test by pushing loaded rounds against a bathroom scale. If I can push down and read 30 or so pounds without the bullet moving, I have a good load. Have never blown a case, a gun, or had one telescope into the case. Before I started the above process I used to really screw down that taper die. I ruined a box of pricey jacketed bullets one time when I tapered too much and the bullets almost fell back out of the cases.
I use that same expander ball on 45 Colt cases also. The case neck expander is used only to get a slight flare so the bullet base will go in the case without shaving lead or crumpling the case. The part turned (ground) down is the part just below the flaring taper on the expander ball.
WHat he said ^^ ..
I use these Berrys 200 grain HPs myself.. I like them a lot. But as said by PapaG you should crimp so the diameter just before the top of case is .472. Berrys are fairly soft so you will still get a slight indentation/ring, however nothing excessive like the OP's pics. Just back off on the crimp and your good to go. Best of luck... B.B.

Walkalong
February 10, 2012, 05:57 PM
A Berrys 230 Gr RN
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=153244&d=1322011199


Berrys 230.. Hornady 230.. Berrys 200
Precision 200.. Zero 185.. Berrys 185
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=115828&stc=1&d=1266369040

XxBulletBendeRXx
February 11, 2012, 03:03 AM
A Berrys 230 Gr RN
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=153244&d=1322011199


Berrys 230.. Hornady 230.. Berrys 200
Precision 200.. Zero 185.. Berrys 185
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=115828&stc=1&d=1266369040
Very nice clear pictures. ^^ And they say a picture is worth 1000 words.... This is a fine example......

dragon68
February 11, 2012, 05:19 AM
Yes thanks very much for the info I am just braking into this and do alot of reading!! This forum has sooo much info. Thanks again guys!!

Tony

buddhas
February 11, 2012, 06:04 PM
Thank you all who responded to this posting. It's a treasure trove of information.

buddhas

rfwobbly
February 11, 2012, 08:42 PM
Mr Dragon -

To follow up on the excellent info already given.....

The "taper crimp" only erases the flair or belling used to seat the bullet. Due to the generous radius Berry bullets have on their base, you can use minimum belling with this brand, but some flair will usually be needed just to get the bullet started in correctly.

To find the perfect crimp diameter, take a sized but un-flaired case, and seat one of your Berry bullets. Since the taper crimp is simply to erase the belling, and since this test cartridge never had any belling, the results will give you the perfect crimp diameter.

Then you can back-off on the crimp die until that diameter is reached.

badhabit
February 12, 2012, 08:35 PM
Walkalong has it the way I load on the 230 rn berry's exact right out of the gate this is the way mine came out. bought the hornady taper crimp die and dont even use it i get the same #'s with the seat and crimp die

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