Glock Boiling???


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coolluke01
February 16, 2012, 10:48 PM
Ok, so I know this sounds weird. Has anyone heard about rehydrating the polymer in their Glocks?
I have a Pearce grip extension for my G26. It adds two rounds. When loaded with 12 the number 7 and 9 rounds rattle. I can poke them from the back and they will move back and forth. I called Pearce and they suggested that the polymer needs to be rehydrated. Boiling the mag in water for 15 mins is supposed to rehydrate it.
Ok, So I tried it. I'll post the video on youtube and put a link on here later. As you may have guessed it didn't fix the issue.
I called Glock today and asked them if they had ever heard about the need to rehydrate their guns. They had never heard about it. He put me on hold and asked some others in the office if they had ever heard about this. No one had. I think they thought I was crazy.
The guy from pearce said that an armor had cleaned all of his departments Glocks with a sonic cleaner and some solvent. None of the guns would function properly after. After boiling his own Glock he fixed all the problems he was having with the malfunctions! After boiling the glock mag I could tell that it was softer. When fired the Glocks flex, if it was too dry it could be too stiff?

Has anyone heard of this?

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Psa1m144
February 16, 2012, 10:51 PM
Never

Mainsail
February 16, 2012, 10:58 PM
Re-hydrating plastic?

Who fed you that?

Ohio Gun Guy
February 16, 2012, 11:01 PM
The chemical bonds of the Polymer are not water based and I doubt they react at the temperature of water boiling point.

Sounds like a load of B.S. to me.

dirtengineer
February 16, 2012, 11:08 PM
Did you hear giggling in the background as he was giving you instructions?

armoredman
February 16, 2012, 11:11 PM
Sir, with all due respect, according to what I know of firearms grade polymer, you've been had.

armarsh
February 16, 2012, 11:15 PM
Leave the pot boiling. You can cook your snipe in it. ;)

After that, you can go get some new pins for the board stretcher.

coolluke01
February 16, 2012, 11:16 PM
I have called pearce twice about this issue and two different people have said the same thing!
I know it sounds like B.S. But he was very convinced!

MachIVshooter
February 16, 2012, 11:20 PM
Boil to clean? It works on many things.

Boil to "rehydrate" a long chain polycarbonate resin? I've got some snake oil if you're buying. It's at my oceanfront vacation home here in CO.....

W.E.G.
February 16, 2012, 11:33 PM
Rehydrating (https://www.google.com/#hl=en&safe=off&sclient=psy-ab&q=how+to+rehydrate+plasticine&pbx=1&oq=rehydrate+plastic&aq=0m&aqi=g-m1&aql=&gs_sm=1&gs_upl=15542l15542l1l23078l1l1l0l0l0l0l85l85l1l1l0&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&fp=e497b0ef37f63d8f&biw=939&bih=559) plastic on Glocks. http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/smileys/crackhead.gif

stevekl
February 17, 2012, 12:38 AM
Don't worry about your Glock feeling pain, it's basically an insect.

JDGray
February 17, 2012, 05:38 AM
Sounds like a scene off Waterboy!:D

beeenbag
February 17, 2012, 06:10 AM
just don't sprinkle salt on your glocks while boiling them, the M&Ps might come eat them. Ha ha I had to.

Ghost Tracker
February 17, 2012, 09:15 AM
Whoever told you that certainly wasn't taking the High Road! More like an alley.

mesinge2
February 17, 2012, 09:42 AM
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc401/mesinge2/Misc/BS20Alert2.gif

Ragnar Danneskjold
February 17, 2012, 10:04 AM
In all honestly, I would contact Pearce and make it known they have an employee attempting to trick customers into destroying their guns. That's a big issue.

Kingcreek
February 17, 2012, 10:05 AM
"This call may be recorded for quality assurance purposes...
(and to play back for entertainment at the office christmas party)"

robinkevin
February 17, 2012, 10:27 AM
Ermmm maybe vaseline will help? Just kidding...

I use be a machine operator on a plastic extruder. We made poly gas pipe and I can tell you this, the melting point on the stuff was around 350F and usually had to be closer to 400F to be workable. Now the only water used was to cool the pipe so that we could keep it the size needed, however the plastic itself does not absorb any H2O.

HarcyPervin
February 17, 2012, 10:35 AM
Leave the pot boiling. You can cook your snipe in it.

After that, you can go get some new pins for the board stretcher.

Used to love the board stretcher gag...that and the 4-foot level in the glovebox of the truck.

But seriously, don't boil your glocks. If you want to make soup, try something with some more flavor, like a nice 1911.:neener:

Overkilll0084
February 17, 2012, 10:37 AM
Dog wash.
Either that guy at Pearce is a moron or he's trying to jerk you around. FWIW, I have given a polymer pistol a ride through an ultrasonic cleaner, it worked fine, though I did "re-hydrate" it with some lubricant.

dogtown tom
February 17, 2012, 10:46 AM
coolluke01 Ok, so I know this sounds weird. Has anyone heard about rehydrating the polymer in their Glocks?
I have a Pearce grip extension for my G26. It adds two rounds. When loaded with 12 the number 7 and 9 rounds rattle. I can poke them from the back and they will move back and forth. I called Pearce and they suggested that the polymer needs to be rehydrated. Boiling the mag in water for 15 mins is supposed to rehydrate it.
Ok, So I tried it. I'll post the video on youtube and put a link on here later. As you may have guessed it didn't fix the issue.
I called Glock today and asked them if they had ever heard about the need to rehydrate their guns. They had never heard about it. He put me on hold and asked some others in the office if they had ever heard about this. No one had. I think they thought I was crazy.
The guy from pearce said that an armor had cleaned all of his departments Glocks with a sonic cleaner and some solvent. None of the guns would function properly after. After boiling his own Glock he fixed all the problems he was having with the malfunctions! After boiling the glock mag I could tell that it was softer. When fired the Glocks flex, if it was too dry it could be too stiff?

Has anyone heard of this?

1. You had a problem with your Pearse grip extension. Taking the advice to boil your Glock is analogous to calling Goodyear when you have a flat and they advise repainting your car. Dump the Pearse extension and go with a different one.

2. Plastic CAN rehydrate. Soft daily and extended wear contact lenses are hydrophilic (water loving) and if allowed to dry out will crack and shatter. Glock frames, mags and parts are not made of a polymer anywhere close to the stuff contact lenses are made.

3. It is possible that what the Pearse rep was having you do was heat the plastic to allow the rounds to stack correctly.....the boiling wasn't to "rehydrate" but to prevent you from melting it in the oven, microwave or with a heat gun.

4. It is also possible that he's pulling your leg.

shootniron
February 17, 2012, 10:48 AM
You can put it in with this and it will not be a complete waste.

spclpatrolgroup
February 17, 2012, 11:27 AM
I have heard of people boiling their glock frames in order to make them flexible to fix pig nose, even though there really isnt any reason to fix it.

Dr. Sandman
February 17, 2012, 12:23 PM
The mag is not the problem. It sounds to me like your Glock may be pregnant. If you want to be sure, you can have it take an online pregnancy test.

Sounds to me like you need a new mag. If you want extra rounds, there are many mag options for the G26.

mesinge2
February 17, 2012, 12:35 PM
Originally posted by Dr. Sandman

The mag is not the problem. It sounds to me like your Glock may be pregnant. If you want to be sure, you can have it take an online pregnancy test.

Sounds to me like you need a new mag. If you want extra rounds, there are many mag options for the G26.

Many options:

http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc401/mesinge2/My%20heaters/9mmGlock262.jpg

Onward Allusion
February 17, 2012, 02:33 PM
coolluke01
Glock Boiling???

The guy wasn't pulling your leg, at least not intentionally. He was probably referring to the water absorption properties of Nylon 6 and Nylon 6,6 along with their moisture regain properties. HOWEVER, it highly unlikely that boiling a magazine for 10 minutes will remould it to to its original shape since the melting point of Nylon 6,6 is 509 F.

Try tossing a polymer mag in the oven and baking it for a few hours at 275. Let me know the result. :)

coolluke01
February 17, 2012, 02:44 PM
I just spent 40 mins talking to the very informative President of Pearce Grips. Lane Pearce. He is the one who I talked to the other day. He again mentioned that rehydration of Hygroscopic Polymer is a real thing. He asked me to try it again for a longer period and see if that would fix my issue. If not it may be a different problem.

The purpose is not to change the shape or reform the mag as much as to rehydrate the polymer and bring it back to spec.

He said he would send me a few links to this polymer rehydration process.

Here is the video I took of boiling my glock mag. I was just trying to have fun with it.

http://youtu.be/FwuKCXe-D1M

Brazos
February 17, 2012, 02:45 PM
If you were "re-hydrating" the plastic why would you need to boil the water? Why not just put it in water? I can see how you can boil plastic to change it's shape (boiled the end of my glock frames to get rid of pigs nose) but that was to soften the plastic enough to bend it, not to re-hydrate.

Onward Allusion
February 17, 2012, 03:01 PM
^^^
Heat excites the molecular structure...

<dang, can't believe we're talking about this in a gun forum>

Onward Allusion
February 17, 2012, 03:04 PM
rehydrate the polymer and bring it back to spec.

THAT makes a lot more sense.

tipoc
February 17, 2012, 03:06 PM
Hmmm...

From Webster's Ninth Collegiate;
hydrate... to cause to take up or combine with water or the elements of water...

There are a couple of other definitions but all along the same lines. There is no water in the polymer compounds that Glocks are made of. They were not hydrated in the first place. This means that they cannot be re-hydrated.

There are hygroscopic resins and polymers though. They are designed to take up moisture through capillary action. I do not think that the Glock is made of such however.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygroscopy

http://www.museumstuff.com/learn/topics/hygroscopic::sub::Polymers

http://www.ptonline.com/kc/articles/Plastics-Drying/drying-parameters

This topic has come up before with poly guns...

http://thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=144725

Raul

GLOOB
February 17, 2012, 03:07 PM
If you were "re-hydrating" the plastic why would you need to boil the water?
Cuz at room temp, you might have to leave your Glock in there for 10 years to achieve the same result. Temperature can make a huge difference in the speed of such things. I'm not saying this works or doesn't, but the "boiling" part doesn't make this hogwash.

mesinge2
February 17, 2012, 03:16 PM
Dude, just spend $30 on a new mag please and stop cooking your guns without seasoning them properly.

Onward Allusion
February 17, 2012, 03:20 PM
tipoc
Hmmm...

From Webster's Ninth Collegiate;

I use this reference every now and then... Crystal Cat Litter...

tipoc
February 17, 2012, 03:33 PM
Actually the fellas not talking about rehydrating the Glock, just the Pearce mag extensions. This because the cheap plastic compound they make them out of became loose and sloppy over time. Could be there is some hygroscopic material used in them.

The man, on advice from Pearce, boiled them. They did not do like Levi's and "Shrink to Fit" instead they remained loose and sloppy. More advice from Pearce-"Boil longer". At this point I'd double the boiling time and look to the results.

What do you have to lose? Not much. Boiling water is neither hard nor expensive. Look to science and experiment. Follow Pearce's advice and boil away. Post the results here. It will either work or after 2-3 hours in the pot call it a day and buy someone else's extension.

tipoc

coolluke01
February 17, 2012, 04:05 PM
According the Pearce Glock polymers are made with hydroscopic resins. He told me the company that makes their material but I forgot what it was.
He didn't think the Pearce mag plate was the only thing that needed hydration. The mag tube was what he thought could benefit from the hydration. I followed his advise and boiled the mag for 25 mins. Still no change. I may try longer.
It is right that the boiling process is only to speed up the process.

He did mention that this polymer was very much like superglue. It requires moisture. He said that in very very dry climates superglue won't always work and it will turn to dust.

I was planning on adding some salt when I cooked it on the video but I forgot.

MachIVshooter
February 17, 2012, 05:03 PM
According the Pearce Glock polymers are made with hydroscopic [SIC] resins

First, it's hygroscopic. Secondly, it refers to water absorbing on a molecular level-not something rigid plastics do. Rigid polymers that take up water do so through capillary attraction

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygroscopy

He did mention that this polymer was very much like superglue. It requires moisture. He said that in very very dry climates superglue won't always work and it will turn to dust.

These folks are either very diluded or having great fun yanking your chain. Do you really think a Glock cares if it's in the jungle or the desert? Likewise, do you really believe super glue needs humidity to work? Ever try gluing wet materials together? Doesn't work so well……….

Black Butte
February 17, 2012, 05:12 PM
Hilarious! I heard of cleaning Glocks in the dishwasher, but this takes the cake!

mesinge2
February 17, 2012, 05:28 PM
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc401/mesinge2/Misc/Bestthreadever.jpg

Too much laughing!! http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc401/mesinge2/Misc/rofl3.gif

beag_nut
February 17, 2012, 05:41 PM
As a former design engineer I must add that nylon (a polymer) DOES absorb water, up to about 11% of its weight. Boiling is not necessary, but would speed up the process. I DON'T know which polymer Glocks are made of. If it is nylon, or similar, it would absorb water. All that is NOT to say that a Glock must be "rehydrated", or anything. One needs more info to give this "rehydrating" idea any more credence. In the meantime, don't boil your handguns!

Maximumbob54
February 17, 2012, 05:59 PM
I'm confused. We are making this sound like the poly frame nylon or whatever may need water to somehow restore it. I agree that some polymer compounds may indeed soak up water, but how does this do anything for the durability of the polymer? I have family that lives in a desert and they have several poly frame autos and they aren't cracking like drying out tires left in the sun. They are just fine. I think some here are acting like this is similar to leather or cellulose somehow. Such does not seem to be the case. :confused:

dcarch
February 17, 2012, 06:22 PM
This may be the most bizarre thread I have ever read.

coolluke01
February 17, 2012, 06:51 PM
Ever try gluing wet materials together? Doesn't work so well
Gorilla glue requires water!

Jungle or desert isn't the whole issue. They do seem to function fine in extreme circumstances. I did notice that the polymer was a little softer after the treatment. The frames do flex and torque quite a bit when fired. I wonder if in really dry environments a dryer/stiffer frame could be an issue.
As a former design engineer I must add that nylon (a polymer) DOES absorb water, up to about 11% of its weight.
He did compare it to nylon several times. According to him Glocks polymer is very similar.

I'm glad everyones enjoying this thread. I was very skeptical as well.

Hygroscopic. That could be right. I might have misheard him on the phone.

CWL
February 17, 2012, 08:57 PM
Nylon 66 in raw form can absorb up to 11% of its weight in water... HOWEVER, Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb very little if any, moisture and will remain dimensionally stable.

This is why Glock (presumably) uses Nylon 66 + 30% GF. This is commonly known by injection molding manufacturers and is no trade secret.

BTW, even if nylon absorbs water while boiling, it will expel the water as it cools down.

JHenry
February 17, 2012, 09:03 PM
Try frying it.

It makes everything else better:)

Maximumbob54
February 17, 2012, 09:52 PM
With the bacon? Yum...

newbuckeye
February 17, 2012, 11:35 PM
I have heard of people boiling their glock frames in order to make them flexible to fix pig nose, even though there really isnt any reason to fix it.

OK.....I've owned glocks for almost 20 years....what's "pig nose"??

MachIVshooter
February 18, 2012, 01:22 AM
they aren't cracking like drying out tires left in the sun.

Don't confuse "drying out" with damage from UV. Sunlight will destroy nearly anything, given enough time. Polymer, urethane, petroleum/organic rubber, etc. are particularly susceptible.

JohnKSa
February 18, 2012, 01:34 AM
Hot water isn't really good for the Glock frame material.

Do a search with the terms:

glock hydrolytically attacked nylon

I wouldn't boil a Glock frame, nor would I put it in a dishwasher with a heated dry cycle.OK.....I've owned glocks for almost 20 years....what's "pig nose"??Some folks apparently don't like the fact that the dustcover of a Glock sometimes angles up and makes contact with the underside of the slide at the muzzle. They call it a "pig nose" and some will even go to great lengths to try to eliminate the situation.

kyletx1911
February 18, 2012, 04:29 AM
See there ya go(lol) 1911s have to be smoked

fatcat4620
February 18, 2012, 06:17 AM
Plastic is made from OIL!!! how could water do anything to it???

Ben86
February 18, 2012, 07:36 AM
Has anyone heard about rehydrating the polymer in their Glocks?

Ok, now I've heard everything. No, I've never heard of such a thing before. It sounds like someone from Pierce was pulling your chain.

The guy from pearce said that an armor had cleaned all of his departments Glocks with a sonic cleaner and some solvent.

Sonic cleaners are notorious for screwing up otherwise fine guns.

Having a couple rounds move around in a Glock magazine is not that uncommon or a big deal. From my experience it usually goes away after the magazine is broken in.

Certaindeaf
February 18, 2012, 09:05 AM
.The guy from pearce said that an armor had cleaned all of his departments Glocks with a sonic cleaner and some solvent. None of the guns would function properly after..
I've never heard of rehydrating plastics except for the hundreds of magic car products available.
Many plastics can be harmed by many solvents. Personally, I'd not use certain brake cleaners and or full strength Simple Green on any plastics I owned.

beag_nut
February 18, 2012, 01:32 PM
Quote:
"Nylon 66 in raw form can absorb up to 11% of its weight in water... HOWEVER, Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb very little if any, moisture and will remain dimensionally stable.

This is why Glock (presumably) uses Nylon 66 + 30% GF. This is commonly known by injection molding manufacturers and is no trade secret.

BTW, even if nylon absorbs water while boiling, it will expel the water as it cools down. "


Sorry, but Nylon 66 +30% glass fiber will absorb between 6.4 to 7 % water. Also not a trade secret. And, it will NOT expel the water during cooldown. That was a problem we had when making surgical instruments. Absorption of the water causes the nylon to temporarily (as long as the internal water is present) soften. So the original guy who said to boil the Glock frames was a little bit correct, but only correct enough to get himself and others in trouble.

exavid
February 19, 2012, 01:41 AM
Boiling some plastics in water can relieve stress. Years ago when I was a young lad flying R/C models the new nylon propellors that became available tended to break if you just bolted them onto the engine and crashed. If they were boiled for twenty minutes they became almost crash proof. It's also true that there are several different plastics that will absorb some water. If you have a powder scale it's easy to prove, just weight some samples, boil them for a half hour or more and weigh them again.

Maximumbob54
February 20, 2012, 03:53 PM
I'm not concerned about the open cell structure of nylon or similar. What I'm trying to figure is how WATER would do a darn thing to how pliable the plastic is or isn't. We aren't talking about your dried out dish sponge. If we were soaking them in mineral oil then maybe I could see how that MIGHT do something, but I'm not enough of a chemistry teacher to know what nylon is made of or what it would need to react and become more "gummy" that it would normally be. I know acetone and turpentine tend to melt down anything they touch so that's one of the few things I would see in a very diluted state maybe making a Glock more pliable. But who would be willing to put that to a Glock torture test... :uhoh:

Certaindeaf
February 20, 2012, 04:04 PM
Dear heavens to betsy.

Who would have even known that pig noses needed fixed.

skt239
February 20, 2012, 04:53 PM
You need to post this in the "worst gun advice you've ever got" thread. This is easily the worst advice I've ever heard.

brickeyee
February 20, 2012, 05:03 PM
Leave the pot boiling. You can cook your snipe in it.

A snipe is any of about 25 wading bird species in Scolopacidae.

Night Snipe hunting is the gag.

http://www.dgif.virginia.gov/hunting/regulations/webless-migratory-gamebirds.asp#common-snipe
Common Snipe

Season Dates:
October 6 - October 10
October 22 - January 31
Bag Limit:
8 daily, 16 in possession
Shooting Hours:
Ĺ hour before sunrise until sunset

armarsh
February 20, 2012, 06:12 PM
^^^^
I was referring to the fruitless exercise famously known as a snipe hunt, hence the ;) smiley in my post.

We have plovers here that people call snipe too. I'm not ashamed to admit I had to look up scolopacidae. :)

W.E.G.
February 20, 2012, 06:23 PM
I wonder if this means that it would actually preserve my Glock to carry it in a sweaty IWB holster?

Would I need to carry it righty and lefty on alternate days to keep one side of the Glock from getting over-hydrated relative to the other side?

Can I bend my Glock by carrying it regularly on just one side in the sweaty holster?

If I coat my Glock in paste-wax, will it keep the plastic from dehydrating?

nonseven
February 20, 2012, 07:18 PM
The plastic in a Glock is either nylon 6, nylon 66, or a blend. It may be glass fiber filled, but from the looks of it likely less than 30%. Nylon 6 and 66 absorb moisture from the environment until they reach equilibrium. Moisture effects the properties of the plastic by making it tougher, more flexible, more impact resistant. Often nylon products like cable ties, have moisture added to them to make them tougher, less brittle. However, these properties can also be added to the nylon by chemical impact modifiers which cause the nylon to be tough and impact resistant independent of moisture content. Since it is likely that the Glock polymer has impact modifiers, I can see no reason that it needs moisture conditioning even in a very dry environment.

Master Blaster
February 20, 2012, 07:22 PM
left handed smoke shifter anyone?

coolluke01
February 20, 2012, 07:41 PM
Thank you to all those that know what they are talking about. It helps a great deal to have professionals weigh in on this.

To those that have a hard time understanding how water can effect "solid" objects, our own bodies are made up of 70% water. Finger nails and bones have water as part of their makeup. Heck, even rocks have water in them, that water level can change too!

In no way would we want to make our Glocks gummy or like a noodle. This is simply a process to ensure the moisture content is at the optimal level. If there are impact modifiers in the Glock polymer I can see that it could be something that is not needed. However, it could still be a positive practice as even with those modifiers it could still take on additional moisture. I would think that Glock would do it's best to maintain the baseline they would like the impact resistance and durability to be. Making the gun more impact resistant or flexible could be a good thing.

If I remember right Pearce said that there were no or few glass fibers in the Glock polymer. I can't remember exactly what he said. He did contrast it with keltec's that have glass fibers and a cheaper grade of polymer.

I don't think I'll boil my Glock frame until I see it failing though.

mesinge2
February 20, 2012, 07:44 PM
moisture content is at the optimal level

hahahahaha

hapidogbreath
February 20, 2012, 07:59 PM
Does anyone with a materials science degree have any informative input??? I could talk to a QC Engineer and find out if not....

481
February 20, 2012, 08:16 PM
The plastic in a Glock is either nylon 6, nylon 66, or a blend. It may be glass fiber filled, but from the looks of it likely less than 30%. Nylon 6 and 66 absorb moisture from the environment until they reach equilibrium. Moisture effects the properties of the plastic by making it tougher, more flexible, more impact resistant. Often nylon products like cable ties, have moisture added to them to make them tougher, less brittle. However, these properties can also be added to the nylon by chemical impact modifiers which cause the nylon to be tough and impact resistant independent of moisture content. Since it is likely that the Glock polymer has impact modifiers, I can see no reason that it needs moisture conditioning even in a very dry environment.

I agree.

Last FTIR I ran on the Glock polymer was kind of inconclusive (the results didn't differentiate as well as I'd've liked) but the exemplar library matches it as Nylon 6 nonetheless. Overall, my best guess is that the Glock polymer is a glass filled impact grade of Nylon 6, possibly blended with a hybrid.

Polyamides (nylon) like those found in the Glock are attacked by strong bases and acids, suffer hydrolysis in hot (> 120F) water and are softened by ketones (e.g.: acetone) and permanently damaged by halogenated hydrocarbons. Nylon 6 (and its variants) has a Vicat softening point of 419F and melting points in the range of 401-437F and saturates (H20) between 7% and 11%. Nylon 6 exhibits excellent chemical resistance to alcohols (isopropanol, ethanol), gasoline and petroleum lubricants (like motor oil).

In short, I wouldn't advise boiling Nylon 6 because it risks permanent damage (primarily through hydrolysis) to the polymer with little benefit in return.

Fishbed77
February 20, 2012, 09:11 PM
http://i371.photobucket.com/albums/oo157/Furyataurus/glocklobster3.jpg

Overkilll0084
February 21, 2012, 11:14 AM
Just for the heck of it, I sent a link to this thread to a friend of mine who owns a plastic molding company. Here is the response:
Just a follow up on the Glock boiling subject. BASF has on their website a technical paper entitled "Mechanical Performance Of Polyamides With Influence Of Moisture And Temperature". Polyamide is the technical name for Nylon. The people on that thread should read it. Among other things it states that for every 1% of moisture absorbed there is a 0.2-0.3 % increase in dimension. This would amount to .002 - .003" per linear inch. I don't know about Glock or the Pearce magazines but that can be significant if you are concerned about tolerances in a precision assembly.
The article cited:
http://www2.basf.us//PLASTICSWEB/displayanyfile?id=0901a5e180004880

I'm not going to be boiling any guns, but I thought I would add some info.

Maximumbob54
February 21, 2012, 01:19 PM
And since the frame nor the mags are super tight tolerance parts, none of this should matter. Since UV was mentioned already, I would think that UV damage to the frame would be more of a worry item than the amount of moisture in the frame. Since I donít know of many holstered carry Glocks failing from becoming brittle due to UV damage, I would think this would also be a non issue. At least this was a fun and slightly informative thread as far as learning about nylon.

tipoc
February 21, 2012, 05:19 PM
Can anyone cite a source for the reference that Glock itself recommends boiling of the gun? I ask because I have not seen nor read that Glock encourages this practice for freshning up it's guns. I have not read or heard where any other manufacturer of poly framed guns recommends this either. Until I do I believe I'll pass on boiled Glock.

It was Pearce, the manufacturer of the after market extended base plate mags (if there was ever a useless product this has gotta be it, by the way) that made the boiling recommendation. In light of this I'd send the extended mag back to Pearce and have their skilled technicians do the boiling. If the mag was wrong let them repair it. I'd bet ten bucks they send it back and say "Hey we can't repair this someone boiled it!!?!"

Ain't it a bit nerdy to be actually debating this by the way?

tipoc

K1500
February 21, 2012, 05:37 PM
If you want it to last, deep fat frying is the way to go. Clean, lube, preserve, and 'rehydrate' in one simple step.

JohnKSa
February 22, 2012, 12:59 AM
Since UV was mentioned already, I would think that UV damage to the frame would be more of a worry item than the amount of moisture in the frame. Since I donít know of many holstered carry Glocks failing from becoming brittle due to UV damage, I would think this would also be a non issue.The frames are black due to a substance added to the plastic to cut down on UV damage. I've seen the results of one test quoted. In that test, which exposed the frame material to UV levels and durations equivalent to 100 years of sunlight exposure, the mechanical properties of the frame material were not significantly altered.

ny32182
February 22, 2012, 11:48 AM
Man I've read some good BS Glock threads over the years but this one really takes the cake. :scrutiny:

The answer to the original question about rounds rattling in the mag is that it is normal from time to time with just about any double stack pistol mag I have ever seen. As long as the springs are stiff enough to keep them from going bullet-up, it is a complete non-issue.

Likewise, the dust cover is angled up to touch the slide on every single Glock I have ever seen. Personally I would not go boiling the frame or mags in an attempt to reshape the dust cover, "re-hydrate" the frame, re-homogonize the molecules, or for any other reason.

"Re-hydrating the Glock". Good lord. I bet the fellows are Pearce are changing their headlight fluid in their cars every so often as well. :D

Certaindeaf
February 22, 2012, 12:30 PM
.In that test, which exposed the frame material to UV levels and durations equivalent to 100 years of sunlight exposure,.
These condensed time tests (all) are valuable but the one important thing they lack is actual time. I'm not a Glocker but why are they on generation 5 after 30 years?
I guess we'll just have to see for ourselves how the first generation holds up after 100 years of hard use.

ny32182
February 22, 2012, 12:35 PM
Same reason that any product produced for more than five minutes undergoes revisions: Designs evolve over time to make improvements or meet new customer expectations.

Certaindeaf
February 22, 2012, 01:01 PM
Same reason that any product produced for more than five minutes undergoes revisions: Designs evolve over time to make improvements or meet new customer expectations.
This is true. Like I said, we'll see the truth after 100 years.

dom1104
February 22, 2012, 01:19 PM
You know, what is it about Glock folks that they believe anything?

I have noticed a LOT of BS threads related to Glocks.

A LOT.

KodiakBeer
February 22, 2012, 01:57 PM
I use MSG to tenderize my plastic guns. Just saute in butter with a dash of garlic and MSG... Nice, but you do get hungry after a range session!

SharkHat
February 22, 2012, 02:14 PM
This thread reminded me that I need to ask my mechanic to change my tires over from winter air to spring air soon.

exavid
February 22, 2012, 02:31 PM
Do you use 100% or 78% nitrogen in your tires?

JohnKSa
February 23, 2012, 01:05 AM
These condensed time tests (all) are valuable but the one important thing they lack is actual time.First of all, while the oldest Glocks have yet to work their way into their third decade, nylon has been around for just shy of 80 years. There's really no mystery about what happens to nylon when it gets old.

Second, the UV test wasn't designed to determine the effects of aging, it was to determine the effects of UV exposure. The amount of UV exposure was quantified into something that would make sense to persons interested in interpreting the test results, but time wasn't really a tested parameter in the experiment.

Third, the condensed time tests are actually pretty useful. No one would spend the money to do them if the results didn't provide useful data. And as pointed out, they've had 8 decades of experience to determine if the condensed time tests are providing accurate results or not.

Finally, I'm always somewhat amused by these threads implying that high-tech engineered polymers are likely to self-destruct with the passage of a few years. I can still remember when the biggest worry about plastic was that the planet would be eventually inundated by essentially eternal plastic waste.I'm not a Glocker but why are they on generation 5 after 30 years?First of all, they're on generation 4, not 5.

Second, it's only been about 25 years.

Third, none of the changes in any of the generations had anything to do with changing the polymer frame material--the topic currently under discussion.

leadcounsel
February 23, 2012, 04:22 AM
Boil it in a teflon pot to give it a bullet proof coating!

Sheepdog1968
February 23, 2012, 10:29 AM
1. You had a problem with your Pearse grip extension. Taking the advice to boil your Glock is analogous to calling Goodyear when you have a flat and they advise repainting your car. Dump the Pearse extension and go with a different one.

2. Plastic CAN rehydrate. Soft daily and extended wear contact lenses are hydrophilic (water loving) and if allowed to dry out will crack and shatter. Glock frames, mags and parts are not made of a polymer anywhere close to the stuff contact lenses are made.

3. It is possible that what the Pearse rep was having you do was heat the plastic to allow the rounds to stack correctly.....the boiling wasn't to "rehydrate" but to prevent you from melting it in the oven, microwave or with a heat gun.

4. It is also possible that he's pulling your leg.
Answer number 3 was the only plausable rational I could come up with as well.

TonyT
February 23, 2012, 02:18 PM
If you add some garlic, a bay leaf, tomato paste and sauce you might be able to serve it with spaghetti.

coolluke01
February 23, 2012, 04:08 PM
No the reasons given were to rehydrate the polymer and return it to it's original dimensions. This would take up the extra space and allow things to fit properly. If you read the explanations of those that understand this process in earlier posts you will see that the polymer will expand a small amount.

While I don't think rehydrating a Glock is a must, it is ignorant to fail to understand the truth behind the theory.

I know many compare this to blinker fluid and the like. I fully appreciate the humor in that. It does sound kinda weird. :)

ny32182
February 23, 2012, 04:20 PM
The magazine has a metal liner in it anyway.

Even if you could "Re-hydrate" your Glock (you should try boiling it in Gatorade... the Glock might need electrolytes or protein it sweated out too :rolleyes:) it would not impact the internal shape of the mag.

Occassional rattling of rounds is normal. You will not be able to boil out the rattle. Repeat: Boiling of the Glock will accomplish nothing.... except maybe provide for my continued amusement.

wickedsprint
February 23, 2012, 05:52 PM
Back in the day we used to boil suspension arms of our remote control cars to make them less brittle...seemed to result in less broken arms.

Zoogster
February 23, 2012, 06:11 PM
Boiling your polymer firearm parts is a bad idea.

Boiling the frame as some do is really stupid.

Some people in the thread are citing the melting temperature of the material, as if that is the temperature required to distort it. That is not the case, the melting temperature would turn it into a distorted mess. However you can cause the material to stretch and the internals and components to shift and be out of spec by softening it at a much lower temperature than the melting temperature. In fact you can reshape the plastic at lower temperature with pressure, and there is springs and weight and material stresses and similar pressures already present in the firearm.
Even if it works after you may have dimensions and gaps internally that the firearm was not meant to have and is functioning less safely as a result of.
You do not need to change the dimensions of the frame much or even to an extent that is visibly obvious to have made it less safe or less reliable.

If you are going to boil a part which is stupid, at least use a double boiler so the thing is reaching a certain temperature uniformly, and the portion touching the bottom of the pot is not much hotter than the water itself.

I can just see some poor guy with a used gun not know the previous owner boiled the gun and distorted the dimensions of the internals slightly.
I already don't like that some people use a dishwasher, some of which have cycles approaching boiling, not to mention covering the internals of the dish washer and your dishes in current or future loads with lead that you shouldn't be consuming. But actually boiling it submerged at such a temperature is far worse.

jeepnik
February 23, 2012, 06:21 PM
Do they still teach math and science in high school?????

tipoc
February 24, 2012, 03:56 PM
Do they still teach math and science in high school?????

Only in the schools where the rich or well off attend. The rest of us fend as best we can.

tipoc

coolluke01
February 24, 2012, 04:30 PM
The temperature required to remold the gun frame would have to be much higher than 212 deg I would think. The mag I boiled was slightly more flexible but was not anywhere near malleable or distortable. Glocks operate in temperatures over 212 degs just fine. It would take a pressure cooker to change the way it's molded or formed.

I hope that with a statement like Do they still teach math and science in high school????? You understand that this is a fact. Right? It has been shown here by those that understand the process; that not only will polymers, like those used by Glock, take on water but they will increase in size as well. Boiling has also been stated to be a very effective way to hydrate a polymer.

The need for this has not been quite so clearly documented. The science is right though.

P.S I don't know what kind of math and science they teach in high school, I got a real world education as a homeschooler. If we didn't understand something we studied it out until we found the truth.

leadcounsel
February 24, 2012, 07:28 PM
Boiling it just boils all the nutrients out! I prefer to bake mine with butter and lime, or even grill it over a spit. Make sure you put BBQ sauce on it to keep it moist!

JohnKSa
February 25, 2012, 01:48 AM
The temperature required to remold the gun frame would have to be much higher than 120 deg I would think.Water boils at 212 degrees F.

JohnBT
February 25, 2012, 11:09 AM
Depending on the altitude. :)


I can answer this question: "Do they still teach math and science in high school?????"

We don't needs no education no more.
We gots the internet.

Zerodefect
February 25, 2012, 11:14 AM
Glocks aren't made from a polymer that will gain anything from water.

Boiling a Glock, if anything, will cause the plastic to more likely lose some of it oils that keep it plastic. You're far more likely to dry out the plastic and hurt it.

Heating certain polymers in an oil bath can be a good thing. But not your Glock.

coolluke01
February 25, 2012, 12:39 PM
will cause the plastic to more likely lose some of it oils that keep it plastic.
I guess I don't understand what you mean by "oils that keep it plastic".

Glocks aren't made from a polymer that will gain anything from water.

In earlier posts The glock polymer has been identified as nylon 6 or 66. Each can retain water. They will also gain thickness as is stated by a professional below.

Just a follow up on the Glock boiling subject. BASF has on their website a technical paper entitled "Mechanical Performance Of Polyamides With Influence Of Moisture And Temperature". Polyamide is the technical name for Nylon. The people on that thread should read it. Among other things it states that for every 1% of moisture absorbed there is a 0.2-0.3 % increase in dimension. This would amount to .002 - .003" per linear inch. I don't know about Glock or the Pearce magazines but that can be significant if you are concerned about tolerances in a precision assembly.

mesinge2
February 25, 2012, 02:22 PM
http://i1210.photobucket.com/albums/cc401/mesinge2/Misc/beatingadeadhorse.jpg

nonseven
February 25, 2012, 05:02 PM
Depending on if the polymer is nylon 6 or 66 or a blend, it will melt somewhere between about 425F to 500F. Nylon doesn't gradually soften as it is heated like polyethylene; it suddenly turns into a liquid like state when the melting temperature is reached.

brickeyee
February 25, 2012, 06:03 PM
And if it does absorb any water it it not likely to do so uniformly and will distort in shape.

GLOOB
February 25, 2012, 06:22 PM
This thread is clearly divisible into facts and observations backed by research, knowledge, and/or experience. And uninformed opinions.

My uninformed opinion is that my uninformed opinion is worthless. My only opinion that I'll share is this one:

If I thought Glock polymer was hurt by boiling water, I wouldn't own one. I have many times shot enough rounds to make water boil off the barrel, and I have many times gotten it wet. Just leaving a Glock in direct sunlight can get it close to those temps. I'm so glad it hasn't swollen out of spec or melted, yet. To anyone that believes boiling water will ruin their Glock, why do you still own yours!?

This sounds like new ground for Glock torture testing. We've already seen Glocks frozen in ice. Now it's time for someone to make some Glock stew and post it on Youtube. :)

coolluke01
February 25, 2012, 06:49 PM
As you wish. Here is the video of me boiling my glock 26 mag.

http://youtu.be/FwuKCXe-D1M

JohnBT
February 25, 2012, 07:00 PM
It won't be long now and this thread will begin approaching the memorable historical significance of the tactical wheelbarrow. Iow, internet lore.

Honest John
February 25, 2012, 08:35 PM
Ok, so I know this sounds weird. Has anyone heard about rehydrating the polymer in their Glocks?
I have a Pearce grip extension for my G26. It adds two rounds. When loaded with 12 the number 7 and 9 rounds rattle. I can poke them from the back and they will move back and forth. I called Pearce and they suggested that the polymer needs to be rehydrated. Boiling the mag in water for 15 mins is supposed to rehydrate it.
Ok, So I tried it. I'll post the video on youtube and put a link on here later. As you may have guessed it didn't fix the issue.
I called Glock today and asked them if they had ever heard about the need to rehydrate their guns. They had never heard about it. He put me on hold and asked some others in the office if they had ever heard about this. No one had. I think they thought I was crazy.
The guy from pearce said that an armor had cleaned all of his departments Glocks with a sonic cleaner and some solvent. None of the guns would function properly after. After boiling his own Glock he fixed all the problems he was having with the malfunctions! After boiling the glock mag I could tell that it was softer. When fired the Glocks flex, if it was too dry it could be too stiff?

Has anyone heard of this?
I've shot a Glock for 16 years but know very little about plastics. I have never heard of rehydrating plastics.
My question is - did the perceived problem affect the functioning of the pistol and magazine combination in any way?

Ben86
February 25, 2012, 08:43 PM
It won't be long now and this thread will begin approaching the memorable historical significance of the tactical wheelbarrow.

I know what my next weekend project is going to be.

coolluke01
February 25, 2012, 08:56 PM
I never had any problem with the mag and the rattling rounds. It was annoying and I did fear the possibility of a failure. Rapping the base of the mag on the counter a few times seems to seat the rounds better with less rattling.

This quickly expanded far beyond the realm of loose rounds, to snake oil and mysticism.

481
February 25, 2012, 09:00 PM
It won't be long now and this thread will begin approaching the memorable historical significance of the tactical wheelbarrow. Iow, internet lore.

I think that it is there already (this one is replete with all sorts of misinformation :rolleyes:), John.

Despite the fact that very hot/boiling water will depolymerize Nylon through hydrolytic attack (hydroxyls attack the carbonyl group of the polyamide) and will eventually result in mechanical failure (fracture) of the polymer (Nylon), we have several here who've elected to dispute what happens when Nylon 6 or 66 is exposed to very hot/boiling water simply because they haven't experienced any visible damage or failure yet.

So...go ahead and boil your Glocks, toss 'em into the dishwasher and let 'em go 'til they are sparkly clean. You might get away with it a few or even several times, but chemistry, harsh mistress that she is, will eventually catch up with you and you will see your polymer frame fail (cracks, fracture, etc).

Incidentally, I own several (21, actually) Glocks and do so in spite of this "issue" (it isn't really :)) simply because I respect the qualities of the engineering polymer used in their construction.

:cool:

Ben86
February 25, 2012, 09:06 PM
So...go ahead and boil your Glocks, toss 'em into the dishwasher and let 'em go 'til they are sparkly clean.

But even people who use a dishwasher in a normal manner and place polymer kitchen wear in there ought to admit that over time the harsh cycles of the dishwasher degrade or downright destroys the polymer material they are made of.

I guess Glock polymer isn't subject to any of the same chemical limitations of lesser polymer.

481
February 25, 2012, 09:09 PM
I've shot a Glock for 16 years but know very little about plastics. I have never heard of rehydrating plastics.
My question is - did the perceived problem affect the functioning of the pistol and magazine combination in any way?
No need to rehydrate anything, the polymer is fine as it is. :) Besides, Nylon will absorb atmospheric moisture (humidity/water) all by itself over time and you don't need to do a darned thing like subjecting your gun to excessive treatment.

This has gotta be the most messed up thread that I've ever read here. :rolleyes:

481
February 25, 2012, 09:16 PM
But even people who use a dishwasher in a normal manner and place polymer kitchen wear in there ought to admit that over time the harsh cycles of the dishwasher degrade or downright destroys the polymer material they are made of.

I guess Glock polymer isn't subject to any of the same chemical limitations of lesser polymer.
Such durability is testament that Glock's formulation is exemplary (not to mention his manufacturing process evidenced by the hard, glassine finish that tells me his molds are set at the perfect temperature), no doubt about that.

However, abuse it enough and even Gaston's wunder-formula will fail.

JohnKSa
February 25, 2012, 10:28 PM
But even people who use a dishwasher in a normal manner and place polymer kitchen wear in there ought to admit that over time the harsh cycles of the dishwasher degrade or downright destroys the polymer material they are made of.You guys are in agreement, 481's comments were sarcasm.Nylon doesn't gradually soften as it is heated like polyethylene; it suddenly turns into a liquid like state when the melting temperature is reached.I'm not sure that the facts support that. There are two high temperature specs quoted for nylon 6 that I've seen. One, in the neighborhood of the temperature you mention (over 400F) is the "never exceed" figure past which the frame will be irreparably damaged/melted. However, there is a much lower figure--somewhere around 250F, which is quoted as a "let it cool before you use it" figure. In other words, the frame is not being damaged at the lower temperature simply by getting that hot, but the material's mechanical properties are temporarily compromised and the product shouldn't be subjected to stress until it cools down again.

In addition, there does appear to be some anecdotal evidence from folks who have used boiling water to sufficiently soften the dustcover to eliminate the "pig-nose" non-problem.

Besides, this whole issue should be a closed subject given that there is sufficient evidence from a variety of sources to convince anyone who's willing to listen to reason that really hot water isn't healthy for the Glock frame material due the fact that it is hydrolytically attacked by water above 120 degrees.

Finally, I hate to bring this up, but are we REALLY supposed to believe that ONLY polymer magazines rattle? Because if we acknowledge that metal magazines sometimes rattle too, that leaves us in the even more nonsensical dilemma of trying to determine how to rehydrate our metal magazines in order to restore their dimensions and make them stop rattling.

It's been my experience that double column magazines sometimes rattle regardless of their composition and apparently independent of their "hydration level".

481
February 26, 2012, 11:14 AM
Finally, I hate to bring this up, but are we REALLY supposed to believe that ONLY polymer magazines rattle? Because if we acknowledge that metal magazines sometimes rattle too, that leaves us in the even more nonsensical dilemma of trying to determine how to rehydrate our metal magazines in order to restore their dimensions and make them stop rattling.

It's been my experience that double column magazines sometimes rattle regardless of their composition and apparently independent of their "hydration level".

Well, now you've done it. :uhoh:

I am sure that we'll soon see a thread on how someone has decided that they can change the dimensions of their metal magazine bodies simply by immersing them in molten lead or molten aluminum.

:)

GLOOB
February 27, 2012, 04:10 PM
Despite the fact that very hot/boiling water will depolymerize Nylon through hydrolytic attack (hydroxyls attack the carbonyl group of the polyamide) and will eventually result in mechanical failure (fracture) of the polymer (Nylon), we have several here who've elected to dispute what happens when Nylon 6 or 66 is exposed to very hot/boiling water simply because they haven't experienced any visible damage or failure yet.
Exposing a Glock to sunlight causes damage too. Unless it's much hotter (steam) or strongly acidic, this hydrolytic attack would be quite slow. While the potentially beneficial (just keeping an open mind, here) hydration of the nylon would occur quite quickly.

Water boils at 212F, or so, BTW. Not 250F. If you turn up the heat, the water doesn't get hotter. It just boils off faster. So even if 250F would cause temporary changes, no big deal. It's not going to get that hot, and you wouldn't be shooting it while it's 250F, anyway, unless you can fit a cooking mitt in the trigger guard. :)

Why don't we all just keep an open mind when we're discussing interesting topics? You're the one who seems to dispute the fact that nylon6 absorbs water and undergoes dimensional changes as a result. This dimensional change (swelling) could in fact stop a magazine from rattling. It doesn't take much. Even changing the brand of ammo can stop a magazine from rattling. Question is, how long would it last, even if it worked?

JohnBT
February 27, 2012, 05:35 PM
"Why don't we all just keep an open mind"

"While the potentially beneficial"

Potentially? You know what they say, if your mind is too open your brain falls out.

Okay, tomorrow's topic: Should I put my Glock in the pressure cooker?

481
February 27, 2012, 06:02 PM
Exposing a Glock to sunlight causes damage too. Unless it's much hotter (steam) or strongly acidic, this hydrolytic attack would be quite slow. While the potentially beneficial (just keeping an open mind, here) hydration of the nylon would occur quite quickly.

That's why a UV inhibitor (carbon black) is added to the polymer. At room temperature (68F/20C) the process of any significant hydrolysis (with whatever absorbed water is present in the polymer) may for all practical purposes be considered to be so slow as to be immeasurable.


Why don't we all just keep an open mind when we're discussing interesting topics?

Unless you can somehow prove that the immutable laws of chemistry have changed with regard to the process of depolymerization, there is nothing to keep an open mind about. The laws of chemistry and process of depolymerization remain unchanged irrespective of your opinion.

Water boils at 212F, or so, BTW. Not 250F. If you turn up the heat, the water doesn't get hotter. It just boils off faster.

You have an impressive grasp of the obvious. Thanks for sharing.


You're the one who seems to dispute the fact that nylon6 absorbs water and undergoes dimensional changes as a result.

That's awfully dishonest of you. I've said nothing of the sort. Feel free to show us all where I've said such a thing.

In fact, I have made it very clear in post #109 above that-

No need to rehydrate anything, the polymer is fine as it is. Besides, Nylon will absorb atmospheric moisture (humidity/water) all by itself over time and you don't need to do a darned thing like subjecting your gun to excessive treatment.


If you can't understand what you've read and can only misrepresent what you've seen, then I would appreciate it if you wouldn't bother quoting me at all.

My uninformed opinion is that my uninformed opinion is worthless.

There ya go. ;)

481
February 27, 2012, 06:09 PM
Okay, tomorrow's topic: Should I put my Glock in the pressure cooker?

That's funny!

I'd bet that a video of that little piece of silliness would go "viral" in less than a day and soon everyone'd be doing it. :evil:

GLOOB
February 27, 2012, 06:56 PM
Unless you can somehow prove that the immutable laws of chemistry have changed with regard to the process of depolymerization, there is nothing to keep an open mind about. The laws of chemistry and process of depolymerization remain unchanged irrespective of your opinion.
Is there an immutable law that says boiling a Glock mag for 10 minutes causes significant damage? Or are you taking one immutable fact and painting broad strokes with it without further thought?

That's why a UV inhibitor (carbon black) is added to the polymer.
Thank you for also stating the obvious. I wasn't trying to be insulting, but if you'd like to get into a contest, god help you. :) Carbon black works pretty good, but if you think your properly hydrated Glock will last forever in the sun, you need to revisit your immutable laws of chemistry and figure out how to read them. I mentioned the sunlight damage to make the point that damage is relative. How much damage? How fast? These are important considerations, because saying that boiling a Glock for 10 minutes causes irreparable damage, and saying that shooting your Glock in sunlight for a shooting session causes irreparable damage, both statements are correct. But it's not going to stop people from shooting their Glock outdoors.

At room temperature (68F/20C) the process of any significant hydrolysis (with whatever absorbed water is present in the polymer) may for all practical purposes be considered to be so slow as to be immeasurable.
I'm sure this is true. Again, why are you stating the obvious? Weren't we talking about boiling water?

That's awfully dishonest of you. I've said nothing of the sort. Feel free to show us all where I've said such a thing.

In fact, I have made it very clear in post #109 above that-

Quote:
No need to rehydrate anything, the polymer is fine as it is. Besides, Nylon will absorb atmospheric moisture (humidity/water) all by itself over time and you don't need to do a darned thing like subjecting your gun to excessive treatment.
Well, then I guess I owe you an apology. Let me rephrase. You seem to deny the possibility that boiling a Glock might be able to significantly change it, structurally. Yes, you are quite adept at stating the obvious. Nylon absorbs atmospheric moisture. Amazing. This tells us nothing about the rate at which is equalizes.

A Glock that is stored for years in a dry environment may well be dimensionally different than the same gun stored in a humid environment. And changing the level of hydration by boiling may very well make a lasting change (as in months/years), depending on the rate of equalization with the environment. Just an example, here: wood also absorbs moisture from the environment. A good quality wood bow has to be kept at an optimum humidity, or it must be laquered. If it is allowed to get wet, you can't just hang it up and let it dry overnight. It might take months or years to dry out at room temp/humidity. (An environment that is too dry, will also damage the bow.) So even though the level of moisture in the wood equalizes with the atmosphere, you can make a lasting and significant change to it with just a short dunk in water.

Could nylon react in a similar way? Maybe it doesn't. I don't know. Do you? Is this one of your immutable laws?

Your grasp of chemisty is quite impressive. I hope you will be a teacher some day, so that you can pass on your immutable knowledge to others. Just stay away from philosophy, because that requires thinking. And engineering, because that requires practical application. But anything that can be painted in black and white, you should be ace at. Maybe math or the immutable chemistry. By all means, please continue your lecture.

wickedsprint
February 27, 2012, 07:04 PM
That's funny!

I'd bet that a video of that little piece of silliness would go "viral" in less than a day and soon everyone'd be doing it. :evil:

So that's not how they make their sub-compacts??

coolluke01
February 27, 2012, 07:08 PM
No you have to put them in the dryer on high heat to do that.

The pressure cooker is not a bad idea! ;) It would raise the temperature you could boil it at and expedite the process.

Could someone explain the hydraulic attack and depolymerization problem? Is this really a big concern? How does it impact the polymer? How can it be that is can occur at 120 deg as someone stated?

paintballdude902
February 27, 2012, 07:35 PM
ive heard about people using KY lubricant on their polymer guns to preserve/treat/care for the polymer. but idk how true it is

coolluke01
February 27, 2012, 07:48 PM
hahaha I think they meant something that rhymed with glock.

481
February 27, 2012, 08:39 PM
Is there an immutable law that says boiling a Glock mag for 10 minutes causes significant damage? Or are you taking one immutable fact and painting broad strokes with it without further thought?


Thank you for also stating the obvious. I wasn't trying to be insulting, but if you'd like to get into a contest, god help you. :) Carbon black works pretty good, but if you think your properly hydrated Glock will last forever in the sun, you need to revisit your immutable laws of chemistry and figure out how to read them. I mentioned the sunlight damage to make the point that damage is relative. How much damage? How fast? These are important considerations, because saying that boiling a Glock for 10 minutes causes irreparable damage, and saying that shooting your Glock in sunlight for a shooting session causes irreparable damage, both statements are correct. But it's not going to stop people from shooting their Glock outdoors.


I'm sure this is true. Again, why are you stating the obvious? Weren't we talking about boiling water?

Well, then I guess I owe you an apology. Let me rephrase. You seem to deny the possibility that boiling a Glock might be able to significantly change it, structurally. Yes, you are quite adept at stating the obvious. Nylon absorbs atmospheric moisture. Amazing. This tells us nothing about the rate at which is equalizes.

A Glock that is stored for years in a dry environment may well be dimensionally different than the same gun stored in a humid environment. And changing the level of hydration by boiling may very well make a lasting change (as in months/years), depending on the rate of equalization with the environment. Just an example, here: wood also absorbs moisture from the environment. A good quality wood bow has to be kept at an optimum humidity, or it must be laquered. If it is allowed to get wet, you can't just hang it up and let it dry overnight. It might take months or years to dry out at room temp/humidity. (An environment that is too dry, will also damage the bow.) So even though the level of moisture in the wood equalizes with the atmosphere, you can make a lasting and significant change to it with just a short dunk in water.

Could nylon react in a similar way? Maybe it doesn't. I don't know. Do you? Is this one of your immutable laws?

Your grasp of chemisty is quite impressive. I hope you will be a teacher some day, so that you can pass on your immutable knowledge to others. Just stay away from philosophy, because that requires thinking. And engineering, because that requires practical application. But anything that can be painted in black and white, you should be ace at. Maybe math or the immutable chemistry. By all means, please continue your lecture.

I just stated some factual information. Your inability to digest it doesn't mean that it is incorrect.

For someone who freely admits to having no knowledge of the chemical processes being discussed here, you've done nothing more than manage to prove it for a third time.

This thread is clearly divisible into facts and observations backed by research, knowledge, and/or experience. And uninformed opinions.

My uninformed opinion is that my uninformed opinion is worthless.

Based upon this admission (in conjunction with your clear conviction to not let the facts get in your way), it is clear that you have mistaken a lack of knowledge as being a desirable thing and fall into the latter group that you describe.

I have no remedy for such obtuseness and no desire to entertain it. :rolleyes:

Enjoy. :)

coolluke01
February 27, 2012, 08:44 PM
Ok, Please stay off my thread. You boys want to quibble go somewhere else.

9mmepiphany
February 27, 2012, 08:59 PM
I think this has gone far enough and we are now just going in circles which won't come to a accepted conclusion without testing which I doubt anyone here is willing to conduct.

I think there is enough information here for readers to make an informed decision. With that I'm going to close the thread

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