Conceal Carry: Glock or J-frame


PDA






Gergify
February 21, 2012, 12:29 AM
So I turn 21 within the next few months and I plan on geting my CCW.

I'm planning on going gun shopping and range test handguns before deciding what to buy; I will be carrying during all occasions, both pocket and belt carry (depending on my attire). As of right now I'm considering either a J-frame Lightweight or G26 (or something similar like PM9 and etc).

Can someone explain which (if you could only have one :rolleyes: ) Is the better choice for a good all around first CCW firearm.

If you enjoyed reading about "Conceal Carry: Glock or J-frame" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
jeepnik
February 21, 2012, 12:36 AM
Glocks, even the baby Glocks are a bit large for pocket carry, unless you tailor your wardrobe around large pockets.

J Frames fit pockets better, and obviously will work as a "belt gun" just fine. On the plus side, and I don't know your skill level, revolvers are simpler/safer for new shooters. Yet many, like myself, who've been around firearms for more decades than we care to admit, don't feel "undergunned" with a 5 shot revolver.

Truthfully, the best thing is to give several firearms a try at a range that rents them, and if you have older friends with the ones you are interested in, try them for "fit". Most ranges would frown if you stuck one of their handguns in your pocket.

coolluke01
February 21, 2012, 12:39 AM
The G26 might be a little big for some to pocket carry. But I would think it's a better choice for a first time carry.
Find what you shoot best and go with that.
I carry the G26 IWB and ankle. It works well with a Galco ankle glove. With a two round extension on the G26 mag you can have twice the capacity as the J frame.

Gergify
February 21, 2012, 12:43 AM
I'll have to go and get a feel for both the smalled semi 9mm's and the J-frame. To be honest I'm mainly carrying for personal/home protection and I don't plan on needing more 5rds.

Realistically, how often will you ever need 10 rds in a usual real world situation?

Scott Free
February 21, 2012, 12:54 AM
I'm temped to recommend a J-frame. Know that they are difficult to shoot accurately at distance, though. As for me, I am okay with this, and with the 5 round limitation. A J-frame is very easy to pocket carry. A Glock, not so much.

Don357
February 21, 2012, 12:58 AM
per Scottfree..."Know that they are difficult to shoot accurately at distance"
For a personal defence/CCW piece, you don't need a long range gun. Do yourself and those around you a favor, go with the J-frame in .38spl/.357Mag.




Friends don't let friends carry Glocks!

Doubting Thomas
February 21, 2012, 01:04 AM
Suggest you take a course that covers pertinent laws and liability, and listen VERY, VERY closely. Not being critical, just alluding to the fact that there are very real pitfalls and a lot of dangerous BS "make my day" advice floating around out there. The NRA personal protection course (which I used to teach) stressed this. We had the local DA teach it, and after hearing three different DAs cover the same ground I had a pretty good idea of the legal hazards involved.

As to hardware: The Glock 26 is not a pocket gun. It needs a holster. Nor would I carry one without a holster unless the chamber was empty. Plus any semiauto, even the best, requires perfect ammo to work properly, and is a fussier piece of equipment by its very nature.

I have 40 years plus experience (much of it as an LEO) with J frames. Not counting the one that I put out of time with +P+ ammo and S&W rebuilt (and one blown up next to me with bad ammo) , I have never seen one fail to work. I still carry a 442 daily because it is easy to have on me, morning to night, and it has always gone bang. 5 for sure is a decent Plan A. If I needed a Plan B a second J frame wouldn't be bad either.

Just remember--your primary weapon is your mind. Guns are just a tool to execute the plan.

David E
February 21, 2012, 02:16 AM
I'm mainly carrying for personal/home protection and I don't plan on needing more (than) 5rds.

Oh, I guess I missed the part where we, the attacked, get to plan anything, like time of day, number of attackers, lighting, location, ensuring both hands are available, etc etc etc....but we can "plan" on how many rounds we will need?

Realistically, how often will you ever need 10 rds in a usual real world situation?

Ask anyone who's been in a gunfight if they wished they had fewer rounds in the gun.

Any gun with you bears any gun not. But you must acknowledge any shortcomings in your equipment and understand them. You should also achieve a high level if proficiency with your chosen gun. Failure to do so transforms the gun into a mere talisman.

Guillermo
February 21, 2012, 02:28 AM
the first rule of gunfighting is

HAVE A GUN!!!

In my life a J-frame would be more likely to be carried.

Of course, depending on what I am wearing, where I am going, I have 4 standard carry guns.

There is no "one answer"

XxBulletBendeRXx
February 21, 2012, 02:58 AM
The G26 might be a little big for some to pocket carry. But I would think it's a better choice for a first time carry.
Find what you shoot best and go with that.
I carry the G26 IWB and ankle. It works well with a Galco ankle glove. With a two round extension on the G26 mag you can have twice the capacity as the J frame.
I would go with Glock 26. But Like the Quoted above, you need to carry a G26 in a holster. But you can get a IWB holster of your liking or something similar. For pocket carrying the G26, naturally you would want a pocket holster. A DeSantis pocket holster works quite well. Being that Glock has no external manual saftey, the trigger needs to be protected well from any accidental snagging or similar mishap that can occur with a loaded Auto pistol in condition one, or any pistol for that matter.
Some say that auto loaders are prone to trouble feeding, ejecting, etc., "due to there nature" However IMO Glocks are a very reliable platform to trust for defense in the auto loader catagory. And to put it simply, Like David E. mentioned above, one can never have to many rounds. Another thing, the more rounds you carry the heavier it gets, So its a give and take.
To carry on a little longer with my comment...... I like the G26 a lot, and carry mine with the 10 round mag and either a 15 or 17 round mag spare in case. So, with one in the pipe and a G17 mag(17 round mag) you would have 28 rounds. If you add mag extentions on those that would up it to 32 rounds. Plenty to get yourself to saftey and/or stop any threats. Lots of times thugs run in packs, So God forbid 2 or more guys try and attack you in some way, you would have no problems defending yourself, as far as round count goes anyway. God forbid of course.
Good luck with your purchase no matter what you decide on, as deciding, trying out and talking about what you want to get is half of the fun. Enjoy the Ride.. Take Care. B.B.

wlewisiii
February 21, 2012, 09:49 AM
Had a J frame - a 642. Very nice for a snubby and I could shoot it reasonably well with light 158 gr LRN loads. But even +P were too painful for my tastes. Even with speedloaders, reloads are slow and the short ejector rod gives very little margin for error.

I now EDC a Glock 19 and two spare mags in a deepconceal.com shoulder holster. It gives me a weapon I am comfortable shooting hot loads out of (RA9TA) and 46 rounds of it at that. I don't find it too big or heavy but I'd never just chuck it in a pocket or such.

2wheels
February 21, 2012, 09:53 AM
Can't really go wrong with either choice, I'm not a Glock fan and I love my 442 so that'd be my choice.

glassman
February 21, 2012, 11:06 AM
I agree with guillermo and carry a 642. Fewer moving parts than a semi and in my opinion more reliable. It can be easily concealed no matter the weather or clothing requirements.

Guillermo
February 21, 2012, 11:24 AM
Fewer moving parts than a semi

does anything have fewer moving parts than a Glock?

Guillermo
February 21, 2012, 11:28 AM
in the name of full disclosure, while I have respect for the J-frame and have owned them before, I do not own any.

As I carry a revolver OWB I carry a D-frame Colt.

David E, however, has me thinking about looking for an early model 40 (Centennial) from the 50's.

(and I was doing SOOO well not buying guns. It has been over a month :fire:)

X-Rap
February 21, 2012, 11:29 AM
I carry a G19 most of the time, it is reliable and carrys a fair amount of ammo. I also, when dress requires it will carry a J frame or a 380 but I have no illusions about having enough ammo. The smaller and lighter the gun the bigger the compromise.
Having a gun is the first priority but I am fully in the camp with wanting some ammo left over if I ever have to use my gun in a fight.

franco45
February 21, 2012, 12:41 PM
You may want to look at the Kahr PM and CM 9mm. I can pocket carry my CM9 in the front pocket of most of my pants. I do carry a 642 in my jacket pocket as well during winter months.

NG VI
February 21, 2012, 12:55 PM
Can someone explain which (if you could only have one ) Is the better choice for a good all around first CCW firearm.


For me, and my advice, the Glock 26. Cheapest centerfire pistol ammunition, which means more practice per dollar, they are as accurate or more accurate than a fullsize pistol, they are remarkably easy to fully service, so you will be able to get to know your gun intimately without worrying about being able to put it back together properly or damage it, they have an outstanding surface treatment and finish as far as corrosion goes, they hold two times as many shots as a J frame with the stock magazine and nothing in the chamber, 9mm gives you access to the best available handgun ammunition at reasonable prices.

There are a lot of good reasons to go with the Glock here. And the 26 might feel a little odd in the hand, but resist the urge to go attaching things to it before you've really wrung it out and gotten familiar with it in stock form. The only thing I would suggest adding, other than maybe different sights, are some GAP floorplates. They aren't extensions, they are just flat baseplates with a little spur on the front that really does add to functionality without detracting from concealability. And I always got pinched by magazine extensions.

Zundfolge
February 21, 2012, 01:02 PM
Gergify, you didn't mention what state you're in.

In some states you have to qualify with your CCW piece and if you qualify with a revolver your license will ONLY allow you to carry a revolver, but if you qualify with an auto you can carry either.

If you're primarily going to pocket carry than J frame all the way ... if you're going to carry IWB I'd go for the G26.

But ultimately I say buy whichever one you can afford right now and then start saving for the other. Then you'll eventually end up with one for pocket carry and one for belt carry.

For belt carry, make sure you budget for a good holster AND a good belt.

Old krow
February 21, 2012, 01:05 PM
I'd probably go with the Glock if I absolutely had to choose between the two. I own both and love them both. If funds are limiting the decision to buy one or the other, then they'll probably be fairly limiting on ammo as well. 9mm is cheaper and will allow you to practice more.

I agree with David E, you probably won't get to plan on how many attackers you face. I also agree with Doubting Thomas, I wouldn't pocket carry a Glock. I carry both and I trust both. Reloading with just about negate the disparity in price between the 2 cartridges, but if you do not, then the cost to practice is something to consider.

allaroundhunter
February 21, 2012, 01:07 PM
I would take the Glock 26, but not with pocket carry. I personally wouldn't pocket carry a J-Frame either just because I am not a pocket carry type of person.

The good things about the Glock are the more tolerable recoil, magazine capacity, and it is easier to be accurate with (for most). It is simple to operate, just make sure you practice malfunction drills in case you need them.

I am not a fan of small airweight revolvers because of the increased recoil, and slower follow-up shots. I also do not want to be one of those that only planned on needing 5 shots but wished I had more....The best laid plans of mice and men....

NG VI
February 21, 2012, 01:11 PM
does anything have fewer moving parts than a Glock?


Doubt it. Pretty common misconception that a revolver is somehow simpler than an auto, when that just isn't the case. May be less parts you can put your hands on, but any work is much more sensitive and critical, and failures are much more likely to require a gunsmith instead of an immediate action drill.

Originally Posted by Gergify
I'm mainly carrying for personal/home protection and I don't plan on needing more (than) 5rds.

Oh, I guess I missed the part where we, the attacked, get to plan anything, like time of day, number of attackers, lighting, location, ensuring both hands are available, etc etc etc....but we can "plan" on how many rounds we will need?


I don't feel the need to be hystrionic about things, but planning on how many shots you will need strikes me as more than a little silly. Certainly it will likely be enough, but that's heavily skewed by the overwhelming prevalence of situations where having any gun is enough.

RetDep310
February 21, 2012, 01:59 PM
Owned both, and loved them. Traded the 26 for a Glock 19. The 26 is not a pocket gun, but great for OWB/IWB carry. Still have a j-frame for pocket carry. Might I suggest a 3rd option? The Ruger LC9 is right in-between the two you are looking at, size wise. Just a tad big for pocket carry, but it can be done with right pair of pants.

Doug S
February 21, 2012, 02:06 PM
Depending on how you plan to carry, the J-frame will carry easier, but the Glock will shoot easier, and have more capacity. In my experience both are reliable, so chocie for many comes down to ease of carry, and how many round you think you need in a carry gun. Should probably mention that the Glock is probably the more durable of the two both in long term use, and finish wise.

David E
February 21, 2012, 04:30 PM
When dress requires it will carry a J frame or a 380 but I have no illusions about having enough ammo. The smaller and lighter the gun the bigger the compromise.

It's amazing to me how few people realize this!

Having a gun is the first priority

Amen!

Dnaltrop
February 21, 2012, 04:55 PM
Nothing wrong with the Glock, but make sure it's comfortable to you before you set your mind in stone with the brand. Some folks just don't like the Ergos, Some folks like me have meaty, long-jointed hands that line up the bone of the thumb with the corner of the slide no matter how hard we try to hold them properly.

If I knew of a Factory Beavertail model, I might have a Glock instead of the M&P. I just hate sticking aftermarket "thingies" on a clean pistol.

J Frame can fit in a large pocket, coat pocket, easier to fire from within as well. I personally tend towards large frame pistols as I'm a tall guy, with more options.

I've used a 3" Chief's Special here and there rarely, but bigger guys get bigger pockets :D I'm perfectly willing to shoot through my clothes if it comes down to it, so the hammer snagging on the draw is a non issue.

Guillermo
February 21, 2012, 05:03 PM
The smaller and lighter the gun the bigger the compromise.

Of course this is true as compared to a battle rifle.

Which is a compromise as compared to a main battle tank

Which is a compromise when compared to artillery

Which is a....

You get the idea.


But as a civilian who lives a modest life in a safe neighborhood my chances of being attacked are not high.

And if I am going for a run, there is only so much gun that is legal (concealable) for me to carry.

Since we have to live our lives, and most of us have to conceal, the most gun THAT WE CAN SHOOT FAST AND ACCURATELY and conceal is what we should carry.

Today I am in jeans and a t-shirt. Have a D Frame Colt on my hip.
Other times I am in a sport jacket, a P7 is the best I can do
At the pool, hiding a PM9 is as good as it gets
At the beach I am lucky to hide a LCP

PcolaDawg
February 21, 2012, 05:31 PM
Carrying my 642 J Frame right now. Never owned a Glock, though, so I can't comment on it. Do love my 642, though.

Waywatcher
February 21, 2012, 06:45 PM
An apples to apples size comparison would be a Glock 19/23 to a J-frame. The Glock 26/27 is smaller than either.

Personally, I found myself confronted with this very same dilemma. I ended up getting an LCR, and then a Glock 23, then traded the LCR and got an SP101. It is very important to me to have all of my fingers on my gun, which is why I went away from the LCR and into the SP101 (with Hogue grips.) It is also important to me for ease of maintenance to have guns that are easily taken apart for cleaning. J-frames and LCRs are not easy to take apart. (LCRs and most J-frames have internal locks which I am also not fond of.) My SP101 and my Glock 23 are extremely similar in overall dimensions and weight when loaded. Practice is cheaper with the revolver because I reload for it.

Realistically, pick which one you want First. You will end up with the other one also. :)

gbran
February 21, 2012, 09:30 PM
Here's a size comparison. Kahr PM9, J-Frame and G26

http://i4.photobucket.com/albums/y145/gbran/100_0145.jpg

Bojangles7
February 21, 2012, 09:50 PM
I've carried a 442 and G27 (same size as G26) and I've had failures with both at the range. The Glock was a one FTF with no failures since. The 442 was a failure which didn't allow the cylinder to rotate (can't remember the name of the spring) and had to be sent to S&W for repair. Both were bought brand new and the 442 failed with under 200 rds through it.

I've since traded in the glock and now carry the 442 full time until I get a G30 next month. FWIW, I was very pleased with the CS of S&W, and just didn't really care for the .40 in a compact frame.

gp911
February 21, 2012, 10:46 PM
I say shoot both before you pick. On paper the Glock wins on capacity but you might dislike the grip angle, grip thickness, etc. J-frames are great, safer in a pocket than the Glock IMO. The SP101 is a great gun, I had one, but it's a tank so it really needs a holster or clipdraw. You can't go wrong with any of them unless you pick based on theory and then find it was a bad choice once you shoot it. That being said, half the fun of shooting is trying new stuff. You might also step up to a G19 or G23 with a good holster, I like their balance better than the baby Glocks.

Bobson
February 21, 2012, 11:07 PM
does anything have fewer moving parts than a Glock?
I've seen canes with more moving parts than a Glock.

My selection would be the G19 IWB. I wouldn't ever pocket carry a Glock, even the G26. I had a borderline infatuation with the 442 a few months back, but the more I read up on them, the more I learned that a 2" barrel doesn't allow adequate time for a bullet to reach sufficient momentum. If I had a 4" barrel, I'd feel better about 38SPC, but I don't think I'll ever get a J-Frame now.

fishjar
February 22, 2012, 12:14 AM
Firearm and holster choice is an " acquired taste" over the course of one's lifetime.

"Acquiring" ($$$$$) being the key word :banghead:

Best of Luck

SlowFuse
February 22, 2012, 01:40 AM
A G26 is my usual carry. However, during summer months when less clothing is common, I find a J Frame a lot easier to tuck. The G26 can be a little thick, but its still a good choice if that's what you are comfortable with.

PabloJ
February 22, 2012, 03:14 AM
So I turn 21 within the next few months and I plan on geting my CCW.

I'm planning on going gun shopping and range test handguns before deciding what to buy; I will be carrying during all occasions, both pocket and belt carry (depending on my attire). As of right now I'm considering either a J-frame Lightweight or G26 (or something similar like PM9 and etc).

Can someone explain which (if you could only have one :rolleyes: ) Is the better choice for a good all around first CCW firearm.
I would not carry Glock in pocket. It would be great shame to ruin finely tailored Italian suit.

doc2rn
February 22, 2012, 03:56 AM
I am going to make a few recommendations:
Try an LCR from Ruger over the Airweight J Frame. Big difference in recoil, for me. Also look at the PM9 and other medium frames for auto carry. Light weight guns for carry are sometimes not the best to shoot. I prefer a solid piece of steel like a S&W mod 10 snubbie or 1911/ BHP of some flavor in the inverse. Get good leather and you can carry anything! I like to recommend Milt Sparks and Galco holsters.

guyfromohio
February 22, 2012, 04:45 AM
I carry a Glock 19, Sig p239, or Smith 642. Each has pros and cons. Slow fire, I shoot similar groups with each. However, shooting quickly from low-ready, I find the Glock easiest to acquire target and get lead downrange.

I have had both a 26 and 19. I highly recommend the 19 over the 26. I actually feel that the 19 conceals better and feels better in the hand.

When it comes to absolute discretion with carry, I pull out the 642. Five in the chamber beats 15 in the safe.

The Sig is the more comfortable to carry and is highly capable as well. I actually carry and shoot it more than any other, but you didn't ask about Sigs.

Lawdawg45
February 22, 2012, 06:31 AM
I have both of the guns you mentioned, and while they're both great guns, they're worlds apart in function/ability. In my opinion the G26 is too large for pocket carry, but the 11 shot capacity is nice, and the J- Frame is the optimal pocket carry gun, but the 5 shot limitation can sour some on it. What is the general sense of your threat scenario's, and what is your personal capacity comfort level? If you carry the J-Frame, become proficient at tactical reloads and carry a minimum of two on your person, also find a quality defensive ammo. I would also recommend you look at the Ruger LC9, it's the best of both worlds.;)

LD

gpjoe
February 22, 2012, 07:13 AM
If pocket carry is absolutely critical get the J-frame.

SorenityNow
February 22, 2012, 10:20 AM
My first hand gun was a 642 and i soon relized that it was a gun that required LOTS of practice. And lets face.it its not a comfortable range gun. But with that said it still serves a great purpose and i would not part with my 642. I also own some glocks and the g26 is a great primary ccw carry hands down that nothin comes close. 642 great back up gun but also not limited to just that. Also ill add that with the 642 and other internal hammer style weapons , the weapon can be fired from inside your coat pocket.. And my opionion the j frame is the only and best way to pocket carry. Thanks

Seven For Sure
February 22, 2012, 10:34 AM
The Glock 26 makes a great IWB pistol (27 even better:neener:) but unless you're freakishly large, you can forget about pocket carry. The PM9 would make a great small carry pistol (PM40 even better:neener:). A flat base 6 rd. mag, 6 rd. mag with pinky extension and 7 rd. mag would broaden it's practical uses along with a pocket and IWB holster.

J-frames are good pocket guns but really no fun to shoot at the range IMO. A Glock 23 or 27 AND a pocket 380 or J frame would have you set for carry very nicely. Good luck!

NG VI
February 22, 2012, 03:16 PM
but you might dislike the grip angle,

If he's asking us for our advice on which platform to carry, he clearly doesn't have enough shooting experience to get wrapped up in the grip angle of a particular platform. Most of the people who really don't get along with the grip angle of Glocks are the people who have spent their whole shooting lives with 1911. You don't hear about any police cadets having trouble with the grip angle, because it's an 'issue' that results from a career of shooting a very specific gun, not from the Glock itself.

FMF Doc
February 22, 2012, 07:56 PM
A couple points to ponder:
-Find out which you shoot better...then get that one
-If they are a draw because you are not a seasoned shooter, go with the J-frame. If you can learn to shoot that well, then you can shoot anything well. It will force you to focus on the basics, trigger control, grip, sight.
-The G26 is not anything the size of a PM9, it is quite thick, and I find it harder to conceal than most med-large frame revolvers. I dropped the G26 like a hot date for my daily carry and replaced it with a Ruger SP101 with 3" barrel.
-Don't just look at S&W Jframes, ruger makes EXCELLENT revolvers for carry as well. I would suggest the SP101 with 3" barrel personally, but the shorter 2 1/4" with/without explsed hammer are also a good choice, as is the LCR. I would definantly take an LCR over any airwight smith.
HAving carried everything from a Beretta 92fs to a different Glocks to Sigs to reolvers...I like revolvers.

And as Lawdawg mentioned, the Ruger LC9 is a great all around carry...and actually what I have today!

XxBulletBendeRXx
February 22, 2012, 08:18 PM
FMF Doc said -"The G26 is not anything the size of a PM9, it is quite thick, and I find it harder to conceal than most med-large frame revolvers. I dropped the G26 like a hot date for my daily carry and replaced it with a Ruger SP101 with 3" barrel.

Here is the Thickness comparison between PM9 and G26 :

Glock 26: Slide Width 1.002" in.

Kahr PM9: Slide Width .94" in.

Why would anyone drop a hot Date? :neener:

:rolleyes:

The .94 in. thickness of the PM9 and 1.002 in., for the G26 is .062 of an inch, Not very Much difference when really looking at the Facts.

ANYWAY: TO the OP.. Go with the G26 out of the two options provided. More rounds than a wheel gun, and Glock is a proven reliable pistol. I dont want to repeat what I already said in my previous post, but my reasoning is in that post.
Glock just has a lot of hate towards them, and well on the other other hand they do have a lot of love. Dont let anyone but yourself decide. A lot of good advice here. Like a lotta folks already said, try them out, and let the gun pick you. Meaning when you find the right fit for you, it will be an obvious choice. Have fun and enjoy the ride.... :)

skt239
February 22, 2012, 10:23 PM
You really need to get some trigger time with the J-frame before you seriously begin to consider one. They have very short barrels, hardly have sights and very long, heavy trigger pulls. Not to mention the Airweights can give quite a slap to the palm.

The Glock 26 on the other hand has a very easy to manage trigger pull, decent sight radius and a good weight to caliber ratio. All that being said, here is my EDC...

http://img.tapatalk.com/42575507-a2c8-0ff4.jpg

I love the Airweight J-Frames and shoot them pretty well. They are about perfect when it comes to a civilian carry weapon, IMO. However, for most people they take some time to master and frequent practice is usually necessary to remain proficient. I would highly recommend you give them a look.

Frozen North
February 22, 2012, 11:08 PM
I am a long time G26 guy. It is an absolutely fantastic balance of controllable, concealable, reliability, and capacity. I can shoot it as well as a bigger gun, and I have not found anything that can beat it on all fronts. It is a belt carry pistol though, it it too bulky and square to be comfortable in a pocket.

I have been through the pocket pistols a few times now. I am not a fan of snubbies, micro 380s are too underpowered for my tastes, kahrs have the same block effect as the Glock to a much lesser degree, and I am far from being a Kel-Tec fan. I seem to have found my answer though.

I bought a Ruger LC9 about two weeks ago, and it may be a winner. There are no square corners on the gun at all, it is super thin, shoots 9mm, and fits in my pocket pretty well. It is not itty bitty like an LCP, but it works for me very well.

Add the LC9 to your list. 8rds of 9mm beats 5rds of .38 in my book, and it is as close to an all around pistol as I have found so far.

theicemanmpls
February 22, 2012, 11:16 PM
The 9mm is cheaper to practice with. SD loads in a J frame can be painful.
If you are new to shooting, I would get the 9mm. It is harder to conceal then the J frame. IMO.

OR,

Get yourself a .22 revolver, in addition to a carry piece. practice practice practice.
Learn the laws, this is more important then target practice. As the old saying goes, every SD round you fire has a lawyer attached to it.

Find a friend to load you up some 110g WC .38 rounds, or contact a place like mastercast in PA who will reload your brass.

It doesn't matter to me if my S&W has that silly keylock. IMO, it has no effect on anything. It just one of those things to keep the trial lawyers away from the gun manufactures.

The secret I found as others have with the J frames, is to choke up on the trigger. Yes its five rounds. If you can't get it done with two rounds, you won't get it done with ten. Carry a reload just in case.

IMO, the J-frame is safer then a glock. A little bit easier to clean. The glock is fairly simple to take down.

I carry a mouse gun, or a S&W 442. For "special" occasions, I have duty style pistols.

If you have some $$, buy four guns. A 22 for practice. A J-frame, A G-26 or small auto. Have you looked at the Walther PPK? In 380, or 32. Then you will need a full size 38/357 or 9mm to send rounds down range.

JoNate
February 22, 2012, 11:32 PM
I have a S&W J frame (model 36). The first time I shot it, I couldn't hit much with it. I bought snap caps and practiced firing at imaginary targets around my house for the following week. After that, I went back to the range and suddenly I could hit damn near anything. I practiced more and after the next week I felt completely confident with it.

Even though I am very accurate with it, I still practice.

"If people knew how hard i worked at my mastery, they wouldn't think i were so great after all."
-Michelangelo.

Hunter125
February 22, 2012, 11:52 PM
he clearly doesn't have enough shooting experience to get wrapped up in the grip angle of a particular platform.
That's not necessarily true. I have a decent amount of shooting experience, and before I bought my own first pistol all my semi-auto experience was with a G17, which I didn't like. When I bought my own I went with an XDm because the Glock just didn't point naturally for me. I think the Glock grip angle is what you learn to compensate for over a long period of training, not the other way around.

rskent
February 23, 2012, 05:52 AM
I gotta go with the Jframe (first). I have a G36 and as easy as it is to carry there are still times when it is
too big. If the dress for the day is shorts, T shirt, and flip flops a Centennial air weight is the way to go.
Steve

jbrown50
February 23, 2012, 11:42 AM
My two J-frames, a S&W M&P 360 and 637, hide much better in a pocket than any of the tiny 9mms including the Ruger LC9, Kahr PM9/PM40 and Beretta Nano. The J-frame's lighter weight and rounded contours make them surprisingly easy to conceal in a pocket. The only guns that conceal better in the pocket are the tiny 380s like the Ruger LCP, Keltec P3AT, Kahr P380.

The Glock 26/27 is just too heavy, thick and blocky to carry comfortably in a pocket. Earlier in life I carried a Glock 27 in a pocket holster but it stuck out too much so that ended. I prefer carrying my 27 or 33 in IWB/OWB hard holsters because of their light triggers. I carry a Kahr PM9 or PM40 in a pocket holster but, because of their lighter triggers, I'm much more cautious about reholstering those guns than the J-frames.

To me the J-frames, especially my M&P 360, are the best backup/pocket/everywhere carry guns. They have heavy but smooth triggers, adequate power, point instinctively, and hide extremely well. The downsides are low ammo capacity and slower more cumbersome reloading but, if you're using it as a backup gun or a gun to have with you when stealthiness is of the utmost importance, then those downsides don't really matter.

BossHogg
February 23, 2012, 12:11 PM
I carry a glock-36 on the belt with IWB holster most of the time just because I like the 45acp. To me the perfect pocket carry is a S&W 638 J-frame. I can always carry the J-frame but not always the Glock-36.

I don't know if you're a new shooter are not, but be aware the snubnose is a up close and personal weapon. It will take a lot of practice to learn to shoot accurate at any distance. It's not that they're bad shooters it's just the short sight radius.They're more of a point and shoot type of gun. I love to shoot all my J-frames and practice with them all the time.

HoosierQ
February 23, 2012, 12:15 PM
I didn't read the whole thread but a hammerless S&W 642 or 442 pocket carries pretty well. Sometimes the thing will move around and the grip may not present itself easily...pocket carry is not the fastest carry method from which to deploy the weapon without a pocket holster.

I would never pocket carry any Glock (which is in fact my EDC CCW IWB) without some sort of purpose built holster or garment...and maybe Kevlar boxers!

xXxplosive
February 23, 2012, 12:24 PM
I'd love to be able to feel confident carrying a small frame 9mm.....I just have no confidence in the round.
I usually carry a Combat Commander in .45 or a "J" frame other times but would like to like the 9mm.
But....It just leaves me hangin' on.

mopar92
February 23, 2012, 01:37 PM
I conceal a 19 no problem...

The Lone Haranguer
February 23, 2012, 01:46 PM
For everything but pocket carry, I like the mini-Glock or other, similar, subcompact pistols over any revolver. It is about the same size (but with much different contours), yet holds twice as many of a more efficient cartridge and is much easier to hit with and more pleasant to shoot.

X-Rap
February 23, 2012, 01:54 PM
I'd love to be able to feel confident carrying a small frame 9mm.....I just have no confidence in the round.
I usually carry a Combat Commander in .45 or a "J" frame other times but would like to like the 9mm.
But....It just leaves me hangin' on.
I don't doubt your feeling but I do doubt your logic, neither the commander or J frame have near the potential capacity of a modern 9mm and the 38 has nothing ballistically on the modern 9. I have no argument with the superiority of the 45 acp but with double the capacity in a similar package I have come to choose the 9 every time when it comes to CC.

coolluke01
February 23, 2012, 02:30 PM
I'd love to be able to feel confident carrying a small frame 9mm.....I just have no confidence in the round. I usually carry a Combat Commander in .45

I think your estimation of the 9mm may be very well correct. But I think if you think the .45 will drop them in their tracks you would be over stating the effectiveness of that round. A handgun is a compromise in it's self. 90% of handgun wounds are not fatal! A handgun is at best a very good deterrent. Belief that it is anything more can lead you into a false sense of security.
When choosing a carry weapon, pick the one that you shoot the best. I doubt the J frame will fit that bill out of the two options listed. In self defense situations shoot fast and shoot often. Find the gun that does that the best for you.

I think the Glock grip angle is what you learn to compensate for over a long period of training, not the other way around.
I have to disagree with you on this one. The Glock grip angle is something that has to be overcome by those that are used to something different. New shooters do not have the same issues old 1911 shooters have, for example. I personally believe that it is a better "mousetrap" and even if it takes some work to overcome the experiences with inferior :neener: ;) platforms it is worth it in the end.

NG VI
February 23, 2012, 03:03 PM
I would also suggest that pocket carry is not really a good way to go. A decent in waistband holster with something like the Glock 26 will give you a gun that's actually fun on the range, shoots as well as a fullsize, holds more ammunition, is ballistically superior, even though I feel the service calibers are all about the same, and more importantly, has many more options for top-class defensive ammunition available.

Try the FIST #1AK, took about a month for mine to arrive, but it is an outstanding thin Kydex holster, perfect for the subcompact Glocks.

SlowFuse
February 24, 2012, 12:09 PM
+1 on the fist for an IWB, very slim fitting and seems well built for the price.

orionengnr
February 25, 2012, 12:46 AM
Well, I have owned multiple Glocks, multiple j-frames and a PM9.
The only one I currently own is the PM9. Bottom line: j-frame--too few rounds and too big. Any Glock--too fat.

Although I carry a 4" 1911 every day, I keep the PM9 because it is (IMHO, and after a lot of experimentation) the ultimate pocket pistol, and a nice option to retain. I also own an LCP but I do not take the .380 cartridge seriously (YMMV).

dnilson
February 25, 2012, 01:04 AM
First of all, I am an AVID Glock fan...don't know why, but I just love them!!!!! I just took my CCW class, but have decided not to carry my glock. I have a G30 (.45 ACP subcompact), however, at least for me, even a subcompact is a little too bulky to carry IWB. Also, as a woman, my clothing can make concealment more of a challenge. I did quite a bit of research and while the glock has NEVER jammed on me, it could. Therefore, I ended up getting a Ruger SP101, DAO with a 2 1/4 inch barrel (.357, 5 shot). Revolvers are just more reliable and less likely to malfunction. I'm not saying they can't malfunction, just that it's less likely than with a semi-auto. I assumed I'd get a j frame but after finding the Ruger, I was hooked. It's a little bigger than a j frame and made of stainless steal, so, it's heavier, but the weight doesn't bother me and it helps with the recoil. Also, it's built like a tank...I mean really sturdy. When you hold it, you can tell you're holding a great gun!!!! I LOVE it!!!! Regarding the reduced amount of ammo, if you can't get in at least one decent shot out of five, you should probably be practicing more! However, having said that, I'll admit that a face to face confrontation is obviously a great deal more stressful than being at the range. Therefore, even though I'm a pretty good shot, I added Crimson Trace laser grips to improve my odds. Also, if necessary, with a speed strips, and practice, you should be able add extra rounds pretty quickly.

NG VI
February 25, 2012, 06:29 PM
I did quite a bit of research and while the glock has NEVER jammed on me, it could. Therefore, I ended up getting a Ruger SP101, DAO with a 2 1/4 inch barrel (.357, 5 shot). Revolvers are just more reliable and less likely to malfunction. I'm not saying they can't malfunction, just that it's less likely than with a semi-auto.

And if a revolver does quit, which does happen, it usually takes an act of gunsmith to correct the deficiency. Sometimes it's just that crud got into any of the places where all those moving parts are located, but it's much slower to clear a malfunction with a revolver than an auto.

An auto chokes, you yank the slide back and let it fly forward, and probably eight or nine times out of ten, probably more, the problem is resolved. People act like revolvers are so simple, but look at the way it's designed, look at all the things that absolutely must go right for the revolver to safely function properly.

It's honestly a miracle to me that revolvers don't crap the bed far more often than they do. Autos can present a more intimidating visage to the mechanically unfamiliar, but look at what they really do, most of the service autos are far simpler than people give them credit for. Four basic pieces, the magazine, which is held in place and doesn't really need to do anything special, the frame, which just acts as a platform to keep all the other parts cohesive, the barrel, pretty inert, and the slide, which only has to hold the sights and move in two directions, forwards and back.

Compare that to a revolver, whose hands have to work perfectly or a bullet could hit the forcing cone and destroy the revolver entirely. Autos may choke on bad ammunition from time to time, but their malfunctions are almost universally user-fixable in under two seconds.

dnilson
February 25, 2012, 06:59 PM
I hear what you're saying, but I've also heard that most revolver malfunctions are just as easy to fix...just pull the trigger again and that will usually take care of it (at least according to my gunsmith). I guess it's just the luck of the draw. Of course with my luck, I could carry both a revolver and semi and have them BOTH malfunction. :cuss: Oh well, at least I've still got my pepper spray.:( In all honesty though, especially during certain situations, I probably will carry both. In fact, earlier today I bought an ankle holster so I could use the ruger as my BUG. I'm just a lot more comfortable with the Glock and it IS more intimidating. I recently found a holster online that I think will work with the TLR 2S. If it doesn't fit with the light, I'll just take it off. I found some REALLY cool, small (about the size of a nickel) LED lights that have adhesive on them. You just peel off the strip and stick the light on the gun (probably best to put it in front of the back sights). I'm sure it won't be that bright, but it's better than nothing.

dprice3844444
February 25, 2012, 07:24 PM
i can carry a g26,g19 or a 9mm sigma in my pocket,no problem
for different type of clothing to hide guns in safely,go to nrastore.org,5/11 tactical makes nice pants to hide stuff in,and http://www.concealedcomfort.com/

http://smartcarry.com/

jad0110
February 25, 2012, 07:24 PM
It's honestly a miracle to me that revolvers don't crap the bed far more often than they do. Autos can present a more intimidating visage to the mechanically unfamiliar, but look at what they really do, most of the service autos are far simpler than people give them credit for. Four basic pieces, the magazine, which is held in place and doesn't really need to do anything special, the frame, which just acts as a platform to keep all the other parts cohesive, the barrel, pretty inert, and the slide, which only has to hold the sights and move in two directions, forwards and back.

While I agree that revolvers can jam, I think you are oversimplifying semi automatic handgun function quite a bit. You say the magazine doesn't really need to do anything special. On the contrary, the magazine is the heart of the entire system. If the feed lips are slightly bent or cracked, or if the spring tension isn't quite right, or if the follower hangs up you will get malfunctions. If the recoil spring tension is too low or too high you'll get failures. If the mainspring or firing pin spring weakens you can get light strikes. The extractor can wear or loose proper tension and cause failures. Crap can get into the works (just like a revolver) and sieze it up just the same. The ejector can sheer off and jam into the slide rail, which will basically weld the slide to the frame (ask me how I know this). Then there are the numerous small internal parts in the frame that, like revolver parts, can and do break. Finally, the reliability of the whole system is dependent on the user holding the gun correctly and at a good angle. Note that I've found polymer autos in particular to be especially susceptible to "limp wristing".

I'm not knocking autos, just pointing out that both platforms have their complexities and simplicities. Also, as for this:

Compare that to a revolver, whose hands have to work perfectly or a bullet could hit the forcing cone and destroy the revolver entirely.

True, but such a failure usually doesn't happen out of the blue. This sort of failure develops over hundreds, even thousands of rounds. Any half way knowledgable person can see the issue developing before it becomes a real problem.

As for the Glock and J Frame, carry both! Both work fine as a belt gun (IWB or OWB), but for pocket or ankle carry the J Frame gets the nod between the 2, at least IMHO. This of course assume you can shoot either reasonably well. I'm alright with a J frame, but Glock ergonomics flat don't work at all for me, and concequently I shoot them pretty poorly. Great guns, just not for me.

whalerman
February 25, 2012, 10:00 PM
There are so many choices regarding holsters for small Glocks. The holster issue is a non issue. Not sure why it was brought up. As far as what is the best choice, I like 'em both. The Glocks give you lots of firepower, but I carry my JFrame more when off duty.

DevilDog0402
February 25, 2012, 10:17 PM
Others have mentioned the LC9 a few times already. It is a great choice. It carries well in a pocket and disappears IWB. 7+1 9mm with a quick reload is not bad at all.

I own a Glock subcompact (33) and a j-frame (340 pd) and have carried them all, but the LC9 is currently my go-to piece. I shoot it far better than a j-frame, and almost as well as the Glock 33.

ORHunter79
February 26, 2012, 12:09 PM
I went through the same thing. Small revolver or small semi-auto. There is always a trade off. For me it was size vs firepower and the reliability of a revolver vs semi-auto.

I recommend you rent them before you buy if you can. Some people hate not being able to put their pinky finger on the small Glock. Some people cant shoot a small revolver to "save their life".

After weighing all the options and carrying a variety of guns, I went with a Glock 27 in 40 S&W (same as a 26, but bigger caliber). With a good holster, it's comfortable.

Good luck.

Madjohn
February 26, 2012, 01:17 PM
i had a smith 642 revolver for a while and didnt like it. i ended up trading that in towards a glock 27 and havnt looked back and its become my standard carry gun when i feel the need to carry.

wheelyfun66
February 26, 2012, 05:09 PM
How about both?

G26 IWB and J-frame pocket or ankle:
http://i1062.photobucket.com/albums/t497/spec4towle/041.jpg

http://i1062.photobucket.com/albums/t497/spec4towle/043.jpg

Prosser
February 27, 2012, 11:08 PM
Both are truly horrible, because without a bit of work, they both have the worst triggers on the planet. The glocks because of it's being a Glock, and the S&@ because for instance, mine came out at 16 pounds, and, a 'tuned' trigger was 10 pounds. combine that with a feather weight gun, and .357 magnum potential and you have a recipe for barn accuracy.

There are far better triggers, and more accurate guns at both sizes.

bbuddtec
February 27, 2012, 11:19 PM
j's are wider. done
In an SD application, I can pull a 50 lb trigger....

just sayin...

Armedleprechaun
February 28, 2012, 11:06 PM
If it were me,I would go with the Glock 26. It is boringly simple, reliable, tough and just plain works. Also, it offers twice the capacity of the revolver. Another thing to consider is that should something break, almost all the parts are easy to find, and easy to replace. Not to mention the Glock 26 along with it the rest of his 9 mm brethren can take 33 round magazines! Talk about range fun! I've just started to CCW and, the Glock 26 is my daily carry. Hope this helps. :-)

jrod
February 29, 2012, 12:12 AM
Glock 26! I've carried both off duty. G-26 is much easier to shoot fast and accurately.
Don't get me wrong,I love Revolvers and shoot them very well. The G-26 is no problem to pocket carry.

deadasslast2004
February 29, 2012, 08:07 AM
i use a glock 26 and a seacamp as a back up. ammo count is definitely something to consider.

Autolycus
March 1, 2012, 06:15 AM
I prefer the Glock myself. I am a Glock fan. The J-frame is nice for carry but I would rather have a Glock on my side. If you can carry the Glock 26 then why not carry that?

mes228
March 1, 2012, 08:05 AM
Glock Model 19

S&Wfan
March 4, 2012, 02:22 AM
Yep . . . its hard to hit accurately with a S&W snubbie!:rolleyes:

I bought this old S&W snubbie in the fall of 2007, and took it to the range to see what it would do. Next to me was a Georgia Probation Officer practicing hard for annual qualification with the issue Glock Model 23 (.40S&W)

I set up one target at ten yards . . . a personally created (on my computer) target with 1" black squares to shoot at 10 yards. Here's the FIRST target I ever shot with the Model 36

Loading the snubbie, and standing @ ten yards, unsupported, I put all five rounds into roughly a 1" group . . . right into the 1" black square.

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/415/415871/folders/305468/2452763IMG2500-e2web.JPG

The Probation Officer was ALL OVER THE PAPER . . . probably 4"-5" groups at the same distance!!!

I put my little snubbie down and simply chatted . . . didn't want to discourage the officer on the upcoming quals and thought it best not to shoot more targets til the officer left.

FOR CONCEALED CARRY, IMHO there's no comparison . . .

Only the snubbie revolver can be very discreetly pocket carried at all times. Everything bigger and/or wider will have to be left behind in some cases.

My "always" pocket revolver is this S&W Model 37 . . . the Airweight version of the Model 36 pictured above. It also shoots comparatively well, I just don't have targets to upload from that revolver.

I've gotta go revolver here. My safe has a bunch of autos in it . . . but through the years I've come to realize that I need to carry a handgun that I can shoot very well . . . and that will always be small enough and light enough to carry no matter what I'm wearing . . . and that's a S&W Airweight snubbie!

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/415/415871/folders/305997/2454596IMG1153pcropped10.004t.jpg

Frankly, when I hit the road, the Model 37 is in my pocket, and a big ol' S&W Model 25-2 .45ACP revolver (chopped to a 3 1/4" barrel) is my main self defense revolver (in the glove box). Here's what it does to a 1" target at ten yards (standing/unsupported) if I do my job . . .

http://216.77.188.54/coDataImages/p/Groups/415/415870/folders/305851/2483071IMG2446copy.jpg

PS: The small holes were made by a Ruger Mark II Target Model .22 pistol . . . the S&W snubbie is only pictured here for size comparison.

BUT . . . I fully understand that trouble comes on a man with no warning, and when the predator thinks it/he has an advantage. That means that I'll almost surely NOT be armed if/when a predator attacks . . . except for the snubbie that he won't know is there!!! That's what a snubbie is for . . . everything else might be too big.

I've only needed my revolver once against a two-legged predator . . . who surprised me as I was unpacking my car to go into a motel room at 1:30 in the morning. The result was a total success . . . the thug decided he didn't want any part of me and disappeared as quickly as he came into the night. That's a good thing . . . and the ultimate goal!!! I'm glad he made the RIGHT decision!!!

Good luck on your personal choice and don't fret what the first one is . . . attaining handguns is a lifelong pursuit! Most end up in the safe . . . and the snubbie in the pocket!;) The bigger and heavier the handgun, the less opportunities one has to carry it!!!

X-Rap
March 4, 2012, 12:10 PM
I'm sure those targets were all shot DA against the clock.
I sensed a certain smugness toward the officer who was "all over the paper" with his 4-5" group.
I would just ask for a little parity when describing the incident. In regards to time, how long did it take to shoot three cylinders full compared to his 14 rds?
Both guns have their limitations, I'll take 15rds from my cumbersome old G19 any day over the 5 in my J frame. Doesn't mean I won't carry one but I don't live in the illusion that 5 will get me by or that a tight 1" SA group will serve me any better than a 9" as fast as I can pull the trigger will if I'm in a gun fight.
I'm not being criticle of some very fine shooting and I will stand corrected if you indeed were shooting DA under the clock and doing speed loads like a world champ, both are fine weapons with limitations on each.
It's apples to oranges.

Crazy Carl
March 8, 2012, 11:17 AM
G26/27/33 is too big for pocket carry, but disappears when worn on the belt.

Plus.... I can shoot my SW 442 either quickly or accurately, but not both. Just the nature of the beast- the J-frame is harder to control. My G26 is very soft-shooting & VERY accurate. For some reason, I can shoot the baby Glock faster than any bottom feeder I own & that includes my .22s- a Buckmark & a tricked out MkII.

Don't forget that 9mm ballistics out of a 3"-3.5" barrel are literally the equal of .38/.357 out of 2" barrel. Cheaper to feed, too.

Snubshooter
March 8, 2012, 04:30 PM
Try a revolver first. Practice ALOT. Learn good trigger control and sight picture (FRONT sight....PRESS). Over your lifetime you will settle on both platforms at different times.

barstoolguru
March 8, 2012, 05:46 PM
g23 or g26 both work fine

Prosser
March 8, 2012, 07:18 PM
"Don't forget that 9mm ballistics out of a 3"-3.5" barrel are literally the equal of .38/.357 out of 2" barrel. Cheaper to feed, too."

Show me a 9mm that shoots a 180 grain anything, or, 148 grain bullet at 1131 fps, out of a 3-3.5" barrel.

Haven't seen any 9mm 125 grain loads that go 1204 fps out of a 3-3.5" barrel, either.

fxstchewy
March 8, 2012, 08:09 PM
G26 on the side, J Frame in the pocket.

David E
March 8, 2012, 11:08 PM
"Don't forget that 9mm ballistics out of a 3"-3.5" barrel are literally the equal of .38/.357 out of 2" barrel. Cheaper to feed, too."

Show me a 9mm that shoots a 180 grain anything, or, 148 grain bullet at 1131 fps, out of a 3-3.5" barrel.

What .38 Special load will do that?

What .357 load will do that out of a 2" barrel?

Haven't seen any 9mm 125 grain loads that go 1204 fps out of a 3-3.5" barrel, either.

What .38 Special load will do that?

A Corbon 125 grain 9mm will do 1250 from a 4", so a 3.5" will likely break 1204 fps or come so close it won't matter. And with less kick, etc, etc, etc.

Ben86
March 8, 2012, 11:27 PM
Carry the one that you like/shoot better.

For me it'd be the G26, I'm not really a revolver guy.

stealth
March 8, 2012, 11:27 PM
I own -and love- both.

Pocket carry = Airweight
IWB/OWB = Glock

If forced to do duty in the opposites realm, each one will show its weakness. Within their own element, probably THE most ideal for carry mode. Great guns, these two. Thats for sure.

If you can pack the IWB option do so. 1] Faster to shoot and also to deploy (if hands are out of pocket and off of 442, if on then its downright lightning to yank that airweight!), 2] twice the round count, 3] actually slightly more round power despite grossly less recoil, 4] more durable and 5] the cheaper ammo and lesser recoil actually encourages practice instead of dissuades it.

That said you'll usually just find me with the 442 in the pocket. "Pocket Iron"

regards,
Stealth

PS: You can now easily score NIB no-lock airweights, If you don't need the hilary hole, why have it?

otasan56
March 9, 2012, 02:10 PM
G17. It is quite concealable, and it is a very powerful gun with the right loads (17 +p+ 115gr JHPs)

LTR shooter
March 9, 2012, 05:52 PM
I say get the gun that you feel more comfortable with.

I went with the 15 oz 642 Airweight J-Frame for pocket carry. I could even fire it from the pocket if need be. Once I handled the 642 at the gun show I was sold.

I have a compact Sig P239 that has been my main defensive gun for nearly 15 years but it is a GIANT compared to the Airweight.

If you enjoyed reading about "Conceal Carry: Glock or J-frame" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!