Online gunsmith license?


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BellyUpFish
February 23, 2012, 01:40 PM
Hey guys-

I'm not looking to get into serious gunsmithing, but more along the lines of refinishing, doing small repairs and parts installs.

I want to be legal with the BATFE.

I understand if I get an online certificate and were to attempt to get a job as a GS, I'd most likely be laughed out of the shop. There is no substitute for a flesh and blood teacher, I understand.

I do not wish to partake in general gun smithing. No crowning barrels, no stoning triggers, no bolt accurizing, etc, etc, etc.

I'm looking at it in terms of legalities and know my own limits. Somethings I can't do. Others I can.

Mainly, coating weapons and Saiga conversions are my areas of focus. In order to hold onto a weapon for 24 hours, I need to be a "licensed" smith or hold an FFL?

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Birch Knoll
February 23, 2012, 01:47 PM
Training has nothing whatsoever to do with the legal requirements to be a gunsmith. You can be a total hack, and be perfectly legal. All you need is an FFL dealer's license, which is fairly easy to get as long as you can legally possess firearms. Once you have that, you are 100% legal in the eyes of the Federal government.

Whether or not you can so much as field-strip and reassemble a 1911, much less polish a feed ramp, is not the government's concern. It's your customer's.

jrhines
February 23, 2012, 01:50 PM
There is no such thing as a gunsmith license, online or otherwise. What you are talking about is a FFL, that and a truckload of other paperwork and you can keep someone else's gun at least overnight. But you will also need a business license, O.K. from zoning, approval from the CLEO in your area, insurance, security alarm,....

I can tell you how to make a small fortune in gunsmithing...



...start with a large fortune!

But good luck and read all the other threads on this forum that talk about "I want to be a gunsmith!"

BellyUpFish
February 23, 2012, 01:56 PM
Thanks for the replies guys.

Much of the work I would be doing would be under a local shops FFL.

The owner would like to add some services to his shop. Services I can readily provide. I just want to be legal.

Not looking to make a fortune. That phrase works well in aviation as well. :)

Birch Knoll
February 23, 2012, 02:28 PM
If you're working under the auspices of an FFL, you need nothing to be "legal"; he already is.

By the way, the need for an FFL (yours or the boss's) to perform gunsmithing as a business has nothing whatsoever to do with "keeping guns overnight", and everything to do with engaging in the business of gunsmithing. If you were an amateur gunsmith who took no money, you could keep guns overnight to your heart's content without an FFL. But if you gunsmith for profit, you need the FFL even if guns never stay overnight.

Ryanxia
February 23, 2012, 03:34 PM
I would listen to ttolhurst he's been kind enough to give me info/references into matters concerning getting an FFL.

BellyUpFish
February 23, 2012, 07:56 PM
I do plan on making a little side money, so I'll need to get legitimate with it.

Good stuff here. Thanks guys.

dethwort
February 23, 2012, 08:07 PM
I actually took a gunsmithing course. Bought the books, followed the lesson plans, took the tests. Complete course lasted for several months. Problem is, without any hands on experience, what you read in a book doesn't necessarily translate well into real life scenarios. The only usable info I took away from the whole experience was an understanding of the terminology used in the field of gunsmithing.

medalguy
February 23, 2012, 08:31 PM
Yep. I read in a book how to engine turn a bolt. Wanna send me one to try on? I've never done one by the way. :scrutiny:

mljdeckard
February 23, 2012, 08:33 PM
Yeah, I have learned the hard way that a guy's 'certification' is much less important than his experience.

BellyUpFish
February 24, 2012, 12:47 AM
Yeh, some sheet of paper means very little.

The plan is to offer refinishing services and plug and customized Saiga conversions. I won't be doing anything more than basic installs I've done three dozen times before. :)

wannabeagunsmith
February 24, 2012, 01:36 PM
But good luck and read all the other threads on this forum that talk about "I want to be a gunsmith!"

Nothing to say....:rolleyes:

Onmilo
February 24, 2012, 04:53 PM
OH wait,,,, I understand this thread now!
You want a suggestion for an online course to become Certified as a gunsmith!
Fuggitaboutit!
No online course will teach you the real world skills that only come with hands on experience.
An online course may show you how to become a parts replacer, none I am aware of can teach you how to become a skilled gunsmith.

By the way, you do need a 'License' to actually work as a gunsmith nowadays & that License is called The Federal Firearms License, you will need this and a Liability Insurance Provider before you conduct any business for profit as a gunsmith

BellyUpFish
February 24, 2012, 10:48 PM
OH wait,,,, I understand this thread now!
You want a suggestion for an online course to become Certified as a gunsmith!
Fuggitaboutit!
No online course will teach you the real world skills that only come with hands on experience.
An online course may show you how to become a parts replacer, none I am aware of can teach you how to become a skilled gunsmith.

By the way, you do need a 'License' to actually work as a gunsmith nowadays & that License is called The Federal Firearms License, you will need this and a Liability Insurance Provider before you conduct any business for profit as a gunsmith
Thanks.

I'm already decently skilled at what I plan to be doing. Enough so that others have seen my work and have asked me for help.

I don't plan in crowning barrels and lapping scopes and doing full on tu smithing work. I said this in my very first post. :)

I'm trying to find the right way to go about this legally. Seeing after my dog, so to speak. I want no part of shady dealings with anyone, especially the BATFE.

CapnMac
February 25, 2012, 03:31 AM
I'm trying to find the right way to go about this legally. Seeing after my dog, so to speak. I want no part of shady dealings with anyone, especially the BATFE.

That's just what they are saying here--You Do Not Need A License.

Unless:
1. Your State requires one.
1.a. Your locality requires one.
2. You manufacture (per B(AT)FE regs) weapons or ammo.
3. You profit by the sale or trade of firearms and/or ammunition.
or, 4., if you really absolutely have to have one.

ATF has a number of FFL covering a number of contingencies. You can search THR and find several discussions describing each of the types (around a dozen, if memory serves). Becoming a Type 07 can make a lot of sense for some gunsmiths.

BellyUpFish
February 25, 2012, 08:05 AM
Yeh, I wasn't aware of that, now I am. ;)

Zeke/PA
February 25, 2012, 03:48 PM
Gunsmith LICENSE?????
No such thing!
Get some training though at a school or otherwise.
I ain't taking my guns to a guy just because he SAYS that he is a Gunsmith.
THAT Poop don't work no more.

BellyUpFish
February 25, 2012, 04:45 PM
Gunsmith LICENSE?????
No such thing!
Get some training though at a school or otherwise.
I ain't taking my guns to a guy just because he SAYS that he is a Gunsmith.
THAT Poop don't work no more.

Yeh, I think you're right. I'll quit my day job and go to a school to learn to Gunkote a firearm, install a pistol grip and trigger group. Good call.

EVEgreen2001
February 28, 2012, 08:38 PM
Hey BellyUpFish,
I'm looking to do some of the same things you are. I'm looking to take on-line courses from Penn-Foster Career College next year to earn a diploma in Gunsmithing. I intend to take this education and fix up mil-surp guns bought for cheap(in rough shape)and make them beautiful and functional and build up other military rifles from parts/parts kits. Having an FFL will eliminate the dealer transfer fee. It wouldn't be a bad idea to build these guns up and sell them on gunbroker or other approved sites to sell them privately. a little cash on the side is a nice thing.

BellyUpFish
February 29, 2012, 07:01 AM
Hey BellyUpFish,
I'm looking to do some of the same things you are. I'm looking to take on-line courses from Penn-Foster Career College next year to earn a diploma in Gunsmithing. I intend to take this education and fix up mil-surp guns bought for cheap(in rough shape)and make them beautiful and functional and build up other military rifles from parts/parts kits. Having an FFL will eliminate the dealer transfer fee. It wouldn't be a bad idea to build these guns up and sell them on gunbroker or other approved sites to sell them privately. a little cash on the side is a nice thing.

I feel you. ;)

After reading this thread, I think I might skip the online classes.

I have the capabilities to perform the work I was planning on, I just wanted to be legal.

gym
March 1, 2012, 11:13 AM
Don't you need a class 7, in order to do anything to a gun that adds value? That's what I was told, by a few gunsmiths. Of course this is on a clients gun, not your own. I was told that even duracoating required this. I would think the only way to learn this skill to be at a level consomate with somone who people would really go out of their way to go to, would be to apprentice for 5 years under a top guy, like 1911 tuner, "not that he is taking on apprentices", but that type of reputation in order for people to listen and do what you suggest, instead of debating with you from what they think you should do.

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