In search of a more powerful 44spl carry load.


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R.W.Dale
February 26, 2012, 04:06 PM
A major disappointment today from my prized big bad carry loading for my 44 snubbie. It would appear as though the 200grain speer gold dot load suffers from "low T"

From a 2" Taurus titanium five shots averaged a massively underwhelming 687 fps :what: which calculates out to a mere 200 ft lbs.

There's no way the gold dots would even attempt to expand at these velocities, and not all of this problem can be blamed on a short bbl. Cases ejected covered in soot an obvious underpressure sign. Even my 200 cast TRAIL BOSS practice load had more spunk averaging 700 fps.

So here I am looking for a sufficiently powerful carry loading before I resort to handloads possibly with full wadcutters. What other good SD loads are there to look into that have VERIFICATION of the velocities achieved ?

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gp911
February 26, 2012, 04:15 PM
Check out Buffalo Bore Ammunition. Pricey, but it's potent & velocities are tested out of regular guns not long test barrels.

336A
February 26, 2012, 04:27 PM
How about this or this http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=271

Or this http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=86

Yeah it is expensive but you can't exactly put a price on your well being.

CraigC
February 26, 2012, 04:42 PM
8.0gr Unique under that Gold Dot will do the trick.

R.W.Dale
February 26, 2012, 05:02 PM
8.0gr Unique under that Gold Dot will do the trick.

Have and chrono results?

I'm not above resorting to handloads if need be.

I can only hope those gold dots wont expand at 675 fps. Because if they did penatration would most assuredly be abysmal

The only thing that puts me off about the "boutique" ammo makers is while you get the velocity they supply you with a bullet of unknown origin or construction usually some mystery cup n core JHP.

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CraigC
February 26, 2012, 05:30 PM
No, I've tested XTP's over that charge but never chrono'ed them.

sidheshooter
February 26, 2012, 06:24 PM
I'm with the folks who suggested the 190 gr. Buffy load, above. The bullet is a gas-checked softer LSWCHP-nothing to dislike there-and 190 going 1000 fps from 2" is hard to dislike as well.

JMHO.

R.W.Dale
February 26, 2012, 06:50 PM
I'm with the folks who suggested the 190 gr. Buffy load, above. The bullet is a gas-checked softer LSWCHP-nothing to dislike there-and 190 going 1000 fps from 2" is hard to dislike as well.

JMHO.

That load does look good!

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gp911
February 26, 2012, 07:17 PM
I've had a lot of positive experiences with Buffalo Bore ammo in other calibers. They have a lot of stout loads with lead bullets and they use Starline brass. Also it's available at places like Cabela's. I'm interested in their new hardcast .380 rounds and the new "manstopper" loads with those nasty wadcutters for my .45LCs.

jimniowa
February 26, 2012, 08:15 PM
I carry a 2" Taurus .44sp loaded with 210 g Win sthp loaded to 900 fps although they will not reach that but as a SD gun I dont care because all 5 are going to the PERP and I have speed loaders. This is a back pocket/ drivers door gun.I am replacing it in the carry mode with a 3" .45 acp as a carry gun.

CheckFire
February 26, 2012, 08:32 PM
Timely and interesting topic to me, as well. I shot my Rossi 720, in .44 Spcl/3"bbl./5-shot, at the range yesterday for the first time in many years.

Just to encourage myself to shoot this one again, I had picked up some GA Arms Speer 200 gr. Bonded Unicore HP's at a gun show. Listed velocity from Ga Arms is 850fps, I have not chronographed.

#1--Anyone have an opinion on this load, in this firearm? I do know to stay away from heavy loads, in this model; primarily thinking of it as a 'woods' carry piece, but also re-considering it for in-town carry.

#2--Also read the related threads--- am thinking the Cor-Bon DPX and the BB's may be too stout for this mfg.?

Thanks for insight/ advice.

sweater914
February 26, 2012, 09:33 PM
I hate posting handloads but this one hit a nerve. My ole man developed and I chronographed a duty load for his Model 22 Smith. He took his time working up the load in small increments as every reloading manual recommends. USE AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Starline Nickle plated brass virgin, CCI #350 Magnum primer, 13.5gr AA#7, 200gr Hornady XTP. 1.465 OAL

AGAIN DO NOT USE THIS LOAD IN AN OLDER SPECIAL LENGTH CYLINDER.

Out of a 7.5in Ruger Redhawk averaged 1150fps. My dad's 4in Model 22 averaged 1050-1100fps. The virgin nickle brass adds 25fps, I used regular Starline brass and lost some speed out of my Redhawk.

I'm not done tweaking this load. I plan on swapping out the magnum primer for a Winchester WLP to see if the ES numbers will come down. The ES was around 80-90fps, at 25 yards this won't make much of a difference.

4thHorseman
February 26, 2012, 10:10 PM
Buffalo Bore is what you are looking for.

HiWayMan
February 27, 2012, 07:31 AM
I think I have some chrono data for 200gr gold dots over 8.0 of Unique at home. I'll have to check tonight. As I recall 8.0gr was pushing most 200gr bullets at around 1000fps out of a 4" barrel.

CraigC
February 27, 2012, 10:15 AM
That sounds about right.

BlackSky
February 27, 2012, 12:49 PM
I use Cor-Bon DPX XPB HPLF 200 grain, fresh out of the box. Out of my 624 with 3" barrel it's in the 905 to 920 fps range.

R.W.Dale
February 27, 2012, 12:53 PM
Thank you blacksky. This is the kind of info I'm looking for.

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Earlsbud
February 27, 2012, 01:24 PM
From Speer: We have a 200 grain 44 Special load whose bullet was designed expressly for 44 Special velocities. It expands at velocities as low as 780 ft/sec in our tests.
I'd like to see what your same lot of ammo would do out of a 4" tube just out of curiosity.

The Buffalo Bore looks like a great choice as long as you can deal with the recoil on follow up shots.

R.W.Dale
February 27, 2012, 01:41 PM
From Speer: We have a 200 grain 44 Special load whose bullet was designed expressly for 44 Special velocities. It expands at velocities as low as 780 ft/sec in our tests.
I'd like to see what your same lot of ammo would do out of a 4" tube just out of curiosity.

The Buffalo Bore looks like a great choice as long as you can deal with the recoil on follow up shots.

Id be surprised if the ammunition I chronied reached the advertised 875 fps in a 7.5" blackhawk. Of course 680 fps being well well under sowers 780 fps expansion window.

My ammo is a slightly older lot in the old style box. I wonder if that has any bearing in this matter?

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Hammerdown77
February 27, 2012, 02:52 PM
I think I would be calling Speer and discussing the results with them. They might be able to tell you whether your results seem reasonable for that particular load, whether they are abnormal and you have a bad lot of ammo (at which point you would hope they'd send you a replacement), and/or whether they have recommendations on what might be a better performing round for your particular launch platform.

Earlsbud
February 27, 2012, 03:30 PM
My ammo is a slightly older lot in the old style box. I wonder if that has any bearing in this matter?

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My first thought was no, but that would be dependent on how it was stored. Humidity etc..
The 190 grain Buf Bores will replace the ammo in my 624. This is a scaled up variation of my favorite .38Spl. load, the Rem 158Gr SWCHP +P

Haxby
February 27, 2012, 05:12 PM
Quite a while ago I chrono'd some Remington 246 gr and some Federal 200 lhp 44 special ammo. Don't remember the numbers, but they were wimpy.
7.5 gr Unique and a 240 gr cast swc in a special case gives me 1050 fps from a 6" 44 mag. Might be a little warm in a 44 Special revolver, might be good with a 215 gr lswc.

DC Plumber
February 27, 2012, 05:50 PM
Handload Caution:

My load for my Smith and Wesson 24-3 which is an N Frame with a 3" barrel is a 240g JHP XTP over 17g of 2400. I have chrono'd it at an average of 950 fps. It was a load in a gun mag when the new Ruger Blackhawk 44 specials first came out.

I would never shoot it in my 696 L Frame, but in the N Frame, it's a nice round.

joed
February 27, 2012, 05:57 PM
8.0gr Unique under that Gold Dot will do the trick.
Yep, you need this one in that pistol. Guarantee it will make enough power for you.

joed
February 27, 2012, 05:58 PM
Handload Caution:

My load for my Smith and Wesson 24-3 which is an N Frame with a 3" barrel is a 240g JHP XTP over 17g of 2400. I have chrono'd it at an average of 950 fps. It was a load in a gun mag when the new Ruger Blackhawk 44 specials first came out.

I would never shoot it in my 696 L Frame, but in the N Frame, it's a nice round.
Geez, that's a bit stiff. I have never gone over 16.0 gr and my favorite is 15.0 gr with a 250 gr LSWC.

CraigC
February 28, 2012, 09:56 AM
7.5 gr Unique and a 240 gr cast swc in a special case gives me 1050 fps from a 6" 44 mag. Might be a little warm in a 44 Special revolver, might be good with a 215 gr lswc.
No, that's a good load. The classic "Skeeter" load is a 250gr Keith bullet over 7.5gr Unique for 950fps. Your sixgun is running them pretty fast. :)

Hamilton Felix
February 28, 2012, 02:37 PM
Back when I handloaded for my 3" Charter Arms Bulldog, I put a 240 grain SWC over 7.2 gr. Unique. Didn't want to go hotter in that tiny gun. I figured I wasn't going to get velocities that would expand (mid 1970's) hollowpoints, so I'd just throw a big square shouldered SWC.

I wore that gun out, swapped it off, bought a 2" Bulldog in the 1980's, and carried the same load while backpacking. The Charters are "carry much, shoot seldom" guns, but it was hard to beat a .44 Special in a 19 ounce package for carrying. My last one evaporated in my 2008-2010 divorce. Maybe I'll get another and try stainless.

Personally, I'd probabably stick with heavy square shouldered bullets. I just don't have confidence in reliable expansion from very short barrels.

Frank V
February 28, 2012, 05:57 PM
I think Buffalo Bore is marketing a 200gr full wadcutter for defense in the .44 Special now. It should be a great carry load.
Frank

R.W.Dale
February 28, 2012, 06:38 PM
I think Buffalo Bore is marketing a 200gr full wadcutter for defense in the .44 Special now. It should be a great carry load.
Frank

I'm giving this loading a very hard look. http://www.buffalobore.com/index.php?l=product_detail&p=282

IMO it looks to be exactly what I'm looking for. Adequate velocity without being excessive and a proven bullet that doesn't rely on shakey expansion from a snub

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