Hunting with Non-Traditional Firearms


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CountryUgly
March 2, 2012, 10:22 PM
My wife likes to deer hunt but she doesn't like recoil, heights, getting "scope eye", working a bolt or lever, taking a shot at anything over 100yrds, and/or being limited to a single shot. I love a good challenge and this was my solution. First I set up a ground blind on a 1/2 acre green field in a densely wooded area, this solved the shooting distance and heights issue. Now to resolve the gun issue. I bought a WASR 10/63 and ditched the wood furniture, iron sights, 30 round mag and barrel nut. I replaced all that with a 6 positon stock, quad rail w/ forward grip handle, a Simmons pistol scope w/ 14in eye relief on the q-rail, picked up a 5rd mag and capped the barrel off with a muzzle brake. Thankfully she loves the gun and her green field setup. The draw back is we keep catching grief for not hunting "traditionally" and it seems some people think deer hunting with an AK47 is taboo. I don't get it, she's legal the gun is accurate (generally less than 2in at 100yrds) she uses quality ammo not mil-surp and she thins out the doe population. I respect most everyone's opinion on here and would like to know do you all think this is people just being childish or did we really over step some boundry we didn't know about.

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Orkan
March 2, 2012, 10:54 PM
If they think what you guys did is taboo... they'd really hate me. ;)

http://www.gregd.net/pics/deer_hunting/IMG_1047.JPG

Hunt for yourselves countryugly. Don't concern yourself with placating others. There will always be someone that thinks you are doing it wrong. Don't sweat it. Enjoy your time under God's creation and savor every second in the field with your family.

NOLAEMT
March 2, 2012, 11:27 PM
I would tell them to go pound sand.

I can't stand people who think that if you don't do something the way they do it, you are doing it wrong. As long as you hunt humanely it doesn't matter what you are shooting, be it a wood stocked model 70, or a SBR 300 blackout with suppressor. The deer die just as quickly and humanly.

Art Eatman
March 3, 2012, 08:59 AM
I guess an appropriate response might be, "So? We're eating deer meat. Can't do that if you're not doing it right."

Sounds like you know some folks who, if the IQ gets up to 50, oughta sell.

Mamertine
March 3, 2012, 10:03 AM
The WASR isn't what I traditionally think of as a deer rifle, but I don't see why anyone would have a problem with it. Many people start out hunting with mil surplus. I don't really see how this is different.

a-sheepdog
March 3, 2012, 10:43 AM
I would not be concerned with the opinions of others. As long as the rifle is accurate enough to make an ethical shot, I would say use what works for her provided its not against state law. I am glad to hear that she is a fellow hunter, congrats to her on her shooting skills and doe count.

CountryUgly
March 3, 2012, 05:24 PM
You have shown me something new(the gun not the deer) what is it and where do I get one. That is just too cool.

lizziedog1
March 3, 2012, 05:44 PM
Just remember, most of the guns that we use today started as military firearms. A bolt action is as military as any EBR.

The liberal love folks making those comments. It helps them with divide and conquer strategies.

Skyshot
March 3, 2012, 05:50 PM
It doesn't matter to the deer!

Orkan
March 3, 2012, 08:35 PM
You have shown me something new(the gun not the deer) what is it and where do I get one. That is just too cool.
It's a DTA SRS. (desert tactical arms - stealth recon scout)

Best precision rifle platform going if you ask me. I can swap calibers and retain zero within 1/2MOA or better in about a minute. Bullpup switch caliber bolt action. It's quite good.

They have a stocking dealer network, or you can get one directly from DTA. Tell them I sent you. I'll be wrapping up a full review of that rifle in the next couple months. I've got several thousand rounds through it in 308, with about a thousand of 338LM.

jmr40
March 3, 2012, 08:49 PM
Hunting is something we do for fun. As long as someone enjoys using a particular tool to kill their quarry I have no problem with them hunting with most anything. They can use a spear as long as they know how to use it and understand any shortcomings that tool may have as far as I'm concerned.

MCgunner
March 3, 2012, 09:06 PM
I prefer a minie ball over about 90 grains equivalent of Pyrodex, myself. I'm not into tacticool. I prefer retro of late, my bolt guns and hunting handguns having been collecting dust. I do, however, have a scoped inline along with my two Hawken replicas. A 385 grain .50 caliber Minie ain't broke. It works fantastic on deer. I've about shunned all my modern rifles at this point for the BP thing. It's just more fun. I'll know I've gone loopy when I start wingshooting with a front loading shotgun. Ain't got there, yet, but do like my SxSs.

Everyone has their thing. I have retroed, others go with ARs and such. It's all cool so long as you enjoy it. Even though it interferes with dove season, I see bow hunting in my future. :D

Orkan
March 3, 2012, 10:35 PM
Even though it interferes with dove season, I see bow hunting in my future. :D Don't do it. You'll be more broke and no other kind of hunting will ever be as satisfying ever again. ;)

Doe about to have her heart shut down - 2011
http://www.gregd.net/pics/bowhunting/doe1---2011.jpg

145" - 2010
http://www.gregd.net/pics/deer_hunting/archery/IMG_4657.JPG

Cull buck - 2011
http://www.gregd.net/pics/deer_hunting/archery/2011/IMG_1161.JPG

Nice big doe shot on video, with some forensic's at the end.
http://youtu.be/nlT_m015gv4

How about 2 doe out of the same tree, on the same morning?
http://youtu.be/DiUJ-zB2cxc

plumberroy
March 4, 2012, 09:01 AM
If it is legal , has enough power to make humane kills and you stay with in it's working range go for it . I have a lot more problem with some jack wad with an uber-mag shooting half a box of shell at 100 yards on a bench off a lead sled 2 days before opening day then trying to take a 500 yard shot
I hunted small game for a while with a smooth bore 9 mm muzzle loader musket I could reliably kill at 14 steps with shot and reliably hit at 22 steps with #00 buck patched with craft felt. out side those ranges I passed the shot. It took at least 75 shots at targets to come up with usable ranges
Roy

Patriot1/3
March 4, 2012, 03:55 PM
Time changes and so do some people. Tellm to mind their own business. Grand daddies shotgun is outdated and an ethical hunter will adapt to his or her specfic needs. People that condem are the ones that are ignorant to the fact,technology has been moving steadly forward and I choose to move with it. My arsonal includes heirlooms but,what I choose to hunt with is NO ONES business.

MCgunner
March 4, 2012, 05:52 PM
Quote:
Originally Posted by MCgunner
Even though it interferes with dove season, I see bow hunting in my future.




Don't do it. You'll be more broke and no other kind of hunting will ever be as satisfying ever again.

Well, I have bows, love to shoot 'em. I'm not real great, but good enough to make perhaps a 35 yard shot with my compound, MAYBE 40 in good light. My eye dominance problem hurts me as I shoot lefty, but can't do that with a bow. But, I ebayed a bow some time back for cheap, an older 60 lb Hoyt compound, and found I could do it. :D Problem is, it's dove season and I prefer wing shooting. Also, it's 100+ degrees out, 70 percent humidity is typical, and the skeeters are usually thick enough that you choke on 'em unless you breath through a bandana. I don't really enjoy being inactive in nature with those conditions. :D A bow hunt in 1974 down at Aransas NWR was about as miserable as I've ever been in the field. I can dress for cold, but I needed a mosquito net and they didn't have thermocells back then. I walked out of there 8 lbs lighter from all the blood I'd lost.

We're planning a move and I'm trying to sell my coastal land and buy some hill country (way fewer mosquitos) land. There's WMAs up there that are bow only, too. I can see that I might just get into it soon as I'm off the mosquito bitten coast. At least when you're dove hunting, you can slap yourself. :D

Orkan
March 4, 2012, 08:37 PM
I hear that.

Up here in SD we've got some mosquito's the size of sparrows. They really tiresome.

T Bran
March 4, 2012, 09:00 PM
If they dislike her hunting gear they are really gonna hate mine. Spent all afternoon making arrow/spears to shoot out of my potato cannon. Still working up an accuracy load. Cant wait to get in my ground blind and spear me a hog. Feel free to send them a copy of this so they know how good they really have it.
Be proud to have her as a hunting buddy and good on you for finding something she's happy with. My wife is my fishing buddy and I taylor both the trips and the gear for her enjoyment. If someone doesnt like the way we do things they are most welcome to swim home.
T

svtruth
March 6, 2012, 02:34 PM
7.62x39 comparable to the 30-30?

Orkan
March 6, 2012, 03:52 PM
Pretty close.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
March 6, 2012, 05:01 PM
7.62x39 comparable to the 30-30?

Ballistics make them darn near twins.

CSestp
March 6, 2012, 08:49 PM
If they have anything other than a spear in their hands while covered in mud giving you guff, I'd tell them to f off.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk

kayak-man
March 10, 2012, 08:38 PM
CountryUgly,

The only problem that I have with your new hunting rifle is that you didn't post pictures of it. :evil:

Chris "The Kayak-Man" Johnson

SimplyChad
March 11, 2012, 02:27 PM
Quote:
7.62x39 comparable to the 30-30?

Ballistics make them darn near twins.


Only when comparing a 123 gr projectile to a 170 gr.

Art Eatman
March 11, 2012, 03:41 PM
SimplyChad, as near as I can tell from reading several hundred posts for over a dozen years, now, they are about equal for effectiveness out to around 150 yards.

Magwa45
March 14, 2012, 04:27 PM
I think the 30-30 has the edge over the 7.62x39 mainly because you can throw 170-180 grain bullets down range with it.

That is quite a fancy bolt gun for 2 or 3 thousand bucks. Not sure I would go there when a featherweight or 700 could do the same trick. To each his own.

As far as archery goes, never try shooting a longbow. You will throw the compound on the trash heap in no time!:-)

Orkan
March 14, 2012, 04:45 PM
As far as archery goes, never try shooting a longbow. You will throw the compound on the trash heap in no time!:-) I've been bowhunting for 20 years, and I much prefer a compound. I've shot them all at one point or another.

That rifle isn't a purpose built hunting rifle. It's my main competition rifle for long range shooting. At 17lbs, its not something you want to take elk hunting. Yet it is very "non-traditional" in the spirit of this thread. However, unlike an ultralight rifle... if it walks out between me and 800yds, its dead as disco. Obviously I could hit much further than that, but that is my limit for a 99% hit ratio on a deer-sized kill zone.

MCgunner
March 14, 2012, 05:08 PM
Only when comparing a 123 gr projectile to a 170 gr.

My fave 7.62x39 ammo is 154 grain Wolf soft point hunting ammo which is, indeed, the equal of the .30-30 out to 200 yards and is more accurate than the lighter stuff i've shot, including handloads, in my SKS. It shoots 2MOA in my rifle, haven't shot groups with it in the paratrooper. One can make a case for the .30-30 RIFLE as the handier rifle, lighter, easier to carry afield, but it's also not as rugged a rifle. Falls can damage the tube mag, for instance. One could probably run over the SKS with a tank and still shoot those 2" 100 yard groups. :D

1911 guy
March 15, 2012, 09:04 AM
At one time, anything more advanced than a wheel lock was reserved for the military. When us poor peons were still using flintlocks, the militaries of the world had advanced to percussion. Then to cartridge rifles, while the populace got used to persussion caps. Then along came the repeating rifle. The U.S. military was several versions into them when they (the rifles) began making their way across the west with covered wagons.

The next big innovation came with the M1 Garand. Same action type (gas operated) as your AK, just in a "respectable" hunting caliber, the .30-"06. Now, with several generations of American hunters having familiarity with the M16, the AR type rifles are becoming popular in hunting rifles.

In short, tell he nay-sayers to get educated about how hunting and general use civilan guns have ALWAYS followed the trends of military arms. Even shorter, tell 'em to go pound sand while your wife hunts.

My choice for a deer rifle? A bolt action .308. Anything wrong with your wife using a modified AK? Not a thing.

mbt2001
March 15, 2012, 09:08 AM
uhhh I have no problem with the setup. What exactly is "traditional" hunting BTW? You use what gets it done, what you have, what will work, what you can afford PERIOD.

I have caught grief for using pistol caliber carbines before, but usually it is from ignorant self proclaimed "gun experts". God save us from those folks.

CountryUgly
March 25, 2012, 06:28 AM
Sorry for the wait on a pic. The 30rd mag is pictured but like I said before a 5rd mag is used when hunting.

splattergun
March 25, 2012, 02:47 PM
traditional hunting has been the use of the technology of the day to take the target animal. An auto-loading plastic stocked rifle is really no different than the fire hardened sharp stick of 25,000 years ago in that regard.

R.W.Dale
March 25, 2012, 03:12 PM
I wouldn't worry about it. Times are changing and changing fast.

This past year I saw several black rifles on shoulders in the woods. I didn't see a single traditional levergun.

Last year I hunted with a 450 bushmaster. The year before a Retro ar15. Next season ill use a bullpup ak47. Not once has anyone raised an eyebrow over the equipment I used.

posted via mobile device.

okiewita40
March 25, 2012, 04:29 PM
Hey if it makes her happy and gets her in the woods. Plus puts bambi in the freezer. Then who cares what others think. Use what ya got. Hey my deer rifle is an SKS. Hopefully soon i can upgrade to an AR in 6.8SPC.

What can I say I like some off the typical path stuff.

SimplyChad
March 26, 2012, 02:33 AM
I dont doubt the x39s effectiveness on deer and such. Ive actually been thinking of possibly using my Sks as a brush gun for when Im deer hunting near houston. But to me it does have the peretration to handle bigger game. People take Elk and Moose with the 30-30 because its ballistics can handle that 170+ grain pill and get to the vitals. Its comparing a battle caliber to a hunting caliber.

Wolf 7.62x39 154 gr SP 2104 fps 1513 FTLBS
Cor-Bon 7.62 X 39 150 GR. JSP 2300FPS 1762FTLBS

Federal 30-30 170 gr sp 2200 fps 1827 ftlbs
Hornady lever 30-30 160 gr 2400 fps 2046 ftlbs


Close at heavy to moderate loads. I think im going to have to look up the reload data.

R.W.Dale
March 26, 2012, 12:50 PM
I dont doubt the x39s effectiveness on deer and such. Ive actually been thinking of possibly using my Sks as a brush gun for when Im deer hunting near houston. But to me it does have the peretration to handle bigger game. People take Elk and Moose with the 30-30 because its ballistics can handle that 170+ grain pill and get to the vitals. Its comparing a battle caliber to a hunting caliber.

Wolf 7.62x39 154 gr SP 2104 fps 1513 FTLBS
Cor-Bon 7.62 X 39 150 GR. JSP 2300FPS 1762FTLBS

Federal 30-30 170 gr sp 2200 fps 1827 ftlbs
Hornady lever 30-30 160 gr 2400 fps 2046 ftlbs


Close at heavy to moderate loads. I think im going to have to look up the reload data.

Just bear in mind that with any 30-30 comparisons the velocities given are for those mythological 30-30's with a 24" barrel. Fired over a Chronograph you'll find that especially with heavier than 150 g bullets the old "thutty thutty" is a great deal less powerful than ammunition makers leas us to believe.

This chart shows actual velocity from a win 94 with a 20" bbl compared to published velocity

http://i3.photobucket.com/albums/y96/krochus/FIRE/table30-30.jpg

posted via mobile device.

SimplyChad
March 26, 2012, 01:06 PM
Lower then advertised. Has anyone chronod a x39?

R.W.Dale
March 26, 2012, 01:14 PM
Lower then advertised. Has anyone chronod a x39?

Sure have. In my experience aside from weak kneed Remington ammo the steel cased stuff runs pretty close to advertised

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=409365

posted via mobile device.

SimplyChad
March 26, 2012, 01:35 PM
Ok R.W. you make your point. But what is the biggest game you would hunt with a x39? What about 30-30?

R.W.Dale
March 26, 2012, 01:47 PM
Ok R.W. you make your point. But what is the biggest game you would hunt with a x39? What about 30-30?

It would depend more on how accurate I am with the particular rifle. Assuming proper bullet construction no critter on four hooves will be able to tell there was a slight disparity in just a few ft lbs. I use the cartridges interchangeably as you can see from the link I'm not above even using the same bullets (170g)

posted via mobile device.

CountryUgly
March 26, 2012, 01:55 PM
Had to go check for myself.

Results: 154gr wolf sp 7.62x39 in WASR w/ 16 and lil bit of an inch barrel w/ birdcage flash hider 10 shot average 10 ft from muzzle was (pause for effect) 2100fps even

150gr Winchester SilverTip 30-30win in Win model 94 10shot avg. at 10 ft from muzzle was (another pause) a whopping 2116fps

I'm not scared to take on a deer with either one but nothing larger than that with the AK and I don't hunt bear/elk but I think a 30-30 could handle either with the right ammo.

CountryUgly
March 26, 2012, 02:03 PM
I dont doubt the x39s effectiveness on deer and such. Ive actually been thinking of possibly using my Sks as a brush gun for when Im deer hunting near houston. But to me it does have the peretration to handle bigger game. People take Elk and Moose with the 30-30 because its ballistics can handle that 170+ grain pill and get to the vitals. Its comparing a battle caliber to a hunting caliber.

Wolf 7.62x39 154 gr SP 2104 fps 1513 FTLBS
Cor-Bon 7.62 X 39 150 GR. JSP 2300FPS 1762FTLBS

Federal 30-30 170 gr sp 2200 fps 1827 ftlbs
Hornady lever 30-30 160 gr 2400 fps 2046 ftlbs


Close at heavy to moderate loads. I think im going to have to look up the reload data.
Don't be scared to use your SKS for the brush. There is quite a few people I know who have had plenty of success with the SKS deer hunting and now that I think about it, it's a few of the same people that have been harping about me fixing the MRS. up with an AK47 for the same purpose. I'll be back I got to go take care of something.:fire:

SimplyChad
March 26, 2012, 02:05 PM
I dont think there is anything in N.america that I would hesitate to hunt with a 30-30. Just ly my father and his father before him. I would likt to thank you tho R.W. now i have to start reloading for my SKS.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
March 28, 2012, 02:09 AM
I've dropped darn near everything edible on 4 hooves with the little old weak in the knees, not fit for anything larger than deer, poor pitiful, no respect .30/30. Many a Elk has fallen to mine. Few Caribou, several Mulies, uncountable white-tail and wild hog. Only reason I take a .30/06 Elk hunting is when I am going to be hunting the open lands and need something I can reach out to 300 yards with. I see too many folks that just know about what "paper" says. I know what the dropped animals tell me. Dead is dead. Book learnin is all well and fine. But people going and saying you can't kill Elk sized game with a .30/30 or a 7.62x39 need to be re-educated. The only thing they cant do as well as a .300 win mag is reach out there. But hell, getting within 200 yards of my quarry is what it's all about to me. Actually I like to get within 40 yards and let a string go :D It's HUNTING not SHOOTING. But it's hard to do in the later seasons when they have come down from the highlands to the open fields. So I take the .30/06 for a stroll and get on the belly and crawl if I gotta!

T.R.
April 7, 2012, 09:52 AM
I'm a huge fan of the modern crossbow for its amazing accurasy and powerful strike. How do you like my "camo" shirt? It works quite well for me!

TR

http://i26.photobucket.com/albums/c146/rushmoreman/PaulMarylandbuck.jpg

RhinoDefense
April 9, 2012, 11:28 AM
Yup. I gave away all my camo and just wear a Cabela's insulated plaid buttoned shirt, jeans, and an orange hat.

Last few years I've done most of my hunting with an AR15.

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