Gun shop problem


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351 WINCHESTER
March 30, 2012, 04:39 PM
I just got back from Shooters in Jax. where I went to purchase an LC9. I asked the salesman how many mags. the pistol came with and he told me 2. I bought the pistol and I checked the box at the checkout counter and there was only 1 mag. in the box. I asked the guy where the other mag. was and he checked and told me he had made an error. I said, "no problem", just give me another mag. and we can call it even. The "manager" came up and told me he could not give me a mag. and offered to knock off $5. from the price of the second mag. I told him if he would not give me the second mag. I wanted a refund which I got, but they kept the $5. call in fee. Granted the salesman made an honest mistake, but rules are rules. They should have given me the second mag. just to keep up their end of the contract, but instead let me walk after wasting my time.

I will never darken their doors again.

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royal barnes
March 30, 2012, 04:50 PM
I'm sorry. I wouldn't have given you a free mag either.

Ryanxia
March 30, 2012, 04:53 PM
So that extra magazine was the tipping point for whether or not to buy the gun?
I would have asked for $10 off but worst case took the $5 off.

youngda9
March 30, 2012, 05:05 PM
Salesman made an honest mistake. Nothing to get upset about.

nofishbob
March 30, 2012, 05:09 PM
I'm sorry. I wouldn't have given you a free mag either.

The way I see it, the mag was not "free"- it was part of the package of items that the salesman described as being included to the customer for the price the customer agreed to pay.

There are three ethical options for this in my opinion:

1. Stand behind what the salesman promised and include two mags.
2. Discount the gun the full price of an extra mag (they might not have a mag in stock).
3. Void the sale.

The salesman promised a specific group of items in exchange for a specific number of dollars. How can you accept getting less for your money?

They missed a teaching opportunity for their salesman where he could learn the consequences of making these kind of errors.

Bob

browningguy
March 30, 2012, 05:15 PM
The salesman made a mistake, how hard is that to understand. There is nothing unethical about it.

Tipro
March 30, 2012, 05:25 PM
I agree with the OP. At the time he and the salesperson reached an agreement of sale, that magazine was part of the deal. the salesperson assured the op that the stated price included that second magazine, and it is irrelevant what the salesman thought . A real mistake would be if he stated the price for a lc9 and the op thought that was the price for a les baer 1911 he had moved too. Their was no mutual mistake about what was being bargained for. The terms as discussed by the parties included the mag, and the salesperson and store owner broke the contract when they didn't give you that mag. Thats evidenced by the fact that you were free to walk away once they idscovered their error

They should have thrown in the mag and been more careful about what they tell customers.

mdauben
March 30, 2012, 05:29 PM
I have to agree with nofishbob. :cool:

Yes the salesman made what was probably an honest mistake, but the manager should have stood behind what his salesman promised the customer. I have had similar situations myself (not at the gun shop) and I either held them to the price I was quoted, or I walked. If you want to accept the price switch at the register, that's find, but IMO the OP was fully justifed in walking out the door.

351 WINCHESTER
March 30, 2012, 05:29 PM
Amen. Fair is fair and right is right.

Cosmoline
March 30, 2012, 05:30 PM
In some respects the purchase of a firearm is akin to any other POS consumer purchase, where the salesman is mere functionary not authorized to negotiate terms. The goods are what they are. Price and packaging are set by others not present. The clerk just takes the money and offers basic customer assistance.

Firearms are a bit different, though, and at small gun shops the salesman often does negotiate such things as ammo or mags to go with a sale.

Is "Shooters" the sort of chain where you would expect the guy at the counter to be able to haggle in this manner? Or is it more like a Wal-Mart where nobody expects the clerk to be able to give you extra candy bars?

CountryUgly
March 30, 2012, 05:35 PM
My LC9 came with 2 mags NIB from my LGS. Maybe this guy was pilfering the extra mag and trying to get away with the ole I'll sell you an extra mag at a discounted price routine, unfortunatly I've seen it done before.

bannockburn
March 30, 2012, 05:37 PM
Nothing really unethical going on; just a simple mistake on the part of the salesman. And unless there was something written down saying you were getting two mags with the gun there really wasn't any contract in force here. Not sure what kind of rules were broken either unless it's the one where supposedly the customer is always right. I guess management figured your continued business wasn't worth the cost of an extra mag. Live and learn.

ColtPythonElite
March 30, 2012, 05:37 PM
The salesman made a mistake, how hard is that to understand. There is nothing unethical about it.
That's how I see it, too.

Telekinesis
March 30, 2012, 05:38 PM
Granted the salesman made an honest mistake, but rules are rules. They should have given me the second mag. just to keep up their end of the contract

I hate to be the one say this, but you did not have a legally enforceable contract.

I asked the salesman how many mags. the pistol came with and he told me 2. I bought the pistol and I checked the box at the checkout counter and there was only 1 mag.
If this is what happened, there was no invitation to negotiate (and no negotiation). You asked a question of fact and he replied with a fact (even though later to proven false). You did not say "I will buy it if the gun comes with two mags".

But the real issue is that the "contract" was made under a mutually mistaken understanding of fact (that there were 2 mags included with the pistol). In this case, the contract is voidable by the adversely affected party given that the mistake had a material affect on the exchange.

(I am open to anyone with a law degree correcting me on this, though these statements are almost direct quotes from the law textbook sitting on my desk...)


Now, in my opinion they should have given you the second mag or maybe a 50% discount on the mag because of the mistake, but there was no contractual law or rule broken.

Bubba613
March 30, 2012, 05:46 PM
I think the gun comes with 1 mag, not two. That is certainly the case with the LCP. That said, the salesman made a mistake. Happens. The manager tried to give you some compensation for the trouble. Sounds above board to me. You dont want to shop there anymore, don't go.

Varob
March 30, 2012, 06:19 PM
I would have expected them to keep the $5 fee for the background check.

Most of the LGS's I deal with just factor that into the price, so you don't feel like you're being nickeled and dime'd at checkout. But, I know its factored in.

chevyman097
March 30, 2012, 06:32 PM
Lesson learned.

Always check the product AND contents of package before paying.

AlexanderA
March 30, 2012, 07:47 PM
I'm assuming this was a new gun. The number of magazines included should have been specified in the manufacturer's catalog or spec sheet. The OP's "contract" was to buy the gun, as per the manufacturer's written specifications. The salesman's oral representations, made in good faith but mistaken as to the facts, do not override the written specifications. Since there was a material misapprehension, the OP's recourse was to void the contract; he could not compel the seller to honor what he thought was the contract. As to the fee for the NCIS check, that's generally understood to be nonrefundable.

HankB
March 30, 2012, 07:53 PM
The gun shop represented the merchandise falsely - it may have been an honest error, but it was THEIR error, and influenced you to purchase the firearm.

You WERE due the refund for the pistol.

And a $5 call-in fee? If this was a regular NICS check, this is just another profit center for the store; since it was a charge accrued as a direct result of their misrepresentation - honest or otherwise - of the merchandise, they should have refunded that, too. (I'm not aware of any local gun shops charging a NICS fee, but then with a TX CHL they don't have to do a NICS check on me anyway.)

Always a good idea to check the product pack-out before paying.

(Did you pay cash or by credit card? If I got a $5 charge on my Visa/MC/Discover/Whatever, I'd consider contesting it.)

Tomcat47
March 30, 2012, 08:13 PM
Hmmm....:scrutiny:

If salesman said two at bargain table (counter ) manager / owner should give 2 at price quoted!

Yes Simple mistake/ But even Simpler Solution...value the customer as to what your salesperson offered. If there was not enough profit margin to consume a magazine and make (keep) the customer happy, he needs to go sell something else.

Firearms are generally a 10-12% profit margin with anybody....(minimum)

$300.00 firearm = $36.00 @ 12% So he takes a $10 hit on firearm sell and sells two boxes of ammo that net him about 25% profit each and sells a holster, and gun oil, and ear muffs...etc. etc.

I would have said well it really does not come with 2 mags, but since salesman said it did...ok! Can I get you some ammo....or some targets? got a special on those!

Its just simple to give the customer what was offered....my .02?

jcwit
March 30, 2012, 08:14 PM
Only thing I can add is the shop must be working on a heck of a tight margin to lose a sale over nothing more than a mag and also losing a customer for life.

Strange!

Tomcat, you beat me to it.

The Lone Haranguer
March 30, 2012, 08:27 PM
It depends on whether the gun was shipped with two magazines. (There seems to be conflicting information here, with one poster saying he got two, another, one. I had always read it was one. Perhaps Ruger changed their policy or something.) If it was supposed to have two, and the shop pocketed one and tried to resell it, this is unethical - in fact, it is theft. If it only comes with one and the salesman said he would "throw in" another magazine but a supervisor overruled him due to its being a mistake, they are not legally obligated to give you the second mag.

WRT keeping the background check fee, they do this here if they have already run the check, and the fee is $10. (TN uses TBI for background checks, not NICS, but it is still instant.)

Claude Clay
March 30, 2012, 08:45 PM
tight is right.....some new guns as low as 5-8%


so a $30 mag breaks the sale for them if, if the 2nd mag is not included. i do much with 3 local stores and 1 of them would offer it up a used one, another would offer to split it with me and , one would say 'so sorrie charie'. i have no problem with any of them.

Tomcat47
March 30, 2012, 08:46 PM
I was fishing around concerning the LC9.....they have a kit above the (assumed) box set that comes with a Gun rug, Holster, and Extra Magazine

Cabela's List it from $389.99 - $549.99 with a range of 4 models incl. 2 with lasers (more pricey!)

The boxed Gun at $389.99...The Kit at $429.99...A $40 difference for the Holster, Rug, and 2nd Magazine!

http://www.cabelas.com/product/Ruger-LC9-9mm-Pistol/1182399.uts?Ntk=AllProducts&searchPath=%2Fcatalog%2Fsearch.cmd%3Fform_state%3DsearchForm%26N%3D0%26fsch%3Dtrue%26Ntk%3DAllProducts%26Ntt%3DLC9%26x%3D0%26y%3D0%26WTz_l%3DHeader%253BSearch-All%2BProducts&Ntt=LC9&WTz_l=Header%3BSearch-All+Products

But while he is not legally obligated ...... It was not a customer error...it was employee error....If I were shop owner I would suck it up, and tell my employee to be more careful!

gp911
March 30, 2012, 08:50 PM
Ever notice when a salesman says it comes with one mag & the customer gets two you never hear the customer giving one mag back to the store because of an alleged contract? The salesman made a mistake and the shop missed the opportunity to give a little in order to win over a repeat customer. If this is the worst thing that happened that day it was still a pretty good day.

blarby
March 30, 2012, 09:02 PM
Per Ruger, comes with one mag.

True, but at this point, sad and irrelevant.

Purchase was negotiated, considered, and accepted based on the representation of two mags in the deal.

But while he is not legally obligated ...... It was not a customer error...it was employee error....If I were shop owner I would suck it up, and tell my employee to be more careful!

I would have made the sale, included the mag, and docked the commission on the sale.

Before everyone gets all cranky....commission sales in most states are calc'd on gross...which isn't determined till the sale is final. I wouldn't be docking the employee for ignorance, I would be adjusting the gross commission earned off the deal to reflect the ACTUAL sale value..... and thats perfectly legal.

That mag just came "off the top" so to speak.

For instance, in one of my last car deals.... I had to chip in some floormats that weren't included on the factory list. My error. It came off the back end of the deal.

Granted, this isn't a high markup item....but walking someone over salesman error is horrible.... taking your $5 is almost criminal at that point.

slowr1der
March 30, 2012, 09:04 PM
I too see they are in the wrong, but unfortunately 90% of the gun shops I've dealt with would do this same type of thing. I've never seen such horrible in any other industry (although I'm sure somewhere there is worse) service as I have when dealing with gun shops.

In my job, had I told a customer it comes with something it didn't, I'd either be giving him the extra part free of charge, offer a significant discount off of the item if we didn't have that part, or offer a full refund with us eating the costs of any fee's that were associated with the purchase. Yes, I believe he probably made a mistake, but they should be responsible for eating the cost of that mistake. Had you made a mistake, and only given him part of the money you agreed on do you think he would have been okay with that? Heck no. He basically pulled a bait and switch on you.

I'd also be tempted to contest the $5 fee if I payed via credit card. Them not refunding that is 100% in the wrong imo.

Apple a Day
March 30, 2012, 09:11 PM
A man's word is his bond and a business lives or dies by the way they treat their customers especially in the age of the Internet. I'd never go back there.

john wall
March 30, 2012, 09:56 PM
What Apple said. If the shop will not honor their word, do not honor them with your money.

I have eaten numerous mistakes. It is called ETHICS. Some folks don't have any.

Too many dealers will lose a regular customer over their unwillingness to honor their word.

TennJed
March 30, 2012, 10:47 PM
Ever notice when a salesman says it comes with one mag & the customer gets two you never hear the customer giving one mag back to the store because of an alleged contract? The salesman made a mistake and the shop missed the opportunity to give a little in order to win over a repeat customer. If this is the worst thing that happened that day it was still a pretty good day.

Well said.

How many here can honestly say they would give it back had the situation been reversed?

Fremmer
March 30, 2012, 10:57 PM
The sales guy made a mistake. You exercised your right to walk. Still ended up with nothing, though.

blarby
March 30, 2012, 11:06 PM
Ever notice when a salesman says it comes with one mag & the customer gets two you never hear the customer giving one mag back to the store because of an alleged contract?

Nope, never heard of that one.

Cuz I doubt its ever happened. Guncases get opened immediately upon receipt. Anything missing is noted. Occasionally, what should be there is "misfiled". I've yet to hear of any "extras".... but any FFL that deals in new weapons can feel free to correct me.

What does happen frequently, however...is the "it only comes with one mag" trick....where they resell you the 2nd mag that came with it.

tomrkba
March 30, 2012, 11:09 PM
1) Look inside the box
2) Note number of magazines present in the box and on the counter
3) Review contents of box.

Guns are sold "as-is". You need to inspect everything prior to purchase and it is up to you to do it.

mnrivrat
March 30, 2012, 11:12 PM
The salesman's oral representations, made in good faith but mistaken as to the facts, do not override the written specifications.

From my perspective when I make a sale it is up to me to deliver what I sold. In other words, the OP would have gotten the second magazine had it been me . If I am not a man of my word ,then I am not much of a man. (JMO)

At the least, the shop should not have charged the $5 fee. The transaction was voided due to the sellers fault, not the buyer.

friscolatchi
March 30, 2012, 11:12 PM
Hi, just my 2˘ from NY. You would have paid for the gun, went with the receipt to your Sheriff`s pistol licensing dept, got the pistol on the permit, got your `green card`, went back to the dealer, paid for the gun, opened the case, noted one mag, thought about the half tank of gas just burned, inquired about the missing mag, got po`d then went home with the gun. Not to bash NY.

WALKERs210
March 30, 2012, 11:28 PM
Guess I am lucky with Gun Shop I go to. Owner and now the manager will give me a very low price without even asking, also several time they turn around grab a box or two of shells and once even thru in a very nice holster. Yes I spend a lot of money but they do just about the same with others. Salesman and manager should have honored the deal that was put forward in name of good relations

coalman
March 31, 2012, 12:03 AM
I get tired of all this "written contract" talk. The purchase was made based on receiving two mags. Verbal should have been good enough, and once was. An employee is your business reputation. The shop made a mistake the customer paid $5 for, in addition to frustration that will cause him to take business elsewhere. The $5 basically adds insult to injury and the $5 really becomes the issue for me. I would not shop there on principle, but principle matter less now for many, as do "verbal contracts". I guess I'm too old school.

gp911
March 31, 2012, 12:18 AM
Nope, never heard of that one.

Cuz I doubt its ever happened. Guncases get opened immediately upon receipt. Anything missing is noted. Occasionally, what should be there is "misfiled". I've yet to hear of any "extras".... but any FFL that deals in new weapons can feel free to correct me.

It happened to me in 2005. I bought an AR15 that was supposed to come with 1 magazine per the salesman. It had 2 mags when he opened the box and he said "I guess it comes with two mags!" That was the end of it. I don't think it was an extra, I figure the salesman made an error thinking they only came with 1 mag. I doubt anyone in my position at the time would say "no way, mister gun shop employee, I was expecting one mag, you keep this other one lest my honor be besmirched". Now I'm not saying the position of customer vs business owner is equal, the business should be the one doing the grunt work, going the extra mile, and trying to please the customer. I just bristle sometimes when people act as though failing to correct a salesperson's mistaken commentary financially is borderline criminal. On the other hand...

What does happen frequently, however...is the "it only comes with one mag" trick....where they resell you the 2nd mag that came with it.

I've seen that too, same LGS! I bought an AK from the same place in 2006 that I knew came from SOG with 2 mags and they sold it to me with one and they were selling the extra mags a little cheaper than anybody else was (rare Yugo bolt-hold-open mags). Thing is, they were selling the gun 50 bucks cheaper than any other place (50 dollar markup vs 100 everywhere else) and selling the mags for $25. Business is business, it ain't charity work. Ultimately it was the best deal going in my area and an FFL transfer fee would have killed any benefit of buying from somewhere farther away. Do I feel ripped off? Not really, knowing their profit margin doesn't mean I deserve to get my stuff at cost. I shop around and do my homework. If things start looking shady I'll go elsewhere, but people can run their business however they want.

ms6852
March 31, 2012, 12:56 AM
This is something that is probably taught at Harvard law, and depending who the lawyers are, it could go either way. But under good business practice the verbal contract was struck and the sale was made on the information provided from a salesman...who in this case is an agent of the gun store and is therefore ethically obliged to follow through.

Both parties lost on this transaction, the consumer lost $5 and walked away with nothing when he chose the refund but got charged for the call. The local gun store also lost in that had the owner or manager had chosen to honor verbal agreement made by consumer and the agent of the store though giving away a new magazine might have cut into the profit of the sale. They lost potential revenues they could have received from future purchases this client could have provided because he felt that this gun store stood behind their word and made things right in the "EYE OF THE CUSTOMER''.

But in all honesty I do not really know, but I did sleep at a Holiday Inn.

Telekinesis
March 31, 2012, 01:01 AM
I get tired of all this "written contract" talk. The purchase was made based on receiving two mags. Verbal should have been good enough, and once was [...] but principle matter less now for many, as do "verbal contracts"

Coalman, verbal contracts still bind both parties legally (even though they are a bit harder to use in court). The problem is that verbal and written contracts must both follow the same contract law. A voidable contract will be voidable weather it is verbal or written. The form doesn't matter (in this case), it is the content of the contract that determines if it is legally enforceable.

Yes, the contract to purchase was made based on the fact that there were 2 mags included in purchasing the gun. The contract was then voided because it was found to have been made under a mutual mistake of fact: instead of the gun coming with two mags as both parties believed, it only came with one.

This does not change my opinion that the gun store should have added in an extra mag anyway because of their mistake; but it in no way was the gun store bound by a contract, verbal or otherwise, to do so.


Edit:
This is something that is probably taught at Harvard law, and depending who the lawyers are, it could go either way. But under good business practice the verbal contract was struck and the sale was made on the information provided from a salesman...who in this case is an agent of the gun store and is therefore ethically obliged to follow through.

Hell this kinda thing is taught to people who aren't even graduate students. It is simple contract law governed by the Uniform Commercial Code. Under good business practice, the gun store should be ethically obligated to follow through with the 2 mag deal. Under contract law, there is no such obligation as there was no legally enforceable contract once both parties were aware that it was made under a mutual mistake of fact.

Granted, a part of what is leading to my opinion that there was no contract created is the OP's own statements about the conversation about the number of mags. Saying "how many mags does it come with?" and getting an answer "it comes with two" is not negotiation, it is a factual mistake. If that conversation happened differently, it could have very well been negotiation possibly making the contract valid. But with just the information given, the contract was voidable once both parties realized the mistake, and was voided once the OP received his refund.

bannockburn
March 31, 2012, 06:21 AM
Years ago I bought a new gun and it only came with one mag. Asked the salesman about it and he said they all come in with only one mag. Take the gun home and while reading through the manual, I find that the manufacturer specified that the gun comes with two mags. I call the U.S. distributor who was importing the guns at the time and they gave me another dealer to contact to get my extra mag. A couple of weeks later I got my extra mag.

So maybe next time, instead of relying on what the salesman says, check with the manufacturer (website or phone call), and see how many mags they actually say should come with their guns.

TennJed
March 31, 2012, 09:49 AM
Good idea IMHO

BSA1
March 31, 2012, 10:15 AM
This isn't going to sit well with this crowd.

Much ado is being made about the ethics of the gun shop manager over what seems to be a honest mistake by the salesperson but what about the ethics of a buyer that expects something for nothing when he knows the clerk made a honest mistake and the item is NOT included as part of the package by the manufacturer?

My Christain values and sense of fair play that most Americans have do not allow me to intentally take advantage of anothers persons honest mistake unless they offer to stand by it.

Earlier this week I was in LGS and I noticed that they had some ammunition underpriced by $12.00 a box. I took a box to the clerk and ask her if the price was correct which of course it wasn't. After she saw the incorrect price on the shelf she said I could have the ammo at the cheaper price. I told her I was not upset or trying to get something over on them and it was strictly up to them what price they wanted to sell me the ammo. Well I got the ammo at the cheaper price!

I know. It is pretty naive, croney and downright country bumpkin of me not to try to weasle every penny out of a deal.

As for the $5.00 I would expected the dealer to refund it. BUT what does $5.00 really mean these days; a gallon of gas and a few drops left over, coffee at Starbucks???

As for me in this deal I wouldn't make a issue of it. I would continue to visit the store and the next time a gun came up that I wanted to purchase I would use the $5.00 I already paid to haggle the price down some more.

p.s. Only the Lord knows how mistakes I have made.

Agsalaska
March 31, 2012, 11:55 AM
That's kind of funny and one of the many problems I have with gun shops. You bought it thinking there were two mags because that's what the guy told you. Doesn't matter what a web site or manual says. What matters is what you are told.

So let's see here. The gun shop can take two different approaches to this misunderstanding. A long term approach or a short term approach. Long term-give the guy an extra magazine, try to sell him some ammo, talk about some new lines that are coming in, thank him for his business, and invite him back in soon. Or, get caught up in margin concerns, ignore what they promised, hold the line, and probably lose a customer forever who will no doubt tell everyone he knows. That would be the short term approach. All professional sales people and most successful businesses understand the difference.

They chose the short term.:banghead: And for everyone that agrees with that, please don't complain or ponder why people are moving towards online shopping.

Salmoneye
March 31, 2012, 12:36 PM
Quite often I will see a posted price on a shelf for anything from toothpaste to ammo...When you get to the register it rings up as a higher price...I simply inform the clerk that the shelf says something different, and 9 times out of ten they simply change the price, and on the other one occasion they send someone to check...

In either event, they honor the posted price...

Same situation here...

Honor your price for the goods described, or cheerfully give the man his money back...

ADDING:

And apologize...

Fremmer
March 31, 2012, 12:41 PM
And that's what happened I think. Aka a release, lol. And the ucc probably doesn't apply to a consumer transaction like this. And all of the legal stuff is meaningless, I hope the op gets a gun somewhere else and has fun with it.

Heck to think about it the transaction never was consumated because the op refused to take possession and they mutually agreed to terminate the transaction. But still utterly irrelevant. I need to mow the lawn.

Black Butte
March 31, 2012, 12:55 PM
If you want cheap, get a Hi Point.

crracer_712
March 31, 2012, 07:02 PM
It kinda surprises me when an expert, or enthusiast of anything, wouldn't have checked out an item they were interested in and already know what it includes, or doesn't include.

It also surprises me a person would inspect the firearm before checking out to see if everything was accounted for and if everything was in good fit, finish and function.

And BTW< the LC9 along with the LCP only come with one magazine from the factory.

WTBguns10kOK
March 31, 2012, 08:20 PM
As always, many of you are nitpicking the finer points of law, contracts and other pointless subjects. The store fails badly at customer service and refused to look at the customer as a lifelong patron. It's actually counter-intuitive to do the things businesses do nowadays. They think they're pinching pennies but are actually decreasing long term profit due to negative perception. Hilariously pathetic.

Telekinesis
March 31, 2012, 09:17 PM
As always, many of you are nitpicking the finer points of law, contracts and other pointless subjects

Did you even read the OP? He claimed that the gun store should have given him the second mag because of a contract between him and the store. Here it is again:
They should have given me the second mag. just to keep up their end of the contract

Discussing contract law is a valid response to the OP. Especially considering the fact that he had no legally enforceable contract to begin with, it seems like it might just be a tad bit relevant, don't ya think? :rolleyes:

If the OP just wants to complain that his LGS told him something and then didn't follow through, that's one thing. Hell he could go to one of hundreds of other forums on the web and get a bunch of "hell yeas!" and "F-them, lets go burn the LGS!" and a completely separate contingent screaming "Oh, your LGS made a mistake??? Lets riot, rape, pillage, and then burn the entire city to the ground! Yeah! - That'll sure teach them to include an extra magazine next time!!!"
(I recommend reading that bit as if it was read by the "burn the witch!" crowd from Monty Python's The Holy Grail. I believe it will be quite entertaining :D)

But this is THR, a more calm and rational sort of place, which relies upon legitimate fact instead of mere emotion. In following that ideal, once the OP started calling them out on breach of contract, I threw my BS flag and then backed it up with actual legal doctrine (though if it makes anyone feel any better, the doctrine I cited is from case law and not statutory law, so a review of code likely wouldn't have found it.)


And the UCC actually does cover contracts created when purchasing goods. It is actually one of the larger sections of the code.

latesvak
March 31, 2012, 10:21 PM
I'm with the Op . Should have gotten what was agreed on. If not
Then your money back if they did not want the loss of your bussines






Latesvak

oneounceload
March 31, 2012, 10:37 PM
There was no "contract". I can't find anything on Ruger's site that says how many mags come with the gun - if it is only one, then the OP should realize that a simple mistake was made. Want the second mag, then buy it. Getting all huffy and slamming a store anonymously over the internet is really uncalled for.

Amazing how many people think the LGS should give them a lot of free things for buying something from them. It is a retail store, buy from them or not - your choice with your money.

But all of this over a magazine?

Sport45
March 31, 2012, 11:19 PM
Honest mistake by the salesman. If I didn't know better, I'd have said the LC9 came with two magazines as well since that's what came with most pistols I've purchased. But my LC9 only came with one as that is how Ruger ships them. It did come with two baseplates so you can configure the magazine in two different ways.

I wouldn't have insisted on getting an extra magazine free because of the mistake. It's no different than when a store has a typo in their sales flyer. They are not required to sell something for 10% of its value just because they put a decimal in the wrong place.

exavid
March 31, 2012, 11:59 PM
The salesman's error doesn't create a contract. It's an error. If a car salesman told you a new car you were buying came with a spare engine do you think that would stand? Personally I think it a poor thing to try to make hay out of someone's innocent mistake.

Agsalaska
April 1, 2012, 01:38 AM
I'm surprised so many of you would be willing to lose a customer over a magazine.

Sport45
April 1, 2012, 01:57 AM
Gun shops are in the business to make money. Customer satisfaction is one thing, but they have to make money or they go out of business.

The OP didn't say he was a member of their "gun a week" club or anything like that. For all we know he may have never set foot in the shop before or planned to again anyway.

If a store owner says, "good day to you" and it's raining when you go outside do you expect restitution?

The salesman had no control over how many magazines Ruger packages with the pistol and made a bad assumption. Next time he'll know.

Or maybe the magazine should have been included and the cost docked from the salesman's wages just like they dock the waitress if she forgets to put something on the ticket. I wouldn't do that to a waitress and I won't do it to a salesman either.

But I may not be typical here. I even give back any extra change I get by mistake at the register.

exavid
April 1, 2012, 01:57 AM
In gun shops around here a sale wouldn't be lost for long because most of the various new Rugers are hard to come by. I really don't think many gun shop owners are getting very rich in their business so I'm surprised you think they should give away magazines.

TennJed
April 1, 2012, 02:55 AM
Question to the OP. What do you honestly think you would have said or done, if when you asked him how many mags came with the gun and he said 1?

Do you think you would have declined getting the gun?

Would you have tried neog. him down some on the price?

Would you have bought the gun regardless?

No right or wrong answer, I am just curious

blarby
April 1, 2012, 04:20 AM
I guess I'm too old school.

Nope, too right school. I'm with ya.

made a bad assumption

If ya don't know, ask someone. Look it up mebbe. Letting your lips do research, your mind should be doing, to make a sale, is not uncommon.... but there is this saying about "assume" that plays true here.

required to sell something for 10% of its value just because they put a decimal in the wrong place. Check your local laws. If the flyer matches the price on the shelf ( happens at wally world all the time) they very well could be made to eat it. And do on many occasions.

Gun shops are in the business to make money. Customer satisfaction is one thing, but they have to make money or they go out of business. I agree that they are there to make money. Making money and customer satisfaction are not mutually exclusive. Without customer satisfaction, often enough, they will go out of business just as easily....one does follow the other.

The salesman's error doesn't create a contract. It's an error. If a car salesman told you a new car you were buying came with a spare engine do you think that would stand? IANAL..don't know if its a contract or not, as the OP states. I think that in actuality may have been just a poor word choice, mebbe not. Mebbe he will chime back in.

If a car salesman told me a car came with a spare engine while we were negotiating price and features, it better be there on a pallet when they pull it up from detail. Not kidding. Failure to deliver as promised at delivery can very easily cause a customer to NOT take delivery.... try explaining that to a finance manager. If you are lucky enough to have him there while it happens, you can expect your deal to be whittled away to nothing to get that customer to take delivery.

Agsalaska
April 1, 2012, 04:48 AM
Gun shops are in the business to make money. Customer satisfaction is one thing, but they have to make money or they go out of business.

The OP didn't say he was a member of their "gun a week" club or anything like that. For all we know he may have never set foot in the shop before or planned to again anyway.

If a store owner says, "good day to you" and it's raining when you go outside do you expect restitution?

The salesman had no control over how many magazines Ruger packages with the pistol and made a bad assumption. Next time he'll know.

Or maybe the magazine should have been included and the cost docked from the salesman's wages just like they dock the waitress if she forgets to put something on the ticket. I wouldn't do that to a waitress and I won't do it to a salesman either.

But I may not be typical here. I even give back any extra change I get by mistake at the register.
Ok. Maybe he's not a member of the 'gun of the week' club. That gun shop just guaranteed that he never will be either. Your right. Gun shops are in business to make money. You do that by creating a repeat customer base, not by dickering over a pistol magazine.


I don't know of any successful business owner willing to risk losing a customer over an item that has 20 dollars cost in it, no matter what business they are in.

And customer problem resolution is a part of doing business. You don't take it out of an employees paycheck. You would also be willing to make an employee, your front line in customer service, disgruntled over a 20 dollar mistake.

A good business owner would allow that employee to make that decision on the spot and congratulate the employee for making a smart customer decision while learning a lesson at the same time.

S&W620
April 1, 2012, 10:56 AM
Just my take, but I don't have it in me to hold some poor schmucks feet to the fire for an honest mistake, nor do I have the time to waste looking for and purchasing the gun elsewhere.

If that's a deal breaker for you, so be it, but to expect another mag to be thrown in for free is a bit absurd.

If your attempt was to prove some sort of point by voiding the sale, I'm guessing you probably fell a bit shorter than you intended.

WTBguns10kOK
April 1, 2012, 11:07 AM
Telekenesis.........I have no idea what you tried to write. But once somebody tells him he had no contract, the question is answered. You just spent a ton of wasted words doing exactly what I said people doing...

Agsalaska
April 1, 2012, 12:56 PM
It's not about a contract. I get he said it in his OP but it is not about a contract. It is about customer service.

And it's also not about what you would or would not do. Cardinal sin in customer service decision making.

Agsalaska
April 1, 2012, 01:08 PM
I guess I'm going to leave it at this. I would be perfectly comfortable saying that there is not a CEO, managing consultant, sales consultant, business professor, business school, strategy book, sales class, or sales seminar that would tell you that it was a good idea to lose a customer over a $20 part. Not one. Nor would they tell you to make the decision based on what you would do if you were the customer. It doesn't matter what business you are in. Guns are not different.


The gun industry is loaded with problems and customer service is near the top of the list. If you don't believe that go see the thread about what you want to see in a gun shop. I can only hope that one or two gun shop folks read this thread, see the fundamental flaw in the decision made by the business, and try to apply a higher standard in their stores.

Serenity
April 1, 2012, 01:25 PM
One of my jobs (the other one is milking cows which isn't as different as you'd think) is warranty fulfillment for aftermarket Harley Davidson parts. This is my area: satisfying present customers who have a complaint so that they remain customers and continue to refer their friends. I'm not going to address the matter of the OP's actions or attitude because that's not my area professionally. But as customer service provider I can tell you that the smart and profitable thing would have been to throw in the second mag.

In dealing with customers we don't cave to blackmail; if someone threatens to trash us on the HD forums we say go ahead, because we know that most people realize that there is that 1% of people who hate everything and are never satisfied. We know that we have done everything possible to please them, and that they won't be happy no matter WHAT because some people are haters.

We can do this because we have an excellent reputation with the other 99% who will immediately speak up and shut down the complainers, because we have taken excellent care of them. So we have referrals and repeat customers and are thriving when many small businesses are failing; especially in the luxury goods market.

Did the store have the right to do what they did? Sure. But it would have been smarter to keep this customer who has friends and apparently has money to spend in what is essentially a luxury goods market.

mnrivrat
April 1, 2012, 02:52 PM
It's been an interesting thread, and an interesting look into the human thought process.

Like many topics here it seems to take on a warped Darwin effect and grows branches to places where reason and logic are still in it primortial stages.

A simple small issue with a lot of fertilizer grows quickly into a SCOTUS scale debate.

If that's a deal breaker for you, so be it, but to expect another mag to be thrown in for free is a bit absurd.

I think the OP expected to receive what he bought from the salesman. That hardly makes it a free magazine. I understand if that makes it a deal breaker for either the customer or the store - as you say " so be it" . In that sense I do not blame the store as all it realy owed the customer (IMO) is an explaination of the error and a full refund if he wanted to cancel the transaction.

For me, its about the $5 fee . As I stated in an earlier post, if it was I the customer would have gotten the two magazines. I can understand a reasonable course of action for the store to include the option of cancelling the transaction. I can not see the $5 fee as being anything but the stores obligation.

homatok
April 1, 2012, 03:27 PM
To me it is simple! If I am buying anything and the sales person tells me it comes with a certain number of parts/accessories, whatever I was told I would get had better dang well be there at delivery. It is not about a mistake, or any legal mumbo jumbo, it is about the store's reputation for keeping it's word. In this case I would have had my money back and I would have told the store manager in no uncertain terms why I would never shop in his store again. Further, before I left the store he would have clearly understood that I would be telling all my friends about my problem. If that store was part of a chain the head office would get a letter politely telling them how I felt.

hoohaa310
April 1, 2012, 04:26 PM
I'd like to answer this thread seeing as I'm a gun store employee.

OP I understand where you're coming from, but I can tell you that most gun shop employees are part time workers. Imagine having to know every aspect of every gun, magazine size, weight, caliber, take down procedure, warranty etc. and on top of that everything that comes with every gun.



This is the same as going to a restaurant and ordering a meal with mashed potatoes and then afterwords the waitress comes back and says we're all out of potatoes so you decide to cancel the rest of your meal and leave. Or demand a discount.


The mags cost 25 bucks you're the kind of customer that just makes my day tougher honestly. If 25 bucks matters that much to you ya should find another hobby.

Certaindeaf
April 1, 2012, 04:39 PM
If I had an employee say that elephants flew, it wouldn't change the fact that it was untrue/an error.
Ruger ships and sells that package with one magazine.
Oh, edit. I think I tapped on the wrong thread.. forgive me.

Agsalaska
April 1, 2012, 04:44 PM
I'd like to answer this thread seeing as I'm a gun store employee.

OP I understand where you're coming from, but I can tell you that most gun shop employees are part time workers. Imagine having to know every aspect of every gun, magazine size, weight, caliber, take down procedure, warranty etc. and on top of that everything that comes with every gun.



This is the same as going to a restaurant and ordering a meal with mashed potatoes and then afterwords the waitress comes back and says we're all out of potatoes so you decide to cancel the rest of your meal and leave. Or demand a discount.


The mags cost 25 bucks you're the kind of customer that just makes my day tougher honestly. If 25 bucks matters that much to you ya should find another hobby.

Are you serious? First of all, thank you for putting on display the problem with gun shops. That kind of arrogance and attitude towards customers and their value is exactly why people like me buy online.

As for your comparison, that is not even close to the same. In your example the restaurant was out of potatoes. But the gun shop had a magazine. Right there your analogy falls apart. What would have made more sense is an analogy like-'It is just like a restaurant that tells you a steak comes with two sides when it only comes with one after you have ordered two. Smart successful restaurants bring you what you ordered, dont charge you for the extra side, and may or may not even inform you of the mistake. You will hopefulyl have a nice meal and come back, with friends, over and over. Or they only bring you one of the sides you ordered because they have to make money too and its really hard to remember all the different sides with all the different meals, especially as a part timer. Now, you tell me, which one makes more sense in the long run.




I apologize for such a brash tone.:banghead: I know this is the high road. But that kind of arrogance towards customers is, in my opinion, just as dangerous and a threat to our rights as any gun hating liberal. It confirms a lot of what they believe. This industry HAS to learn how to treat people.

Lex Luthier
April 1, 2012, 05:42 PM
Howdy.

I acquired an LC9 when they were a hot ticket item last year. I knew they came with one magazine. It did, in fact, come with one magazine. No tears were shed.

A few weeks before that purchase, I bought a consigned Kimber Dessert Warrior that supposedly had one mag. Okay. Really liked the weapon and took it home. The guy who sold it to me approached me on another subsequent visit with a nice blue hardcase that had two more mags, the manual and cable lock, and a nice Safariland style holster in it and said he found it, knew what gun it belonged to and saved it for me.

I guess the moral of the story is suit up and show up. Get to know folks and they will treat you right. Good luck expecting miracles when people are involved.

zeek96
April 1, 2012, 07:12 PM
I bought a cz and the box was short a mag. The shop owner was not too helpful either. He said they normaly come with more then one but this pistol only came with the one in the pistol. He through in a fobus holster to keep me in the deal. The best part is a called cz customer service the next day verified the serial number and they sent another mag by mail. Dont know if ruger will do the same but cz is nop notch customer service wise.

Gato Montés
April 1, 2012, 07:25 PM
I apologize for such a brash tone. I know this is the high road. But that kind of arrogance towards customers is, in my opinion, just as dangerous and a threat to our rights as any gun hating liberal. It confirms a lot of what they believe. This industry HAS to learn how to treat people.

LOL! Someone has an axe to grind, God Damn!!!

Let's see; contract law, Christian beliefs, riots Fever FAMINE MY GOD! All over a simple error. I wish getting one mag instead of two was the worst way I was burned at a gun shop.

If the case were;
"The price was higher than normal, but the sale included an extra mag which made it worth it." I can understand that. But this doesn't seem to be the case here.

Every time I buy something at that price level I research before hand to the contents of that package. It took me under two minutes from first stumbling upon this thread to confirm yes, the LC9 comes standard with one magazine.

If anything, let this be a lesson to DO YOUR RESEARCH. The internet has made this task incredibly easy; someone with over 2,500 posts should have no problem with this.

gp911
April 1, 2012, 08:17 PM
This thread has been fantastically entertaining! Where is my popcorn..?

Redlg155
April 1, 2012, 08:22 PM
As a point to satisfy curiosity, I would call Ruger and see how many are supplied with the weapon. Some dealers are nasty about keeping the extra mag for a profit. I was licky when I bought my Glock 34 Gen 4. I actually recieved 3 17rd mags that are supplied with the weapon from the factory.

sawdeanz
April 1, 2012, 08:39 PM
I agree with the OP to the point that the number of magazines etc. is an important consideration in price, but I don't really see a problem considering the gunshop refunded the money. I feel like they honored their mistake by voiding the sale, if they refused the refund then I would say you have a right to complain.
As for the background check fee, my gunstore has a policy that there are no refunds for that, not that they couldn't make an exception if they wanted to, but that's how it is.
In the future, I would suggest, as others have, to inspect the product. When I bought my CZ I asked what it came with and they were more than happy to go get the box it came in and show me. Second, confirm what the deal is by saying something like "So it is all of this stuff for $XXX out the door, right?"
Didn't have any problems.

SkyFreek60
April 2, 2012, 05:12 PM
I would have looked over the full package before the transfer.

David E
April 2, 2012, 05:20 PM
Granted the salesman made an honest mistake,

Yup, they happen all the time.

but rules are rules.

To what "rules" do you refer? Surely not the "rules" where the customer inspects what he's buying, I'll bet.

They should have given me the second mag.

Because YOU failed to inspect your own purchase?

but instead let me walk after wasting my time.

Sounds more like you wasted theirs.

I will never darken their doors again.

Promise? ;)

slowr1der
April 2, 2012, 09:04 PM
To the above poster, so you are saying it's okay to tell people they are getting stuff in a deal, that they really aren't as long as they don't catch it until they get home? So if you were selling someone a car and told them it came with a V6, but they didn't realize until they got home that you really sold them the 4cylinder, that's okay with you? To me, it's dishonest, and I don't see how anyone can justify it.

Sadly the days of trusting people seem to be long gone, which is really sad.

SharkHat
April 2, 2012, 09:15 PM
The entire problem could have been avoided if the gunstore employee had acknowledged that he wasn't sure how many magazines were included, and then actually checked to see before ringing the sale. Or the shop could even include specific information on the tags hanging from the trigger guard.

dajowi
April 2, 2012, 10:03 PM
They're just practicing what I've seen numerous times at gun shops and gun shows. They get a new gun that comes from the factory with two or three extra mags and short change the customer. But of course they're willing to sell you an "extra" magazine for your gun at the standard price.

Sport45
April 2, 2012, 10:41 PM
They're just practicing what I've seen numerous times at gun shops and gun shows. They get a new gun that comes from the factory with two or three extra mags and short change the customer.

No. They're not. The LC9 comes from Ruger with ONLY ONE magazine.

mnrivrat
April 2, 2012, 11:41 PM
I'd like to answer this thread seeing as I'm a gun store employee.

OP I understand where you're coming from, but I can tell you that most gun shop employees are part time workers. Imagine having to know every aspect of every gun, magazine size, weight, caliber, take down procedure, warranty etc. and on top of that everything that comes with every gun.


Well so am I ( a gun store employee) - have you ever thought of saying " I don't know , let me check " ?

drsfmd
April 3, 2012, 12:29 AM
Well so am I ( a gun store employee) - have you ever thought of saying " I don't know , let me check " ?

Of course... I've said that to customers a million times. Then I come here and see threads complaining about LGS employees being useless because they aren't walking encyclopedias. :banghead:

David E
April 3, 2012, 12:48 AM
.
I think the OP expected to receive what he bought from the salesman. That hardly makes it a free magazine.

No, the customer freely admitted that he knew the clerk made an honest mistake and then thought he could scam a free magazine out of it.

The customer would've gotten what he paid for if he hadn't thrown a hissy fit because the store refused to be scammed by him.

SharkHat
April 3, 2012, 12:53 AM
No, the customer freely admitted that he knew the clerk made an honest mistake and then thought he could scam a free magazine out of it.

No he didn't. He acknowledged that it was an honest mistake, and that the shop should have made good on that mistake. There were no scams.

mnrivrat
April 3, 2012, 02:39 AM
Then I come here and see threads complaining about LGS employees being useless because they aren't walking encyclopedias.

Well that is the truth , but perhaps a different subject ? I've been around firearms in variaous capacity for well over 50 years and I have to keep in mind there is a lot I don't know. Customers should also keep that in mind.

A thick skin helps with this job (gun shop employee), as well as an understanding that like the folks responding to this thread - there is a lot of room for all sorts of personality to over rule what we used to refer to as common sense. It is mostly listening skills that fall by the wayside with some folks who are overeager to say something before they understand what they just read.

No, the customer freely admitted that he knew the clerk made an honest mistake and then thought he could scam a free magazine out of it.

Nothing personal , but I apparently failed to read anything like this into the prior postings. Perhaps you can point out what posting you took this from ? And how you drew that conclusion to what was posted . To me, saying he was trying to get a "free" magazine has no basis in reality . How can you draw such a conclusion ?

Ramone
April 3, 2012, 09:57 AM
I have to chime in here, becuase I had almost exactly the opposite experience at the Same store a few months back (Shooters of Jacksonville on University Blvd).

I was buying a GLOCK 17 to go with my SUB2000, and as he brought it from the back, I asked "It comes with two Mags, right?"

He said 'Yes", and when we opened the box there were three. He *did* check to make sure that it was supposed to be three, and that we weren't shorting someone else's pistol, but I expected two, got three, and no issue was made of it...

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 10:22 AM
This thread is giving me the worst headache. Once again, I cant believe how many of you would lose a sale and a customer over a $20 part. Sitting here trying to show why the customer was wrong for wanting the gun shop to honor what they said. Brilliant. I see now why so many gun shops struggle. Actually it confirms what I already knew. There is not an industry in America that fails more at basic customer service principles than the gun business. :banghead:

oneounceload
April 3, 2012, 11:51 AM
There is not an industry in America that fails more at basic customer service principles than the gun business.

Nor is there any other segment of the retail industry where the customer expects everything at cost plus 5% AND some other freebies for walking in the door.

An honest mistake was made, the gun only comes with one magazine - there is no obligation to give this person a free one - that would eliminate the profit on the gun - and then the business is out of business.

Gato Montés
April 3, 2012, 03:24 PM
I can't believe how many of you would burn a bridge so quickly over nothing at all.

atomd
April 3, 2012, 04:57 PM
Put this in perspective of a private sale. You call the seller and specifically ask if it comes with 2 mags. He tells you yes, the gun comes with 2 mags. You drive over and meet him, look the gun over, and decide to purchase it....but in the case you find only 1 mag. This makes it not as good of a deal as you once thought so you decide not to buy it. He tells you sorry but says he needs you to give him $5 to pay for the gas he used to meet you. How many people would be ok with giving him $5? I wouldn't.

Salmoneye
April 3, 2012, 05:02 PM
I can't believe how many of you would burn a bridge so quickly over nothing at all.

I agree fully...

That Manager certainly burned that bridge...

;)

David E
April 3, 2012, 05:20 PM
.

No, the customer freely admitted that he knew the clerk made an honest mistake and then thought he could scam a free magazine out of it.

Nothing personal , but I apparently failed to read anything like this into the prior postings. Perhaps you can point out what posting you took this from ? And how you drew that conclusion to what was posted . To me, saying he was trying to get a "free" magazine has no basis in reality . How can you draw such a conclusion ?

By reading the Original Post.

The OP admits the clerk made a simple, honest mistake. Those guns only ship with one magazine, so the OP was getting everything he had paid for. Demanding a free magazine based on this honest mistake is asinine. If there had been 3 mags, this same OP would've ranted loud and long if the clerk took away the third one. "Sorry, sir, they only come with two."

Maybe "scam" wasn't the best word choice. I should have used "extort."

Extort: 1. to wrest or wring (money, information, a FREE MAGAZINE, etc) from a person by intimidation, or threat.

IE;

"if you don't give me a free magazine, I'll cancel this sale, never buy anything from you again and spread this incident all over the Internet!"

Yeah, "extort" fits much better than "scam.". Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

SharkHat
April 3, 2012, 05:39 PM
By reading the Original Post.

Maybe "scam" wasn't the best word choice. I should have used "extort."

Extort: 1. to wrest or wring (money, information, a FREE MAGAZINE, etc) from a person by intimidation, or threat.

IE;

"if you don't give me free magazine, I'll cancel this sale, never buy anything from you again and spread this incident all over the Internet!"

Yeah, "extort" fits much better than "scam.". Thanks for bringing that to my attention.

If the OP had not been told that 2 magazines were included from the beginning, your accusation might make sense. If he had gone in and asked, "If I buy this gun can you guys throw in an extra mag for free?", then your accusation might make sense.

Since his expectation appears to have been only that the shop include what the salesman said was included before he was charged for it, I have trouble giving you credit for making any sense.

thorazine
April 3, 2012, 06:39 PM
I just would have countered their five dollar offer to fifteen. =P

atomd
April 3, 2012, 07:04 PM
Extort: 1. to wrest or wring (money, information, a FREE MAGAZINE, etc) from a person by intimidation, or threat.

Using the term extort to describe someone saying that they won't purchase an item because they won't include what they initially said it included is completely ridiculous. As a consumer we have the option to ask for whatever we want and the store can consider our request and then has the option to honor our request or deny it. If whatever we ask for isn't granted we have the option to end the transaction. Simple as that. The free market at it's finest.

It's hardly extortion. Extortion is a crime. Extortion would be a customer saying "I want a discount on this or else I'm calling OSHA and falsely reporting safety hazards on your property"...or something of that nature. It's unreal how customer service is just a thing of the past and this thread proves it.

Pistola
April 3, 2012, 07:42 PM
Store people just sound greedy.

David E
April 3, 2012, 10:37 PM
You guys need to look up "extortion" before you say it doesn't fit or make sense.

If I had some clown try to pull this stunt, _I_ would refuse the sale.

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 11:33 PM
Nor is there any other segment of the retail industry where the customer expects everything at cost plus 5% AND some other freebies for walking in the door.

An honest mistake was made, the gun only comes with one magazine - there is no obligation to give this person a free one - that would eliminate the profit on the gun - and then the business is out of business.
Yea ok. Said the home seller, the bartender, the general contractor, the wholesaler, the pawnshop owner, etc etc etc.


And as for you second paragraph, that is extremely short sighted thinking. Businesses go out of business because of a lack of customers, specifically repeat customers. They generally accompisH that by trying to win every time.



And remember, the guy didn't want anything for free. He wanted what was agreed on before the purchase.

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 11:36 PM
If the OP had not been told that 2 magazines were included from the beginning, your accusation might make sense. If he had gone in and asked, "If I buy this gun can you guys throw in an extra mag for free?", then your accusation might make sense.

Since his expectation appears to have been only that the shop include what the salesman said was included before he was charged for it, I have trouble giving you credit for making any sense.
Exactly. That was a ridiculous argument. He's not tying scam or extort. He is trying to get what was agreed to. How do people even come to the conclusion that he tried to extort. Thats ridiculous.


Burning bridges over a 20 dollar part. Good job.

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 11:42 PM
You guys need to look up "extortion" before you say it doesn't fit or make sense.

If I had some clown try to pull this stunt, _I_ would refuse the sale.
What do you not see here. He agreed to the deal because he was told it came with two magazines. That was the deal. He made the agreement based on that. When he goes in to pick it up the terms have been changed by the gun shop, not the distributor. His agreement was with the gun shop, not the distributor. The fact that the distributor only shipped one, or it only comes with one, is not the buyers problem. It is the gun shops responsibility.


Clowns? Really? Good to see you would also lose a customer over a 20 dollar part. Brilliant. But good for you cause that clown didn't get over on you. And don't let it bother you that he and twenty other people he tells will never be in your shop again. But you got him. You showed him he wasn't going to get over on you and your 20 dollar part. Brilliant.

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 11:43 PM
Store people just sound greedy.
Greedy is not the first word that come to my mind when you listen to this logic.

dprice3844444
April 3, 2012, 11:51 PM
FROM DAVIDSONS
Item #: 3212
UPC_Code: 736676032129
Description: RUG LC9-CT 9MM DAO PST B 7RD
Manufacturer: Ruger
Model #: LC9-CT (Crimson Trace Laserguard)
Type: Semi-Automatic Pistol
Finish: Blue
Stock: Black Glass-Filled Nylon Frame
Sights: Adjustable 3-Dot/Crimson Trace Laserguard
Barrel Length: 3.12"
Overall Length: 6"
Weight: 17.70 oz
Caliber: 9MM
Capacity: 7+1
Action: Double Action Only
# of Mags: 1
Chokes:
Packaging:

Agsalaska
April 3, 2012, 11:55 PM
What's your point dprice? So that shows it only comes with one mag. I don't think anyone is claiming it came with two. The problem is they agreed to a price with 2.

David E
April 4, 2012, 09:19 AM
No, it sounded like he asked about the mags as an after thought, not as "part of the deal," especially since the OP acknowledged and admitted that the clerk made an honest mistake.

For all we know, the OP was fully aware, having done simple research, that the gun only ships with one magazine, but was hoping to get the clerk to say it came with two. This happened, so he pounced on what he saw as an opportunity to get a FREE $30 magazine by compelling the store, by means of threat and intimidation, to give in to his childish demand.

If the clerk had jokingly said, "oh, a couple dozen mags and a date with Raquel Welch when she was 25," not only would the OP acknowledge and admit the clerk was joking, he'd demand the store provide 2 dozen magazines and a time travel machine for that date with Raquel. When that didn't happen, he'd complain on the gun forums about how that shop didn't "play by the rules."

If the gun ships with two mags, THEN he has a point, but not now.

homatok
April 4, 2012, 10:35 AM
Sorry, the clerk is the agent for the store and as such a customer has the right to expect the store to live up to what the clerk promised. If the clerk made a mistake the store should have sucked it up and honored the deal!

I just had continuous gutter installed on my deck roof (62 feet). The installer said the company will not waranty any length over 40 feet so he wanted to put it up in 2 pieces. I said OK. He said there was a small part that would be installed over the join of the 2 pieces to prevent leakage at that point. After he left I noticed the small piece had not been put on and I called him. I told him the next time he was past our house would he please put that piece on and he said yes. About 5 PM (after work hours) he showed up and put the piece in place. Now--realize we live 22 KM out of town and he made a special trip to complete the job so he could conform to what he said he would do. I would have been happy to wait untill he had reason to come by the house whenever it was covienient for him. That is customer service!! Will I recomend him to other people if I get the chance? You bet! Do you think the customer (OP) in this thread will recomend that gunshop to anyone? I wouldn't!

SharkHat
April 4, 2012, 11:31 AM
No, it sounded like he asked about the mags as an after thought, not as "part of the deal," especially since the OP acknowledged and admitted that the clerk made an honest mistake.

For all we know, the OP was fully aware, having done simple research, that the gun only ships with one magazine, but was hoping to get the clerk to say it came with two. This happened, so he pounced on what he saw as an opportunity to get a FREE $30 magazine by compelling the store, by means of threat and intimidation, to give in to his childish demand.

If the clerk had jokingly said, "oh, a couple dozen mags and a date with Raquel Welch when she was 25," not only would the OP acknowledge and admit the clerk was joking, he'd demand the store provide 2 dozen magazines and a time travel machine for that date with Raquel. When that didn't happen, he'd complain on the gun forums about how that shop didn't "play by the rules."

If the gun ships with two mags, THEN he has a point, but not now.

From the original post:
I asked the salesman how many mags. the pistol came with and he told me 2. I bought the pistol and I checked the box at the checkout counter and there was only 1 mag. in the box. I asked the guy where the other mag. was and he checked and told me he had made an error.

It sounds to me like he asked about the mags before making the purchase, not as an afterthought. Unfortunately, nobody checked the box until after the purchase was completed, which is why a refund was required.

Sheepdog1968
April 4, 2012, 11:40 AM
Sounds like an honest mistake and sounds like the owner tried to make up for it.

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