Would like advice choosing a pocket pistol.


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Demitrios
April 2, 2012, 02:02 PM
Hello all. I would like some reccomendations to get me into the wide world of pocket pistols.

To start my budget is no more than $500.

Since I want low recoil the calibers go I'm interested in the .32 NAA, .380 and 9mm. I'm well aware that 9mm is stronger than .380 and that both are easier to find in Walmart than the .32 NAA, however I reload so it's a moot point.

Reliability, I need something with not only a good reputation but something you guys have personal experience with.

A good trigger, I'd really like to avoid a 12 lb. trigger with a huge amount of length of pull. Also DA/SA or just SA would be preferable.

Lastly no revolvers and preferably no double stacks. Nothing against them at all but I'm looking for something slim. The slimmer the better.

What I've been considering is the Ruger LC9, Beretta Nano, Kel-Tec P series and Diamondback Firearms. I'm completely open to suggestions on other firearms, I only named those four off as examples.

Thank you in advance for all your help and advice guys, I really appreciate it.

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Ledgehammer
April 2, 2012, 02:16 PM
Easy enough. Get the Kahr CM9 - it's slim, reliable and the trigger is smooth like butter. I love mine. Also it fits in your pocket better than the lc9

tlatoani
April 2, 2012, 02:33 PM
sig p238? may push the $500 a bit.

tarosean
April 2, 2012, 02:36 PM
S&W Bodyguard is a little smaller than the Lc9

momano
April 2, 2012, 02:41 PM
Right now I'm got the Ruger LCP and LC9 in my carry rotation. I had the Kel-tec P3AT and the P-11. The Rugers are heavier than the Kel-tecs they copy; but the recoil is much easier and the reliability is much better in my experience. With a little practice on their long trigger pulls, the Rugers are very accurate for me. Good luck in your choice; I'm very satisfied with my Rugers.

Shadow 7D
April 2, 2012, 03:36 PM
SHOOT THEM FIRST

That's about it
mouse guns have a DEFINITE bite
they are hard to hold due to short grip
they are sometimes difficult to sight due to type (or lack of) sights
they have a heavy recoil due to light/small frame and poor grip

past that it's all personal preference:cool:

Fishbed77
April 2, 2012, 03:43 PM
Easy enough. Get the Kahr CM9 - it's slim, reliable and the trigger is smooth like butter. I love mine. Also it fits in your pocket better than the lc9


Good advice here. ^

jahwarrior
April 2, 2012, 03:48 PM
Hello all. I would like some reccomendations to get me into the wide world of pocket pistols.

To start my budget is no more than $500.

Since I want low recoil the calibers go I'm interested in the .32 NAA, .380 and 9mm. I'm well aware that 9mm is stronger than .380 and that both are easier to find in Walmart than the .32 NAA, however I reload so it's a moot point.

Reliability, I need something with not only a good reputation but something you guys have personal experience with.

A good trigger, I'd really like to avoid a 12 lb. trigger with a huge amount of length of pull. Also DA/SA or just SA would be preferable.

Lastly no revolvers and preferably no double stacks. Nothing against them at all but I'm looking for something slim. The slimmer the better.

What I've been considering is the Ruger LC9, Beretta Nano, Kel-Tec P series and Diamondback Firearms. I'm completely open to suggestions on other firearms, I only named those four off as examples.

Thank you in advance for all your help and advice guys, I really appreciate it.
If you're looking for low recoil, you're looking at the wrong guns, especially in .380ACP and 9mm. I've owned both the Keltec P3AT and the PF9, and they had some of the worst felt recoil of any gun I've ever shot. Also, their trigger pulls are about 20 miles long. The Diamonback is close to feeling like a Glock, as far as the trigger is concerned, but the recoil is still a bit much.

My pocket gun of choice is a Baby Browning clone, made by PSP/PSA, and is chambered for the .25ACP round. It's all-steel construction, but is lightweight, accurate, reliable, and easy to take down for maintenance. It's probably the smallest gun I've ever had. I can conceal it in my hand, and it fits in just about any pocket I can find.

http://unblinkingeye.com/Guns/PSP-25/psp-25.html

http://www.precisionsmallarms.com/

Byrd666
April 2, 2012, 03:53 PM
Sig P238 in .380 single stack sao
Sig P938 in 9mm single stack sao

Both are unfortunately more than 500 but, well worth it.

jbr
April 2, 2012, 03:54 PM
Your trigger desc. sounds right up my alley so I will tell you what I have found so far as i started my search over a year ago. I agree with Shadow, you need to try them for your self once you gather some info here. I tried the ruger LCP and the trigger bit my finger every shot - long trigger pull also - horrible accuracy. Tried the Kahr - long trigger pull - not accurate with it. I settled on the Taurus PT738. Decent trigger and though I never would have believed it, I shoot it very accurately and fast out to 10 or 15 yards. I actually like shooting it at the range. I am not bashing any of the guns I mentioned, they just didn't work for me.

Certaindeaf
April 2, 2012, 03:59 PM
Deep pockets are good.

gearhead
April 2, 2012, 04:09 PM
I carry a Taurus 709 Slim. Trigger is SA/DA (rather than the other way around) with a long pull and trigger safety plus a thumb safety on the frame. Very manageable recoil and it's been quite reliable so far.

JustinJ
April 2, 2012, 05:24 PM
I was about to trade in my LC9 for a Khar due to the trigger until the LGS selling it told me about the number of issues customers have had with feeding HP ammo even after break in period. Upon breaking one done the reason become apparent. The feed ramp is simply far too steep in my opinion. So i'm stuck trying to make the LC9 work. If you won't at least go for a nine then i'd say get a Makarov.

Zerodefect
April 2, 2012, 05:41 PM
My Kahr P380 is the best shooting .380 mousegun I've ever shot. I've gone through a few mouseguns over the years.

Gentle recoil, requires no real skill at all. I shoot it one handed, or tea cup. It's so small you can't use a regular pistol grip stance, you'll char your support thumb off. But the mousegun world is a one handed world anyways.

It runs 100% on Corbon Powerball. Weaker recoiling WWB causes it to choke sometimes.

I like Kahrs trigger. It's smooth like a J-frame, but breaks sooner. It has good sights, and as long as Im careful with the trigger, I can keep all my shot on notebook paper at 13 yards. I'd like to try a thinner Dawson front sight and a plain black rear sight.

Avoid the Keltec and the Ruger-tec. They have a harsher recoil.

bannockburn
April 2, 2012, 05:54 PM
I really like the size, weight, SA trigger, and night sights on my SIG P238. The gun is a natural pointer for me and is very easy to conceal. A friend of mine has a S&W Bodyguard .380, and while I'm not a big fan of DAO semi-autos, the trigger on his particular gun is quite smooth and manageable. The only problem he has had with it has been the laser module moving around within the frame. Recoil is minimal with either pistol.

qcsmitty
April 2, 2012, 06:04 PM
I pocket carry the LC9. I need to get a Nemesis pockets holster with the bottom/back hook to keep it in place. This Blackhawk wants to come out with the pistol. I also carry the LC9 with the standard floor plate; not the finger extension plate pictured. The std plate allows the pistol to slide out of the pocket without catching. As long as I am wearing pants with a good size pocket, (i.e. cargo shorts or 5.11 type pants) there is no problem. I like having this much firepower in the pocket. Currently I have 150 rounds of 115g Fed Champion FMJ rounds through it with no issues.

http://i856.photobucket.com/albums/ab129/QCSmitty/LC9C.jpg

SwampWolf
April 2, 2012, 06:07 PM
Other than extreme reliability (the first consideration when deciding on any pistol to get for self-defense), when it comes to choosing the best pistol for pocket carry, possessing relatively light weight and having a snagless configuration become very important factors. Personally, any pistol weighing much more than ten ounces or so is too heavy for long term pocket carry and pocket carry, in my book, constitutes a true "niche" pistol.

My recommendation for a reliable, relatively snag-free pistol weighing ten ounces or under and costing (considerably) less than $500.00 is the Ruger LCP, chambered in .380 ACP.

Ledgehammer
April 2, 2012, 07:48 PM
a Khar due to the trigger until the LGS selling it told me about the number of issues customers have had with feeding HP ammo even after break in period. Upon breaking one done the reason become apparent. The feed ramp is simply far too steep in my opinion. So

Lol - Don't believe everything the lgs tells you. My cm9 has been 100% with fmj and jhp. The barrel tilts up so feed ramp angle is perfectly fine. Look at the feed ramp on a glock 36. It's about the same steepness.

jon_in_wv
April 2, 2012, 07:53 PM
I own both the Ruger LCP and the S&W Bodyguard. The LCP makes a fine backup but the BG is hands down a much better primary carry. It's the perfect pocket pistol in my book. Any of the small nines like the LC9 are just a little too big for me to draw easily from my pocket with my meaty hands. If I were to where it IWB I would rather carry my S&W 3913 or my M&P 9C.
BTW both the LCP and the BG are much better shooters than you would think based on their size and weight. This weekend I was breading pieces of broken clay pigeons at 25 yards with my BG. I'm not capable of that all the time but the BG is capable of it when I am.

The small Kahrs might be an exception for pocket carry if you can shoot it well. IWB I would still lean towards a larger weapon.

MedWheeler
April 3, 2012, 07:18 AM
I carry the PF9, and have done so for two years now, having switched from the more-pleasant-shooting Bersa Thunder .380 (great gun, BTW; I still own and enjoy shooting it.)
The PF9 can indeed be snappy to shoot, but I found it easy to acclimate to. It's trigger pull is substantially improved over the one on the P-11.
If you like the .380 round, the Bersa Thunder CC might fill the bill as a heavier gun in that caliber. That makes it, as well as the one I have, much easier to shoot and return to target than many people find the "keychain" .380s to be.
Incidentally, I also own on of these "keychain" guns, but it is in .32 ACP. It's the Kel-Tec P32 and usually rides along with the PF9 and is rarely carried alone.

searcher451
April 3, 2012, 10:59 AM
What Shadow 7D said: Go to a ranage with a variety of candidates, give them all a test-drive, find the two or three that strike you as the best of the bunch, and then test-drive the heck out of those until you find the single pistol that best fits your hand and eye. Everything else is a crapshoot, and yo don't want to entrust your life to a crapshoot.

benderx4
April 3, 2012, 06:21 PM
If you want a real POCKET gun, I'd look at the Seecamp LWS32. The other guns mentioned in this thread are excellent, but unless you constantly wear pants with huge cargo pockets and strong belts, they really aren't "pocket" guns.

Ala Tom
April 3, 2012, 06:40 PM
I went through this search and finished Saturday when I bought my Ruger SR40C. I have a SW MP 40 FS as a main gun for Home Defense. I was willing to go to a 9 mm to get reasonable recoil in a smaller gun for CC. But the 9 mm I like the best was the Ruger SR9C. It was not the smallest but it was the smoothest shooting. My LGS had a sale that took a bunch of money off the Rugers. So I figured the SR40C would not be too tough to handle since it has the same external dimensions as the SR9C. I expect it will take some practice. I regret that I could not shoot the SR40C before buying. But now I can take both my 40's to the range and work on which ever needs the most practice. I think it will work out. I know I will have enough power. It fits my Galco WB472 holster that was intended for the MP40FS. It is an "Inside The Waist Band" holster that hides the weapon very well.

heeler
April 3, 2012, 07:33 PM
Since you mentioned pocket pistol I would rule out anything that requires a cocked hammer much to the disagreement of the Sig 238 fans.
In my opinion,for what thats worth,a striker fired pistol or concealed hammer pistol is the way to go if you are talking pocket pistol.
I alternate constantly between a reliable Ruger LCP and a Kahr PM9.
The Ruger LC9 or the Kahr CM9 are great choices.
The Diamondback has potential as long as it's consistently reliable.
Which many here, including myself,have found that wanting.

theautobahn
April 3, 2012, 08:31 PM
To me the .380's and the 9mm's are two different classes of pistol. The 9mm's are just enough bigger to make pocket carry questionable (to me). I would MUCH rather carry the 9mm round, but the compromise of having a .380 that is small/light enough to always have with me is worth it.

I'd really like to shoot the Kahr and Sig, but having shot the LCP, TCP and 3AT, I think the TCP was by far the most comfortable to shoot. The grips on the 3AT and LCP were nowhere near as comfortable and the slide doesn't lock back on the last round (if that matters to you). That being said, I had decided on the TCP until a friend bought one and had MULTIPLE failures to go fully into battery (two bad magazines), which made me extremely gunshy (pun intended).

WRGADog
April 3, 2012, 11:23 PM
Beretta Nano. I carry mine daily and love the gun. I also have a Kahr PM9, which is a great pocket pistol, but it doesn't fit the $500 budget. I find the Nano fits my hand better than the PM9, and I am more accurate with the Nano. I also have a Kahr P380 that is a dream to carry because of size and weight, but I much prefer 9mm to 380.

MrDig
April 4, 2012, 12:43 AM
CZ 83 the Surplus Versions are great 380's and the price is easy on the old wallet too. Usually around 250 after shipping and transfer fees.

bbuddtec
April 4, 2012, 09:58 PM
lc9/pf9, lookin myself... :)

Soldiernurse
April 5, 2012, 03:29 AM
Love the 5 lb trigger pull on my PF-9 & IMO recoil very tolerable. Inexpensive & excellent pocket carry in 9 mm.

mingansr
April 5, 2012, 03:54 AM
i've shot and just love the Sig P238 also. since it's an SAO trigger, having the manual safety would make it more 'comfortable' to carry in pocket with round in chamber, IMO. a mini 1911, in .380. nice, but pricey too.

if cost is an issue, the S&W Bodyguard .380 would be my next choice. friend has one and it's well made, like the Sig, and accurate as heck for a DAO trigger.

but i'm holding off for the SA XDS, for Slim, single stack when it comes out in .40sw (just 45acp now). not really gonna be for pocket, but since i have an XD 40, muscle memory will be the same with the XDS. i want nothing but SAO, so the grip safety and the USA Trigger (Ultra Safe ..?.) combine to give me peace of mind when i'm locked and loaded, since there is no manual safety on the xd line. if that XDS is too big for pocket, it's gonna go in an ankle holster. as a single stack weapon, the small mag capacity is still about what .380's have, and well, the knock down power is tons better. if i for some reason don't like the XDS, slim chance of that, no pun intended, i'll opt for the P238. cuz it is one sweet shootin pistola.

Sergei Mosin
April 5, 2012, 04:51 AM
My wife wants a pocket gun because she doesn't care for my service pistols. Just too big for her. So we went looking for something more her size. She picked up a Ruger LC9 and put it down almost as quickly - her distaste for the plastic frame and the useless safety was evident. Then she spotted a SIG P238 - and it was love at first sight. Metal frame, 1911-style controls, nice single-action trigger, good sights, natural pointer, just the right size. Next paycheck, she's getting one.

Then I handled the little SIG. And even though I like my service pistols, now I sort of want one too...

Morrell
April 6, 2012, 08:11 AM
+ 1 for the LC9. Love mine! A trigger as smooth as silk and recoil as soft as a baby sneeze

Demitrios
April 6, 2012, 12:24 PM
Guys, you've all been a great help and thank you for all of your advice.

I just bought a brand new Taurus TCP 738 with a Crimson Trace Laser from Buds Gun shop for $176.68 after tax.

When I saw that price my eyes nearly bugged out of my head and I picked it up quick, fast and in a hurry.

Again you've all been great and thank you all for your help.

Bone2bWild
April 6, 2012, 02:32 PM
I was just in the same boat till I picked up a used Kahr CW9. They let me shoot some so I tried 3 including a PF9, a Kahr PM9, and my CW9. I first settled on 9mm and wanted a dual duty CCW and HD gun. I thought the CW9 gave the best compromise for me and I shot it best. Don't worry about long triggers, there is a technique called staging the trigger that eliminates most of any complaints you'd have. And with the long trigger it's safer to CC, so I wanted that feature plus no safety to worry about, is it on is it off? The manual says a 200 round breakin period, now I bought used and it looked lightly used. I ran 100 rds through last nite with FMJ &JHP without a single hiccup. I'm still working on my form and got better as I shot more, but I have to say for $400 used I'm highly satisfied!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

el Godfather
April 6, 2012, 03:04 PM
Dont know if someone has mentioned this already, but I would suggest SigP250 sub compact.

Lee D
April 6, 2012, 03:13 PM
.380? Sig 238
9mm? Walther PPS with the flush mounting mag

jj1962hemi
April 6, 2012, 03:18 PM
I don't have a CC permit, but was considering a small Glock (w/be my first). I rented a 26 (9mm), a 27 (40 S&W), both double-stacked magazines, and a 36 (45ACP single stack). I liked all three. Gen 3s in Model 26 and 27 are available at Bud's for $499 new. None kicked too harshly for me, although my hands and body mass are above average. My trouble was: the lower capacity Model 36 (in honkin' 45ACP!) had a better grip for me, and less kick than the 40S&W (less "sharp"). If it was just on size and comfort, I'd spring for the Model 36. I haven't tried a Kahr yet and I like the parts availability for Glocks. I also like the fact that I can run 9MM and 357Sig through a Model 27. Decisions, decisions!

Pukindog12
April 7, 2012, 04:19 AM
In my limited CCW experience I have found that the CW9 is perfect for me for T-shirt weather as far as subcompacts go. It is almost identical in size to as well as being 7+1 like the PF9 (got one of them also), can get a full grip (no dangling pinky), is built well with good ergonomics, no safety, and has a VERY SMOOTH DAO trigger. On a good day I can keep the shots in a three inch group at ten yards. Other days typically about 4 inches. I got it with an extra mag for $360. I don't think I could be happier about a CCW piece. ;)

Granted, all the above may change if I ever get to shoot a Walther PPS. :o

19&41
April 7, 2012, 07:43 PM
Demitrios, congratulations on your new purchase. Be sure to keep us posted on how the pistol handles for you. It can also benefit others who are looking for a pistol with similar qualities.

bluethunder1962
April 7, 2012, 10:34 PM
It is a little heavy but I love my Walther PPK/s. I have two more one the way. I carry it in my pocket and 45 on my belt.

Agsalaska
April 8, 2012, 12:01 AM
Agree with the PPK. I dont know if it has been topped. At least for a 380.

Gary A
April 8, 2012, 12:03 AM
The CZ83 is a superb pistol but at almost 29 ounces with an empty magazine, it is NOT a pocket pistol. It is a beauty, though.

cluznar
April 9, 2012, 05:38 PM
Try a NAA small .22 mag 5 shot, I carry one and trust it.

rob i
April 15, 2012, 09:42 AM
I don't post here very often at all, but wanted to chime in. I have an affinity for pocket pistols and I have to echo jahwarrior's recommendation of a baby browning or PSA variant.

I have an original FN and 2 recent production Stainless PSA's. They are extremely well made, very reliable from my experiences, and insanely pocketable. They are oddly accurate for such a little pistol and have much less recoil than say a ruger lcp. I know as I have an lcp as well.

But if you don't want to consider anything less than a .380, I would suggest a Sig P238. It's small enough to fit in the pocket, and is a MUCH softer shooter than the lcp. It's my favorite .380 at the moment.

Gary A
April 15, 2012, 10:48 AM
I can second the comments from rob i regarding the PSA Baby Brownings. I used to have a PSP (predecessor) and just last weekend visited PSA 's booth at the NRA show in St. Louis. The PSAs are jewels and I remember my earlier version as being a very nice shooter.

That said, a viable option, to me, that splits the difference between the .25 acp and the harder to shoot LCP/P3AT, is the Kel-Tec P32 in .32acp. Inexpensive, reliable, easy to shoot.

Trad Archer
April 15, 2012, 10:54 AM
Sig Sauer p238. My wifw has one and she has sent at least 2,000 rounds through it. The first couple hundred resulted in some issues, but now, it runs beautifully with no issues at all.

TrailWolf
April 15, 2012, 11:00 AM
I am a Glock guy through and through, but the brand new S&W M&P Shield looks pretty great if its not too big for you...

If I didnt own a Glock 26 already I'd take a hard look at it.

rob i
April 15, 2012, 11:08 AM
trailwolf- the new shield does look nice, but it doesn't seem very pocketable.

trad archer- My p238 required two trips to sig for stove pipe issues in the first 500 rounds. Seems to run like a champ now.

Gary- thanks for the back up. I am obsessed by their guns. I bought both of my stainless ones directly through their company president, Lenn Kristal, and have my sights set on at least one or two more!!!!

for those that don't know about PSP / PSA, they are the licensed manufacturers of the baby browning pistol. They actually sell the same pistol in Europe under the FN name. They are identical in fit and finish to the original's, and perhaps even nicer due to the advances made in machining over the years. They only make this gun, but produce about 18 different variations of it. Mine are 303 stainless cut from billet.

MachIVshooter
April 15, 2012, 11:21 AM
On the Baby Brownings and clones;

Really cool little guns, and they are small. But only being chambered in .25 ACP and still weighing more than the micro .380's, they're not a very appealing choice in today's market. I have a Bauer, and I enjoy it. But I don't carry it. I carry my P3AT. With it's light weight and textured exterior, it will stay properly oriented in my jean pockets. The Bauer will not; They become inverted in short order, thus requiring a pocket holster that actually makes them bulkier to carry than a P3AT/LCP/etc. The Baby Brownings will also bite your hand web if you're not careful; They're so small that it is very easy to creep up on them. The back of the slide is slightly rounded on the under side, but it still doesn't feel good when it rakes your skin.

My P32 (same size as P3AT) and Bauer .25:

http://i110.photobucket.com/albums/n117/Hunter2506/P32Bauer25.jpg

As well, the short recoil system used in the P3 and similar pocket .380's keeps the felt recoil quite low for such tiny, light weight guns. My first gen P3 weighs a scant 10.1 ounces fully loaded, but is more pleasant to fire than any blowback .32 I've ever shot.

climbnjump
April 15, 2012, 11:43 AM
I am a Glock guy through and through, but the brand new S&W M&P Shield looks pretty great if its not too big for you...

The Shield is pushing the size limit for pocket pistols for most folks, although it might work fine in cargo pants pockets. The barrel is about .60" longer than a PM9 and the Shield is about .40" taller (due to the extra round) when both are using their flush-fitting mags.

As far as thickness, the Shield is a titch thicker, but only about on the order of .05" or so depending on where you measure. Empty, the Shield weighs 4 oz more than the PM9, so loaded the difference would be that plus the extra round in the mag.

Beyond the size, though, the biggest difference between these two is in the triggers - they are completely different. Trigger pull length and especially reset are much shorter on the Shield, while pull weight isn't much different between the two. The reset on the Shield is also audible and very positive unlike on the FS M&P pistols at the current time. (The lack of a positive and audible trigger reset has been a complaint of the FS line. I've seen rumors - maybe only wishful hoping - that the Shield trigger will be moved into the FS M&P line. Time will tell on that one.)

academy
April 15, 2012, 11:44 AM
.380? Sig 238
9mm? Walther PPS with the flush mounting mag

Amen to this. I have both of these and they're wonderful. The Sig shoots like a dream. I could go to the range, shoot nothing but that little Sig all day and be happy. The PPS is a little snappier, but still a great shooter. It's also crazy comfortable to carry, and is thin enough that you can stow it in a pocket without people asking if "you're happy to see them."

If you look VERY carefully and aren't picky about style, the Sig can be had in your budget. I got mine for something like $515 OTD at a show. He had that model and another for less, but it was used.

The PPS? Your best bet on that would be to find a disgruntled owner. I'll never sell mine, but it seems like there's always someone around here with a PPS who has some beef with it.

MrDig
April 15, 2012, 12:16 PM
Dont know if someone has mentioned this already, but I would suggest SigP250 sub compact.
These are definitely Not Pocket Guns. Way too wide and cumbersome for pocket carry. I sold mine for something smaller.

marine 97-03
April 15, 2012, 06:43 PM
Kel tec pf-9

Gary A
April 15, 2012, 07:05 PM
This thread beautifully indicates that the size which defines "pocket pistol" is literally a "moving target" as it is defined by each individual defining it. Clearly, the PSA Baby Browning, Seecamp 32/380, and Kel-Tecs are pocket pistols. Whether the Various 9mm pistols (other than the Rohrbaugh) and others, including some other .380s are pocket pistols depends a lot on the individual and his/her pockets and on the degree of concealment desired (or necessary).

Dean1818
April 15, 2012, 07:47 PM
I have a CM9 that fits the bill.....

But...... You may want to try a small 38 revolver

They draw MUCH faster IMHO

jahwarrior
April 16, 2012, 06:36 AM
I don't post here very often at all, but wanted to chime in. I have an affinity for pocket pistols and I have to echo jahwarrior's recommendation of a baby browning or PSA variant.

I have an original FN and 2 recent production Stainless PSA's. They are extremely well made, very reliable from my experiences, and insanely pocketable. They are oddly accurate for such a little pistol and have much less recoil than say a ruger lcp. I know as I have an lcp as well.

But if you don't want to consider anything less than a .380, I would suggest a Sig P238. It's small enough to fit in the pocket, and is a MUCH softer shooter than the lcp. It's my favorite .380 at the moment.
Rob, those PSA's are absolutely gorgeous. I was looking to buy a Raven, when I bought my PSP. I had a Raven when I was a kid, and wanted one for nostalgic reasons. But my dealer had a PSP right next to the Raven I was going to buy (not to mention being overpriced at $100+), and at first I thought the PSP was a Browning. I had no idea they were being made here under a different name, and after doing some research, here and elsewhere, I thought it was well worth the $200 I spent.

x_wrench
April 16, 2012, 07:53 AM
well, i wanted total conceal ability in ANY clothing, so i went with the 380's. i have a kel-tec P3AT, and a Ruger LCP. they are both very close to the same dimensions. BUT, they both have their good and bad points. with my LCP, i have NEVER (after the initial run in of 200 rounds) had a mis fire, jam, or any other functioning problem. with the kel-tec, i have had a few problems. at first, there was a problem with jamming. even after the initial run in of 200 rounds. i consider the 200 round run in MANDATORY for a gun that you are going to bet your life on. moving parts need to "mate" in order to work properly, and i do not know of a better way than to shoot it. anyway. kel-tec paid to have the gun returned to them, and shipped it back rather quickly i might add, with an entire new slide assembly. they were not going to take a chance on fixing one little thing. a couple of years later, the firing pin broke. which they sent me a replacement, no questions asked. of course, my LCP had to go back to the factory as well. it was an early model, and there was a recall on them. as far as shooting them. the kel-tec wins out on controlability, hands down. the checkering on the grip is sharp, and even with sweaty hands, i can still get a good grip on the gun with no problem. the Ruger, has an inverted checkering that gives the sweat some place to go, but there are no "points" to come out and let your skin bite into. both guns are designed to shoot very short ranges. so sights are both really weak. i have developed a much faster way of aiming, that at 20 feet (or less), is plenty good enough to stop a person (if the cartridge will). i simply look down the slide, and make sure that the top is flat and that i can not see one side or the other of the slide. this is close enough for center of mass shots. and with the long double action only of these, it is probably about as good as your going to get anyway. speaking of which, the kel-tec's trigger is a good 2-3 pounds lighter, and easier to pull than the rugers is. combine that with the superior grips, and it is easy to see why the kel-tec is the better shooter. both of these guns now have well over a thousand rounds thru them. and i do not worry about reliability anymore. i am always carrying one or the other, but in cooler weather, it is a back up gun, as i prefer to carry the ol 45. but it is going to be HARD to conceal a full size 45 in cut offs and a t shirt. and just so you know, these are actually small enough that if you need to, you can carry them under a baseball cap on your head. certainly not the preferred place, but in a pinch....

NMGonzo
April 16, 2012, 11:50 PM
If you're looking for low recoil, you're looking at the wrong guns, especially in .380ACP and 9mm. I've owned both the Keltec P3AT and the PF9, and they had some of the worst felt recoil of any gun I've ever shot. Also, their trigger pulls are about 20 miles long. The Diamonback is close to feeling like a Glock, as far as the trigger is concerned, but the recoil is still a bit much.

My pocket gun of choice is a Baby Browning clone, made by PSP/PSA, and is chambered for the .25ACP round. It's all-steel construction, but is lightweight, accurate, reliable, and easy to take down for maintenance. It's probably the smallest gun I've ever had. I can conceal it in my hand, and it fits in just about any pocket I can find.

http://unblinkingeye.com/Guns/PSP-25/psp-25.html

http://www.precisionsmallarms.com/
My pf9 was not bad at all but I work on my grip strenght.

the p3at is a kitten

BHP FAN
April 17, 2012, 12:33 AM
under $200.00!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FEG_PA-63

rob i
April 17, 2012, 11:06 AM
Thanks Jahwarrior! You got a great deal indeed!

Gary A
April 17, 2012, 01:36 PM
x_wrench, I find your experience with the LCP and P3AT to be interesting. As I looked at them, I originally chose the P3AT over the LCP for two reasons: A - it felt like it would be more secure in my hand for the checkering reasons you mentioned, and B - I figured George Kellgren deserved profit from what is essentially his idea. After shooting the P3AT and a friend's LCP side-by-side, however, my thinking changed 180 degrees. Oddly enough, for me, the LCP was more controllable, more accurate, and softer shooting than the P3AT. I do agree, however, that I liked the P3AT trigger better than the LCP trigger, but I can't argue with results. I ended up trading my P3AT toward a Bersa CC model and then bought an LCP and I'm very happy. I do have a Kel-Tec P32 that I like very much and will not be rid of. I like mouseguns and might even try another P3AT someday but am quite content with the LCP.

bluecollar
April 17, 2012, 02:47 PM
Haven't read the entire thread but something you may want to look at is a Kel Tec .32 ACP. Its the gun I carry when "I can't carry a gun." Fill it with Fiocchi hard ball for best results. It has virtually no recoil and you just about forget you have it with you no matter how you tote it. Mind has been reliable but its main drawback is its a .32;)

abq87120
April 17, 2012, 11:32 PM
One of the NRA mags had a pretty comprehensive comparison of the 380 mouse guns about a year ago. They were pretty blunt in their experiences and opinions. Anyone have a link to that article? Was the the mag American Rifleman?

BConklin
April 18, 2012, 06:01 PM
If you want a real POCKET gun, I'd look at the Seecamp LWS32. The other guns mentioned in this thread are excellent, but unless you constantly wear pants with huge cargo pockets and strong belts, they really aren't "pocket" guns.
I don't understand - the Ruger LCP weighs 9.4 oz unloaded VS the Seecamp at 11.5 oz. unloaded
The LCP is .35 inches taller than the Seecamp - The Seecamp is .04 inches wider than the LCP
And the LCP is less than 1 inch longer than the Seecamp.

In some dimensions, the Ruger is a larger gun - but only slightly so, and it carries .380 ammo VS .32

And it's considerably lighter than the Seecamp.

I really don't think one needs huge cargo pants to carry the Ruger as opposed to the Seecamp - in fact, I'd rather carry the Ruger as it's so much lighter.

jimbo555
April 18, 2012, 06:53 PM
I had the pockets of my cargo shorts extended so I could carry a Ruger police service six 357 with 4 inch barrel,but realistically for me about 16 ounces is the limit for comfort!

BConklin
April 19, 2012, 10:05 AM
I had the pockets of my cargo shorts extended so I could carry a Ruger police service six 357 with 4 inch barrel,but realistically for me about 16 ounces is the limit for comfort!
My S&W BG380 weighs in at 14 oz with 6 in the mag and one in the pipe. In a pocket holster, it's smaller than my wallet. When I carry it sits in my right front pocket.

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