My groups is drifting down and left


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Sig Bill
April 4, 2012, 06:56 PM
With my Sig P250c I shot 50 UMC 40sw 180 HPs and 20 WWB 40sw 165 FMJFNs today at the range. On the fresh mag (10 rnds at a time) I get a few in the center and drift down left. Fill the mag and repeat, same thing. As I shoot more it gets lower.

I think the long trigger is making my hand tired. Reckon so?

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gearhead
April 4, 2012, 07:10 PM
My guess is that it's either shifting in your hand or you're compensating in your grip for the muzzle flip.

Sig Bill
April 4, 2012, 07:22 PM
I've shot before this session and I had a spread like 4-5" at 25 feet. Today I'm drifting down the more I shot, I don't get it. I have to think my hand's getting tired of it. It's also the first time I've shot UMC 180 HPs but shot the WWB 165 FMJFNs before and then this happened.

I guess I'll have to wait til next month for another session and see how I'll do. I just hope the ammo prices doesn't go through the roof.

ninja45
April 4, 2012, 07:37 PM
You are flinching (anticipating recoil). You are right handed and your shots are landing at 7 oclock, right?

Do a lot of dry firing exercises.

Sig Bill
April 4, 2012, 07:55 PM
It started at the center and as more as I shoot the lower/left it gets. I'll get 2-3 mags at the center and after each mag my shooting gets lower. I load ten rounds at a time so that's 7 mags total.

Claude Clay
April 4, 2012, 08:28 PM
couple of things....you are becoming fatigued and need to rest without losing your grip; so let the gun go down and the nose touch the top of the table, than dial back the grip strength to 25%. do some deep breaths, cleansing breaths--whatever, till you feel yourself like a battery getting a surface charge. than reengage---however-- the 3 fingers below the trigger finger must hold strong to start the shot--as the shot occures and as the trigger resets. its when you suddenly increase the strength--grasping, that the nose goes down and to the left.

mrvco
April 4, 2012, 08:33 PM
I haven't shot a P250, but my P226 seems very adept at punishing me for poor fundamentals... my groups drift low and left when I don't apply equal force with my off-hand (e.g. get lazy, forget, etc.).

DoubleTapDrew
April 4, 2012, 10:26 PM
Maybe this will be of some help in determining the problem

http://www.lake-link.com/images/forumphotos/ShootersWheelofMisfortune_03052012_010105.jpg

Lex Luthier
April 4, 2012, 10:26 PM
I have learned to place the trigger exactly in the center of my first finger joint. If the trigger rests on the second metacarpal pad the whole operation gets pushed left.

Downward lagging shots may indicate anticipating the bang, or not settling your line in sight and exhaling completely.

Sig Bill
April 4, 2012, 11:11 PM
I remember what it is, I made three trips to the range since Fri so I've shot too much. On one trip I shot my Sigma 9mm as well.

I or my arm was tired. Time to give it a rest. :uhoh:

writerinmo
April 4, 2012, 11:27 PM
I had this problem crop up too. Eventually I found that my pistol was shifting ever so slightly in my hand by firing two shots, then laying the pistol on the bench and picking it up, firing two shots, and repeating this. My groups were nice and tight shooting like this. In my case it's something to do with some problems I've been having with my right hand, the docs are checking me for the beginnings of carpal tunnels. In the meantime I've started working on shooting with my off hand. Adding a Hogue grip helped immensely but even with it I can't shoot as many rounds accurately as I'd like to.

tryshoot
April 4, 2012, 11:36 PM
If sigma tracked like that also, you found it. If not I have seen guns as they heat up start (stringing) If every time you shoot a group from a cold gun it does the same its the gun. If it groups diff next time its you.

Sig Bill
April 5, 2012, 03:19 PM
No, my Sigma does fine. Never had problem with the groups. I think I was just tired and shooting a hand beater just add to it.

Pietro Beretta
April 5, 2012, 07:12 PM
It really is hard to determine on your own, having an experienced spotter can often see things you cannot; the last thing I was having an issue with was trigger finger placement. You have to position your finger so that when you pull the trigger back -- when the trigger breaks you are pulling straight back.

Sometimes your nerves get rattled loud bangs, anticipation, fatigue can all come into play.

What stance are you taking, are you locking your arms in place causing excess tension/fatigue ?

Pietro Beretta
April 5, 2012, 07:18 PM
Here is a video that, in my opinion, gives good advice -- it may help you. :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PdDFA9EtFc4

Sig Bill
April 5, 2012, 08:09 PM
I was shooting like the way Stephen Seagal shoot. I found it easier than the full frontal stance. It also brought the sights closer.

Guy B. Meredith
April 6, 2012, 02:47 AM
Maybe fatigue causing flinch. Have a friend load the pistol behind your back. Have the friend sometimes put a round in the chamber, sometimes not. Observe what is happening when you pull the trigger on an empty chamber. Better yet, go to a revolver and put an assortment of live and dead rounds in the cylinder and watch what happens when the hammer falls on an empty.

murf
April 6, 2012, 03:12 AM
first thing that goes is your followthrough. when you get tired you give up on the shot.

either rest, or concentrate more on what you are doing. stay in focus. don't let your mind wander when you get tired.

just a guess!

murf

Sig Bill
April 7, 2012, 02:55 PM
I shot 50 today and I think I'm getter better as there's no flyers. I had the injections done in my neck and lower back last Thursday and on the next visit I'll get one in my right shoulder. I wished I took pics of my last session because that was awful.

I'm pretty proud of this one.

http://img9.imageshack.us/img9/6150/s5030352.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/9/s5030352.jpg/)

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