Mayor Bloomberg on stand your ground and the NRA


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Sky
April 12, 2012, 11:56 AM
http://news.yahoo.com/bloomberg-blasts-nra-over-stand-ground-laws-223507086--abc-news-topstories.html

"In reality the NRA's leaders weren't interested in public safety. They were interested in promoting a culture where people take the law into their own hands and face no consequences for it. Let's call that by its real name, vigilantism," he said. "The NRA should be ashamed of themselves. This has nothing to do with gun owners rights. It has nothing to do with the second amendment."

Gotta love this guy and all he stands for.:what:

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CoRoMo
April 12, 2012, 12:00 PM
Yeah, I first came across it here:

http://www.politico.com/news/stories/0412/75043.html

Bloomberg's quote regarding self defense type laws, "...give people a license to murder,”.

Midwest
April 12, 2012, 12:04 PM
The antis are not going after guns this time, they are going after the laws that govern the use of a gun. We been hearing these stories that the antis have been planning a different roundabout way to achieve gun control. Looks like they are planning to use this situation to achieve that objective...(in my opinion).

kludge
April 12, 2012, 12:14 PM
Gotta love this guy who can afford to stand behind body guards.

fixed

Sky
April 12, 2012, 12:47 PM
Originally Posted by Sky
Gotta love this guy who can afford to stand behind body guards.

fixed

With a little help from my friends thusly I go! THANKS

HOOfan_1
April 12, 2012, 12:54 PM
I care about what Bloomberg has to say about ANYTHING, especially guns, about as much as care what Al-qaeda has to say about America.

Both are fanatics

The character Raymond Cocteau from "Demolition Man" must have been modeled after Bloomberg. He won't be happy until we are living in a Society like San Angeles in "Demolition Man" or "1984" or "V for Vendetta".

Sky
April 12, 2012, 01:35 PM
I care about what Bloomberg has to say about ANYTHING, especially guns, about as much as care what Al-qaeda has to say about America.


Remember the old Chinese dude who wrote the book on warfare? Think his name was something like Sun Tzu or Howard or something. He devoted many a word about knowing your foe. He was kinda famous in his day and is still quoted in many pubs and documentaries.

We have whole agencies whose sole mission in life is to study and listen to perceived enemies. IMO it is always good to listen to both sides of an argument before a judgement is made. Also you can anticipate when it might be a good time to duck and cover.....or beef up you defenses.

The Mayor has money, political clout, and the ear of many....He got voted into office....So I postulate he must have a following that does not consider themselves "fringe".

Notice when he speaks it is covered and spread via communication links for all the world to see.... That Chinese dude was pretty good you might enjoy the read?

303tom
April 12, 2012, 01:36 PM
Bloomberg is a IDIOT.................

HOOfan_1
April 12, 2012, 01:52 PM
He devoted many a word about knowing your foe.


Bloomberg is a IDIOT...............

There you go :evil:


Besides we can know our enemy without caring what they say...we care more about what they DO.

Notice when he speaks it is covered and spread via communication links for all the world to see

Well it helps that he has his own personal "news" service

elrowe
April 12, 2012, 01:54 PM
If he'd been arrested and tried for violating federal law with the whole Virginia gun store thing we'd have been over him by now. Wonder why he wasn't...

Oh yeah, I get it now, it's an agenda thing...

Sky
April 12, 2012, 01:55 PM
Well it helps that he has his own personal "news" service

Good point.

Maybe we should start a group buy for CNN??

Cosmoline
April 12, 2012, 02:02 PM
Doesn't anyone in the press have the guts to point out that he's way, way outside the Hudson drainage?

Can you imagine the fuss they'd make if the governor of, say Alaska, had the audacity to launch a campaign against the Sullivan Act?

Midwest
April 12, 2012, 02:14 PM
Can you imagine the fuss they'd make if the governor of, say Alaska, had the audacity to launch a campaign against the Sullivan Act?
.

Seriously, that is not a bad idea. I think the pro gun groups, individuals, NRA, GOA and internet groups and forums should band together and take a proactive approach against these anti gunners.

We need to stop going on the defensive and take the offensive. The Sullivan Law could be responsible for the deaths of a lot of innocent people because they were forbidden to defend themselves. We need to have marches and protests against these unjust antigun laws and the people that support them...

tdstout
April 12, 2012, 02:39 PM
Remember the old Chinese dude who wrote the book on warfare? Think his name was something like Sun Tzu or Howard or something. He devoted many a word about knowing your foe. He was kinda famous in his day and is still quoted in many pubs and documentaries.



It was called 'The Art of War'

Certaindeaf
April 12, 2012, 02:47 PM
Lesson one: Have ground to stand upon.

Bloomberg fail.

HoosierQ
April 12, 2012, 02:49 PM
The antis are not going after guns this time, they are going after the laws that govern the use of a gun. We been hearing these stories that the antis have been planning a different roundabout way to achieve gun control. Looks like they are planning to use this situation to achieve that objective...(in my opinion).

Well I think this is true. However, I think this is the act of a desperate group. Here's the thing IMHO. One has always been allowed to use deadly force to defend one's life. Sometimes people are not prosecuted for doing so (real common here in Indiana) at other times, people are acquited because a jury goes for the self defense argument. Let's face it, the difference between what any citizen has always been allowed to do vs the provisions of various "castle doctrine" or "stand you ground" laws is pretty thin in a practical sense. Heaven forbid you should shoot somebody and Heaven forbid even more serverely you should shoot somebody that really "doesn't need shooting". That's going to still be true with these new laws. You're not going to be able to shoot somebody for insulting your wife and get away with it. You're not going to be able to shoot some aggressive panhandler unless he pulls out a knife and then wouldn't you retreat even if just to avoid the thrust of the blade? Would one stand one's ground and be stabbed just so you could get that shot off? I think not. The guy keeps coming, backs you into a blind alley...well that's always been acceptable use of deadly force.

Now, I've rambled a bit...always do. I personally support these laws. I think they will make society safer, not less safe. Look at the decrease in violent crime inversely proportional to the spread of CC. It's a fact. Murder would be way down if one "normalized" the data to eliminate career criminals killing each other.

So my point is when I see people of the anti-gun persuasion arguing in this arena...I see a beaten group frankly.

Loosedhorse
April 12, 2012, 02:53 PM
Proves that anyone who is claiming that "SYG prevents charges being brought against gangbangers who murder each other" is lying. If you can indict a Neighborhood Watch captain who claims slef-defense for second-degree murder, you can also indict a gangbanger.

Shoobee
April 12, 2012, 02:55 PM
Bloomberg presides over a city that strips people of their 2nd Amendment rights completely. So he is like the pot calling the kettle black.

Standing Wolf
April 12, 2012, 03:00 PM
I have a hunch Bloomberg is wasting his money and effort to position himself as a 2016 presidential candidate. No tears.

SimplyChad
April 12, 2012, 03:03 PM
I wonder how the antis would act if we went on the offensive. Would they try to be covert ot overt in the return fight?

Bob M.
April 12, 2012, 03:08 PM
Yessiree Bob, Ole bloomin Bloomie is at it again..:rolleyes:

TheCol.U.S.M.C.
April 12, 2012, 03:16 PM
It is death by a thousand cuts, a little here and there and you have bleed out, the blood being the 2nd

ErikO
April 12, 2012, 03:19 PM
Bloomberg is just a rich kid with a megaphone and a couple of million "Get Out of Jail/political voice" bills.

NYC hasn't had a good mayor as long as I have been alive at least.

Old krow
April 12, 2012, 11:15 PM
Maybe we should start a group buy for CNN??

It's a good idea, except that it might take a while to turn the rep around. You think hanging an "under new management" sign will make them credible again? :uhoh:

Twmaster
April 12, 2012, 11:30 PM
It's a good idea, except that it might take a while to turn the rep around. You think hanging an "under new management" sign will make them credible again?

If we put an NRA logo on the screen it might.... :)

ol' scratch
April 13, 2012, 09:05 AM
Not only have they mentioned Stand your Ground, they have mentioned Castle Doctrine. http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2012/04/12/mayor-bloomberg-campaign-gun-laws_n_1420235.html

And http://www.khou.com/news/Jackson-blasts-stand-your-ground-as-Trayvon-Martins-killer-appears-in-court-147244635.html

Sam1911
April 13, 2012, 09:20 AM
You can certainly provide a LINK -- in fact, that's what we ask you to do. Just don't quote more than a handful of lines of text from the article itself.

We also ask that you provide a few of your own comments as well, rather than just dumping a clipping and link.

ol' scratch
April 13, 2012, 09:57 AM
Thanks for clarification Sam.

AirForceShooter
April 13, 2012, 10:20 AM
What's sad is Bloomie doesn't have a clue that he's a minority in this country.
The majority of states allow guns and CCW.
Most of those states are democratic and not republican.

AFS

GambJoe
April 13, 2012, 02:09 PM
Not me, if there was a crime being commited in front I would fall back to a safe... I mean an area where I could help coordinate with LE by cell phone. Way back.

alsaqr
April 13, 2012, 05:41 PM
Bloomberg will continue to huff, puff and spread his distortions and lies. In the end Bloomberg is irrelevant.

Cesiumsponge
April 13, 2012, 05:54 PM
The two most dangerous things in New York...guns and unhealthy foods. So he has a crusade to practically ban both but gets all the transfatty fried chicken and armed goons he wants. What a great example he sets!

hso
April 13, 2012, 06:00 PM
What's the plan of action here? Concern isn't enough.

Ky Larry
April 13, 2012, 06:40 PM
Calling Mayor Bloomberg an idiot is a serious mistake.He is intelligent, articulate and educated. He has a carefully thought out agenda and a plan to accomplish it. Adolph Hitler was insane, but he wasn't stupid. Bloomie is a power hungry meglomaniac who want to rule like a dictator, but dumb he ain't.

NEVER UNDERESTIMATE YOUR ENEMY!

glove
April 13, 2012, 07:16 PM
"vigilantism"

Isn't that what the Black Panthers did by putting a bounty on Zimmerman's head?
How do they get away with it? I thought we were a Nation of Laws.
Wake up White people.

Cesiumsponge
April 13, 2012, 07:54 PM
New Black Panthers. Different group, and it was a citizen's arrest bounty, not a hit. I knew it was only a matter of time before someone brought in Hitler. I wonder who the popular bad guy was before Hitler was around.

glove
April 13, 2012, 08:38 PM
"New Black Panthers. Different group, and it was a citizen's arrest bounty, not a hit. I knew it was only a matter of time before someone brought in Hitler. I wonder who the popular bad guy was before Hitler was around."

So this is legal in the USA?

Neverwinter
April 13, 2012, 08:51 PM
What's the plan of action here? Concern isn't enough.
Ensure that SYG laws don't protect vigilantes while still protecting people acting in self-defense. If they do protect vigilantes, modify the law to exclude them. If the Court's are misinterpreting the law, add language which makes it unambiguous and only protects self-defense.

Sent using Tapatalk 2

Old krow
April 13, 2012, 09:02 PM
I knew it was only a matter of time before someone brought in Hitler.

Godwin's Law -"As an online discussion grows longer, the probability of a comparison involving Nazis or Hitler approaches 1."

What's the plan of action here? Concern isn't enough.

At a minimum I think that it's worth writing your state legislature and letting them know your stance on these issues. IMHO the Castle Doctrine had very little to do with anything in this case and it's all just political posturing.

Bloomberg is not an elected official in my state. I would like to think that my state legislature feels the same way that I do about it, but in case they do not, I'll remind them.

Can you imagine the fuss they'd make if the governor of, say Alaska, had the audacity to launch a campaign against the Sullivan Act?

I'd prefer the Gov of Alaska launch a campaign against the ACLU for NOT defending the RBKA.

Ensure that SYG laws don't protect vigilantes while still protecting people acting in self-defense.

Is this something that is running rampant and I have been missing it? Most people weren't even familiar with Florida's SYG until this case and now there are vigilantes out there... that aren't the New Black Panther party?

gym
April 13, 2012, 11:37 PM
It's starting to cause concern, the current case in the courts down here in FL. I have relatives who are emailing me, who I haven't heard from in ages, asking about the "stand your ground law", "as our biased media has coined it. It's bad PR for the states where the Castle Doctrine is in effect, and now before an election, a case could be made by the liberal media for a shot at repealling our states gun laws in this area. I explained to them that this guy was just a stupid person, and not the norm but rather the exeption to the majority of lawfull gun carrying folks who quietlly go about their business. My fear is that this blows up into a national debate. which is what they are trying to do. I also ask them why all these guys have armed bodygaurds if it's so safe out there for us.

Rail Driver
April 13, 2012, 11:52 PM
The way I see it, Bloomberg doesn't have a dog in this race where the Zimmerman/Martin case is concerned.

In regards to the SYG laws, I haven't yet seen a case personally (and I've read a LOT of self defense case briefs... I focused on RKBA and self defense cases while in college for my research papers) where Stand Your Ground laws protected someone that was obviously in the wrong.

Of course Bloomberg and all the anti-gun proponents are going to attack SYG, Castle Doctrine and RKBA in general. The thing they don't or won't understand is that taking guns from law abiding citizens is not going to prevent violence at all. Look at New York, Bloomberg's home city... It's got one of the highest crime rates per capita in the country. Bloomberg himself won't go out in public in his own city without multiple armed guards.

Oh, and Old krow: Second time Godwin's law was invoked today on THR :P

Carl N. Brown
April 14, 2012, 01:59 AM
Given that the "uplifters" railed against by H.L. Mencken in 1925, to Mad Ave Exec Carl Bakal in the 1960s, to Bloomberg today have tried to ram a federal version of the Sullivan Act down the throats of the rest of us, we outside NY do have the right to criticize the Sullivan Act.

http://www.thegunzone.com/rkba/rkba-25.html
H. L. Mencken, "The Uplifters Try It Again", Baltimore Sun, 30 Nov 1925.

Tommygunn
April 14, 2012, 12:50 PM
Given that the "uplifters" railed against by H.L. Mencken in 1925, to Mad Ave Exec Carl Bakal in the 1960s, to Bloomberg today have tried to ram a federal version of the Sullivan Act down the throats of the rest of us, we outside NY do have the right to criticize the Sullivan Act.

http://www.thegunzone.com/rkba/rkba-25.html
H. L. Mencken, "The Uplifters Try It Again", Baltimore Sun, 30 Nov 1925.
__________________

Thanks for that link! Always loved Mencken!
It is striking how the argumments the antigunners used haven't changed in 87 years!!!!
Same old...same old...same old.....

Midwest
April 14, 2012, 01:05 PM
To sum it up, I will protect myself and my family regardless if I have the 'blessings' of the state or not.

Elkins45
April 14, 2012, 03:23 PM
I think the plan of action in this particular case is to let the courts do the job of airing out Zimmerman's affirmative defense. If my understanding of the way these laws work is accurate then if it can be proven that he initiated the conflict he has no "ground" to "stand". That would make all the noise about SYG laws just that- noise.

I was listening to Jesse Jackson's XM Radio show last weekend (an act of self-flagellation) and he went on a tirade about SYG laws and tossed in the need to bring back the AWB in the same barely-intelligible rant. All the good little commies are trying to exploit this tragedy to drive their own agendas. Why should Bloomberg be any different?

Tommygunn
April 14, 2012, 07:28 PM
AYB??

kenken
April 14, 2012, 07:44 PM
I wonder if this fella has any firearms? He is such a ....... un-likeable person.

kenken

Old krow
April 14, 2012, 08:38 PM
AYB??

AWB perhaps?

Elkins45
April 14, 2012, 08:43 PM
AYB??
AWB - fixed it.

HOOfan_1
April 14, 2012, 11:07 PM
AWB - fixed it.

Maybe he meant "All your base are belong to us"

I wonder if this fella has any firearms?
Didn't Rosie O'Donnell (militantly anti-gun) admit she has a gun because "she needs protection from all the people she pisses off"

Hypnogator
April 14, 2012, 11:33 PM
Didn't Rosie O'Donnell (militantly anti-gun) admit she has a gun because "she needs protection from all the people she pisses off"

Naw, that would make her a hypocrite. She just has a hired gunslinger! :rolleyes:

Hacker15E
April 14, 2012, 11:38 PM
What's idiotic is that, not only does Bloomber (and his fellow MAIG guys) fundamentally mis-characterize to the public what these laws say when they make statements like this, but they also probably don't actually understand the laws themselves.

Such ignorance in most intelligent folks usually results in an opportunity to keep your mouth shut.

Not for someone like Bloomberg, though.

rcmodel
April 14, 2012, 11:45 PM
You got to wonder how many MP7's & P90's are riding under the coats of Blomberg's covey of bodyguards that surround him all the time?

I'd be against "Stand your ground" self-defense too.
If I knew I was paying somebody else big bucks to stand my ground for me!

rc

HOOfan_1
April 14, 2012, 11:57 PM
You got to wonder how many MP7's & P90's are riding under the coats of Blomberg's covey of bodyguards that surround him all the time?

I'd be against "Stand your ground" self-defense too.
If I knew I was paying somebody else big bucks to stand my ground for me!

rc

Is he paying them, or are New York's tax payers?

Pilot
April 15, 2012, 05:44 AM
NYC residents get what they vote in office. Bloomberg is as rich as they come, but he was elected by the people of NYC. The rich think it is chic to ban guns, the poor don't want the average person legally armed, as they want easy prey. Put it together and you have liberalism at its finest.

Carl N. Brown
April 15, 2012, 09:34 AM
The NYPD shoot a black guy Diallo 41 times for pulling his wallet when cornered. The editor of Harper's magazine based in NYC calls the NYPD the most trigger happy in the nation.

In 2011 NYPD did warrantless, no-probable-cause stop-and-frisk searches of 685,000 New Yorkers, mostly minorities, with over 88 percent free-to-go nothing-found (this time).

So to show concern for the rights of the poor of New York, Bloomberg joins the media lynch mob after a hispanic guy in Sanford Florida. :barf:

Coltdriver
April 15, 2012, 12:45 PM
I wonder if the good mayor has armed protection around him, ever.

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