More deaths linked to ATF Fast and Furious


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ol' scratch
May 1, 2012, 07:10 AM
Guns allowed to walk to Mexico by the ATF were used to kill the Attorney General of Mexico's brother. The ATF apparently covered the information up.

http://www.elpasotimes.com/news/ci_20518887/report-guns-used-mexico-lawyers-murder-traced-atf-operation?source=most_viewed

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ApacheCoTodd
May 1, 2012, 10:14 AM
Geeze - and the hits just keep on a comin'. What an epically tragic scenario of bad judgement both before and after the decision to give this operation the go-ahead. It's a good thing the current administration has a fawning media. Another administration - given the operation and later (current) cover-ups - would be looking at a F-n-F-gate scenario with daily attacks from both sides of the border. and rightly too!

Red Cent
May 1, 2012, 11:44 AM
Icing?

Ryanxia
May 1, 2012, 01:04 PM
Amazing they are still walking around free after orchestrating that fiasco.

allaroundhunter
May 1, 2012, 01:05 PM
I am ready to see Holder in a set of handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit...

Bojangles7
May 1, 2012, 01:25 PM
^That would be nice but it won't happen under this administration.

Mr.454
May 1, 2012, 01:53 PM
It doesn't happen under ANY administration without serious negative publicity. Most folks don't care about anything till it's on their front door.

rajb123
May 1, 2012, 02:00 PM
CNBC had a congressman on last week who was preparing a contempt of Congress citation for Attorney General Eric Holder and others at the ATF who refuse to answer questions truthfully about Operation Fast and Furious.

At this point, we have to assume to was designed to create a situation where laws could be passed that limit multiple gun sales to individuals; right? If not, what was the original intent and purpose of Fast and Furious?

CharlieDeltaJuliet
May 1, 2012, 03:05 PM
The ATF & DOJ both need to answer for this. Both need "a house cleaning" and maybe even restructuring. They are governed by their own laws. Seems to me ALL of the three letter government orginizations need to be controlled a little better. This is a sad situation.

SlamFire1
May 1, 2012, 03:08 PM
Lets see, if Mexico asked it, would we extridite Attorney General Holder for criminal trial?

Shinbone
May 1, 2012, 03:12 PM
Need a special investigator. I'm sure they're covering up for the White House.

allaroundhunter
May 1, 2012, 03:19 PM
Lets see, if Mexico asked it, would we extridite Attorney General Holder for criminal trial?

Our administration? No. Me? No. I want him to answer for the deaths of Americans first.

Mr.454
May 1, 2012, 03:40 PM
The White House couldn't cover anything up, this the fault of the ATF over stepping their boundaries. Just look at the great track record through history of "White House Cover Ups". Every cover up failed like Watergate, Iran Contra, or the Bay of Pigs. So I don't think they would cover anything up, but maybe quietly trying to deal with it in house. I know if I was the president I wouldn't want to publicly deal with this either, it looks bad to have these things going on under your nose. Obama regardless of his political views is no fool, I'm sure he is pissed about this in private.

EvilGenius
May 1, 2012, 03:44 PM
At this point, we have to assume to was designed to create a situation where laws could be passed that limit multiple gun sales to individuals; right? If not, what was the original intent and purpose of Fast and Furious?

One of many gun exportations to various cartels in mexico (this one accidentally got exposed) that are designed to keep mexico's govt at the mercy of them (or possibly the brink of civil war) and keep the public scared so that they can justify a large budget for DHS/Border patrol, probably drone research, etc. and a possible "problem" for a politician to "solve" or use to divert public and media attention away from other real issues.






















:evil:

ol' scratch
May 1, 2012, 04:05 PM
It doesn't happen under ANY administration without serious negative publicity. Most folks don't care about anything till it's on their front door.
Agreed.

ol' scratch
May 1, 2012, 04:10 PM
NPR did an interview with him last week. I missed it, but was listening to the radio today. They apparently didn't ask him a question about this which made at least one listener mad. He sent an e-mail. I might also add that they implied in the precursor of the interview that this fool may not serve as Attorney General even if there is another Obama term in office. We can only hope. Everytime he opens his mouth, I can't find components so I can reload! :banghead::D

CharlieDeltaJuliet
May 1, 2012, 05:46 PM
This operation started in 2005-06, and has been nothing but trouble. I agree that it is the ATF to blame. I would like to see those responsible, answer for this.

Rembrandt
May 1, 2012, 06:27 PM
Holder's pretty much immune from congress and civil cases while he's still AG......once that fig leaf has been removed (depending on election outcome), he'll be in serious legal and financial quicksand as Brian Terry's family takes the matter thru the courts.

Bojangles7
May 1, 2012, 07:41 PM
It doesn't happen under ANY administration without serious negative publicity. Most folks don't care about anything till it's on their front door.

Or until the media tells them it's a major story, which in this case, obviously hasn't happened.

Twmaster
May 1, 2012, 08:53 PM
This is this administration's Watergate. The Washington establishment has indeed circled the wagons.

I am embarrassed for our country to see fools like these in power. AG Holder and all others involved in the planning and approval of this disaster to be held completely accountable.

Holder specifically needs to be indicted and when convicted sent to Levenworth.

The Mexican's can have him once he's served his sentence.

browningguy
May 1, 2012, 10:43 PM
So I've just copied in a section describing Fast and Furious but I'm not going to copy over all the citations, please feel free to research this for yourselves.

The ATF gunwalking scandal came to national attention in the United States in 2011 after the Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives (ATF) ran a series of "gunwalking" sting operations[2][3] between 2006[4] and 2011.[2][5] This was done under the umbrella of Project Gunrunner, a project intended to stem the flow of firearms into Mexico by interdicting straw purchasers and gun traffickers within the United States.[6] "Gunwalking" or "letting guns walk" was a tactic whereby the ATF knowingly allowed thousands of guns to be bought by suspected arms traffickers ("gunrunners") working through straw purchasers on behalf of Mexican drug cartels.[7]

Guess who was president when this all started (hint: NOT Obama), guess who was attorney general (hint: NOT Holder).

Now I really would prefer not to see this team reelected, however if we can't even keep our facts right why would we expect it from the other side? This was started by GWN and his AG Gonzales, lets not kid ourselves that either of the current political parties are on our side. GWB and his AG wouldn't know a constitution if it fell on their head.

Tommygunn
May 2, 2012, 12:04 AM
So...it's OK for Obama to do it....because Bush did it? Really?

HEAVY METAL 1
May 2, 2012, 12:14 AM
" Just look at the great track record through history of "White House Cover Ups". Every cover up failed ..."

But, how would you know if it were successful? :D

Husker_Fan
May 2, 2012, 08:41 AM
I don't think it's OK for Holder to walk on this just because the previous admin did the same things. I think there are enough jail cells in this country for officials from both admins.

Jim NE
May 2, 2012, 01:27 PM
I am ready to see Holder in a set of handcuffs and an orange jumpsuit...


I would LOVE to see that....but then I start thinking; when's the last time anyone saw a politiician or polical appointee actually PAY for their misdeeds? Reality starts to set in. But a good mental image, anyway. :)

Getting the administration to admit the truth regarding "FAST AND FURIOUS" has been "SLOW AND SPURIOUS".

rajb123
May 2, 2012, 01:35 PM
Please explain the intended purpose of Fast and Furious.

It is not rational that this was done by the ATF to help the Mexican government justify large budgets to combat crime and prevent immigration to the USA.

I suspect it was done to make it easier to pass laws preventing multiple gun purchases by individuals in U.S. border states. ....yeh, more gun control.

jbrown50
May 2, 2012, 02:13 PM
Now I really would prefer not to see this team reelected, however if we can't even keep our facts right why would we expect it from the other side? This was started by GWN and his AG Gonzales, lets not kid ourselves that either of the current political parties are on our side. GWB and his AG wouldn't know a constitution if it fell on their head.

You're right, and that's why there's no real urgency to get to the bottom of this scandal and only a lot of lip service being paid to it.

Both Gonzales and Holder should be in jail. Gonzales for allowing the implementation this operation and Holder for taking the baton and running with it. Both of them are rabidly anti-2A. Holder should have ordered it stopped once he took the reigns as AG. Instead, he allowed it to continue as it served the purposes of his anti-2A agenda as well.

blarby
May 2, 2012, 03:08 PM
Talk about "saving scandal" for later use.

Anyone else find it remotely interesting that after all this time this issue magically comes to light just as election year gets in to full swing ?

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