smaller than .30 for deer


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blarby
May 4, 2012, 03:21 AM
Ok, so we're in the market for a new deer rifle for the Mrs.

Its not that she's overly recoil sensitive, but most of the 30 cal rifle offerings are too strong for her to practice with regularly.

She is very adamant about a bolt action, which I fully support.

Here's the hitch...she'd also like to be able to use it for elk when the occasion arises, so the .22+ variations are out here in Oregon.

That leaves us starting at 24 cal.

So, heres the goal of this lil thread :

We need a 24 cal or larger rifle caliber with a recoil less than a .308 win, and a rifle recommendation you'd throw in the pot to go along with it.

Wave "Hi" to the Wife- she's the one that'll be reviewing this one.

If everyone's extra nice...we might get a new THR member out of this :)

Thanks Gents and Gals- I appreciate your feedback !

If you enjoyed reading about "smaller than .30 for deer" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
Inebriated
May 4, 2012, 03:28 AM
Savage Model 11 or Remington 700 of some flavor in .243 Win. I've talked to a couple Elk hunters who've had success with .243 on Elk, but I haven't used it myself.


Oh, and HI MRS. BLARBY!

GooseGestapo
May 4, 2012, 03:37 AM
If you were east of the Mississippi, it'd be easy, a .243.
But since you are west, and elk is on the menu, It is a little more problematic. However, personnaly, I'd suggest the 7mm-08. With 140gr bullets, the recoil is reasonable and it's effectiveness on elk is unquestioned.

The Marlin XS7 is light, good handling,accurate and inexpensive rifle. Ammo is easily available with good ammo in the form of Remington 140gr Corlokt at less than $20 a box. With a good, inexpensive scope such as the Leupold "Rifleman", or Redfield in 2x-7x, you've got a good reliable, lightweight package.

There are many excellent but more "esoteric" choices, but if you don't reload ammo is scarce and expensive. Choices such as the .260Remington and .257Roberts come to mind. The .270 and .25/06 are very good but recoil begins to approach that of the .30's, and ammo is more expensive for the .25/06. An rifles tend to be a bit heavier too.

In the end, it will be a personal choice.

coloradokevin
May 4, 2012, 03:44 AM
.270's have taken lots of deer and elk here in Colorado. The .243 is a great deer gun, and I know of at least a couple of people who have used them on elk (probably a bit on the smaller side for elk, but shot placement is key regardless of the gun you're carrying).

A couple of my friends took some mule deer with their .260's this year (one was shot at 565 yards, if I recall correctly -- plus or minus 20 yards of that distance, lets say). Never heard of an elk being taken with a .260, but I'm sure it has happened.

dubya450
May 4, 2012, 04:34 AM
7mm-08 and don't look back. If she gets it in the right rifle that feels and balances good for her she'll love it and manage the recoil just fine with plenty of power for deer sized animals.
And if she's looking for a smaller sized rifle, the winchester m70 compact featherweight is worth a look.

vaupet
May 4, 2012, 04:38 AM
The solution to your problem is available since the 1890's: it's called 6.5x55 se with almost the power and better accuracy then 308 and much less recoil.


Watch out: it is addictive: after a while you will change your favorite caliber for ayet another 6.5.

available rifle: used: swedisch mauser, winchester 70, ...
new: tikka t3, several cz-models

have fun

Peter

firesky101
May 4, 2012, 04:42 AM
If you think the .308 based 7mm-08 might be too much, the 7x57 mauser is a little less power with comparable loads (hornady as my reference). It still has a bit more than the magic 1500fpe @ 200yds for elk (hornady 139gr interlock), but starts out about 400fps slower than 7mm-08. Different loadings will vary, but it gives you a good idea of the comparison.

interlock
May 4, 2012, 04:49 AM
look at the projectile first. a 6.5 mm bullet of a decent wieght has really high sectional density. indeed a great amount of moose are shot in scandinavia using a 6.5 bullet. These are mainly from 6.5 x 55. The more modern .260 rem gives marginally better performance with heavier bullets.

the 7mm bullets are also proven game getters i shoot 7mm08 and it is very deadly with 139 gr bullets. there are lots of 7mm rounds. if looking for a shorter action then a 7mm08 or a 7x57 (mid length) might be a good bet. I have killed red stags with 7mm08 and 130 and 145 gr bullets.

a trap people often fall into is assuming that rhe recoil is all the same for each round. buying a nice little light rifle then firing really heavy max load rounds. My 7mm08, a remmy model 7 kicks like a mule when shooting 145 gr speers loaded to the max (its most accurate in that bullet wieght) it is perfectly pleasant with mid load 139s and with sierra 120's also pleasant.... but the 120's expand very fast and damage carcasses.

what ever you are going for look for a rifle with a twist rate consistant with the projectile wieght you want to shoot. don't worry about mega velocity. a heavy, tough bullet with relatively high sectional density delivered at reasonable rifle velocity to the pocket will drop the animal.

well done Mrs Blarby. Enjoy your hunting.

I would have no hesitation in taking my 7mm08 and its 139gr hornadies after elk, red stags or moose (elk and moose are in short supply here in lincolnshire)

eastbank
May 4, 2012, 04:54 AM
get a 700 rem sp in 7-08 in the youth model,use varget and a 120-129gr bullet for deer and a 139-140 gr for the bigger stuff. eastbank.

SimplyChad
May 4, 2012, 05:05 AM
7-08, 6.5 swede, 243, or 7mm mauser will all do the trick if she can do her part. They are all found easily online and wont break the bank. Of them i would take the 243 cheapest and makes you get close.

LoonWulf
May 4, 2012, 05:14 AM
We will all have our personal preferences, but honestly any round from the .243 on up to the .308 is a great deer round. Ive never hunted elk so will refrain from posting my uneducated opinion lol.

If i were choosing a round i would probably pick the 7mm-08. This is due to the availability of bullets, its ability to handle heavier bullets pretty well, and the fact that i am enamored to the bore diameter. Adding a pound or so of gun weight and shooting a .270 or .280 could also be an option, as could reduced recoil practice loads for the 08 or 06

As for a rifle i can only recomend that you TRY before you buy, again we all have our preferences. I personally prefer Savage or Remington 700s, but most every gun ive handled lately has be decent atleast.

Something a friend said and i agree with is that. A rifle that fits and feels good is more important then anything but reliable function.

wickedsprint
May 4, 2012, 06:10 AM
My niece got her first elk with a .243.

kingkeoni
May 4, 2012, 06:17 AM
.243 is an excellent caliber for deer and much more mile recoil than most 30 cal's.

NWCP
May 4, 2012, 06:18 AM
For longer shots the .270 would work nicely. Anything from 225 yards and closer you might want to look at the 6.8SPC II. Doesn't recoil much more than a .223 and within it's operating parameters it will put down a deer, or hog for that matter. Besides, if you pick up a 5.56 for her and then buy a good 6.8 upper she can plink all she wants with the 5.56 on the cheap and hunt with her 6.8. Two rifles for the price of one. Can't beat it with a stick. JMHO

Lloyd Smale
May 4, 2012, 06:56 AM
if your a handloader id go with a 257 roberts. Its one of the finest whitetail round going but about needs handloading to see its potential. If not and recoil is a consern id go with a 243. Contrary to what some internet experts will tell you ANY deer hit with a 100 grain bullet out of a 243 out to 300 yards in the right place is going to put meat on the table

critter
May 4, 2012, 07:19 AM
Give the 25-06 a real close look.

303tom
May 4, 2012, 09:29 AM
A Savage in .243 Winchester..............

Damon555
May 4, 2012, 09:40 AM
Your favorite brand in 7mm-08.

jim243
May 4, 2012, 09:55 AM
A Savage in .243 Winchester.............

^^^ +1

http://i620.photobucket.com/albums/tt284/bigjim_02/SAM_0305.jpg

GI_Jared
May 4, 2012, 10:03 AM
You basically described the .243 in your original post, and correct me if i'm wrong but I believe the .243 winchester is a necked down .308

DM~
May 4, 2012, 10:10 AM
For your purpose, i'd get a 7-08, as it's about perfect for deer/blk. bear and plenty for elk sized animals, at any reasonable range.

DM

Kernel
May 4, 2012, 10:11 AM
.260 Rem or 7-08 in a "Youth" rifle. But, then again, maybe you discounted the .308 Win a little to fast. It's a great cartridge, suitable for anything in North America, versatile, affordable, and tons of it is spilling off the shelf of every gun store. The other ones, not so much. Chamberings for the .308 abound. The other ones, not so much.

You can get .308 in a number of reduced-recoil hunting loads. Those are soft shooting, and it leaves open the option for full-power loads for elk or bigger game. With time, practice, proper technique, and a good recoil pad the whole recoil thing will be less of an issue.

Big Bad Bob
May 4, 2012, 10:12 AM
yes .243's parent case is .308 win.

back on topic i suggest the Savage Lady Hunter in 7mm-08 or 6.5 Creedmor

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bIw_UX6PSJ8

http://www.savagearms.com/firearms/model/11Lady

Gunnerboy
May 4, 2012, 10:34 AM
I killed my elk with a 6.5x55 this year, so it is a very capable round for that task

wyohome
May 4, 2012, 11:14 AM
I made some reduced recoil .308 rounds for my wife. 125 gr BT. They didn't shoot well in any of my rifles. I found that she really does not like to shoot targets much anyway, preferring to just shoot a mulie buck each opening day. I check her rifle each year with my regular loads, she fires 4 or 5 reduced loads to affirm her sight picture and that is that. She has fired three rounds in the last 3 years at deer and used her tag each time.

SlowFuse
May 4, 2012, 11:21 AM
For a short action cartridge, I'd put another vote in for the 7mm-08. For a long action I'd go with a 25-06. I'd compare the recoil of a heavier weight 25-06 like a Howa 1500, for example to a 7-08 on a lighter synthetic stocked rifle. You probably already know this, but I'd definitely stay away from single shots! They can be harsh on recoil sensitive people in 308 and -06 based cartridges.

Jim Watson
May 4, 2012, 11:38 AM
I don't have a wife or a hunting license, but a couple of second hand reports:
One guy here furnished his girlfriend with a .260 on the Remington 700 Youth. They agreed later it should have been a 7-08.
Another lady found the dividing line between .30-06 and .270, and bought the latter.

jerkface11
May 4, 2012, 11:42 AM
7-08 or .260 rem. Or if you handload .250 savage.

LJ-MosinFreak-Buck
May 4, 2012, 11:52 AM
Hello, Mrs. Blarby. 'Tis a pleasure meeting you!

I'd be happy with .243 Winchester. It'll take down about most of the hunted animals in North America with the proper shot-placement, and I've witnessed multiple bang-drops with this caliber. May not be the cheapest, but you will be able to practice on the regular. Recoil is a pleasant thump.

The rifle in question is an older Savage Model 110. And the round is pretty capable of being really accurate. On a good day I can group that rifle at just over in inch.

Hope this helps!

goalie
May 4, 2012, 12:00 PM
I have been impressed with the results of the .243 with the Barnes TSX or TTSX bullets on deer.

.260 is hard to complain about from a recoil or results standpoint as well.

MrDig
May 4, 2012, 12:04 PM
You basically described the .243 in your original post, and correct me if i'm wrong but I believe the .243 winchester is a necked down .308
Why yes it is a "wildcat" of the .308

GCBurner
May 4, 2012, 12:08 PM
No mention of the excellent .270 Winchester? The late Jack O'Connor must be rolling over in his grave, after all those years of pushing it as the best all-around calibre available.

wingman
May 4, 2012, 12:27 PM
243 hands down for your use, with proper loads it will do the job plus with low recoil allows the shooter to gain confidence and make one shot count,
I've seen many large eastern white tail go down(one round)with an 85gr hollow point.

wlewisiii
May 4, 2012, 12:35 PM
7x57 and don't look back.

RPRNY
May 4, 2012, 12:41 PM
The Swedes and Norwegians take loads of moose every year (which ironically they call aelg - the origin of our word elk) with their home turf cartridge, the 6.5x55. It has also taken virtually every type of African game south of the Big Five. It is a remarkably accurate, soft shooting, and diverse cartridge. Until the mid Seventies, this was the cartridge used in the biathalon, now replaced with the 22lr, which should add to the evidence that it is a soft shooting and accurate round.

A Ruger 77 RSI in 6.5x55:

http://i29.photobucket.com/albums/c286/taw1126/L1020092.jpg

I would be surprised indeed if the Missus didn't find that absolutely delightful!

blarby
May 4, 2012, 02:10 PM
That is a really nice rifle RPRNY !

TwoEyedJack
May 4, 2012, 02:20 PM
RPRNY, that is one gorgeous rifle. I have never seen the RSI in a stainless/walnut configuration. A family member has a Winchester M70 Featherweight in the same caliber that is almost as pretty.

To address the question at hand, I got my 12 year old son a Weatherby Vanguard in 7MM-08 and it is a joy to shoot. It is a little heavy for a youth rifle which really tames the recoil, and the 20" barrel makes it pretty handy. It is also pretty accurate, certainly good enough for deer and elk. I started him on 100 gr. handloads a few hundred fps off max to build confidence, and even they are more than adequate for deer unless you are shooting across a canyon.

MachIVshooter
May 4, 2012, 02:58 PM
Good deer cartridges for the recoil sensitive:

.243 Win.
6mm Rem.
.257 Roberts
.25-06 Rem.
.260 Rem.
6.5x55mm Swede
7mm-08 Rem.
7x57mm Mauser

Of these, the most commonly available (rifles and ammunition) are the .243 Win, .25-06 Rem, 7mm-08 and 7x57.

If ranges will likely be shorter, the .243 is the most gentle, and still a perfectly capable deer round at 300 yards.

If expecting longer shots (or just wanting a flatter trajectory) the .25-06 is pretty much the undisputed champion of deer rifle chamberings.

If elk are ever to be hunted, I'd suggest the 7mm-08 or 7x57. .25-06 is fine for elk with proper bullet selection and good shot placement, but the heavier 7mm bullets give a better margin of error.

Some have suggested the .270, which is certainly a good round. But the .270 Win (and .280 Rem) will kick harder than a .308 in a given rifle.

texas chase
May 4, 2012, 04:13 PM
Another vote for the 7-08. Great cartridge with reasonable recoil

Dthunter
May 4, 2012, 04:32 PM
I am coaching/teaching my sister in law to hunt.

I have set up a ruger Hawkeye, compact model.
This rifle is chambered in 7.62x39. light recoil, and accurate with my handloads.
I am loading Sierra 150 grain (.308") flat based bullets.
H335 powder. And yes the .308 diameter bullets shoot great!

The rifle has a 16" barrel.
My sister in law is 95lbs. At most, and she loves to shoot this combo.
I am guiding her for black bear this spring.

I would Love to see her get a bear!

This model of rifle also comes in .243,.308win.

Hopefully the OP will find what she likes. And good luck with your choice.
Welcome to the hunters fraternety!

Southernsorrow
May 4, 2012, 05:50 PM
I and many others have used .243 and .270win for deer for many years, I just recently switched to .308 as it seems to drop them quicker and can hit them effectively at slightly longer range. +1 on a savage rifle as you can easily switch calibers on them with a barrel swap and bolt face swap. 223/270/308 etc.etc. without buying a new rifle

68wj
May 4, 2012, 05:58 PM
Has anyone mentioned 7-08? 7-08! :p

Southernsorrow
May 4, 2012, 06:08 PM
you could drop a deer with a .223 with a headshot or direct heart shot if you go behind the shoulder into armpit area...but if you don't get a perfect hit or strike a rib they'll run 1/2 mile atleast before dropping.

68wj
May 4, 2012, 06:16 PM
you could drop a deer with a .223 with a headshot or direct heart shot if you go behind the shoulder into armpit area...but if you don't get a perfect hit or strike a rib they'll run 1/2 mile atleast before dropping.
That has been addressed.
Here's the hitch...she'd also like to be able to use it for elk when the occasion arises, so the .22+ variations are out here in Oregon.

That leaves us starting at 24 cal.

dragon813gt
May 4, 2012, 06:17 PM
257 Roberts since you want to potentially take Elk as well. Its the perfect white tail cartridge. And can be loaded up to take Elk. I know many deer are taken with a .243. But I consider it a marginal round at best. It's also the minimum caliber allowed where I live for deer. It's not allowed for elk. 257 Roberts isn't allowed either. A .308 reduced load is the best option IMO.


Brought to you by TapaTalk.

Coyote3855
May 4, 2012, 06:23 PM
Another vote for 6.5x55. CZ has a couple of nice ones.

Southernsorrow
May 4, 2012, 06:43 PM
never taken an elk, I'm in La plenty of deer here but no elk I'd assume like the rest are saying you'd need a more powerful round than the .243 and .270 to take one down. try using this chart http://www.chuckhawks.com/recoil_table.htm

Southernsorrow
May 4, 2012, 06:45 PM
or http://forum.gon.com/showthread.php?t=56996

LJ-MosinFreak-Buck
May 4, 2012, 08:02 PM
Shot placement, and selecting the proper bullet. .243 will do just fine when this equation is followed.

Panzercat
May 4, 2012, 08:25 PM
I imagine weight matters, but a heavier rifle would help to absorb the recoil of any caliber you pair with it. Light and sexy is great, but you're running a fine line with elk on the menu in terms of caliber, and since somebody always brings it up, OMG!shotplacement panic.

And damn, I don't generally go for Bolt actions, but that Ruger 77 RSI is hot.

valnar
May 4, 2012, 08:38 PM
Another vote for 6.5x55, especially if you were leaning towards the .243

If you were leaning towards the higher end, then 7x57 or 7mm-08 would do good, but I don't know how much difference in recoil they would be compared to .308.

In any case, pay attention to the weight of the rifle too. If she insists on a light rifle for similar reasons, then a lightweight 7mm-08 may not be much difference in recoil than a heavier .308

LJ-MosinFreak-Buck
May 4, 2012, 08:42 PM
Shot placement has always been key in hunting, hasn't it? Unless you guys have been pounding around shooting deer/elk/whichever four-legged-freezer-filler we're talking about here, anywhere on their body hoping for a drop. I'm just saying, I'm not trying to start a war here.

Southernsorrow
May 4, 2012, 10:12 PM
you could still go .308 if you look into semi auto actions.... bolt action rifles always have more "felt" recoil as there is no moving parts or recoil springs to take some of the thump before transferring it into the shoulder.

snakeman
May 4, 2012, 10:31 PM
Get a 25-06 or 6.5x55. They are low recoil and should work well for elk with the right bullets. Personally I would opt for the 6.5x55 Howa m1500.

Swing
May 4, 2012, 10:33 PM
Sub-30 for deer? I'd go with the .270. Maybe the .243.

T Bran
May 4, 2012, 10:41 PM
7MM/08 gets the vote here. It is enough gun for her needs but without the harsh recoil.
I dont know your budget but if you dont want to break the bank look at a Savage AXIS. They come in youth legnth which is nice for smaller statures and at 300.00 including a 3x9 scope (not high end but not bad). Buds guns has them in .223 .243 and 7/08 with free shipping to your FFL. I received one in .223 a month or so ago and am pleased with it. It is a custom with me to lend a rifle to a new hunter and gift it to them after their first kill with it. In this case it is for a close friend's wife who has started hunting hogs with us. She wont know she owns it untill she shoots a piggy but her name is already on it.
Sorry for the long post good luck in your search.
T

Damon555
May 4, 2012, 10:42 PM
No need to use a 243 on elk.....plenty of better options out there.

blarby
May 4, 2012, 11:17 PM
I think she's settled on 7-08. She thanks everyone for their help and pleasantries.


Now with the caliber out of the way........ Rifles ?

snakeman
May 4, 2012, 11:20 PM
I wouldn't take for my 257 weatherby and it doesn't kick much at all. If you placed a vanguard in 257 weatherby in a axiom or compstock from knoxx, it would be a delightful rifle and plenty potent. As far as the 7mm-08 goes I would consider the howa or weatherby line. From my experience and I've had them all, they are the most dependable and accurate rifles available out of the box. If not either of those two I would have to go Savage or TC. I don't know your budget but er shaw has a semi-custom line and so does hill country rifles.

Panzercat
May 4, 2012, 11:33 PM
Shot placement has always been key in hunting, hasn't it? Unless you guys have been pounding around shooting deer/elk/whichever four-legged-freezer-filler we're talking about here, anywhere on their body hoping for a drop. I'm just saying, I'm not trying to start a war here.
Sure has, but somebody always mentions it as if they've discovered gravity for the first time when discussing anything less than .50bmg

MachIVshooter
May 4, 2012, 11:50 PM
I'd assume like the rest are saying you'd need a more powerful round than the .243 and .270 to take one down

.243 is light for elk, but .270 will do just fine at reasonable ranges ( <400 yards) and with proper bullet selection (bonded, 140+ gr.).

7thGenAustinite
May 4, 2012, 11:54 PM
i vote .270 :cool:

Ridgerunner665
May 5, 2012, 12:24 AM
270...kills like lightening, shoots flat..it just plain works.

Its been killing elk since 1925 if I remember correctly...it didn't suddenly become inadequate our inferior in any way....elk ain't armor plated.

Sent from my DROID RAZR MAXX!

jerkface11
May 5, 2012, 03:16 AM
270...kills like lightening, shoots flat..it just plain works.

Its been killing elk since 1925 if I remember correctly...it didn't suddenly become inadequate our inferior in any way....elk ain't armor plated.

No one said it won't kill elk. However the OP wanted lower recoil than a .308 and .270 doesn't fit that.

jnoble87
May 5, 2012, 04:56 AM
Like 2-3 people said .25-06...That's it? You can't go wrong with .25-06, especially for anything long range. 270 is nice, but it packs a decent wallop in the recoil department...25-06 kills like a FRICKIN LASER BEAM, and is a mild shooter...You know where the money is at ;-)

Gunner11
May 5, 2012, 05:09 AM
250 Savage anyone, sometimes the oldies are still the best.

MachIVshooter
May 5, 2012, 12:00 PM
250 Savage anyone, sometimes the oldies are still the best.

It's a good round, but fell out of favor in the US when the .257 Roberts was introduced. Then the .25-06 was standardized and all but killed the other quarterbores.

Joemyxplyx
May 5, 2012, 12:12 PM
Interlock wrote: look at the projectile first. a 6.5 mm bullet of a decent wieght has really high sectional density. indeed a great amount of moose are shot in scandinavia using a 6.5 bullet. These are mainly from 6.5 x 55.

I've often seen this reference to Scandinavians killing moose with a 6.5. But then I read the 6.5 is not much of a moose killer, taking multiple shots to bring one down. Often the moose is just wounded and left to die.

The reason the 6.5 is used by Swedish farmers is not because it is a good killer but because it is cheap and readily available as military surplus. The moose are pests to the farmers who don't much care how they get rid of them.

Gunnerboy
May 5, 2012, 12:25 PM
^ again its all shot placement

tahoe2
May 5, 2012, 01:48 PM
since elk is on the menu also, I would start with the 6.5's(x55, x57 or x.284) and work up from there,
.270 win, 7x57, 7mm-08, .300 Savage etc... Lots of choices out there, of course handloading you can download any cartridge.
There is always the "managed recoil" loads from Remington in .308 or .30-06, just my .02 cents.

RPRNY
May 5, 2012, 05:24 PM
On the issue of 6.5 x 55 and moose, all I can say is that, having hunted in Sweden - only deer and bear, no moose myself - the Swedes have no reservations about the round for moose. I have heard no suggestions that it was a wounding round or inadequate for the task.

Yes, the wide availability of rifles in this caliber is a key factor, but given the cost of hunting in most of the Nordic countries, if it wasn't effective, they wouldn't be using it. There are very few small-hold farmers hunting big game in Sweden (with the exception of shotgun deer season). Land owners hunt big game - and have big holdings. Otherwise, you pay good money for a mooose tag. 6.5x55 is a traditional cartridge, but when fired from a $10,000 custom rifle, it is a cartridge of choice, not necessity.

I am not suggesting the 6.5 x 55 is the only cartridge that meets the OP's criteria. His choice, 7mm-08, is an excellent one as well. But 6.5 x 55 will readily do for elk, does for moose, and is a very pleasant, soft shooting round.

Now - as to rifle choice, I have to say, bang for buck, it's hard to beat Howa these days.

Sav .250
May 5, 2012, 05:29 PM
If you haven`t figured it out by now............. A 243. There are others but
go with the 243. :)

wraith56
May 5, 2012, 06:52 PM
I'll recommend the Savage Model 11. I have the long action version with synthetic stock. IMHO, It has two things going for it 1) the right weight and balance for a full power cartridge shooting from a sitting or kneeling position, 2) very simple and obvious controls design.

When I tried another guy's Tikka T3 lite at my range, it was much too light and recoiled viciously. I also like how the accu-trigger indicates whether the rifle is cocked or not, and generally how its pieces work in simple, obvious ways. It is a very simple, excellent design. When looking at the gun store check out some savage rifles. I see savages in 7mm08 all the time.

If you get a Savage, don't be disappointed if you aren't shooting .75 inch 5-shot groups at 100 yards. Other people have put a lot out alot of accuracy hype about them. My experience is limited to ordinary conditions where wind, scope parallax, and a shaky table keep my 10 shot groups over 2 inches at 100 yards.

Joemyxplyx
May 5, 2012, 07:10 PM
RPRNY wrote: On the issue of 6.5 x 55 and moose, all I can say is that, having hunted in Sweden - only deer and bear, no moose myself - the Swedes have no reservations about the round for moose. I have heard no suggestions that it was a wounding round or inadequate for the task.

You seem to know more about it than I do. I just read this review of the 6.5x55 in Terminal Ballistics Research at this URL: http://www.ballisticstudies.com/Knowledge+Base/6.5x55.html

Here's the money quotes: For many years, Norma produced two loads for the 6.5x55, the 139 grain Vulcan at 2850fps (29" barrel) and the 156 grain Alaska at 2559fps. Both of these loads were used successfully on Sweden's Moose but this deserves an explanation. Firstly, the popularity of the 6.5x55 in Sweden came from the availability of cheap surplus rifles. Secondly, the 6.5x55 has mostly been used by farmers and lower income earners but has otherwise been superseded by more powerful cartridges.

When Norma designed projectiles for the 6.5, some 600 Moose were shot and autopsied which allowed Norma to conclude that flat point bullets deliver the most shock. The resulting flat pointed Vulcan and Alaska were ballistically suited to the Swedish woodlands where shots typically occur under 150 yards. Unfortunately the poor ballistic coefficients of both of these bullets make them highly susceptible to wind, drop and energy loss at the ranges they are used at in America, Australia and New Zealand. At close ranges, these bullets perform extremely well on medium game and offer immediate shock transfer on even the lightest animals. On Moose, death usually occurs after a run of up to 300 meters.

I really like the 6.5x55 and the .260. I envy the Ruger RSI in 6.5x55 someone showed earlier. But I do think something bigger like a .270 or .30-o6 might be more suitable for large elk and moose. Just saying.

blarby
May 5, 2012, 07:29 PM
Ok, shes settled on a model...and of COURSE its hard to find.

She's looking for :

Ruger M77 Hawkeye Compact 7mm-08 Remington Rifle in Matte Stainless Finish

Ruger model # 17111

Just like the Kimber.... If someone can help me locate one of these "in stock" I'd be happy to provide a box of ammo- your choice and caliber- from Midway once she has the rifle in her hands.

Scouts Honor- I promise.

Ky Larry
May 5, 2012, 07:45 PM
Hello Mrs.B. Nice to meet you.Without knowing the type of terrain you'll be hunting it's hard to make recommendations for a rifle. If you'll be hiking an area like Hells Canyon, weight will be a major consideration.
Here's an idea you might consider. How about a Savage bolt action rifle and 2 barrels, one in 7mm-08 or .308 and another barrel in .243. The barrels are very easy and quick to change and you would be able to hunt anything from varmints to moose. Good luck.

wyohome
May 5, 2012, 07:55 PM
deleted

firesky101
May 5, 2012, 09:20 PM
Nice choice, wish I had a link for you but I am sure you will get what you want.

Yarddog
May 5, 2012, 09:53 PM
I'm with the fellows that sugested the 25 06 Great cartridge ; ) PS With less recoil
Y/D

68wj
May 5, 2012, 11:10 PM
Ok, shes settled on a model...and of COURSE its hard to find.

She's looking for :

Ruger M77 Hawkeye Compact 7mm-08 Remington Rifle in Matte Stainless Finish

Ruger model # 17111

Just like the Kimber.... If someone can help me locate one of these "in stock" I'd be happy to provide a box of ammo- your choice and caliber- from Midway once she has the rifle in her hands.

Scouts Honor- I promise.
Sounds nice. Good luck on the hunt (for the gun and the game)!

Mr. T
May 6, 2012, 03:28 AM
I would recommend a Model 700 in .270 Win. For practice I would recommend Remington's Reduced Recoil Ammunition. It has a recoil less than a .243 and the point of impact is the same as standard ammunition out to 200 yards. For hunting you could then switch to the standard ammunition.

Elkins45
May 6, 2012, 09:42 AM
Never mind...I did't read all the way to the bottom of the ad...it's not in stock.

shooter_from_show-me
May 6, 2012, 11:07 AM
Browning X-bolt in .243 for her.

splattergun
May 6, 2012, 04:15 PM
.270 or 7mm-08. Both lighter recoil than standard .30 cal and both effective on mule deer at Western ranges. I give the .270 the nod over 7-08 in the case of elk, however, but barely. My buddy's 12 year old daughter took her 1st buck last fall with 7-08

RPRNY
May 6, 2012, 06:19 PM
I really like the 6.5x55 and the .260. I envy the Ruger RSI in 6.5x55 someone showed earlier. But I do think something bigger like a .270 or .30-o6 might be more suitable for large elk and moose. Just saying.

I think that's a fair statement.

I would prefer to use something like 30-06 or 35 Whelen and think that they would give better margin of error for the average shooter. My 6.5x55 suggestion was based on the OP's criteria of low recoil AND capable of taking elk. I think humane kills on elk with the .243 would require unrealistically close ranges or really first class shot placement. 25-06 and .257 Roberts are marginally better. 6.5x55 and the OP's choice 7mm-08 represent the edge of that envelope between caliber and recoil.

The information in the Ballistics Studies piece that you reference is interesting and has some merit. As I recall, the big game round of choice in Sweden was 160 gr RN bullet. Plus, my understanding is that the Nordic moose is somewhat smaller than its North American cousin. I certainly wouldn't want to go after a New England moose with much less than 180 grs. As to the demographics of the cartridge, I suppose an author could say the same of the 30-30 as a deer round in NA. Lots of older, cheaper rifles around in 30-30 (probably the biggest harvester of deer in NA) and yet nowadays it seems to have been superseded by .308 and .300 WinMag and other more powerful cartridges. I guess only us poor farmers :rolleyes: stilll use 30-30.

RPRNY
May 6, 2012, 06:26 PM
http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=285227222

Buy it now at $669 with rings included! Wood looks nice. The Missus has excellent taste - at least in rifles:D

blarby
May 7, 2012, 01:07 AM
Har har har.

Almost as funny as the rifle not being findable !

Everyone has made great suggestions....to either out-of-stock items, or da wrong rifle !

I appreciate it though....someone is gonna earn that box of bullets yet !

RPRNY
May 7, 2012, 01:34 AM
PM sent with details on in-stock laminate rifle. Enjoy.

elrowe
May 7, 2012, 03:05 AM
.257 Roberts with 100gr boattails for deer - can go up to 120grain for elk (I know it's common to kill elk with .24 and .25 chamberings, but too small IMHO - and KY law requires .270 or larger for elk anyway). Either M77, Kimber, or Ruger No. 1.

More (maybe MOST) importantly, can you share your secret so that I can get my wife to start hunting too???? Been trying to get her into the woods with me for years!

vaupet
May 7, 2012, 08:17 AM
For my shoulder, recoil of my Carl Gustav in 6,5x55 is A LOT LESS then recoil of my Interarms mark X in 270 win.

Could of course have something to do with the rifle being some 4 lbs lighter

blarby
May 7, 2012, 03:49 PM
Still no dice for the search for the 7-08. This might be a long one !

CountryUgly
May 7, 2012, 04:00 PM
First off Hi to the MRS. hope all is well.

Savage Model: 111 FHNS in 25-06 with a 3-9x40 Nikon pro staff glass and if the recoil is still a tad much you can change the factory recoil pad to a Decelerator® Recoil Pad from Pachmayr. My 2 cents worth.

blarby
May 7, 2012, 04:02 PM
...............

Thanks to everyone for your help, it was greatly appreciated !

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