[dak0ta]

Can you guys tell me about the quality of the East German shotguns made by these brands? Were they decent guns? They look awfully similar to one another. I've read they were built in the Thalmann factory and stamped with either name.

JP Sauer & Sohn SXS: http://www.shop.tradeexcanada.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product/14211.png

Simson SXS:
http://www.shop.tradeexcanada.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product/19051.jpg

Merkel SXS:

http://www.shop.tradeexcanada.com/sites/default/files/imagecache/product/19023.jpg

[oneounceload]

Sauer used to make Colt rifles and Merkels currently start about $6,000.

Since your pics won't enlarge, hard to tell about those in question

[JohnBT]

www.uplandjournal.com/cgi-bin/ikonboard312a/ikonboard.cgi?act=Print;f=1;t=59088

These folks don't think too much of them; speaking of the DDR/East German guns.

[wlewisiii]

Thanks for that link, lots of good info there. The link to http://www.simpsonltd.com/ looks entertaining too, interms of wanting to go there and snoop through the piles. Bound to be something acceptable hiding in between the crufties ;)

[451 Detonics]

They are junk and unsafe...please immediately ship them to me for proper disposal!

In all seriousness these are well made brands and I would be happy to own any of them.

[dak0ta]

How about the older AyA Spanish shotguns? The No.3 and No.4.

[earplug]

I have one. Decent shotgun, but steel is a bit soft for lots of shooting. It shoots loose earlier then many other guns. In its day it was a nice gun for the price.

[dak0ta]

Is the steel in the East German shotguns up to the task of shooting lots of clays? Of the 3 above, Sauer, Merkel, and Simson, which is the best GDR shotgun?

[PabloJ]

Look for West-German vintage J.P. Sauer (ejector version goes by 'Royal') it's very stout construction and heavy enough not to loosen all your tooth fillings when you shoot if you have them. The price for clean one was about $1200 five years ago therefore it should be worth about $1000 today (those sell like "penicillin laced" bread).
The problem with current German stuff is high cost while the old East-German guns were light in weight and tight in choke. The usual full---fuller is only useful when birdy is flying away and the gun is still slung over the shoulder by the strap. Now you know the riddle between tight chokes and presence of sling swivels on ole' German doppelflinten.:banghead:

[dak0ta]

Right but was East German steel good? Will it withstand to clay games and hunting?

I guess one of the barrels could be opened up to modified. I just don't want to have the gun and not be reliable.

[PabloJ]

Yes those will hold up well most having Purdey double underbites and Greener x-bolt (the least expensive 'Suhler' extractor models can be found w/o X-bolt) but I would use light loads due to low gun weight. Although made at VEB Ernst Thallman Werke like Merkel the Simson branded weapon will tend to be least expensive simply because many will be confused by strange name. Another sleeper is Husqvarna 350 series A&D gun. Last one I have seen was priced at $500 at which it's impossible to go wrong and on upside those are put together more like British game guns (ie. easier on the eye).

[PabloJ]

PS. French rendition is called Manufrance 'Robust'.

[dak0ta]

What are the purdy underbite and greener xbolt?

Have you heard of the Thalmann 125 model?

[PabloJ]

Purdey underbites are two lumps under the barrels with which those are fastened to the action when the gun is closed. The x-bolt is top fastener between barrels at breech end through which round bolt fits to further secure action to the barrels. Thalmann 125 does not ring a bell.