[Uncle Richard]

I was sorting tumbled 40sw brass today and somehow there were several cases with un-fired primers, which were thrown away. Would a case with a live primer explode while de-capping in a sizing die?

Im asking because a 40sw case with a live primer may get over-looked when reloading on my Hornady LnL. Im Leary of it going off while re-sizing. What is the probability of this happening?

[ArchAngelCD]

I have removed plenty of live primers and I have never had one go off. Primers are designed to ignite by striking the front of the cup, not by pushing on the inside of the primer.

[cavman]

I can't address probability but with my dillon 650 with 45 acp and really cranking , I mean really cranking , without knowing there was a live primer, i had one go off. It blew the little cap catcher to smithereens.

However, knowing that I was de-capping a live primer and just going slow but steady, I have done many with nary a problem.

[Josh45]

Nope.
Won't go off.
As long as your cautious. Do it slow and you won't have an issue.
I even done this with Federal Primers. No issue.

[Lost Sheep]

While it is true that primers are designed to go off by denting the back of the cup and pinching the priming compound between the anvil and the cup, you can perform that same pinch by punching the anvil from the front.

Seating the primer actually stresses the priming compound, too, by squeezing the anvil into the cup. Look at a primer from the side. Measure its height and measure the depth of the primer cup.

Yes you can safely deprime a cartridge with a live primer. Wear gloves, eye protection (full face shield is best) and long sleeves and maybe ear protection as well. Armored like that, you are pretty darned safe.

I have done several and never had one pop, but have testimony of those who have (and sometimes they do pop, so the protection is a good idea). The most important thing is to go slowly. Primers are intended to go off when struck hard and fast.

I have also crushed primers into the primer cup sideways and folded them in half. I have never had one go off (outside the chamber of my guns).

I suggest you take a primed empty case, chamber it and fire it off so you know how load it is and how much energy the release. Don't point it at anything within a foot or two. It will leave a mark (scorch or powder, I am not sure, but it won't wash out.)

Lost Sheep

[greyling22]

never had an issue. I go slow, catch the primer and reuse it. They still work.

[jcwit]

Primers ignite from impact not from pressure. Simple as that.

[Otto]

Primers can explode if subjected to friction, percussion, heat, flame, spark or static electricity.

[medalguy]

True but slow pressure will deprime a case every time. I've done thousands. Yes thousands.

[jcwit]

Primers can explode if subjected to friction, percussion, heat, flame, spark or static electricity.

This is true. But very few firearms or reloading tools utilize friction, heat, flame which is also heat, spark which is an electrical flame, or static electricty which is also a form of spark which again is electrical flame as a means of ignition or for that matter a form of removing spent or live primers.

In the land of firearms and reloading tools again primers are "usually" ignited by impact not pressure.

[1SOW]

I've deprimed 'm a n y' Fed SPPs.
As said above One form or another of heat or percussion WILL ignite it.
I tested one using heat. It will get your attention much more than percussion using a hammer.

[Lost Sheep]

Primers can explode if subjected to friction, percussion, heat, flame, spark or static electricity.
I'm not sure where this falls in your list, but my MRI tech told me that their machine can set off ammunition. At least that's what they learned in training and I know of one instance in Brighton, NY, September 13, 2000.

But that one instance is not really on point of the OP. I just find this story so fascinating.

Lost Sheep

[Uncle Richard]

the small pistol primers appear to be winchester. I will check the cases before loading into the case feeder. They say "an ounce of prevention is worth more than a pound of cure." I don't want any to go off, the powder drop (with 1/2lb wsf powder) is right beside the sizing die.

thanks for the advice.

[Walkalong]

It is highly unlikely, but do them separately without other live primers or powder nearby just in case you win the lottery.

[Lonely Raven]

Reloading manuals and die directions say to never deprime a live primer.

I'm too cheap for that. I gear up for war and deprime the live primers in my Rockchucker with a clear table (nothing to ignite). I've never had one go off, but I'm sure it will happen eventually.

[dickttx]

Where do these live primers, in empty cases you are reloading, come from?

[joecil]

I've decapped a number of live primers using the Lee Universal Decapping tool in a single stage press without one going off however I have sure heard it happening. If worried simply drop the cases in solvent for a while unless you can fire them in a gun. Once done you will need to clean out all the solvent and re tumble or sonic clean which ever method. In a pinch I soak the brass in Dawn and water followed by a straight vinegar bath for about 10 minutes following both the steps by a complete rinse in water. At that point you can let air dry or put on a towel in the oven for a few minutes at 180 to 200 F to speed up drying.

[Uncle Richard]

Where do these live primers, in empty cases you are reloading, come from?
don't know, somehow mixed in my bucket of empty brass.

[Uncle Richard]

I've decapped a number of live primers using the Lee Universal Decapping tool in a single stage press without one going off however I have sure heard it happening. If worried simply drop the cases in solvent for a while unless you can fire them in a gun. Once done you will need to clean out all the solvent and re tumble or sonic clean which ever method. In a pinch I soak the brass in Dawn and water followed by a straight vinegar bath for about 10 minutes following both the steps by a complete rinse in water. At that point you can let air dry or put on a towel in the oven for a few minutes at 180 to 200 F to speed up drying.
Thats a good idea..... I could soak them in water for a day or so and let dry out.

Thanks.

[Gabes220]

No need to soak, just de cap em. Wear safety glasses... As always with reloading...

Sent from my SPH-D710 using Tapatalk 2

[EMC45]

Decap and re-use them. Safety glasses and a slow steady hand will yield you some primers for reuse. Nothing unsafe about it.

[454PB]

I throw a heavy bath towel over the press when removing live primers. I've never had one go off in 40 years of handloading.

[Kevin Rohrer]

Take your time and there will not be a problem.

[kingmt]

It is safe. Even if one pops it won't hurt you. I have had them go off seating them & it is no big deal. If in a decaping die everything is contained.

The powder is safe also. That stuff is hard to burn if it isn't sealed in a cartridge.

[mizer67]

I was taught to NEVER, under any circumstance, decap a live primer, but when I did to go slowly and carefully with eyepro and earpro in place. :D

[Walkalong]

The safe way is to use a sizer die or a universal decapping die and slowly decap, but I routinely use a home made brass hammer and a Lee decapping pin to knock out the odd primer here and there. Set the case on a base with a hole in the middle and gently knock them out. I assume that some day one will go off, but not yet. If I had more than one to do, I would get out the appropriate die.

I am not saying you should do it this way, you probably shouldn't, I am just using it as an example that they don't go off that easily, and so de-priming with a die is highly unlikely to set one off, and not dangerous if it does.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=164673&stc=1&d=1337301693

[T Bran]

I recently received a bag or 38 special brass from an unknown source along with all kinds of other goodies. Two plastic grocery bags full to bursting just dumped together. Some is fired some is resized and decapped some is primed. At least 1/3 seems to be primed but not knowing the age or origin every one will be treated as fired range pick up.
I have deprimed a few live primers but it looks like there is soon to be a lot more expericnce under my belt.
Just go slow and wear your eye/face protection if one goes pow wipe off your stool and keep on going.
I do like the idea of putting a towel over the press great idea thank you I'm going to adopt that one.
T

[Lost Sheep]

I recently received a bag or 38 special brass from an unknown source along with all kinds of other goodies. Two plastic grocery bags full to bursting just dumped together. Some is fired some is resized and decapped some is primed. At least 1/3 seems to be primed but not knowing the age or origin every one will be treated as fired range pick up.
I have deprimed a few live primers but it looks like there is soon to be a lot more expericnce under my belt.
Just go slow and wear your eye/face protection if one goes pow wipe off your stool and keep on going.
I do like the idea of putting a towel over the press great idea thank you I'm going to adopt that one.
T
I have a suggestion:

Chamber the live primed cases and fire the primers. That way you don't have to worry about disposing of live primers.

After setting off a lot of them you might change your mind and decide to load some light plinking loads so you can have some fun while cleaning up your unknown source brass.

Lost Sheep

[James2]

Primers develop quite a bit of energy. Enough to send the primer cup down the slot in the press at a very high rate of speed, and from there who knows where?

That said, be careful. Yes I have many times deprimed live primers. Go slow and cover the slot in the press with a towel as already suggested and wear your goggles. I have never had one go off depriming them, but it seems some have, so it is a definite possibility.

[newfalguy101]

I also belong to the "I have safely deprimed live primer" club

slow and steady, slow and steady...........

[armarsh]

The safe way is to use a sizer die or a universal decapping die and slowly decap, but I routinely use a home made brass hammer and a Lee decapping pin to knock out the odd primer here and there. Set the case on a base with a hole in the middle and gently knock them out. I assume that some day one will go off, but not yet. If I had more than one to do, I would get out the appropriate die.

I am not saying you should do it this way, you probably shouldn't, I am just using it as an example that they don't go off that easily, and so de-priming with a die is highly unlikely to set one off, and not dangerous if it does.


I do the exact same thing, except I don't have a hammer on my bench so I use a screwdriver handle as a hammer. Done it hundreds of times.

I pull apart any rounds I find at the range. I would rather risk popping a primer than shooting something unknown.

[35 Whelen]

I have removed plenty of live primers and I have never had one go off. Primers are designed to ignite by striking the front of the cup, not by pushing on the inside of the primer.
What he said. EXACTLY my experience.

35W

[EMC45]

I recently received a bag or 38 special brass from an unknown source along with all kinds of other goodies. Two plastic grocery bags full to bursting just dumped together. Some is fired some is resized and decapped some is primed. At least 1/3 seems to be primed but not knowing the age or origin every one will be treated as fired range pick up.
I have deprimed a few live primers but it looks like there is soon to be a lot more expericnce under my belt.
Just go slow and wear your eye/face protection if one goes pow wipe off your stool and keep on going.
I do like the idea of putting a towel over the press great idea thank you I'm going to adopt that one.
T


I would load up the primed cases with a middle of the road target loading and shoot them. Heck half the work is already done for you! "Shooting" primers in a revolver will 9.5 times out of 10 tie up your wheelgun. Bad idea.

[sugarmaker]

I stick a rag in front of the ram. Decapping corrosive '06 WRA45 military ball as a kid (and then re-using the powder and bullet) I had many primers go bang in the press. The cup comes down a curved RCBS primer slot, bounces off the press frame, and you don't want to be in its way after that. An old washcloth will stop them quite well.

[Crashbox]

I have accidentally de-primed live primers (Federal SP Magnum) before, with no issues- I somehow got my primed & belled cases intertwined with the spent ones on my bench. "Slow and smooth" is the key IMO.

[Gtimothy]

I too have deprimed live primers without incident. Judging by the number of people who have accomplished this and had no adverse effects, I would say go slow and remove the primer.

[4895]

I too have removed live primers with a resizing die. I have removed upside down primers, sideways primers, and primers installed correctly of unknown origin. If you are in doubt at all simply throw them away. It is better to lose $5 worth of components than sleep over the issue.

[Walkalong]

removed upside down primers, sideways primers, and primers installed correctly
Yep.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=98512&d=1242948036

[Uncle Richard]

It apprears that none of the primers in the picture went kaboom?

[Walkalong]

Correct, and were removed with the above hammer and de-capping pin.

I still recommend one use a die, and go slow, not a hammer.

[Uncle Richard]

Correct, and were removed with the above hammer and de-capping pin.

I still recommend one use a die, and go slow, not a hammer.
Walkalong...

I think its odd that some of those didn't ignite. The compound in a primer is pressure sensitive, believe it might be potassium perchlorate. That being said, it wouldn't matter how the compound ingredient gets crushed, it would ignite.

I will go slow and easy on the press.

[JohnM]

I think its odd that some of those didn't ignite. The compound in a primer is pressure sensitive, believe it might be potassium perchlorate. That being said, it wouldn't matter how the compound ingredient gets crushed, it would ignite.

Wrong. It takes impact. Not just pressure on the primer.

[Walkalong]

The priming compound must be crushed between the cup and anvil with sufficient speed/force.

If guns with weak springs can't set them off, even after showing a small dent in the cup, de-capping with a die, which does not even harm the cup at all, certainly isn't prone to do so.

There is always that oddball, super sensitive, one in a million primer waiting out there, but in general, they are hard to set off.

[JohnM]

Out of curiosity I took some primers out to the shop one time to see if I could get one to go off in the big vise out there.
No matter how fast I tried to crank the vise jaws shut, they would not fire.
With a primer squeezed between the jaws to about the thickness of a piece of tissue paper, if I gave a sharp rap to a jaw with a hammer they would finally pop.

[kb58]

... if one goes pow wipe off your stool and keep on going....
That's pretty funny, either way it's taken.

[edfardos]

why not just fire the primer in the firearm? Wear hearing protection tho, a lrp sounds just lie a .22lr going off.

[Swampman]

I may be a bit paranoid, but if an unfired round that I pick up at the range looks like it might possibly be a reload, I pull it down for components. This has given me a fair amount of experience in decapping live primers. The first few times I did it, I took all precautions, gloves, long sleeves, face plate etc. After pulling many hundreds (possibly thousands), with nary a pop I changed my technique to what an EOD friend called the "Modified Half A--ed Method" that he used for crimping detonators. He was trained to always hold the crimping tool and cap directly behind the largest set of muscles that he (or any other human) possesses. That way, if the cap goes off while crimping, you just get a lumpy behind for the rest of your life, instead of losing eyes, lips or teeth.
I always use a single stage to decap live primers, my current method is to place a shop rag around the bottom of the ram, don a work glove and then to turn the least attractive portion of my anatomy in the direction of the press. I then sort of bow away from the press while I slowly pull the handle down. It takes a lot more time to describe than it does to perform and I can probably do eight to ten cases a minute, although I've never actually timed the process.
As I said, I've never had one go off, including a bunch of WWII era '06 with crimped primers that I've decapped over the years, so I may be over-cautious. I will say that I think the operation should be well separated from the actual loading process, particularly if, as in Uncle Richards case, you've got a hopper full of powder right next to the decapping die. I doubt you'd ever have a problem, but if you did, and it was filmed, I bet you'd have a couple million hits on YouTube within a week. Decorum prohibits me from even speculating on what the videos title might be...
Swampman

It just occurred to me that I didn't mention wearing eye protection during my process, not because I don't, but because I've just gotten into the habit of wearing them pretty much all the time when I'm loading.

[fatious22]

Can anyone explain how, if ever, they removed a primer that seated placed backwards (upside down)?

[JohnM]

Can anyone explain how, if ever, they removed a primer that seated placed backwards (upside down)?

Same way you would remove any other.

[fatious22]

So one side is not apt to discharge as a result of pressure than the other?

[fatious22]

Correction: So one side is not MORE apt to discharge as a result of pressure than the other?

[rcmodel]

No, pushing on either side is not at all likely to discharge it, unless you hit it a hard blow.

Pushing it out with the depriming pin in the press does not transmit the shock necessary to set off a primer, unless you slam the press handle down as fast & hard as you can.

rc

[jcwit]

What is it about impact versus increasing pressure to remove a primer that is so hard to comprehend.

[JohnM]

Can't figure that one out.
Maybe they push on a hammer to drive a nail in? :banghead:

[Lost Sheep]

Same way you would remove any other.
I have done this.

I used the sizing die and regular decapping pin without changing any adjustment and pushed the primer out slowly.

There was no significant depression in the primer cup from the ordeal.

Then I turned the primer over, and seated it right-side up and it worked just fine, firing no differently than any of the others in that batch.

Lost Sheep