Brass Knuckles?


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Swing
May 20, 2012, 11:23 PM
For reasons completely unknown, I've got a bug in my bonnet for a set of brass knuckles.

Question one, are these federally regulated at all like switchblades? Everything I've read indicates the answer is "no", but I thought I'd throw it out there. They are legal to own in my state.

Question two, any recommendations on a vendor?

Finally, to answer the "why" question, just for poops and giggles. Nothing more, nothing less.

Thanx.

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TurtlePhish
May 20, 2012, 11:53 PM
Unregulated, and my LGS has them for $15 apiece. I could pick some up and ship them if you want.

Mrcymstr
May 21, 2012, 12:00 AM
If they are legal to own in your state hit any local martial arts store or maybe a flea market that's on the larger size and stop by the knife counters. Its where I've always seen them

hso
May 21, 2012, 12:25 AM
are these federally regulated at all

No

You may want to search this forum for previous threads on brass knuckles to see what others have recommended.

Ron James
May 21, 2012, 12:26 AM
Out of curiosity, what states are they legal in??? Every state I've ever lived in, they were illegal big time. Of course I have not lived in all 50 states so which ones are they legal in?

Swing
May 21, 2012, 12:33 AM
Thanks all for the replies.

What is LGS? A google search turned up a gazillion unrelated results.

As to legality, I can't speak for all states, but many are OK with ownership but not with concealed carry of said. Best to check local/state laws, naturally.

Mrcymstr
May 21, 2012, 12:34 AM
LGS = Local gun store

Swing
May 21, 2012, 12:35 AM
Gotcha. My local fun store doesn't have them, for sure, but they are likely sold elsewhere.

JShirley
May 21, 2012, 01:15 AM
Like shuriken and a few other martial-arty geegaws, brass knucks are usually legal to own, but illegal to carry.

John

hso
May 21, 2012, 09:22 AM
http://www.bladehq.com/cat--Custom-Knuckles--254

Fun to collect, but dangerous to use.

mdauben
May 21, 2012, 11:11 AM
Out of curiosity, what states are they legal in??? Every state I've ever lived in, they were illegal big time. Of course I have not lived in all 50 states so which ones are they legal in?
I think they are illegal in just about all states, to carry. If you are caught with a set in your pocket you can be in serious trouble. A lot of states, though, do not make it illegal or buy or own them, which makes collecting legal.

Swing
May 21, 2012, 11:33 AM
http://www.bladehq.com/cat--Custom-Knuckles--254

Purdy.

Fun to collect, but dangerous to use.

Indeed. I wouldn't consider it a defense tool for so much as a nanosecond. Collectible GeeWhiz factor and nothing else.

hso
May 21, 2012, 11:34 AM
Just be certain of your state possession laws before putting a set on your desk at work as a paperweight.

DammitBoy
May 21, 2012, 12:05 PM
I know several very hard core biker types who wear huge stainless steel rings on every finger to have the effect of brass knuckles while getting around the law against possessing brass knuckles...

ScottieG59
May 21, 2012, 01:34 PM
I know several very hard core biker types who wear huge stainless steel rings on every finger to have the effect of brass knuckles while getting around the law against possessing brass knuckles...

The rings will not effectively transfer the force to the palm. Fingers are very fragile, especially the ring and small fingers. Punching can cause serious hand damage. For example, imaging when someone ducks and you hit the forehead or crown.

ApacheCoTodd
May 21, 2012, 01:39 PM
I know several very hard core biker types who wear huge stainless steel rings on every finger to have the effect of brass knuckles while getting around the law against possessing brass knuckles...
I had a thing a while back for vintage black-jacks, saps and cool brass knuckles. After near gettin' in a pickle in California over a beautiful trench knife I bought at a flea market the novelty wore off. I had hit the trifecta for that state in that I bought it while riding one of my motorcycles with no bags so I had it wrapped in a plastic bag in my jacket and a CHP guy saw the handle at a cafe. Wonderful law-dog that the was, he stopped me quietly outside and asked me about it. After naively telling him all about it and about to show it to him he said something like "Oh, I don't need to see it as long as it's not a trench knife -- that'd be a violation of dirk/dagger-brass knuckle-concealed weapon weight". Message received and understood Officer Discretion!

Or, Legality - shmegality... just tell 'em you're representin'!

Dr.Rob
May 21, 2012, 02:11 PM
Never found a pair that fit me, but bought a set at a gun show for $5 for a photoshoot.

Legal to own, specifically prohibited in Denver law. Worse than getting caught with an unlawful concealed pistol. Not sure if CO law is as strict but Denver is specific about brass knuckles, nunchucks, blackjacks, saps and spring billys.

308win
May 21, 2012, 04:06 PM
The following is from the Ohio Revised Code. The literal definition makes a watermelon a deadly weapon if you use it to assault a person and cause their death with said fruit/vegetable.


2923.11 Weapons control definitions.


As used in sections 2923.11 to 2923.24 of the Revised Code:

(A) “Deadly weapon” means any instrument, device, or thing capable of inflicting death, and designed or specially adapted for use as a weapon, or possessed, carried, or used as a weapon

TurtlePhish
May 21, 2012, 04:13 PM
The following is from the Ohio Revised Code. The literal definition makes a watermelon a deadly weapon if you use it to assault a person and cause their death with said fruit/vegetable.


Well, I guess I'll have to leave my CC melon at home if I ever visit......

hso
May 21, 2012, 04:25 PM
thing capable of inflicting death, and designed or specially adapted for use as a weapon, or possessed, carried, or used as a weapon

I would have to assume that your watermelon wasn't designed or adapted for use as a weapon nor were you carrying/using it solely as a weapon (unless as a weapon of mass ingestion).

308win
May 21, 2012, 04:32 PM
I would have to assume that your watermelon wasn't designed or adapted for use as a weapon nor were you carrying/using it solely as a weapon (unless as a weapon of mass ingestion).

Lots of or's in the definition such as: "...or used...". There is case law from a case in the Cincinnati area (I think) that established a tire iron as a deadly weapon. Admittedly, a watermelon is an example bordering on the absurd; on the other hand, it is not a leap to apply the definition to brass knuckles or a sap.

kBob
May 21, 2012, 05:28 PM
OK lets give Jorge a frozen Honey Dew Melon to launch from his slingshot cannon.

Not a weapon?

Oh, NO! Jorge might read this and try it!

-kBob

hso
May 21, 2012, 06:13 PM
308win,

No question phrases like "or used as a weapon" are a catchall that allows anything that wouldn't get laughed out of court to be treated as a weapon when used as one.

T Bran
May 21, 2012, 06:32 PM
Never bought a set but have made my own version.
One day goofing off at the shop I started making hatchet heads out of 3/8 plate for the crews. I had one leftover and decided instead of hafting it to cut a finger slot down the center, needing a better grip I welded a piece of 3/4 round stock to the bottom as a palm pad. Never used it for anything but it is truly scarey looking and stays at home to avoid any misunderstandings.
T

DammitBoy
May 21, 2012, 08:34 PM
The rings will not effectively transfer the force to the palm. Fingers are very fragile, especially the ring and small fingers. Punching can cause serious hand damage. For example, imaging when someone ducks and you hit the forehead or crown.

That would be why the bikers carried either a handwidth dowel or metal bar stock that they would palm right before a fight.

Easily disposable after the fight. Not that I condoned the behavior, just aware of it.

Owen Sparks
May 21, 2012, 11:14 PM
No question phrases like "or used as a weapon" are a catchall that allows anything that wouldn't get laughed out of court to be treated as a weapon when used as one.

Then by logical extention wouldn't you have to actually use it as a weapon before being charged with a crime?

Crime is an action, not a tool.

Ron James
May 21, 2012, 11:42 PM
As far as brass knuckles are concerned, if you are caught with them you are considered guilty untill proven innocent. Brass Knuckles are just one of those things that leave a bad taste in every ones mouth, right or wrong , that is the way it is.

sherman123
May 22, 2012, 12:04 AM
As far as the legality of carry, my home state of Kentucky allows it with a carry permit. Kentucky issues concealed deadly weapons license so it allows the carry of them as well as nunchukas,shurikens and a few other things.

Tomcat47
May 22, 2012, 12:11 AM
A Roll of Quarters will suffice!

Owen Sparks
May 22, 2012, 12:30 AM
Law or no law I much prefer a short heavy stick to brass knuckles.

308win
May 22, 2012, 09:42 AM
Then by logical extention wouldn't you have to actually use it as a weapon before being charged with a crime?

Not necessarily; concealed carry of designed as weapons is expressly prohibited. Use or intent to use is not a requirement. I believe that conviction of illegal carry of a deadly weapon places you under disablity to possess a firearm.

ETA IANAL

Wolfsbane
June 27, 2012, 06:45 AM
Well you can get knuckles of a similar design made of 1/2" lexan.

http://www.knockoutknucks.com/lexanknuckles_s/4.htm

http://www.brassknucklesnation.com/SearchResults.asp?Search=lexan

Many more dealers, some cheaper. These are the first two I grabbed off google.

I have no idea as to the legality. One of the websites is claiming they're 50 state legal. I doubt it. (PS Found a 2008 Daily News article saying they're illegal in NYS. Probably other states as well.) The intent is the same as brass knuckles, you're just substituting a different material. They can say whatever they want, they won't be sitting in jail and/or court with you.

The problem isn't having the police misunderstand why you're carrying them. It's having them accurately understand why you're carrying them.

glistam
June 27, 2012, 09:38 AM
I know for a fact that several states have closed the non-metallic loophole. California added to their law so that wood, plastics, composites etc. all still count if the item is designed to inflict more damage when you punch people with it.

Owen Sparks
June 27, 2012, 02:18 PM
A short, heavy 5" stick can be every bit as effective as brass knuckles if you know how to use it as a strike enhancer. It will concentrate the power of your strike on a very small hard surface. You can butt it into the heel of your palm just like a short knife and use it in the same stabbing/thrusting motion. Actually a short stick is better because it will be easier to release if you need to use your hand as something other than a club. Best of all it can double as something else that is perfectly legal to have in your pocket like a flashlight. The main limitation to strike enhancers is that they do not make you a better puncher, they just make your punches better. If you are not already a pretty good boxer these things have very limited value. You have to be able to reliably land a punch with your body behind it and that requires a good bit of training. In the hands of a trained boxer or a Karate black belt short sticks are a fearsome weapon. In the hands of your wife or girlfriend, not so much.

Bikewer
June 29, 2012, 08:20 PM
Of course, a short stick functions effectively as a "yawara stick" or "kongo" as well, striking with the stick itself in a variety of techniques.
This seems to be moving towards a "lost art"; I recall extensive articles on techniques published years ago by various MA rags like Black Belt.
However, not so much any more.
Brass knuckles suffer from the same problem that switchblade knives do... they are still seen as a "thug's" weapon, something used by the mob enforcers to "tune up" a businessman who didn't want to pay "the vig".
They seem endlessly fascinating to some folks, however; over at bladeforums we have constant discussions about them and folks wondering where they can get good ones.

mjsdwash
June 29, 2012, 08:48 PM
interesting enough, those lexan knuckles are for sale on Google Shopping.

Owen Sparks
June 30, 2012, 01:38 PM
I don't know about lexan but I did play with a pair made of light weight aluminum. It did not work very well on a punching bag as it lacked the mass and weight of real brass.

alwilliam
December 19, 2012, 02:32 AM
I have seen a few interesting ones for sale at gunbroker .

lemaymiami
December 19, 2012, 09:04 AM
Knucks, like blackjacks, or slappers, or whatever you call them.... are best left at home. As a street cop for many years, coming across folks armed with various "tools" was very common. Depending on the circumstances I either advised them quietly that such things could get you jammed up on the street (and left it to their good intentions to take the hint....) or used the weapon as either grounds for an arrest or the deciding factor about whether to arrest them or not for other things....

In short, one of the best tools any street cop has is their discretion about whether to make an arrest or let the guy go (particularly for minor stuff - we're not talking about discretion if you've been dumb enough to actually use a weapon on the street and there's an injured party involved...). At least that's the standard I used and encouraged my young cops to follow. Anyone that considers carrying a pair of brass knuckles (or similar things) should think long and hard about that. I can't remember how many times I didn't arrest someone when the facts would have supported the arrest. Add a weapon of some sort to the equation and you're on the wrong end of the deal.

Master Blaster
December 19, 2012, 09:17 AM
Concealed deadly weapon and Felony in most states.

mdauben
December 19, 2012, 12:25 PM
I have no idea as to the legality. One of the websites is claiming they're 50 state legal. I doubt it.

You would be right. Using AL law as an example, they say:
brass knuckles, slingshots or other weapon of like kind or description

IMO it would be very difficult to argue that "plastic knuckles" are not "of like kind" if you were caught carrying them. :rolleyes:

lemaymiami
December 19, 2012, 12:28 PM
Remember, as well, that if you're in court listening to your lawyer telling everyone that you're a great guy, with a great reputation.... You've already lost.....

alwilliam
December 19, 2012, 12:53 PM
Knuckles are great "collectors items" only !

Here's a few my friend has in his collection .


http://i49.tinypic.com/fao22o.jpg

Swing
December 19, 2012, 01:41 PM
Neat-O.

rondog
December 19, 2012, 02:00 PM
1. Reach for kicker pedal on Harley.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b150/rinselman/bikes/bk01.jpg

2. Grab kicker pedal and remove cotter pin.

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b150/rinselman/bikes/bk02.jpg

3. Ready to rumble!

http://i18.photobucket.com/albums/b150/rinselman/bikes/bk03.jpg

Useless idea, sure, but I've had the photos for years, just had to drag 'em out. Nice novelty accessory, but that's all. I'm certainly not interested in hitting anyone/anything that hard.

And no, that's not me or my bike! I could only dream of having a stock Knucklehead like that one.

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