9mm frangible load data


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Han Tzu
May 21, 2012, 11:46 PM
I just got some Remington CTF Frangible Bullets 9mm Luger (355 Diameter) 90 Grain Flat Nose. The powder I have on hand is Bullseye or Unique.

I can't find any load data for this bullet. Any help would be appreciated.

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Certaindeaf
May 21, 2012, 11:55 PM
Don't overcrimp them or they can crack.

bds
May 22, 2012, 01:29 AM
This is 2004 Alliant load data (glarp.atk.com/2004/2004Catalogs/2004AlliantPowderSM.pdf) for Bullseye/Unique for 95 gr FMJ and you can use load data for slightly heavier bullet. Note, they are listed max loads and I would conduct my powder work up with at least 10% reduction.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=160624&stc=1&d=1331188167

Han Tzu
May 22, 2012, 10:40 AM
This is 2004 Alliant load data (glarp.atk.com/2004/2004Catalogs/2004AlliantPowderSM.pdf) for Bullseye/Unique for 95 gr FMJ and you can use load data for slightly heavier bullet. Note, they are listed max loads and I would conduct my powder work up with at least 10% reduction.


Thanks bds. The Alliant data corresponds with what I read on another site. They were using 4.9 gr. of BE with an OAL of 1.155.

Han Tzu
May 22, 2012, 10:43 AM
Don't overcrimp them or they can crack.
Thanks Certaindeaf. I have read advice that recommends pulling these bullets at first to see if any cracking has occurred.

TonyT
May 22, 2012, 12:59 PM
Check the Hodgdon website. I know they have data for 40 S&W frangible bullets.

bfoosh006
May 22, 2012, 10:23 PM
http://www.accuratepowder.com/load-data/

PO2Hammer
May 22, 2012, 11:04 PM
Seating depth becomes a major factor with frangibles because of their low density.
According to Sinterfire, you should use data for a jacketed bullet of equal length, not equal weight. Frangible bullets are light for their size, so they get seated deeper.

Han Tzu
May 23, 2012, 06:00 AM
Seating depth becomes a major factor with frangibles because of their low density.
According to Sinterfire, you should use data for a jacketed bullet of equal length, not equal weight. Frangible bullets are light for their size, so they get seated deeper.
Thanks, Hammer.
According to the Midway website, "the bullet length is 0.595 and The 90gr. CTF bullets have a similar size and profile as a traditional 115gr full metal jacket bullet."

So OAL becomes another question along with the charge weight. I am thinking of using a starting point of somewhere between 4.5 gr to 4.9 gr of Bullseye.

kingmt
May 23, 2012, 02:05 PM
You should be good to go in a 9mm. If it doesn't function the slide add a little more.

Hangingrock
May 23, 2012, 08:03 PM
I used an OAL of 1.130". I employed Winchester AutoComp and used the same charge weight for a 124gr FMJ with OAL of 1.155". Test fired in an S&W-MP9, Glock 17 and Glock 19 with no functionality issues.

Han Tzu
May 23, 2012, 09:10 PM
I appreciate the feedback from everyone. It was tough to find any frangible data elsewhere.

I'm more confident that I have a safe starting load of 4.5 gr. BE and an OAL of 1.13". It will be this weekend before I have time to work up a few test cartridges.

gamestalker
May 24, 2012, 08:08 PM
Hey there Hangingrock, how do you like that Autocomp? I'm currently using Longshot and HS6, how does Autocomp compare in burn rate in your opinion?
GS

mdvctry
June 3, 2012, 05:13 PM
Hi,

I've been following this thread and another on reloading Remington CTF 90gr frangible. As noted there is a huge lack of information.

Based on the alliant data 2004, Frangiblebullets.com and Lyman's 49 book I decide to try the following;
Unique 4.8 grains
OAL=1.125
Mixed once fired brass.
Glock 19C
Results = 50 rounds all failed to feed to due short cycling of the slide or stove piped. It appears that I need more powder or seat the bullets a little bit deeper. There no signs the pressure was too high. I've read other post which seat at 1.12 OAL and loaded 5.2 grains of Unique. So I will probably try 5.0, 5.2, 5.4 grains at 1.12 OAL.

Update: unique 5.0. OAL=1.12 10 rounds with two failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds on 5x8 notecard.

Unique 5.2 OAL=1.12 10 rounds with no failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds on 5x8 notecard.

Unique 5.4 OAL=1.12 10 rounds with no failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds within 3x3 notecard

Used a very very slight taper crimp to remove the bell. Reloaded on Dillon xl650 using dillon 9mm die set

Han Tzu
June 3, 2012, 09:50 PM
Hi,

I've been following this thread and another on reloading Remington CTF 90gr frangible. As noted there is a huge lack of information.

Based on the alliant data 2004, Frangiblebullets.com and Lyman's 49 book I decide to try the following;
Unique 4.8 grains
OAL=1.125
Mixed once fired brass.
Glock 19C
Results = 50 rounds all failed to feed to due short cycling of the slide or stove piped. It appears that I need more powder or seat the bullets a little bit deeper. There no signs the pressure was too high. I've read other post which seat at 1.2 OAL and loaded 5.2 grains of Unique. So I will probably try 5.0, 5.2, 5.4 grains at 1.2 OAL.

Update: unique 5.0. OAL=1.2 10 rounds with two failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds on 5x8 notecard.

Unique 5.2 OAL=1.2 10 rounds with no failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds on 5x8 notecard.

Unique 5.4 OAL=1.2 10 rounds with no failure to feed. Group off hand standing at 10 yards all rounds within 3x3 notecard
Is that 1.2 OAL a typo mdv? I believe 1.169 is max OAL for 9mm. Please let me know of your progress.

I loaded 10 rounds to using the load listed above and hope to test them tomorrow. I am having some trouble obtaining a consistent cartridge OAL. I ranged between 1.128 and 1.132.

mdvctry
June 4, 2012, 09:29 PM
Oops yes that is a typo. OAL should have read 1.12, Thanks for catching that! I'll go back and edit my previous post.

The Unique really fills up the case. I just loaded 100 rounds using 5.4g and the OAL=1.125 to 1.128 for most of them. I ran them through the seating die again and they seated at 1.1205 to 1.1225. I won't have an opportunity to shoot them until the weekend. Im hopeful I'll see similar or better results than the last group.

Ewcmr2
July 26, 2012, 12:33 PM
Midway just put these (9mm, 90g frangible) on sale, $19.99 per 500. Guessing they'll sell out I ordered first posted second!

Certaindeaf
July 26, 2012, 12:39 PM
Dang, that's a good price.

AnyRacoon
July 26, 2012, 07:49 PM
Snagged 2K, $98.00 shipped!!!!

Dakotared
July 27, 2012, 02:41 PM
Looks like they are out of the 90gr ones but still have 100gr ones.


http://www.midwayusa.com/product/685942/remington-ctf-frangible-bullets-357-sig-9mm-355-diameter-100-grain-flat-nose-box-of-500-bulk-packaged?cm_cat=CheckoutConfirm&cm_pla=ProductDescrip

edit: they say 357 sig but they are they work in 9mm

john16443
July 27, 2012, 02:58 PM
Ordered 2k of the 90 gr 9mm's yesterday, and another 1K of the 100 gr 357's today. yes they are the same .355 diameter according to the Midway USA web site.

murphys_law
July 27, 2012, 03:34 PM
Ordered 1k of the 90 gr. Hoping they make some great target rounds with hp-38. Now I just have to get a press....lol

HOWARD J
July 28, 2012, 07:53 PM
Wow these bullets really have a rough finish--solid black
Anyone get ones cleaner ( shiner )

murphys_law
July 29, 2012, 09:49 AM
I should have mine tomorrow..

TonyT
July 29, 2012, 12:29 PM
Check the Hodgdon website for 9mm frangible bullet data - 100 gr. Sinterfire. Do not use the normal loads for bullets of that weight. The recommended loads use much lower charges of powder that one would expect for such a light bullet. The frangible bullets have a much greated bearing surface since they have much lower density.
I have used PB for reloading frangible bullets in 40 S&W. One has to insure that one is belling the case the minimum required to facilitate bullet seating and then insure that one is not crimping into the bullet . they are fragile.
Hodgdon lists loads for frangible bullets with Universal, PB, W-231/HP-38 and HS-700X.

HOWARD J
July 29, 2012, 01:05 PM
Lee revised reloading book has loads for 90 ( not many powders ) & 100 gr
9mm--Rem CFT bullets

HOWARD J
July 29, 2012, 10:20 PM
My bullets were pitch black when I receiver them.
I ran them in the tumbler with walnuts for abouy 8 hours--- they now look good with a dull shine--I guess that is as good as it will get.

murphys_law
July 29, 2012, 11:53 PM
Mine are pretty dark as well, I'm not the least bit worried about the discoloration. I'm going to put them in a cartridge so they go bang. I'm not taking them and showing off to people. Looks like sinterfire recommends using 125 gr jacketed data for the 90 gr and 130 grain jacketed data for the 100 gr. I'm betting that's who manufactured these bullets. I will be using this data to work my loads. :D I don't think you can go wrong with these at this price. Perfect paper punchers/steel target bullets IMO.:neener:

TonyT
July 30, 2012, 09:13 AM
Howard J,
Is the data in the Lee manual for frangible bullets the same as on Hodgdon's website using Universal, PB, W-231 and HS-700X?

HOWARD J
July 30, 2012, 10:23 AM
90 gr
R silhouette
accur 5 & 2
r true blue
ram zip

100gr
as above &
titegroup
universal
imr pb
win 231
imr700x

TonyT
July 30, 2012, 11:52 AM
90 gr
R silhouette
accur 5 & 2
r true blue
ram zip

100gr
as above &
titegroup
universal
imr pb
win 231
imr700x
It appears that Lee copied the data from the powder manufacturers/distributors websites.

HOWARD J
July 30, 2012, 11:59 AM
Lee does NO testing---all data comes from MFR's/DSTR.

jlficken
August 2, 2012, 10:39 AM
Lee revised reloading book has loads for 90 ( not many powders ) & 100 gr
9mm--Rem CFT bullets

Do they have data for Hodgdon Universal in there for the 100gr bullets in 9mm? I don't have mine handy.


ETA: Nevermind.....I should have read further down :)

Do they list an OAL length for the 100gr bullets?

HOWARD J
August 2, 2012, 02:03 PM
min OAL for Universal 1,140 FOR 100GR

ANYBODY LOADING WIN 231 FOR 90 GR ??

john16443
August 2, 2012, 03:31 PM
yes, I loaded 4.3 to 4.4 grains 231 in my recently received 90 grain bullets. Cycled my CZ75b just fine, but gave the Ruger SR9 fits with cycling the slide. I found that strange because the Ruger is typically flawless even with low power rounds. 4.3 grains 231 under a 115 grain plated bullet is my typical target load for the Ruger. These were low power at my start charge weight based on felt recoil. Accuracy was nothing to write home about, I'll be upping the charge to 4.5 grains next session.

I also tried 4.0 grains of WST and 4.0 grains Bullseye under the 90 grains, again the CZ spit them out just fine, the Ruger choked on them. Also very light recoiling loads.

HOWARD J
August 2, 2012, 10:44 PM
Glad you told me---I had loaded 5 @ 4.3 gr Win 231
I will up this to 4.6
will advise results

TonyT
August 3, 2012, 01:32 PM
The Hodgdon website has pressure tested data for 100 gr. Sinterfire (SFIRE) frangible bullets in 9mm using Universal, W-231, PB and HS-700X powders.

Dakotared
August 4, 2012, 01:25 AM
I have a p95 and loaded the 100gr frangible at 1.140 with 4.4 of W231 and they worked great. Very soft recoil, as accurate as i am with the gun. I may try to bump up my next test loads but I liked the way they worked.

stavman11
May 24, 2013, 11:25 AM
I know its an Old Thread... but it did help me Load my RMR Frangable 115gr 9mm Bullets this last week... so wanted to Share

I found W231 and CCI500 primer at 4.6gr worked great.....

COL was 1.135ish...

All fired perfect... no FTE or Slide return issues at All

I am loading a bunch More more more Testing...

So just an FYI all...

firefighter_emt
May 24, 2013, 11:33 AM
I'm glad you posted the 115 gr data you used. I'm loading the same RMR frangible right now with hp-38. I'm going to start around 4.3 and work up from there. I'll let you know what happens.

stavman11
May 24, 2013, 11:41 AM
Ya i couldnt find ANY 115gr info... just 90gr and 100gr

HP-38 and w231 are very similar or Same...

was Gunna start at 4.3gr but I had loaded some new 115gr Falcon Bullets at 4.1 and 4.6... and 4.6 was still in Hopper so just loaded some with that

Let me know how the 4.3gr works... i may try it as well

firefighter_emt
May 24, 2013, 01:59 PM
Just tested some with 4.3 and 4.6. Both work fine in my Ruger SR9. I like the 4.6 better as the 4.3 seems pretty light. Im sure they could handle a little hotter load but im fine with them 4.6. I load with a lee classic turret press with the pro auto disk. The c.o.l. was 1.150. With the length of those bullets I like them a little bit longer than I usual. Have you done any type of test to see how they fragment or how much penetration they have? I'm thinking about doing some tests, maybe with some blocks of wood and I have some scrap drywall laying around I might stack together and shoot. I'm just curious to see what happens to them when they hit something. I was thinking about using them in my 9mm carry pistol. Thanks for the info.

stavman11
May 26, 2013, 09:50 AM
I have a big race all weekend.. so No time ta test tile monday/Tuesday

Gunna try some Longer COL myself... stick with the 4.6gr and see how they shoot..

Will try some penetration testing as well...wood may be best option...

Im using the Lee pro 1000... and jusyt got my bullet feeder on Friday... cant wait to try that as well


Fun Times

firefighter_emt
May 27, 2013, 04:45 PM
I did a quick test the other night. I set up 4 1" pieces cypress wood spaced 1" apart and shot from 5 yards. I expected they would break at some point but they did not. The first one went through all 4 boards and was never found. I added a board and the next shot lodged in the last board. I pulled it out completely intact and did not appear to be deformed at all. I shot the next one at an angle and it lodged in the 4th board, also not deformed. More tests will be done soon. Next test will be some 2x6's. I really didn't expect these bullets to penetrate that much.

stavman11
June 19, 2013, 02:17 PM
Loading up about 50 of the Frangible 9mm 115gr

Tightgroup with 4.2gr COL at 1.15

well see how they go Tomorrow... i anticipate good results based on the 4.6gr tests

Just wanted to keep ya Informed guys


Stav

HOWARD J
June 19, 2013, 03:49 PM
I have a P-35 with a very heavy slide spring giving a 1 1/2 # trigger pull.
I ended up with 4.7 gr of W231. for 90 gr Fragb. bullet
P-35 & Glock both work good with this loading.

stavman11
June 19, 2013, 04:09 PM
Mine are for my XDN 9 and Ruger SR9C

Both ran flawless at last Loads....... and when I did my 1st tests I did both 4.2gr and 4.6gr... So not expecting any surprises tomorrow

Not sure ill get the Frangibles again... i got 1000,,,,, Good Bullets but for sure Different... we shall see.... Lots of em left ta play with:D

stavman11
June 21, 2013, 09:30 AM
Busted out the chrono Today and tested some of the loads


Really do like the 115gr Frangible Bullets...... Shot real Nice and Pretty Darn Accurate... ill test Accuracy Next Trip:D


115gr Falcon Frangible pulled Bullets
4.3gr of tightgroup COL at 1.15
Avg 1227fps High 1237fps low 1217fps
very Happy with the Consistency of the Loads and FPS.... has a Nice SNAP but not Too Much Recoil....

May try em at 5gr next trip....

firefighter_emt
July 23, 2013, 09:17 PM
After a few other random tests around the house ( shooting into dirt, wood, etc.), I don't feel like these bullets perform like I thought they would. I don't know if this is a bad lot or maybe some defective rounds, but they don't seem to break apart as they should. Shooting the above mentioned load with hp-38, very few have broken at all. They are very accurate and good target rounds, but I won't be using them for any type of home defense like I thought I would. Any other thoughts on this...?

firefighter_emt
July 23, 2013, 09:19 PM
Stavman.. What type of chrono do you use and what are your thoughts on it? I'm currently in the market for one. Thanks.

stavman11
July 24, 2013, 11:27 AM
Stavman.. What type of chrono do you use and what are your thoughts on it? I'm currently in the market for one. Thanks.
This is what i have... for the price works great
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/531741/shooting-chrony-f1-chronograph

Dont think I need a $150 chrono... Now the F1 Master does have a remote LCD display that might be nice... but i can see my display perfect at 15'


I have been primarily shooting the Frangibles lately, mainly so i dont have ta change out the Bullet feeder...LOL

Have not really looked at how they react... may do that now and see for myself... They load and shoot good and pretty nice accuracy..

so I will delve into them more myself

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