potent but efficient snubby lead load


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thomis
June 19, 2012, 07:20 PM
I'm looking for a potent but efficient load data for my 340PD .357 mag. It has a 1 7/8" bbl so when I say efficient, well you know what I mean. I have 500 of the solid lead bullets with the correct hardness (Brinnex #?) for magnum loads from Missouri Bullet Co. (158 grain). I have magnum primers and decent brass. I don't have a lot of time to experiment so I'm asking for your experience.

I have the following powders:
Accurate No. 5
True Blue
2400
HP 38
Clays
Unique
H110
Blue Dot

potent, and efficient.
many thanks,
thomis

p.s. if you don't like to post data, pm me

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GP100man
June 19, 2012, 08:38 PM
Out of the list ya have I`d go with 4.5 gr. of Clays in 357 cases. Fast burnin, clean , & not to flashy. Should give ya above 900 fps as this load gives me 1,027 out of a 6" tube .

I clocked this load in 6 different revolvers ,3 6" & 3 4" average loss of fps was 27fps so that`s only 13.5/inch

rcmodel
June 19, 2012, 09:34 PM
I'd use a medium burn rate powder like Unique in the snubby.

Magnum primers are not necessary or desirable with Unique.

Try 6.5 grains Unique since you have it, use a heavy roll-crimp to prevent bullets backing out in your light hard kicking gun, and see what you think.

It will be a handful in a Sc snubby, but still a controllable 1,100 FPS load without excess blast & flash.

rc

Jeff H
June 19, 2012, 10:22 PM
2400 is a proven winner with 357 mag and will shoot bullets at a higher velocity than faster powders regardless of the barrel length. I have used anything from 12grains to 15 with good success. My most accurate loads were with 13.5 grains.

Faster powders will be more efficient, but not more potent.

YMMV

Mag primers aren't recommended with 2400 though.

fecmech
June 19, 2012, 10:34 PM
I'm not sure what you mean by efficient. Potency to me means power and power in handguns is determined by bullet weight and velocity. You have picked a 158 gr bullet so all that's left is velocity. You will get the highest velocity out of your snub nose with a max load of 2400 or H110.

thomis
June 20, 2012, 08:48 AM
fecmech, when I say efficient, I mean I want most of the powder to have a chance to burn before the bullet leaves the short bbl.
Thank you all.

thomis
June 20, 2012, 09:39 AM
I noticed on the Hodgdon website that HP 38 powder max charge for 158 gr lead cast achieves slightly more velocity than the max charge using Clays, but with considerable less pressure (23,900 vs. 33,600 CUP). I'm not proficient enough of a reloader to understand what this means. Can someone explain? Does this translate to less wear and tear on my revolver?

ljnowell
June 20, 2012, 09:45 AM
fecmech, when I say efficient, I mean I want most of the powder to have a chance to burn before the bullet leaves the short bbl.
Thank you all.


No matter how much powder burns in the barrel or not the most velocity will be attained by the slowest powder.

Jim Watson
June 20, 2012, 10:03 AM
True, but at the cost of blast and flash.

Many years ago, there was an article on the subject in Handloader's Digest.
The author concluded that for his purposes a stout but not maximum load of Blue Dot was the best compromise for his shooting in a 2" .357. You might be willing to put up with more blast... or less, but it is a place to start.


thomis, I can only imagine that Hodgdon stopped short of maximum pressure with HP38 because it got erratic at higher pressure.

ljnowell
June 20, 2012, 11:35 AM
True, but at the cost of blast and flash.


Exactly. The point I was making though is that the length of the barrel is really irrelevant. There will be a terrific fire and noise show in a 4" barrel or a 2". Its really a matter of recoil vs. velocity, with barrel length being a non issue.

Certaindeaf
June 20, 2012, 11:42 AM
To me, inefficient means using three times more powder to gain a couple hundred feet per second or so. Potent means something that'll kill about anything. I'd use something like Unique or even Red Dot.

ljnowell
June 20, 2012, 12:03 PM
To me, inefficient means using three times more powder to gain a couple hundred feet per second or so. Potent means something that'll kill about anything. I'd use something like Unique or even Red Dot.

A couple hundred feet per second is more than little gain in terms of handgun ballistics. If you want to download 357 to that point, just use 38s in it and be done. A 38 will certainly kill about anything. I dont think you will find many powders that will make within 200 fps of h110 using 1/3 the powder. Maybe half, but not 1/3. However, powder is not the high cost item in a handgun load, its the bullet. Unless you are going to shoot a few thousand a month it really isnt that big of a deal.

rcmodel
June 20, 2012, 12:08 PM
The OP has an 11 ounce S&W Sc frame .357 snubby.

I really doubt he needs to use a case full of H110 with his 158 grain bullets to get all the performance he can stand to shoot in it.

rc

Certaindeaf
June 20, 2012, 12:15 PM
.If you want to download 357 to that point, just use 38s in it and be done..
Who said anything about downloading? Pressure is pressure.. the special operates at less than half the pressure of the magnum. What are you talking about?

thomis
June 20, 2012, 12:44 PM
allright, gentleman, i'll spill the beans.
scenario: you are wandering into black bear territory. the only weapon you have besides your brain, is a 340 pd. What is your handload?
i am very good at shooting my 340 pd, and i have little sensitivity to recoil.

Certaindeaf
June 20, 2012, 12:49 PM
^
Different question but probably a 158gr SWC going around 1200fps.

jim8115
June 20, 2012, 01:12 PM
Unique or # 5, since you have them. H110 is a total waste with that short barrell. Chronograph them, and you will see what I mean. 7.0 - 7.2 Gr Unique with that exact bullet gives me 1200+ FPS from a 4" Model 28. Plus, have you shot a full-house 357 mag from that thing yet?

zxcvbob
June 20, 2012, 01:22 PM
Try 8.0 grains of either Herco or WSF. I don't know which will be flashier; other than that they will deliver the same performance.

For a real handful, use 11 grains of AA#7.

Of the powders you listed, Unique is probably the best choice, or maybe #5.

jim8115
June 20, 2012, 01:37 PM
Or 12.5 Grains of #9

Walkalong
June 20, 2012, 02:54 PM
i am very good at shooting my 340 pd, and i have little sensitivity to recoil. It is also the flash and blast to go with it, but if none of that bothers you, pick a max load of 2400 out of a load book and enjoy.

I picked 2400 from your list of powders.

Walkalong
June 20, 2012, 03:00 PM
HP 38 powder max charge for 158 gr lead cast achieves slightly more velocity than the max charge using Clays, but with considerable less pressure (23,900 vs. 33,600 CUP). I'm not proficient enough of a reloader to understand what this means. Can someone explain? Does this translate to less wear and tear on my revolver? As long as the pressure is under what the revolver is designed for, it will be fine, but yes, after thousands of rounds running max pressure vs mid range pressure, it adds up.

The amount of powder burned also makes a difference, and adds up over many rounds.

It takes a lot of shooting to wear one out, probably more than you can stand in that lightweight snubby. :)

thomis
June 20, 2012, 03:28 PM
I noticed there wasn't any load data on the Alliant website for 2400 and Lead. All the data is for jacketed. But I know it works b/c I've loaded plenty of Keith style bullets over 22 grains of 2400 for the Super Blackhawk.
I will go with Unique or No. 5 as suggested.
Many thanks.

p.s. Yes, I have tried full house loads in the 340PD. While not necessarily pleasant, I still get a kick out of it ;)

mdi
June 20, 2012, 04:29 PM
Using the scenerio mentioned, I'd keep the 357 snubby in my pocker and either keep a very sharp eye out, or learn to run the 100 meter dash in 4.5 seconds...

Meaning, I think that gun, with just about any load would just make a bear mad.:cuss:

thomis
June 20, 2012, 04:47 PM
just play along, mdi

zxcvbob
June 20, 2012, 04:57 PM
I noticed there wasn't any load data on the Alliant website for 2400 and Lead. All the data is for jacketed. But I know it works b/c I've loaded plenty of Keith style bullets over 22 grains of 2400 for the Super Blackhawk.
I will go with Unique or No. 5 as suggested.
They took the 2400 load data down because they are promoting Speer bullets. Look at their 2004 load book for real data: http://glarp.atk.com/2004/2004Catalogs/2004AlliantPowderSM.pdf

rcmodel
June 20, 2012, 05:01 PM
+1

After ATK bought Speer & Alliant, all they show now is loads for soft swaged Speer lead Bullets that won't stand magnum velocity.

The older Alliant data is for cast bullets.

rc

ljnowell
June 20, 2012, 07:19 PM
Who said anything about downloading? Pressure is pressure.. the special operates at less than half the pressure of the magnum. What are you talking about?

Pressure isnt pressure. I can load bullseye to the exact same pressure as 2400, but 2400 will still achieve more velocity. Thats the point I am making, you dont have to be argumentative.

OP, use the 2400, since you mentioned your intended use now. There will be lots of bark and fire, but thats where the performance is.

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