+P and +P+ brass


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m3mh0g
June 21, 2012, 12:57 PM
I just lucked into about 5000 pieces of assorted nickel plated brass for $50.00. As I am sorting it I just want to make sure I'm right. The only difference between regular head stamps and +P/+P+ are indeed the head stamp. Is that correct?

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sellersm
June 21, 2012, 01:02 PM
Which caliber? Some +P brass is just a stamp (i.e.; 45acp), in other calibers the brass is actually thicker/different so the +P indication actually means something.

rcmodel
June 21, 2012, 01:04 PM
Maybe, or maybe not.

Older Remington +P .38 Spl I have is much heavier then standard Rem .38 Spl brass at least.

If in doubt, weigh some of each on your powder scale.

If it is noticably heavier, it is thicker and has less capacity.

rc

m3mh0g
June 21, 2012, 01:10 PM
In regard to what caliber the bag I have has every common handgun caliber plus .357 sig .38 super and 10mm. Even some 50 ae. Thanks for the help guys once I get through it all I will weigh some samples. If they are different that means to expect more pressure due to less volume?

beatledog7
June 21, 2012, 01:26 PM
Yes. If two cases' outer dimensions are the same and one is heavier, the extra brass making it heavier has to be somewhere, and that somewhere is inside. Thus, decreased interior volume.

Hondo 60
June 21, 2012, 05:19 PM
Which caliber? Some +P brass is just a stamp (i.e.; 45acp), in other calibers the brass is actually thicker/different so the +P indication actually means something.

Sorry, but I disagree.
The +P headstamp is just that, a headstamp.
AFAIK, there is no difference.
That comes directly from Winchester & Starline.


Now having said that, some older brass (made years ago) may be thicker, but current production is no different.

rcmodel
June 21, 2012, 05:23 PM
Well sorry, but I disagree and raise you one disagree.

See post #3.

I have an ammo can half full of older Remington +P brass that is closer to .357 in case web thickness and weight.

rc

hentown
June 21, 2012, 05:27 PM
Check this out, Hondo. This DOES come directly from Starline! ;)

"
45 AUTO +P BRASS (LARGE PISTOL PRIMER)
0.892 - 0.897 O.A.L.

The 45 Auto+P is a strengthened version of the 45 Auto with the same external dimensions. A thicker web and heavier sidewall at base strengthens the case in potentially unsupported areas. This case has approximately 2 grains less internal water capacity than the standard 45 Auto."

They also state that their 9mm+ brass is the same as their 9mm "standard" brass, except for the headstamp.

sellersm
June 21, 2012, 05:52 PM
Thanks hentown, I actually had it backwards! The 9mm is just a headstamp, but the .45acp is actually different!

I'n going to guess that it may depend on mfr and year made, as RC's example seems to indicate.

But to the OP, you've got the idea: weigh and see for yourself!

Hondo 60
June 21, 2012, 07:19 PM
I had checked with Winchester & Starline & they said +P brass was the same as standard.

I guess I took that to mean all calibers, when I had specifically asked about .38 Spl.

Sorry about adding to the confusion.

gamestalker
June 21, 2012, 07:57 PM
I believe the reasoning regarding +P brass is relevent to it's intended action type, that being AL, or fully chambered cartridges such as 38 spcl.. Since AL actions are not typically fully supported, +P and +P+ pressures can present a problem with buldging or even blowing out, where as revolver chamberings are less likely to gain much from a heavier casing. Although as RC stated, some of the older +P 38 spcl. brass is deffinitely heavier/thicker most commonly in the web region. Modern day versions of +P are pretty much targeted in AL brass, 45 acp, 40 S&W, 10mm, and 9mm I would think. But taking steps to determine it's internal capacity is the only sensible approach, in my opinion.

As to reloading brass that is stamped +P or +P+, I personally like to determine it's internal capacity to avoid unexpected pressure spikes, or any other undesireable effects. I believe it's always prudent to address reloading with such safety measures, it's not a hobby to be taken lightly. I'm rather partial to my 10 full digits and pair of eyes.

GS

ArchAngelCD
June 22, 2012, 01:39 AM
I only know about .38 Special brass and what I know is it is all the same NOW. Way back, when the +P rounds came out some of the brass was indeed thicker (like mentioned by RC) but these days it is only a headstamp...

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