As promised, rifle pics...PTR-91F / Vortex Viper PST


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Driftertank
June 23, 2012, 07:23 PM
Went to the range this morning to sight in my new Vortex Viper PST 4-16x50 FFP on my PTR. Used Hornady's "Steel Match" 155gr BTHP, fired from an improvised rest (car hood). Shot 5-rd groups, best was 1.75"@100yd, though a 2.5" group would have been 1.25" if not for the pulled/called flyer. All-in-all, a perfectly acceptable performance for a combat-derived semiauto with off the shelf ammo IMHO. Can't wait to build a handload, set up a proper rest, and really see what happens.

After the range trip we had a little photoshoot. The WASR belongs to the photographer...
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk100/object13/_MG_7762.jpg
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk100/object13/_MG_7764.jpg
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk100/object13/_MG_7765.jpg
http://i278.photobucket.com/albums/kk100/object13/_MG_7766.jpg

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Buck Kramer
June 23, 2012, 07:32 PM
Nice, I think 1.75" is plenty good.

TurtlePhish
June 23, 2012, 09:53 PM
Ooh, that's pretty. Very nice. 1.75" is combat accurate!

LJ-MosinFreak-Buck
June 23, 2012, 10:11 PM
Boy, oh boy, would I like one of those... Ugh, why do they have to be so expensive? LOL

Nice rifle, and nice groups!

taliv
June 23, 2012, 10:31 PM
i love the look of that rifle

nice pics! thanks for sharing

B!ngo
June 23, 2012, 10:35 PM
It's a beautiful piece. Enjoy it for many years to come. I hope to have one some day. Is the 'F' the standard barrel or the precision (?) barrel?
B

Driftertank
June 23, 2012, 10:54 PM
No problem!

Compared to REAL HK91's the PTR's are dirt-cheap. They're also cheaper than M1A's and most .308 AR's.

I've seen a lot of "DMR builds" on these that seem to be sort of halfhearted, or take shortcuts in equipment (cheaper optics, poorly implemented mount solutions) i wanted to take my time and build mine "right," to my own way of thinking. It's taken 3 years of saving pennies, but i'm very happy with how it turned out.

Like i said, ammo R&D is next. 2 MOA isn't bad, but i'm fairly sure 1 MOA is possible with round development. I've heard rumors of these things being near MOA out of the box with ammo like Fed. GMM 168. But the "Steel Match" i got locally for $40/50rd so on the strength of today's performance it may be my new "fallback" ammo while i work on setting up for making my own loads.

Also think my "improvised rest" wasn't helping with group size....but it keeps me honest; no sandbags or remote trigger. Just me, the rifle, and a stationary object to brace it against. :D

Driftertank
June 23, 2012, 11:13 PM
It's a beautiful piece. Enjoy it for many years to come. I hope to have one some day. Is the 'F' the standard barrel or the precision (?) barrel?

The F model is the old "Standard-target" bread-and-butter PTR model. My barrel is a Thompson/Center-contract barrel, and the flutes are cut too shallow; if the ammo i'm using has any sort of sticky sealant in it, the flutes gum up and cause extraction issues and velocity variations. I tried some HSM Match ammo last weekend that produced a +/- 2" group at 200 yds, but then started ejecting weakly and the groups grew to over 6". I was fairly disappointed.

But it eats Barnaul, Wolf, Tula, Fed AE, Rem/UMC, PMC Bronze, etc. and will get REAL dirty and still cycle.

The affected guns with flute problems appear to be AW serial numbers below 8,000 from what i understand.

FYI, the GI models will eat any ammo, from what i've heard, but i don't know if they group as tight or consistent as the F's.

twitchyfinger
October 14, 2013, 05:44 PM
Apologies for resurrecting an old thread but does snyone anyone know what brand and or more more importantly what height the rings are on that ptr91? Tried messaging the OP over a month ago but he is MIA with no reply. I have the exact same scope I am trying to put on my ptr and wondering if those rings pictured are med or high rings? They also look like Burris XTR rings??? Any help from anyone would be greatly appreciated!

dvdcrr
October 14, 2013, 08:49 PM
Those are weaver tactical rings, they look like high rings to me but couldbe xtra high. What is the scope mount thats what I want to know.

twitchyfinger
October 14, 2013, 08:56 PM
Thanks for posting and yeah I think you're right either wraver or blackhawk? At At least thats what I can compare the top top half to. That scope mount is an MFI low profile mount you can find them at hkparts.net I have and prefer the B&T HK scope mount but they are hard to find in stock.

fireside44
October 14, 2013, 09:46 PM
Not a big fan of the PTR/HK91/Cetme type guns but that is a good lookin' DM machine! I am almost certain you will pull better groups with load development. Just using some quality brass cased stuff, such as Hornady Custom 150 grain or SSTs might show some real improvement. Nice!!!

Driftertank
February 2, 2015, 11:37 AM
I've made some changes in the last couple years since I last roamed this forum. My PTR now has a 2.5-10x32 in place of the 4-16x50. This scope is a much better fit for the rifle and it's intended purpose.

http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt328/Driftertank/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg (http://s624.photobucket.com/user/Driftertank/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image.jpg.html)

NunsNAmmo
February 6, 2015, 02:29 PM
Nice gun dude, I'm pretty pleased with mine.

http://oi58.tinypic.com/eqazp3.jpg

Ohio Gun Guy
February 6, 2015, 03:04 PM
Nice... That's a really good start!

Driftertank
February 6, 2015, 08:51 PM
http://i624.photobucket.com/albums/tt328/Driftertank/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg (http://s624.photobucket.com/user/Driftertank/media/Mobile%20Uploads/image-2.jpg.html)

Have been working on a handload for a while now...this is my latest developed recipe at 200 yds, off the bipod, no sandbags. Got several groups like this that day, need to proof a decent sample size to see if it stays consistent. Plus or minus 1.5moa all day is acceptable to me, for this type of rifle in field conditions

Jackal
February 6, 2015, 09:34 PM
Bench accuracy is for bragging rights. Can it hit steel at 600m? Then its a win.:)

Driftertank
February 6, 2015, 09:57 PM
Actually once the load is finalized, I plan to start stretching out and dialing in my dope. Goal is 1st round hit on a B27 silhouette at 800. Anywhere on the black works for me.

dvdcrr
February 6, 2015, 10:13 PM
With the narrow handguard I absolutely could not get the rifle up to my eye in the kneeling position. Wide handguard helped get it up to my face. I think the narrow handguards are cool looking, but I think they must be more ideal for you guys with long arms.

Driftertank
February 6, 2015, 10:47 PM
The wide handguards in the first pics was prettier and more comfortable than the aluminum modular guard that came on mine, but it was touching on the sides of my barrel under the hanger and causing lateral stringing, so I routed out the endcap on the modular rail to ensure clearance all the way around the barrel under all circumstances so it would free float properly and mounted my bipod on it. I think the wide handguard freefloats properly on the GI profile barrel, but not the F model's heavier barrel.

Conelrad
February 7, 2015, 12:05 AM
from a guy that has been pulling the trigger on G3 variants for over 40 years;

Steel mags will beat up the mag well after a while. Aluminum ones won't.

A trigger job is cheap and will get you a lot closer to that single MOA.

An 18" HK barrel will never realize the accuracy of 168gr ammo. plus you will have pronounced muzzle blast. 147/150gr will shoot fine, that is what the gun was designed to use.

Have a paddle mag release installed by a competent smith to make it ATF-OK. You will wonder how you ever got along without it.

Dennis

ttarp
February 7, 2015, 01:00 AM
Have a paddle mag release installed by a competent smith to make it ATF-OK. You will wonder how you ever got along without it.

This can't be emphasized enough.

Phaedrus/69
February 7, 2015, 04:17 AM
A PTR-91 has been on my wish list for awhile! Sadly the "real thing" by HK is priced well out of my reach now.:banghead:

Driftertank
February 7, 2015, 09:49 AM
A trigger job is cheap and will get you a lot closer to that single MOA.

Very yes. Got mine from Bill Springfield.

An 18" HK barrel will never realize the accuracy of 168gr ammo. plus you will have pronounced muzzle blast. 147/150gr will shoot fine, that is what the gun was designed to use.*



Respectfully disagree...I have seen my best accuracy using polymer-tipped 165/168gr ammo; soft points and hollow points get damaged by the square chamber edge during feeding, to varying extents.

Velocity is a different story. I get around 2500fps from my best loads, which puts the transonic boundary somewhere around 900yds, depending on conditions. So I consider 800 to be my hard limit for this rifle.

Have tried 150s, and while I did get a few good groups, I couldnt seem to get them to settle down and be consistent.

My results could just be attributable to the TC barrel though....

Conelrad
February 7, 2015, 10:05 AM
Quote: A PTR-91 has been on my wish list for awhile! Sadly the "real thing" by HK is priced well out of my reach now.

Ah yes, my first HK-91 was from Bumblebee in L.A. and was $350 back in '81.

D

henschman
February 7, 2015, 04:09 PM
Very cool. Looks like a very capable DMR. In addition to the new scope, it looks like you also mounted it farther forward so you didn't have to have the LOP adjusted so long compared to how you had it in your original post.

How do you like that stock? Have you weighed the rifle with that setup by any chance?

Driftertank
February 7, 2015, 07:49 PM
Love the stock. I could lay my head on that cheek piece and stay there for some time comfortably. And I did move the scope forward; I took advantage of the smaller objective diameter to tuck it right in next to the cocking lever when it's locked.

As far as weight....I haven't actually weighed it, but I'd estimate it's about 15 pounds with a full mag. Not real handy, but it's still lighter than a LMG... Lol

briansmithwins
February 7, 2015, 07:56 PM
Ah yes, my first HK-91 was from Bumblebee in L.A. and was $350 back in '81.

$350 1981 dollars would be $911 today.

Or about the price of a new PTR.

BSW

Conelrad
February 7, 2015, 09:22 PM
Is worth around $2K+ today, inflation notwithstanding.

Not that I'm bashing a PTR in any way, I'm glad they are making them with affordable quality. One needs to be in my stable....

D

stubbicatt
February 9, 2015, 11:30 AM
Neat rifles. Like one of the other contributors, I have found 155 grain Amax or Scenars to shoot lights out, as they are both pretty much length tolerant bullets as far as seating depth goes.

I feel fortunate to have purchased my rifle a long while ago, it is a JLD manufactured rifle. It doesn't like tar sealed milsurp, which is OK I guess. But I was able to source so many neat accessories for the rifle when they were relatively inexpensive, such as the 22 lr subcaliber kit, the FeroZ24 scope, which I really like, the night vision scope, etc. It is such a fun rifle to shoot.

FWIW with the 155 Amax off a front rest with a dose of H4895 powder, I can get right at an inch pretty consistently at 100 yards, and have shot prairie dogs out to 400, from prone.

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