noobie, looking for case trimmer, scale and calipers


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wolverine_173
June 24, 2012, 03:12 PM
i just got a used lee classic turret and i need a scale and case trimmer and calipers. Please offer recommendations that wont break the bank

Also do i get #500 small pistol primers to reload 9mm? and what primers do i need for 223/5.56?

thanks all

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cfullgraf
June 24, 2012, 03:21 PM
Most any bargain priced digital calipers will do you fine. Harbor Freight or the units from the major gun emporiums are two sources. There are others.

Dial calipers do not need batteries but cost a little more and are not as sexy. But they will also do fine.

The Lee trimmer system is a good economical trim system. To start, you need the cutter and shell holder stud (one package) and a case gauge and shell holder (second package). After the first purchase, you only need to add the case gauge/shell holder for any new cartridges. The shell holders are not the same as your press shell holders.

L.E Wilson is another nice trimmer but more expensive. If you have deep pockets, go for the Giraud.

Most any reloading beam scale will serve you well. The Lee scale had probably the greatest range of likes and dislikes. If you want a digital, there are lots opinions. My opinion is get one that has a 110v option and be at least in the $100 range. The sub-$50 scales are more problematic.

Small pistol primers for 9x19. Small rifle primers for 223 Remington. Magnum primers are not generally needed but look at your load data.

rcmodel
June 24, 2012, 03:22 PM
You don't need to trim 9mm.
For the .223 I'd just get the Lee trimmer.
It is cheap, and works just fine for a single caliber.

Calipers?
Harbor Freight has digital calipers on sale with a coupon all the time for $9.95.
If you have a Harbor Freight store near you?
There is a coupon in every gun magazine I pick up, and one in the Sunday paper this morning.

For a scale, I'd suggest a good balance beam like the RCBS, Hornady, Redding, etc.

9mm uses Small Pistol Primers.
.223 uses Small Rifle primers.
I have used CCI in both for 50 years with no complaints.

Sounds like you might need to get a good reloading manual, which answers the primer questions and lots of others beginners have.
I recommend the Lyman #49 if you only can buy one.

rc

dbarnhart
June 24, 2012, 05:50 PM
How much trimming to you plan to do and how precise do you need to be?

The Sinclair/Wilson is probably the most precise trimmer on the market and with the power-screwdriver adapter is pretty fast.

It is a step below the Giraud and Dillon trimmers in terms of speed and cost, but it's still not cheap.

Walkalong
June 24, 2012, 06:08 PM
As posted, the Harbor Freight Digital Caliper (http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-digital-caliper-47257.html). Works great. Cheap. Easy to see.

I never trim auto brass. I use a Possum Hollow Trimmer (https://www.possumhollowproducts.com/KWICK_CASE_TRIMMERS.html) for .223. Works great. Still have to deburr and chamfer, but it's cheap.

RCBS 505 (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/758842/rcbs-model-505-magnetic-powder-scale-511-grain-capacity) or Redding # 2 (http://www.midwayusa.com/product/658771/redding-2-master-magnetic-powder-scale-505-grain-capacity) scale. They both work great. Gee they have gone up.

Small pistol for 9MM, and small rifle for .223.

wolverine_173
June 24, 2012, 07:28 PM
i dont know how much trimming ill be doing. I have never done it before. Ill be doing 223 maybe 250 a year and 30 06 maybe 50 a year. I just want something simple

rcmodel
June 24, 2012, 07:55 PM
A Lee trimmer set-up is as simple and cheap as it gets for only 250 cases a year.
http://leeprecision.com/case-conditioning-tools/case-trimming-tools/

BTW: Always measure & trim AFTER sizing.

rc

wolverine_173
June 24, 2012, 08:38 PM
So is this all i need?

so this http://leeprecision.com/cutter-lock-stud.html

and this for 223 http://leeprecision.com/gage-holder-223-rem.html

and this for 30 06 http://leeprecision.com/gage-holder-30-06-sprfld.html


do i need a chamfer tool or primer pocket cleaning tool?

so how does this work. I attach the lock stud to my drill then attach the shell holder to the stud then the case. Then i attach the case length gauge to the cutter and hold it with my hand and insert the case length gauge into the shell case and turn on the drill and it will cut until the case length gauge hits the shell holder then it will be the perfect length and im ready to go?

rcmodel
June 24, 2012, 08:47 PM
Yes.

Cutter & Lock stud kit + Case length gage & shell holder kit for each caliber you want to trim.

You can use them in a cordless drill, or the optional Zip-Trim thing.

rc

BYJO4
June 24, 2012, 08:52 PM
For durability, a Lyman case trimmer, RCBS or similar beam scale, and a dial caliper.

wolverine_173
June 24, 2012, 09:02 PM
should i get this caliper http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-dial-caliper-66541.html

or this one http://www.harborfreight.com/6-inch-digital-caliper-47257.html

Which one do you think is most accurate?

Will this scale do? http://www.ableammo.com/catalog/rcbs-90400-rc130-mechanical-reloading-scale-p-55088.html?tbm=shop

or what about lees beam scale http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/product/7-90681

or should i just spend the money and get lyman http://www.thegunsandgearstore.com/1000-powder-scale-1000-grains-capacity-p-24834.html

rcmodel
June 24, 2012, 09:12 PM
Either caliper is accurate.
You zero them every time you pick them up, and they should always return to zero when you slide them closed.

I have the digital HF one, and an older Midway dial just like that one.

The Midway dial 15-20 years old and still works fine.
I use the two year old HF digital one way more often, as it's much easier to read with no way to read it wrong.

Get the RCBS scale.
It is much easier to use with less mass confusion Chinese fire drill mistakes then the Lee scale.

Oh! Here ya go!
Just cut, past & print and take it to the store.

http://i81.photobucket.com/albums/j219/rcmodel/100_4898.jpg

rc

FROGO207
June 24, 2012, 09:15 PM
If you are on the lazy side of things and dont mind buying a battery or two on occasion get the digital one. If you are like me and want it to work even when there is no battery available and can reason how to read with accuracy a dial scale get the dial type. I am all for buy once and not bother having to "repair" it every so often. Same as the difference between a red dot and standard scope, the standard scope will still work when the "batteries go dead".:D

Litefoot
June 25, 2012, 01:55 AM
It's hard to argue against a $9.99 digital caliper, but you can buy a General dial caliper at any hardware store for about the same price. I've measured mine against an expensive digital caliper and it is always right on the money and it doesn't require batteries. It will give you roughly .005 resolution which would be good enough for most.

Walkalong
June 25, 2012, 07:30 AM
The HF caliper is very accurate to .001, and rounds up/down to the nearest .0005. That is good enough for 99% of reloaders needs. After that, he needs a good micrometer (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=112152&stc=1&d=1262383953), and/or a ball micrometer (http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=115392&d=1265935952).

GLOOB
June 27, 2012, 03:12 AM
Yes.

Cutter & Lock stud kit + Case length gage & shell holder kit for each caliber you want to trim.

You can use them in a cordless drill, or the optional Zip-Trim thing.

rc

Or you can use the Zip-Trim chuck in a cordless drill by buying it separately and adding a cordless drill spindle:

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/352653/lee-zip-trim-case-trimmer-universal-3-jaw-chuck-case-holder

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/174316/lee-case-spinner-spindle-with-drill-shank-for-use-with-3-jaw-chuck?cm_vc=S014352653

These two parts allow you to chuck any caliber faster and better centered than with the caliber specific holders that come with the pilots.

Yes, you still need a chamfer tool. IMO, the cheapo Lee does the best outside chamfer when using a cordless drill. Does an acceptable inside chamfer, too. But it's faster to have two separate chamfer tools, once you get in the swing of things. Course, doing 250 cases a year, that probably doesn't matter too much.
http://www.midwayusa.com/product/389104/lee-chamfer-and-deburring-tool

Walkalong
June 27, 2012, 07:25 AM
The Harbor Freight caliper checking shoulder position on a .300 Blackout case. I get the same measurement with my Mitutoyo or Brown & sharp dial calipers.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=167074&stc=1&d=1340796258

wolverine_173
June 27, 2012, 01:54 PM
so with scales i could get the 60 dollar beam scale the lyman or there are several digital scales for around 35? i think it was hornady what do you think about the digital scales?

http://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Reloading-Pro-500-Scale/dp/B000PW41EO/ref=sr_1_5?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1340819850&sr=1-5&keywords=reloading+scale

or

http://www.amazon.com/Hornady-Electronic-Scale-1500-Grains/dp/B001KZ7JLW/ref=sr_1_2?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1340819850&sr=1-2&keywords=reloading+scale

cfullgraf
June 27, 2012, 04:16 PM
so with scales i could get the 60 dollar beam scale the lyman or there are several digital scales for around 35? i think it was hornady what do you think about the digital scales?

http://www.amazon.com/Lyman-Reloading-Pro-500-Scale/dp/B000PW41EO/ref=sr_1_5?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1340819850&sr=1-5&keywords=reloading+scale

or

http://www.amazon.com/Hornady-Electronic-Scale-1500-Grains/dp/B001KZ7JLW/ref=sr_1_2?s=sporting-goods&ie=UTF8&qid=1340819850&sr=1-2&keywords=reloading+scale

You will be very disappointed and probably frustrated with a digital scale that cost less than $50.

Even a used beam scale, which can be had for less than a cheap digital, will perform so much better.

For a reasonably good digital scale, you need to spend in the $90-$100 range and up.

bds
June 27, 2012, 10:03 PM
should i get this caliper (digital) ... or this one (dial)Either caliper is accurate.
I have a 17 year old MidwayUSA dial calipers and Harbor Freight digital calipers and would gladly recommend them but NOT the Harbor Freight DIAL calipers.

Last year, I did a random sampling of about 10 HF dial calipers and they would not consistently measure out to .001"! The construction, finish and fit between the digital and dial calipers are not the same. While the digital calipers showed better quality of finish, the dial calipers I sampled were rougher and inconsistent.

Last month, to see if the quality of HF dial calipers had improved, I checked several and I was not impressed.

If you are looking for dial calipers, how about Graf & Sons calipers for $21? (free shipping +$6 processing so $27 to your door) - http://www.grafs.com/retail/catalog/product/productId/5376

cfullgraf
June 27, 2012, 10:23 PM
I have a 17 year old MidwayUSA dial calipers and Harbor Freight digital calipers and would gladly recommend them but NOT the Harbor Freight DIAL calipers.



Right.

It seems the electronics for the digital calipers are pretty good and the manufacturers can make them reasonably priced. I recently purchased some inexpensive digital read outs for my lathe/mill. The sensors are similar in appearance and function as those on calipers. Very repeatable and accurate.

There is a bit more involved in building a good dial caliper since it is 100% mechanical. I have an old Starret dial caliper. Very good but if I am not careful, it will skip a tooth when moving the jaws. This problem is primarily due to age, but if a manufacturer builds on the cheap, similar poor results will be had.

wolverine_173
June 28, 2012, 03:17 PM
So the lyman pro 500 does it measure in grams or grains?

cfullgraf
June 28, 2012, 04:36 PM
So the lyman pro 500 does it measure in grams or grains?

Grains

gr = grains

gm = grams

While I was reasonably sure a scale from a reloading company would measure in grains, a simple internet search confimed it.

Sniper66
June 29, 2012, 09:15 AM
I know you are trig to get by with less expensive equipment, but I did that and eventually spent more money to upgrade. I have Forester hand trimmer, which works ok, but wears out your fingers if you trim a lot of cartridges. After much research, I bought a Lyman Power Trimmer and bought a carbide bit for it. Yeah, I spent some money, but oh what a sweet machine! Also bought an RCBS case prep machine for power deburring. I shoot a lot of p-dogs so do trim on occasion. I just save them up and trim when I am in the mood since it is my leads favorite reloading task. My tools make it easy, painless and precise.

rfwobbly
June 29, 2012, 11:28 AM
There is one small concern with the Lyman 500 that you ought to be aware of....

http://picturearchive.gunauction.com/6998082748/9431689/lymanscale.jpg_thumbnail1.jpg

Reloading depends on putting the exact right amount of powder into the case. That's basic to all safety concerns and over-rides everything else. Agree?

On the Lyman 500, the micro adjustment to the right of the fulcrum only goes to 5. The problem for SOME people is that when the micro-adjustment is on "2" are you reading "5" or "7" ?? You have to take a second look-see at the major adjustment to make absolutely sure. For some people this is a pain.

Another hiccup is that if you are set to weigh 4.5gr and need to move to 5.5gr, then you have to move 2 weights. This is room for more error in some people's book. Now there are lots of scales like this on the market and some are a lot more expensive, so I'm not picking on the Lyman. The Lyman 500 is a good buy if you can live with this "feature".

http://www.gunlistings.org/uploads/21708_20100513120045_1.jpg

However, better scales have a micro adjustment of 10 which solves all this. That's what you get by spending slightly more. Here's the Dillon Eliminator at $70...

http://www.dillonprecision.com/uimages//Dillon-Web-Cat_0046_m.jpg

No use in comparing brand names, since most of the scales on the market are made by Ohaus and simply relabeled. For instance, compare the measurement bar on the Eliminator with the one on a green RCBS 505 and the grey Ohaus. Look familiar?

http://t1.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRNoV8vDbw29Q06rKRwdZ4zK699Wmn45ppIQMFa6GtTMxGGs0PHQ1MsFwudhttp://www.bbhfarm.com/albums/album24/aac.sized.jpg


Just thought you might like to know. ;)

wolverine_173
June 29, 2012, 04:06 PM
im planning on getting the lee auto disk powder measure so i think the disk hole says how many grains it should be dropping so the scale is mainly to double check that the auto disk measure is being consistant

rcmodel
June 29, 2012, 04:15 PM
so i think the disk hole says how many grains it should be droppingNO, it doesn't.
Every powder type has different volume per grain, so it would be impossible to mark the disks for every powder.

The disks are marked in CC's.
Lee is the only reloading data in the world that uses CC's as a measurement of powder.

You have to use a Lee manual to find out what it might drop in grains with each powder you use.

Or a powder scale to find out what it really drops.

rc

bds
June 29, 2012, 08:39 PM
rcmodel is correct. Even the same powder can have variations lot-to-lot over the years.

I do not reload by CC but reference the Auto Disk chart (http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=auto%20disk%20pfd&source=web&cd=1&ved=0CFgQFjAA&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.leeprecision.com%2Fcgi-data%2Finstruct%2FAD2302.pdf&ei=K0ruT_HjHOSj6gGnvM2qAw&usg=AFQjCNEGQHpVNfvhQa5PI8m8_LVxKteTfw&cad=rja) to get close and powder charges are always weighed for verification. I highly recommend a set of check weights so you can verify the accuracy of your scale - http://www.midwayusa.com/product/212586/lyman-shooters-weight-check-set

Even when I am using the correct hole and disk, I always weigh the initial several powder drops to verify the powder has sufficiently settled in the hopper and metering consistently.

You need a powder charge between holes? I buy extra disks and drill out in-between and custom holes. An example is W231/HP-38 and .46 disk hole. For my favorite 200 gr 45ACP LSWC bullet I need 5.0 gr but .46 disk hole will drop 4.8-4.9 gr. I have a custom disk hole that will drop 5.0 gr. Life is good. :D

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