"Gun Owners are compensating for something"?


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Skribs
July 2, 2012, 04:09 PM
I've heard it suggested in the past that gun owners are compensating for something, usually the fact that they are physically weak and can't win a fight without one. I came across this article referenced in a wikipedia reading I was doing at work. You can tell who the author is in the article, Jet Li. He is regarded by many as one of the best martial artists, at least in movies, of our time.

http://jetli.com/jet/index.php?l=en&s=body&ss=essays&p=3

Finally, on the issue of self-defense. My knowledge and experience in this area of martial arts are limited, as my focus and training have been on the other three aspects of wushu practice. I cannot give a specific opinion on the subject. The training process, again, must be tailored to the body type of each individual. There is no all-encompassing technique that will enable everyone to fulfill his or her self-defense needs.

Situations always vary. It is hard to say under what circumstances it is right or wrong to use martial arts against someone else. Of course, generally speaking, avoiding conflict and resorting to lawful authorities are always the best means of dealing with a dangerous situation. If a robber holds a gun to you and wants your money, it is better to give him the money than to risk your life. A gun outdoes years of martial arts training in a split second. Like I've said many times before, it is important to differentiate between movies and reality. The hero in movies may be able to knock the gun off his opponent and save the day, but in real life - probably that is not the case.

I find it real interesting that the average joe thinks you should use martial arts to defend yourself because you want to "be a man", but one of the people known specifically for martial arts understands the limitations on man, and what the tools available to us allow someone to do regardless of training.

Anyway, I know it's pretty common knowledge on THR, but I just wanted to present this from the point of view of someone trained in martial arts as opposed to being a gun nut (I'm speaking of Mr. Li, and not myself, of course).

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Johannes_Paulsen
July 2, 2012, 04:11 PM
Hell, you don't have to pull up something by Jet Li- I AM compensating for something.

I really don't have a lot of confidence in my ability to overcome an attack using deadly force on my person (or a situation involving multiple attackers,) with just my hand-to-hand skills alone.

RBid
July 2, 2012, 04:31 PM
I have a martial arts background, which is why I have a gun.

I am painfully aware of how limited empty hands are, in certain circumstances. My gun is a last resort. It is there for when my 1) words, 2) more words, 3) ability to leave, 4) hands and feet fail to negate threatening situations.




I guess you could say that I'm compensating for something... I'm compensating for the inability or unwillingness of some components of society to self regulate.

230RN
July 2, 2012, 04:32 PM
At my age and with arthritis I feel like prey every time I go out with my cane. I do a lot of shopping at night since I'm retired and a bit of a nightowl and there are several stores around which are 24/7. So, since I can't run and I can't fight any more, I carry a laser-sighted wheelgun 24/7.

So yes, I am compensating for "something," but not what usually comes to mind when that pop-psychology concept is used by anti gunners. :neener:

I understand the new attack method is to run up from behind and deliver either a drop kick or a full-body impact to knock the prey down. So I watch my six a lot, like in parking lots and so forth. According to what I've read, this can happen in daylight, too.

A while ago I was tempted to get one of those bicyclist's mirrors you mount on your glasses, but I figured, nah, that was being too paranoid.

But, after all, I didn't get to be 73 by not being careful, so I may do that anyhow and the hell with those who think it looks funny.

However, I found that glass is your friend, like car and store windows and the like, to check your rear echelon by the reflections. Oh, and in daytime, shadows. And for heaven's sake, don't go bopping around with your earbuds in. Nowadays, just plain walking for the enjoyment of it is a tactical excercise.

Terry, 230RN

Sam1911
July 2, 2012, 04:32 PM
Heh heh. That's pretty funny in a way.

Defensively speaking, I AM trying to compensate for something -- the fact that a violent criminal might be stronger, faster, sneakier than me and there might be more of them than me.

Competition-wise, I am compensating for the fact that I can't THROW bullets fast enough to make "power factor" so I won't be allowed to compete if I don't have a gun.

From the point of view of a collector, having a nice gun may compensate for my poor ability to enjoy that blank spot on my wall nearly as much as I can appreciate the gorgeous blued steel and walnut work of art I prefer to hang upon it.

When I go hunting, a firearm helps me compensate for the fact that I can't fly very well, and don't run all that fast, so catching game would otherwise be quite difficult. I also have a stove which helps me compensate for my inability to safely digest raw meats.

My car helps me compensate for the fact that it would take me two days just to get to work on foot.

My phone and internet connections compensate for the fact that my voice is too weak to be heard by friends in other parts of the country, or on the other side of the world.

I also own clothing which helps me compensate for an insufficiently toned physique to be able to go about in public without.

Yup, I'm compensating!

Carl N. Brown
July 2, 2012, 04:37 PM
Yes I am compensating for my inadequacies by keeping a handgun for self defense. I have arthritis that prevents making a fist, and double hernia that prevents running. I am 64 years old and caring for a disabled wife drains a lot of energy and leaves me unable to duke it out with an attacker like the poser "real he men" who don't need a gun to defend their manly selves.

Skribs
July 2, 2012, 04:40 PM
Sam, you made me laugh.

Personally, I compensate for the fact that I am about as physically coordinated as Steve Erkel...and not much bigger.

Texan Scott
July 2, 2012, 04:42 PM
LOL! Sam1911 hit the nail on the head.

_________________________________
Sent over the internet with a computer to compensate for the limited volume of my voice.

MtnSpur
July 2, 2012, 04:53 PM
Ask a 25 year old person that is physically fit whether they can defend themselves from someone of equal fitness and experience in a fight (fist, wrestling, etc). Ask that same question to a person 40 years older who is no longer as healthy, fast, fit nor prone to put themsleves in a situation that requires physically hitting someone.

That 25 year old can probably receive a few good whacks and continue the battle; thinking that 65 year old, not so much. Fight or flight, armed or unarmed? Interesting concept when viewed using age? My randon thought for the day.

Spats McGee
July 2, 2012, 04:56 PM
I believe that Sam1911 gets the "Nailed It Award" for this thread.

armoredman
July 2, 2012, 04:59 PM
I compensate for the fact that criminals are cowards and often run in packs. They don't kindly attack one at a time like on Walker:Texas Ranger, but will dog pile anyone trying to use empty hand techniques. I am compensating for the fact the average criminal thug is half my age or less, and sometimes utilizing chemical "enhancement" that may limit his ability to feel pain or fear, or use logic. I am compensating for the fact I do not sport six pack abs or a body builder physique, nor do I have the time, ability or desire to become an Atlas of physical ability.
Well, gee whillickers, I guess I AM compensating for something after all...

LeonCarr
July 2, 2012, 05:03 PM
This thread reminds of the saying, "If you are fighting fair, your tactics suck".

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

Friendly, Don't Fire!
July 2, 2012, 05:10 PM
I also have arthritis, big time, to the point that my body just does not do the things it once did when I was younger. I was never one for fighting, I am not a fighter. If several people were to attack me at once, I would most likely fear for my life. Not only that, I cannot be depended upon to help those who may be with me!

I have a car to compensate that I cannot run at 70 MPH.
I have a telephone as I am not any good at telepathic communication.
I have a firearm as I cannot catch a deer and kill it with a spear. I cannot shoot a blow-dart with a poisoned-tip at any wildlife as that would be considered illegal where I live.

alsaqr
July 2, 2012, 05:24 PM
By carrying a gun i'm compensating for being old and infirm. Drat; i carried a gun when i was young and fit too.

hso
July 2, 2012, 05:26 PM
I'm compensating for not being Superman.

Stevie-Ray
July 2, 2012, 05:33 PM
Yeah, I'm compensating as well. I no longer feel I can take on 2 or 3 guys at a time like when I was young. Seemed like once I hit 50, it was over. Good thing my city has quieted down some over the years.

ApacheCoTodd
July 2, 2012, 05:36 PM
Compensating? Hell no... I like to think of it as more an issue of over equalizing.

While not directly addressing Li's perspective, I tend to raggedy-ass tired of folk (particular issue haters) laying off anything they don't understand or agree with as "making up (or compensating) for something".

My choices in the following are regularly assailed:

Cars
Dogs
Trucks
Knives
Firearms
Motorcycles
Career choices

To name a few.

sig228
July 2, 2012, 05:59 PM
I don't know who Jet Li is, but he sounds like a very very smart man.

tpaw
July 2, 2012, 06:08 PM
230RN..........

At 65 I feel the same way. Great words! ;)

CharlieDeltaJuliet
July 2, 2012, 06:18 PM
I don't think I am compensating for anything. It isnt a rush for me to own firearms, so I din't feel like Rambo. Firearms have always been a part of my life. I do however carry concealed. This isnt to make me feel tough, it is to try to add to the peace of mind that I will make it home safe and sound. It is a violent volaile world, that I have seen first hand. It is just better to be prepared. I know that it is difficult to protect myself against multiple attackers, if more than one person tries to rob me.

A very wise man once yelled at me" there are three types of people in this world, Wolves,Sheep, and Sheepdogs" He is right.

Clipper
July 2, 2012, 06:36 PM
Never pick a fight with an old man. If he can't kick your ass, he'll just shoot you.

Skribs
July 2, 2012, 06:38 PM
I don't know who Jet Li is, but he sounds like a very very smart man.

An actor and a VERY good martial artist. Which is why if he says a gun wins vs. martial arts, I know it's not because he's bad at martial arts and blames it on the gun, it's because he understands the power that these devices have.

Hacker15E
July 2, 2012, 07:07 PM
Might as well just come out and say it, that when antis make the "compensating for something" argument, they are implying that the gun owner has a small penis.

It is the most infantile and idiotic of ad-hominem attacks. Whenever someone brings that into an adult discussion on firearms, I always stop and make the individual who used that phrase explain exactly what it is they mean instead of letting them get away with such a driveby attack.

brboyer
July 2, 2012, 07:12 PM
At my age and with arthritis I feel like prey every time I go out with my cane. I do a lot of shopping at night since I'm retired and a bit of a nightowl and there are several stores around which are 24/7. So, since I can't run and I can't fight any more, I carry a laser-sighted wheelgun 24/7.

So yes, I am compensating for "something," but not what usually comes to mind when that pop-psychology concept is used by anti gunners. :neener:

I understand the new attack method is to run up from behind and deliver either a drop kick or a full-body impact to knock the prey down. So I watch my six a lot, like in parking lots and so forth. According to what I've read, this can happen in daylight, too.

A while ago I was tempted to get one of those bicyclist's mirrors you mount on your glasses, but I figured, nah, that was being too paranoid.

But, after all, I didn't get to be 73 by not being careful, so I may do that anyhow and the hell with those who think it looks funny.

However, I found that glass is your friend, like car and store windows and the like, to check your rear echelon by the reflections. Oh, and in daytime, shadows. And for heaven's sake, don't go bopping around with your earbuds in. Nowadays, just plain walking for the enjoyment of it is a tactical excercise.

Terry, 230RN

Not paranoid at all.

Wifey & I spend a lot of time with our three grand kids, oldest just turned three last week, and my attention is necessarily on them while out in public.

Sometimes I feel like a sitting duck.

I've been seriously thought about a 'rear-view mirror' lately.

Sam1911
July 2, 2012, 07:31 PM
...when antis make the "compensating for something" argument, they are implying...Oh, of course, but the great thing is that their "compensating" line is a terrific opening for presenting all the positive reasons for owning a gun! (Post 5)

There are also a number of fabulously "Not THR Material" responses if the opportunity was appropriate ... er, sufficiently IN-appropriate for that kind of hyjinx.

303tom
July 2, 2012, 07:53 PM
The wife says she likes my gun...............

bikerdoc
July 2, 2012, 07:58 PM
Ya'all realize "compensating" was originally a theory of Freud. IIRC it was written in 1907.
People that use it are way behind the curve in Pyscology.
Me at 63 with plates and screws in my neck DJD and a bad hip would love to compensate back to the 20 yrs paratrooper, snooping around the jungle again, the 30 yr old cop, wrestling perps and mopes to the ground, or even the 50 yr nurse in the ER taking care of a crip while bloods outside are trying to get in.
But alas I am an old man, totally aware that my brain, situational awareness, and a hunk iron are now my lot in life.

GLOOB
July 2, 2012, 08:05 PM
You can train all you want. You can NOT know how fit, well trained, or well armed your aggressor is until after your butt has already been handed to you.

RaceM
July 2, 2012, 08:12 PM
I'm not compensating for jack. I just got tired of busting my knuckles on people's heads.

1911Tuner
July 2, 2012, 08:19 PM
Of course I'm compensating. I'm too old to outrun'em...too stove up to stand and fight with'em...and I don't heal up very well any more, so I can't handle a beat-down. I just ain't got many options besides a pistol.

pinstripe
July 2, 2012, 08:20 PM
I am compensating, for my inability to take an ass whippin' from some fool, or group of cowardly fools, that want my money, truck, wife, daughter, dog, burrito,soda, or anything else that I have worked my whole life for. He can have the cat!:D

Inebriated
July 2, 2012, 08:23 PM
A lot of anti's make this argument because they don't understand the concept of self-defense. It is when you have nothing left to keep you alive. They think we carry to go get in fights, or to feel tough. Simply put, they are idiots. I can respect anyone against guns, if they can argue without reaching like that.

So I guess I'll "compensate" and stay alive, while they're being a "real man" as they bleed out in an alley from trying to prove their manhood.

TimeRegained
July 2, 2012, 08:30 PM
The only reason I carry a gun is because I'm strong and very fast and I'd usually stick around for the fight rather than fly off.

Really.

If I didn't feel 110% at the top of my physical game then I wouldn't trust myself with a gun in the first place.

My marathon PR is 2:49 which means I can pretty much run out of any situation but I'm not that type.

I actually would put up a fight if my life came down to it.

But, I'm smarter than that and would never provoke a fight, would never intend on using a gun if I could talk my way out of it, would never bring danger to myself or others if all it meant was convincing the other person it's not going to be his worthwhile to start this.

SharpsDressedMan
July 2, 2012, 08:31 PM
I believe that having a high proficiency with a gun, and readily packing one, means that one need not fear another man, or even several men. I am that confident in my ability. I don't go looking for a fight, but I damn sure am not going to run from one. Let my attacker(s) beware. I find it socially objectionable that there are people out there that have intent to harm others, and I believe that it is entirely proper to be righteously indignant about it, and to arm one's self and take action if ncessary.

Hacker15E
July 2, 2012, 08:45 PM
Of course I'm compensating. I'm too old to outrun'em...too stove up to stand and fight with'em...and I don't heal up very well any more, so I can't handle a beat-down. I just ain't got many options besides a pistol.

You could serve 'em a mean cup of coffee, though!

1911Tuner
July 2, 2012, 10:16 PM
Hacker, you're one of the few visitors I've had that'll actually drink my coffee. Yer a brave lad, ya are...but most fighter pilots are rather gutsy. :D

Certaindeaf
July 2, 2012, 10:19 PM
As weak and naked big-brained monkeys, of course we compensate.. by using everything from a wheelbarrow to a lever. feh

SaxonPig
July 2, 2012, 10:25 PM
Dip fecal anti-gun types have been braying this psychobabble BS about gun owners lacking manhood or being sexually insecure for decades. Weak and unable to fight? Need to compensate for lack of achievements? Yeah, right. I'm 6'3" and have a 5th degree black belt in Shotokan karate. I also have five college degrees including a doctorate. I don't need to compensate for anything.

Millwright
July 2, 2012, 10:31 PM
About the only thing I'm "compensating" for these days is the annoying habit of those vilianous paper targets to dodge my perfectly aimed/executed shots on the X ring ! Back when my kids were young and my house was the "hangout" for upwards of a dozen male/female teens hunting supplied the meat for a variety of pasta dishes that fueled them. House rules were simple and succinct. No kid was ever turned away hungry. But those unable/unwilling to abide by our "house rules" seemed, magically, never to return. We didn't enforce this - their peers did ! >MW

mljdeckard
July 2, 2012, 10:34 PM
We are compensating for the time between when something bad happens and when the police show up.

We are compensating for the fact that we can't can't outrun game.

chicharrones
July 2, 2012, 10:46 PM
Why should everyone have to learn to fight by spending years practicing martial arts? I appreciate a person's choice to practice martial arts, but I've got other things to do in this world.

In the physical aspect of using my body I'd rather play sports, ride a bike, row a canoe, or swing an axe than practice martial arts. That's just me, people have their own preferences.

friscolatchi
July 2, 2012, 10:54 PM
I'm compensating for the years I spent growing up in da Bronx, where it was and still is impossible to get a handgun unless you're a felon, or want to become one. With consideration for some of our clientel, it's more comforting to drive home at night on lonely roads with my pistol or revolver handy. I'm compensating for my lack of experience in the fighting arts, my lack of military experience. I grew up a street wise city kid but this city kid has spent the past 40 years in the country. I just love carrying a gun, I love going hiking with my family, dog and gun.

foghornl
July 2, 2012, 11:09 PM
I'm compensating for:
1. at age 59+, with bad knees and hips, I can't outrun a 2-year-old on a "Big Wheel"
2. at age 59+, I don't heal so good when I go "Splat!"
3. I ain't gonna be kickin' 4 or 5 butts at a time.
4. I'm too weak to carry a cop.


'Tuner, ya aughta try some of my Cajun relative's ahhhhhh " Coffee ". They pour a cup, then stand a spoon in middle of cup, and let go. If spoon falls to side of cup, " Coffee " is too weak.

230RN
July 2, 2012, 11:27 PM
The type of anti-gunner who accuses someone of compensating for an inadequacy (of whatever kind) could themselves be accused of compensating for lack of logical capacity.

And speaking of Martial Arts, one of these days I'd like to see someone come out with a tee-shirt saying,

BLACK BELT
IN
KUNG .45

with a bold line drawing of a 1911 under it.

Or some such appropriate legend, like ".45ACP" or ".45 AUTO" or ".357" or even <ahem> "FOTAY GLOCK."

Terry, 230RN

Deus Machina
July 2, 2012, 11:52 PM
I, for one, am absolutely compensating.
I'm compensating for the fact that a mugger or home invader will have a weapon. I want one too.

Zundfolge
July 3, 2012, 12:03 AM
People who reference totally discredited Freudian Psychology (ie gun ownership compensates for small "wedding tackle") to make their political points are compensating for something; stupidity.

Of course the irony is that Freud is credited with saying "A fear of weapons is a sign of retarded sexual and emotional maturity". (he probably never really said that but he also would have thought the whole "gun compensates for small wee wee" charge is stupid).

FROGO207
July 3, 2012, 12:04 AM
When I find myself compensating, it is usually aimed at the local FFL or firearms merchant for all the wonderful items I must purchase and carry home so I then can play with that tend to go BOOM.:D

General Geoff
July 3, 2012, 01:07 AM
I carry a gun to compensate for everyone out there who would do me harm, given the opportunity.

captain awesome
July 3, 2012, 02:13 AM
Being a young man in my mid twenty's, 215 lbs, in good physical shape, I am quick and strong. I feel as though I could hold my own in a physical altercation should the need ever arise. That is against one assailant, perhaps two depending on whether they have any hand to hand combat training. Do I have confidence? Yes. Do I go looking for trouble, or try to prevent it any way I can? I prevent it. Do I carry a gun? Absolutely.

So what am I compensating for? Well as others have said, I am not superman, and I know it. Neither are my wife and child. I cannot predict the future, so I do everything I can to make sure the future turns out in my families favor. I guess you could say I am compensating for not being a supernaturally omniscient man of steel same as the rest of you.

Apparently that makes me a cowardly helpless weakling as well, according to the antis.

Mr. Li seems to be a not only a very talented martial artist, but a very intelligent person as well.

B!ngo
July 3, 2012, 02:24 AM
I think the comments are all too pithy. Yes, it's hard to imagine being able to triumph in street hand-to-hand when you are older and/or infirm. But even when you are young and in shape, the only way to ensure you can have a good chance of winning a fight is to fight. And fight often. On the streets, in the ring, or some form of training.
I grew up in the streets of NY and I mean the streets. Lots of fighting, and I more often than not got my butt kicked. I wasn't looking for a fight, and I wasn't a pure street guy (though I may have engaged in a bit of street mahem). But the ones who typically won a fight were always fighting. I could run, had quick hands, played sports and was wiry strong but it was no match for someone who could suss out a good time to hit hard, when to move, and when to run. Because they did it all the time. Trust me, I hung with 'em or fought against them.
So if there is any implied, 'back in the day', having really been in it back in the day, I suspect there wasn't really a time when many of us could safely go it alone. As a result though, I'm not very concerned walking the streets. I have some built-in radar and attitude from my youth that really helps.
B
P.S. One of the few memorable stories about my father was when I was quite young, came home beat up, bleeding and such. He flew in to a rage, cleaned me up and then looked down at me an said, 'Tell me one thing. Did ya' hurt 'em?'.

icanthitabarn
July 3, 2012, 02:32 AM
I am soon to be 55 and make my coffee with half a pound at a time. :what:

Dejavu
July 3, 2012, 08:46 AM
I always liked that scene in the Indiana Jones movie, in the bazaar, when the black ninja guy showed some moves as he approached our hero and Harrison Ford just looked disgusted, pulled his pistol and shot him.

From a distance, lead beats KungFu every time.

highlander 5
July 3, 2012, 09:10 AM
I've said this in similar threads so here goes. I'm in my early 60s 5'8" 220 and I wouldn't want to take on the teenagers I see now a days. Most are at least 6" tall and out weigh me by a good 20-30 lbs and are in excellent shape. That being said "we" are expected to take on a felon who has probably spent most of his time pumping iron and honing his skill while in prison. Add to this the elements of surprise and the fact that he has nothing to lose if caught as he'll just go back to prison for a stint and use it to hone his predatory skills so he won't get caught the next time. To put it in a nutshell my days of leaping tall buildings in a single bound have long since past.

SimplyChad
July 3, 2012, 09:23 AM
Im 22 6'1 between 225 and 245 depending on if i have a fight coming up or not and can bench press 400 lbs. I have 3 brothers that are at least 6'4 and in the 260's or bigger. Ever got in a fight with a guy 6'8 and 300 lbs? I have it sucks. But Ive always been the smallest and weakest in my respect group until I joined the army. I have complete confidence in my hand to hand skills. But im a medic ive seen the damage even a handgun (makarov) can do to human flesh and bone. If I ever ended up with a gun in my face..... well lead is faster then my hands. Is it compensation? maybe. I just see it as being smart. I carry everywhere I legally can without fail.

Gtimothy
July 3, 2012, 09:51 AM
I have a new found respect for Mr.LI. I enjoy watching his movies and the way they are choreographed. Every punch, kick, flip and jab are practiced to perfection...nobody gets hurt on the set(usually). Real life...totally unpredictable! Even a man who has trained in martial arts his whole life can't predict what the day will bring. I don't feel like I'm compensating so much as just being as prepared for the day as best I can.

Skribs
July 3, 2012, 12:00 PM
I always liked that scene in the Indiana Jones movie, in the bazaar, when the black ninja guy showed some moves as he approached our hero and Harrison Ford just looked disgusted, pulled his pistol and shot him.

The story behind that scene is that there was actually a big fight scene planned, but Harrison Ford was ill and needed to use the restroom so he pulled the gun and fired instead. The director liked that better than the fight scene, and the audience loves it.

GTimothy, that's how I felt after reading that.

nwilliams
July 3, 2012, 06:23 PM
I've been doing Martial Arts for about twenty years, I'm a black belt in Karate and I've been studying Aikido for a number of years now. I own guns and carry a gun for personal protection because using your bare hands against an assailant with a weapon is usually going to end badly for you. You can't block bullets with your bare hands, I don't care how good a Martial Artist you are.

asia331
July 4, 2012, 01:38 AM
Proficiency at small arms is a martial art. Those who practice Martial Arts, regardless of specialty, are compensating for the existence of evil in this world. So what? Those who choose not to prepare to defend themselves while not compensating per se are most certainly naive and woefully lacking in personal responsibility.

basicblur
July 4, 2012, 09:45 AM
Well unless I missed it (just blew through the thread), to those that wanna use the line 'bout compensating because I carry a gun, I just repeat Ayoob's line (don't know where he got it?) - If I were compensating for something, I certainly wouldn't be carrying a short-barreled gun.

When they hit you with the "I would never carry a gun" line, I think Dirty Harry said it best - A man's gotta know his limitations.

Two can play the psychobabble game...

Deanimator
July 4, 2012, 10:12 AM
Virtually everyone I've ever seen make the "compensation" argument had the mentality of an adolescent boy, high on testosterone and "Grand Theft Auto".

At 54, I'm WAY past schoolyard fisticuffs. I'm not interested in interacting with most people in ANY way, nevermind in juvenile fistfights.


I avoid stupid people.
I avoid the places where stupid people get intoxicated.
I especially avoid the places where stupid people get intoxicated and fight each other.


I'm "compensating" for being short, overweight and middle-aged.

Put another way, "Gun control, the theory that 110lb. women have the 'right' to fistfight with 210lb. rapists." I wish my mother in Illinois was able to exercise her RIGHT to not get victimized by some super predator just out of Joliet.

USAF_Vet
July 4, 2012, 05:56 PM
I've trained in several forms of martial arts, am a combat veteran with 3 tours in Iraq, 6'2" and 230 pounds with a pretty solid build. If I need to fight in a non lethal manner, I can hold my own.

Having said that, I own/ carry guns as compensation for the fact that I do not have a personal body guard or police officer in my pocket.

Not every situation can be solved with fists, or a gun. The mind is the best weapon, but sometimes a gun is just more effective.

robhof
July 4, 2012, 06:02 PM
I enjoy the knowledge that if I'm attacked by anyone, it'll be the last time they attack any one. When I cary, the use of lethal force is always authorized. To all the anti-gun people I just gotta say...:cuss::cuss::cuss::cuss::cuss:

1894
July 4, 2012, 07:32 PM
When I was younger, I had my tail kicked as many times as I kicked tail. Maybe more. Most of my old friends think my nose is just a bit crooked because of those outings. Actually, my mother did it when I said something I shouldn't have. I was never concerned about my life in any of that.

The Rules have changed. I'm compensating for those changes.

shep854
July 4, 2012, 07:51 PM
I rather suspect that people who have made that comment have never been in a good fistfight, never mind had the stuffing beaten out of them.:scrutiny:

orionengnr
July 4, 2012, 07:53 PM
Might as well just come out and say it, that when antis make the "compensating for something" argument, they are projecting. There, fixed it for you.
Projection is a very common tactic of insecure people.

I guess you could say that I'm compensating for something... I'm compensating for the inability or unwillingness of some components of society to self regulate.
RBid wins my vote for Post Of The Month.

Happy Birthday, America.
Happy Independence Day, fellow THRers.

Swampman
July 4, 2012, 08:37 PM
"When I cary, the use of lethal force is always authorized."

Really? I hope you like institutional food and making new friends... CLOSE ones...

Sniper66
July 4, 2012, 08:44 PM
I buy guns to compensate for not having enough of them. Fact is, my guns and shooting sports are a boatload of fun. Today, I am shopping for a rail of some sort to make the air-gun scope I bought fit on my pellet rifle, so I can shoot the rabbits that keep eating my wife's beautiful landscaping. Helps me compensate for not being able to kill them by throwing a rock:)

Smokin Gator
July 4, 2012, 09:55 PM
I'm in the group that's compensating for the fact that no one else is going to be responsible for protecting me or my family. The police can only be there taking a report after the fact, 99.9% of the time. I also have them for fun and I shoot a lot of matches. Mark

gunsandreligion
July 4, 2012, 10:05 PM
I dont carry a gun to fight, i carry to defend myself. If i wished to fight i would do karate, but unfortunatly my interests run towards other things. We dont all walk out the door every day hoping to get our daily fistfight in, we walk out the door for our jobs and such, and a gun is used to defend our lives so we can continue with our daily tasks. Figuritively, Instead of being the masters of making, installing, and balacing tires, we just have a spare in the trunk for when rhe need arises.

Hugo
July 4, 2012, 10:08 PM
It's compensating for being under armed and/or outnumbered by the bad guys, or outmuscled by the bad guys. Also, better to have a gun if the bad guy(s) have a knife.

Do you want to have a "fair" knife duel with the bad guy breaking into your home? I think not! You hold your pistol or shotgun and say "Get out of my home!". Plus, women are compensating for mostly being not as prepared for physical combat.

Guns are not compensating, they're equalizing. Wasn't the old slogan for Colt Firearms something like "Be not afraid of any man, no matter his size, call upon me for I will equalize."

Only the misinformed or stupid say gun owners are compensating for something.

Resist Evil
July 5, 2012, 12:03 AM
Having a firearm does not compensate for any physical shortcoming of mine. I carry one because it may be the most efficient tool to deal with the moral shortcomings of others.

abq87120
July 5, 2012, 12:52 AM
The police department's job is not to provide personal security for me. Their job is to arrest people AFTER they commit a crime. I carry to compensate for not having a gun when I need one.

Mp7
July 5, 2012, 07:48 AM
considerting the stats of U.S average bodyweight .. quite a few here must
be to heavy and cardio-unfit to consider hand2hand a promising alternative :D

bikerdoc
July 5, 2012, 08:17 AM
MP7 LOL,

No, actaually Some of the old guy I have met here are fit and thin, just infirm, slow and hurting.

Mp7
July 5, 2012, 10:20 AM
@Bikerdoc ..... if i ever wisit my folks in Letcher Co KY ... iŽll make sure to hop over
get your infirm, slow and hurting behind an icecold beer :-)

(...and take a peek at all those knives n stuff)

Readyrod
July 5, 2012, 10:29 AM
Gun owners are compensating for an unsafe environment. At least the ones who aren't doing it for sport or hobby.

HOOfan_1
July 5, 2012, 11:24 AM
Natural selection has been picking out individuals who are best able to compensate for about 4 billion years now. Compensation = survival.

WardenWolf
July 5, 2012, 12:28 PM
The only thing I'm compensating for is recoil.

http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/th_Tokarev.jpg (http://i154.photobucket.com/albums/s279/WardenWolf_1982/Tokarev.jpg)

gym
July 5, 2012, 12:34 PM
My friend Kasim Dubar, fought Butch Bell, Bill Wallace, and Chuck Norris, in the garden at an exibition. He won all 3 fights, Guess how he died, 2 rounds from a double barreled shotgun. You can google him, it has some of his fights , with Benny the Jet. Back in early 70's late 60's. Martial arts work great if the other guy fights fair.
Taken from an article on gogle:
On May 10th, 1975, in New York, Aaron Banks organizes 4 championships of the world, crowned by the WPKO. The winners are Joe Hess/NY in the heavyweights, Fred Miller/NY in the light heavyweights, Kasim Dubar/NY in the middleweights and Benny Urquidez/Los Angeles in the lightweights. This show was sold to ABC Wide World of Sport, creating a conflict with the PKA. The latter has also sold its first product at this channel. Urquidez beats Tayari Casel. The latter practice Kung-Fu. It was his first fight in full-contact. Casel spend part of the fight on the ground, from which he tries to strike Urquidez. In this blog, a special article is about this tournament.

It was a punk kid who Kasim threw out of a nightclub, "where he did security", "for some dear friends of mine". The kid didn't like being tossed out on his ass, so he came back with a shotgun.

1911Tuner
July 5, 2012, 01:00 PM
Natural selection has been picking out individuals who are best able to compensate for about 4 billion years now.

Oh, I am so gonna steal that...

My friend Kasim Dubar, fought Butch Bell, Bill Wallace, and Chuck Norris, in the garden at an exibition. He won all 3 fights, Guess how he died, 2 rounds from a double barreled shotgun.

Martial arts is essentially a contact weapon. Ya gotta get close enough to use it. The shotgun had the advantage of distance, and the shooter likely had the advantage of surprise.

It's a little like the knife vs gun/karate kid/what-have you. When facing the experienced and determined blade man, you'll never see the knife.

T Bran
July 5, 2012, 01:02 PM
Guns are tools although they are more complicated than a hammer it is as simple as that.

Anyone who doesnt think that they are nessicary should try driving a nail with their forehead or cutting up a tomato without a knife. So like it or not we all compensate every day in some way.

basicblur
July 5, 2012, 01:11 PM
Martial arts is essentially a contact weapon. Ya gotta get close enough to use it. The shotgun had the advantage of distance...
Well obviously the kid doesn't watch TV or he would know the proper way to use a gun - all the folks I see on TV holding someone at gunpoint always close the distance 'til the gun is 'bout an inch from their target.

Don't you watch any TV? :D

Sig Bill
July 5, 2012, 01:29 PM
That punk shooter is a coward.

I used to watch martial art matches on tv and it was fun to watch. I remember when Joe "cougar" Lewis came out of retirement at age 40 for a match. His opponent towered over him and I don't remember who won the match (I think Joe) but I remember later the opponent remarked, "Damn, his punches hurts."

I like Jet Li. He's got some cool movies. I got a few in my DVD collection. If you haven't seen Kiss Of The Dragon you owe it yourself to watch it. Romeo Must Die is great too.

Anyway, I rather avoid situations where I can get hurt (nowadays killed duh.) I've been disabled most of my life and now that I'm in my 60s I'm counting my blessings. I keep a gun in the house so I can protect my sis who's older than me. I also carry in my car which is legal but I'm hoping that I can get a cc permit.

GEM
July 5, 2012, 01:49 PM
It's just crappy Intro Psych Freudian analysis.

Progun folks say that antigunner are hoplophobes and demonstrating reaction formation.

Antigunners say wanting guns is a form of compensation and displacement for wanting a bigger male organ.

Both the pro and anti applications of Freud are stupid.

Freud has been dropped as having much explanatory power years ago by much of the psychiatric or psychological professions. Still have some cult like true believers.

George W. Bush and Mitt Romney were or are trying to possess their mommy by showing up their fathers' failures. Same Freudian deal - buy into that?

Skribs
July 5, 2012, 01:52 PM
I majored in psych, and I can tell you - the craziest people are people who are prominent figures in psychology. With that said, I wasn't referring to the male organ form of compensation, but rather the idea that people own a gun because they are compensating for a lack of fighting skills.

Well...hey, I am! I'm not very coordinated with gross motor skills, but fine motor skills like typing or pulling a trigger I am good at. So I play to my strengths.

bikerdoc
July 7, 2012, 05:38 AM
but rather the idea that people own a gun because they are compensating for a lack of fighting skills.


And has been pointed out it may not be a lack of, but a loss of skills, through age, infirmity, or disabilty. There are at least a dozen member heres who back in the day you would not want to mess with.
Today you still dont want to mess with them.

They give new meaning to the word compensation, or better stated "not being a victim" whether it be by aviodance, evasion, escape, cane, knife or gun. They have the mindset and skill set to survive. Just a different tool box.

2DREZQ
July 7, 2012, 07:22 AM
Some vermin have two legs, some have four.
I own the correct equipment to "compensate" both types.

Sig Bill
July 7, 2012, 12:32 PM
And has been pointed out it may not be a lack of, but a loss of skills, through age, infirmity, or disabilty. There are at least a dozen member heres who back in the day you would not want to mess with.
Today you still dont want to mess with them.

They give new meaning to the word compensation, or better stated "not being a victim" whether it be by aviodance, evasion, escape, cane, knife or gun. They have the mindset and skill set to survive. Just a different tool box.

Good point. Very well said.

Fotno
July 7, 2012, 12:46 PM
I've been following this thread along the way, and after some thought I offer this:

I carry a firearm because I don't start fights, I don't commit crimes, and I don't go to places where I'm likely to run into those that do. If I ever (God forbid) have to draw my weapon to defend myself from attack, it will be because the circumstances have forced me to do so. It is my belief that when an innocent person believes their lives are on the line, they don't have any obligation to 'fight fair'.

greenr18
July 7, 2012, 12:53 PM
I'm compensating for the fact I have an aversion to gouging peoples eyes out with my thumbs.

PTMCCAIN
July 7, 2012, 12:56 PM
I carry a firearm, where and when legally I can, because I am compensating for the lack of ethics, morality and common sense on the part of people who would do me harm.

MrDig
July 7, 2012, 01:05 PM
Every time I hear that I am compensating I think "Why yes, there is an empty space in my Gun Cabinet or my Collection.
On a serious note I am in my early 50's and have disabilities, I am no longer a Street/Bar fighter and am incapable if faced with deadly force of defending myself or my loved ones. Yes I am compensating for my physical disabilities if all other options are not available.

btg3
July 7, 2012, 01:28 PM
I've heard it suggested in the past that gun owners are compensating for something...
Sure, no debate on physical compensation via a firearm. But if we examine using guns to psychologically compensate for "something", the discussion would take a decidedly different tone.

mr.trooper
July 7, 2012, 02:38 PM
People that think that way are not living in reality. They do not understand how serious such situations are, because most of them have never even been in a simple scuffle.

In the vast majority of defense situations, whether they be a mugging or a drunk fist fight:
* You have no way to know what your opponents intent is.
* You have no way of knowing for certain how any individual will react to that specific situation.
* You have no idea how or when your opponent will "change the rules" on you in order to "win" the confrontation
* You have no way of knowing who will suffer what injuries.

How many fist fights have turned into stabbings and shooting after someone got their pride hurt?

How many people have been killed outright from simple unarmed blows?

How many times have people "gone too far" in the heat of the moment?

THESE are the things Joe Blow doesn't think about, because the only fighting he has ever seen have been his buddies drumming their chests in the back yard, or Jet Lee fighting in movies.

KTXdm9
July 8, 2012, 07:04 PM
Ah yes, the age old tactic of personal attacks when your argument has no merit. Sadly, the anti-2A folks aren't the only ones who practice it. I'm sure it has something to do with their disbelief that someone would actually take self defense into their own hands, rather than rely on the government to do it for them.

Rubikees
July 8, 2012, 07:39 PM
I am coming in a bit late and it might have been brought up. I know of several Martial Arts Masters that conceal carry.

justice06rr
July 8, 2012, 09:47 PM
Heh heh. That's pretty funny in a way.

Defensively speaking, I AM trying to compensate for something -- the fact that a violent criminal might be stronger, faster, sneakier than me and there might be more of them than me.

Competition-wise, I am compensating for the fact that I can't THROW bullets fast enough to make "power factor" so I won't be allowed to compete if I don't have a gun.

From the point of view of a collector, having a nice gun may compensate for my poor ability to enjoy that blank spot on my wall nearly as much as I can appreciate the gorgeous blued steel and walnut work of art I prefer to hang upon it.

When I go hunting, a firearm helps me compensate for the fact that I can't fly very well, and don't run all that fast, so catching game would otherwise be quite difficult. I also have a stove which helps me compensate for my inability to safely digest raw meats.

My car helps me compensate for the fact that it would take me two days just to get to work on foot.

My phone and internet connections compensate for the fact that my voice is too weak to be heard by friends in other parts of the country, or on the other side of the world.

I also own clothing which helps me compensate for an insufficiently toned physique to be able to go about in public without.

Yup, I'm compensating!


That is an excellent post Sam!

I agree 100%. Not all of us was fortunate enough to have or afford martial arts training. Furthermore, not everyone is capable of it whether due to physical or mental limitations or disability.

The firearm is really the one True Equalizer.

skoro
July 10, 2012, 12:47 PM
In the same sense that car owners are compensating for something by carrying a spare tire. :rolleyes:

flyskater
July 10, 2012, 02:42 PM
I know brazilian jiu jitsu and take kick boxing and have a CCW.
I knew a guy in high school who won several awards in karate championship and he got shot at a gas station and ended up dying.

Also wanted to add: We all know the OJ Simpson ordeal. Ronald Goldman was a 3rd degree black belt in karate.

whetrock
July 14, 2012, 11:29 PM
Yeah I'm compensating for something, BEING HUMAN !!!!!! As a human being I have rather sorry claws and dull teeth making effective self defense and harvesting game a bit of a challenge. So I use my rather large cranial cavity and all of it's goodies to help me use technology to my advantage. As my dad used to tell me there is no fair fight and to use every resource I had available to win. I won't be fighting for sport but rather survival. I don't like "fist fighting" or fighting just to prove dominance nor do I like fighting in pure self defense but IMHO it's the only fight worth fighting.

MachIVshooter
July 15, 2012, 02:13 AM
I believe that Sam1911 gets the "Nailed It Award" for this thread.

Yes, he does.

Man's intelligence allows him to compensate for all the things he cannot do with his own physical capabilities. We can't run very fast, jump very high, fly, lift very heavy objects and many other things without the tools we build. So, as Sam illustrated concisely, we are ALL compensating, and no matter how rightious the naturalist granola crunchers think they may be, unless they're hermits who do not use ANY tools and live as apes, they are hypocrites, because even living in a community right out of the stone age, they would still be compensating.

TNboy
July 15, 2012, 09:46 PM
They can think what they like. I'm not a big guy, I'm 5'8" 150ish pounds. I was a wrestling standout in high school and I wrestled for a couple of years in college. It's been a long time since I was in a fight but I used to be able to handle myself pretty well even if the other guy was a lot bigger. All of that was a long time ago. I don't train anymore. I don't work out. I don't have the stamina that I once had, I'm not as quick as I once was. I had my heyday but I'm probably as good in a bar fight with a young guy is Al Bundy is on a football field. I would be delusional to think that I can do now what I could at 19. Here in the real world the possibility of getting attacked by multiple people who are bigger than myself is very real. Anyone who carries responsibly knows that they will use their gun as an absolute last resort. But if someone is coming at me with a knife, bat, etc. they are getting shot. I may only get one chance to shoot them. If taking them to the ground doesn't work then I'm screwed. If I shoot when the threat presents itself I have a better chance of living to tell about it. Just my $0.02.

SharpsDressedMan
July 15, 2012, 10:35 PM
Here is something to think about. I just kicked the idea around in my head today, and noticed that this topic was still active, and I think this applies....in a positive way. Through the years, I have always enjoyed a sense of confidence, belief in my own self and abilities. Self reliance, but a bit of a sense of duty, honor, etc, rolled in. I was told by my parents that I didn't have to follow the crowd, etc, and that I could be my own person. I butted heads with teachers, sometimes for fun, sometimes because I thought THEY were slacking, and keeping them on their toes as much as they did to us. Then I went into the working world. Wow! I worked for some great bosses, and by contrast, knew when I had fallen under some real idiots. Well, I didn't let them off easy, either. So, after laying all this background stuff, do you think that people of independent mind, those who don't follow the leader, free thinkers (who rely on logic, etc), might fall prey to the seduction of taking it one step further? I.E., looking at guns as one more way to achieve INDEPENDENCE? If one is comfortable and confident with guns, then one is free from oppression, be it personal social, or political. It is taking that free psyche one step further. Many people rely on others to protect them, but they are not really as free as those who can take care of themselves. Now, the downside to all of this, as type A, freemen often do, we offend and/or scare others who KNOW they are weaker, less self reliant, or just sophisticatedly "handicapped". They just don't "get it", when it comes to the subject of being armed as a DUTY, hand in hand with the concept of freedom.

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